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A REMINDER ON THE RULES


TitanTiger

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I have a few questions for Poet Tiger and aubfaninga actually: Why are you two very defensive when anything is negative said about Chizik as a head coach or when people point out his flaws? And I know you guys like facts, so here are some:

1. We are 4-10 against our big 4 rivals ( UGA, LSU, Ark, and UA) since he has been here, and that is including 2010.

2. We have had 3 straight top 10 recruiting classes.

3. Our players on offense were recruited to play the spread, not pro-style offense, which, again is Chizik's fault.

4. We have had 1 player not named Cam or Nick that was recruited by Chizik to be drafted in the NFL.

5. Our defense has NEVER been in the top 50 since he has been here ( even in 2008 we had a top 25 defense), and he is supposed to know defense.

6. Name 2 players that have seen significant improvement in development since Chizik has been here.

I could go on and on, but I think you see my point. I am not trying to cause anything, but I am just trying to understand how people can defend Chizik. Yes, I know he's a good guy, but he's not being paid millions to be a good guy, he's being paid for two reasons: 1) To graduate players, which he is not doing, and 2) to win, and win consistently, which he is not doing. Can you honestly state that we have improved since he has been here? And the worst part about it is that we won the NC in 2010, yet we have DECLINED since then, which is NEVER supposed to happen. You can blame youth all you want, but if that youth were ever coached properly, you would have seen improvement every week this year, which we have not. I would even actually say Clemson and LSU were our best games, but we have declined since those games. I am always for objective criticism, but sometimes there is a difference between constructive criticism and blind criticism, which I believe you two have the latter. I am alum, and I want what is best for Auburn. I did not like the hiring of Chizik at first, but then 2010 came, and I had thought that I could be wrong. However, last year was the turning point because I saw no improvement in our team, and we are watching the same team this year with no improvement. I'll say we can recruit like crazy, but that means nothing when you cannot coach them up. I believe Chizik was a shot in te dark hour, and now you are seeing his true colors as head coach.

By the way, this does not even include the numerous off-the-field incidents and attrition we have had since Chizik has been here....

Yes, you are dead on with everything you said here. I think you are completely right and I'm in total agreement with everything you said. Good job!

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I have a few questions for Poet Tiger and aubfaninga actually: Why are you two very defensive when anything is negative said about Chizik as a head coach or when people point out his flaws? And I know you guys like facts, so here are some:

1. We are 4-10 against our big 4 rivals ( UGA, LSU, Ark, and UA) since he has been here, and that is including 2010.

2. We have had 3 straight top 10 recruiting classes.

3. Our players on offense were recruited to play the spread, not pro-style offense, which, again is Chizik's fault.

4. We have had 1 player not named Cam or Nick that was recruited by Chizik to be drafted in the NFL.

5. Our defense has NEVER been in the top 50 since he has been here ( even in 2008 we had a top 25 defense), and he is supposed to know defense.

6. Name 2 players that have seen significant improvement in development since Chizik has been here.

I could go on and on, but I think you see my point. I am not trying to cause anything, but I am just trying to understand how people can defend Chizik. Yes, I know he's a good guy, but he's not being paid millions to be a good guy, he's being paid for two reasons: 1) To graduate players, which he is not doing, and 2) to win, and win consistently, which he is not doing. Can you honestly state that we have improved since he has been here? And the worst part about it is that we won the NC in 2010, yet we have DECLINED since then, which is NEVER supposed to happen. You can blame youth all you want, but if that youth were ever coached properly, you would have seen improvement every week this year, which we have not. I would even actually say Clemson and LSU were our best games, but we have declined since those games. I am always for objective criticism, but sometimes there is a difference between constructive criticism and blind criticism, which I believe you two have the latter. I am alum, and I want what is best for Auburn. I did not like the hiring of Chizik at first, but then 2010 came, and I had thought that I could be wrong. However, last year was the turning point because I saw no improvement in our team, and we are watching the same team this year with no improvement. I'll say we can recruit like crazy, but that means nothing when you cannot coach them up. I believe Chizik was a shot in the dark, and now you are seeing his true colors as a head coach.

By the way, this does not even include the numerous off-the-field incidents and attrition we have had since Chizik has been here....

I have said it before and I will say it now. I can't say if Chiz is the coach to get us where we want. I can say that I want one more year. Auburn will never get anywhere if we change head coaches every 4 years. Do you agree?

#1 From 2005 to 2008 UAT, UGA, LSU, and even ARK was way ahead of us in the recruiting area.

#2 We have had 3 straight top 10 recruiting classes! Why is this a bad thing. The 2010 class was a flop but the 2011 and 2012 players are already on the field in mass.

#3 Chiz can take the blame for winning 1 NC in his 4 years using the spread and then thinking that Auburn can win more without it. Maybe we can, Maybe we can't. I know that Auburn has won more games without using the spread.

#4 What kind of statement is that when you know Chiz did not sign a class until 2009? (with about 3 months to do so) Have you ever heard of a guy named Brandon Mosely though?

#5 One word... Spread! I am not saying the spread is bad just that a 7 to 6 score between bama and LSU is the same as a 71 to 72 score between Oregon and Oklahoma St.

#6 I don't call the 2009 class all Chiz so I will leave them off. Tre Mason, Reese Dismukes, CJ Uzomah, Sammie Coates, Cody Parkey, Greg Robinson, Tunde Fariyike (Thats just 6 on offense and 1 on special teams, do you want me to continue)

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1. Tough teams for anyone to beat those years, first year, played everyone tough except LSU, had UA on the ropes with 3 linebackers and a dead arm QB. After 2010 it was just these teams had better players after the exodus of a large senior class. QB - both starting QBs left after each season, 3 years three new QBs,

2.those recruiting classes were strong, but very weak on defense. No elite LB, CB, or DT, I would say Lemonier is the best defensive recruit Chizik has had.

3.whatever offense you run you need a better combination than underclassmen in all critical positions. RT, QB, RB, C, LT... not been in system long enough and just not ready, Personally I think he should have stuck with variation of spread offense....

4.Brandon Mosley says hello, and he will have a compete 4 years at seasons end, pretty of Corey comes out he will be drafted, as well as Ford.

5. Ted Roof - need I say more. But let me say the defense in 2010 was lights out against the run and was probably the best situational defense I have seen, when they needed a play they got it. 2011, too much youth on dline, not enough defensive depth.

6. Depends on your interpretation of significant, Blake has gotten better, so has Reese, Mason, and Lemonier.

We all have our opinions and I for one think Chizik bombed on hiring CSL as his OC, also as crazy as it is AU has been in every game this season, and has led in several of the games. Take away some poor play calls by the OC, untimely penalties, dumb throws by QBs, special team turnover against LSU, this team is easily 5-3

Or better. I have issues with the energy level of the team at times, and the constant personnel changes, but I am ok with him coming back next year...

Edited by PoetTiger
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One constant thing I notice from Poet Tiger and aubgafan is that you guys love making excuses for Chizik being a mediocre coach at best. Would you not agree a competent coach would be able to field a competitive team in year 4? And no, I am not talking being there until the end with Vandy and Ole Miss. But yea, you guys are right. Gene Chizik is the best coach since Shug Jordan. It is people who think like you two who are in the athletic department that are bringing down Auburn athletics. We hire good guys who are not proven coaches. We go after the cheapest find, and hope they pan out. And then when they do not, we leave them here until we are in a dumpster fire like we are now in football. If you want to have mediocre teams, then by all means support Chizik and this staff, and the Athletic department. I really wish more Auburn fans would stop accepting 7-5 and 8-4 records as "good enough". We need to have high expectations as a football team, yet we do not. All of you Chizik lovers and supporters will state that he has exceeded expectations since he's been here, which is true, but do you know why? Because no one expects him to do anything, no one expects him to have a consistent 10 win season. No one expects him to have another SEC title wihout a player named Cam. So, whenever you see these prognosticators predict Auburn's season, and get angry because they believe we will only win 6-7 games, it is because they know Chizik is an average coach at best. Let's say he stays here next year anyways. He will have to have a new OC, right? So, is your excuse going to be new schemes again, and that we are young? To me, it is a no-win situation. My expectations for him if he somehow comes back is a 10 win season, or be fired immediately. I am sorry, but Auburn fans like you two get me really annoyed. I guess I am not attached emotionally like you two are to Gene Chizik. I just want a coach who fields a consistent 9-11 win season, and who is competitive in every game, and who does not have a 35% attrition rate every year. But, whatever, you guys will probably get your wish, because as I said before, we have people who think just like you two in our athletic department who accept mediocrity.

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I keep thinking about the stat that someone posted on another thread. 35% plus players Chizik has recruited are no longer with the program. Why such a high attrition rate? Because players can't stay out of Chizik's doghouse...GC is bullying his players.

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1. Tough teams for anyone to beat those years, first year, played everyone tough except LSU, had UA on the ropes with 3 linebackers and a dead arm QB. After 2010 it was just these teams had better players after the exodus of a large senior class. QB - both starting QBs left after each season, 3 years three new QBs,

2.those recruiting classes were strong, but very weak on defense. No elite LB, CB, or DT, I would say Lemonier is the best defensive recruit Chizik has had.

3.whatever offense you run you need a better combination than underclassmen in all critical positions. RT, QB, RB, C, LT... not been in system long enough and just not ready, Personally I think he should have stuck with variation of spread offense....

4.Brandon Mosley says hello, and he will have a compete 4 years at seasons end, pretty of Corey comes out he will be drafted, as well as Ford.

5. Ted Roof - need I say more. But let me say the defense in 2010 was lights out against the run and was probably the best situational defense I have seen, when they needed a play they got it. 2011, too much youth on dline, not enough defensive depth.

6. Depends on your interpretation of significant, Blake has gotten better, so has Reese, Mason, and Lemonier.

We all have our opinions and I for one think Chizik bombed on hiring CSL as his OC, also as crazy as it is AU has been in every game this season, and has led in several of the games. Take away some poor play calls by the OC, untimely penalties, dumb throws by QBs, special team turnover against LSU, this team is easily 5-3

Or better. I have issues with the energy level of the team at times, and the constant personnel changes, but I am ok with him coming back next year...

I understand your points (aubfaninga's too), but how did he find himself in this position of having too many underclassmen starting in the wrong positions? Where is the JUCO help? If he didn't mind riding their back to Scottsdale, why aren't we using them to avoid 1-6? I also understand the argument against relying on JUCO help. When you inherit a mess, you do what you have to in order to get it working as best as possible immediately, while planning ahead. The head coach is supposed to be smart enough to see this coming, and know that 1-6 here isn't good for your job security. You don't get to press pause and wait for your new guys to develop.

Had we hired Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Les Miles, or Urban Meyer instead of Gene Chizik, do you think we would be 1-6 in the fourth year of his tenure here, regardless of circumstances?

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One constant thing I notice from Poet Tiger and aubgafan is that you guys love making excuses for Chizik being a mediocre coach at best. Would you not agree a competent coach would be able to field a competitive team in year 4? And no, I am not talking being there until the end with Vandy and Ole Miss. But yea, you guys are right. Gene Chizik is the best coach since Shug Jordan. It is people who think like you two who are in the athletic department that are bringing down Auburn athletics. We hire good guys who are not proven coaches. We go after the cheapest find, and hope they pan out. And then when they do not, we leave them here until we are in a dumpster fire like we are now in football. If you want to have mediocre teams, then by all means support Chizik and this staff, and the Athletic department. I really wish more Auburn fans would stop accepting 7-5 and 8-4 records as "good enough". We need to have high expectations as a football team, yet we do not. All of you Chizik lovers and supporters will state that he has exceeded expectations since he's been here, which is true, but do you know why? Because no one expects him to do anything, no one expects him to have a consistent 10 win season. No one expects him to have another SEC title wihout a player named Cam. So, whenever you see these prognosticators predict Auburn's season, and get angry because they believe we will only win 6-7 games, it is because they know Chizik is an average coach at best. Let's say he stays here next year anyways. He will have to have a new OC, right? So, is your excuse going to be new schemes again, and that we are young? To me, it is a no-win situation. My expectations for him if he somehow comes back is a 10 win season, or be fired immediately. I am sorry, but Auburn fans like you two get me really annoyed. I guess I am not attached emotionally like you two are to Gene Chizik. I just want a coach who fields a consistent 9-11 win season, and who is competitive in every game, and who does not have a 35% attrition rate every year. But, whatever, you guys will probably get your wish, because as I said before, we have people who think just like you two in our athletic department who accept mediocrity.

I agree 100%, there is no excuse as to why we aren't competing with UA every year for the west! We have every bit as good of talent as any other school in the country! We are SEVERLY undercoached and undersized. I would like to see improvement in all areas of our team, but all the coaching staff and admin seem to do is pass the buck every week with excuse after excuse. "we are too young, we are inexperienced, we made too many mistakes, i didnt trim my fingernails before the game....blah friggin blah. As a HC you should control ALL of those aspects. I hate to use this POS as a reference, but the reason Sabans' teams play with intensity and passion and discipline is because it's COACHED INTO THEM!!. He expects nothing less than perfection and coaches those players to that standard. We have the same caliber of talent. Auburn fans expect more because we have more talent now than we've ever had and the coaches are just pissing it away. One reason we lost Yeldon IMO was just for that fact.

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"Had we hired Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Les Miles, or Urban Meyer instead of Gene Chizik, do you think we would be 1-6 in the fourth year of his tenure here, regardless of circumstances?"

That might be the best point I have seen yet for not keeping Chizik. I have been on the fence most of the year but after the last two weeks I just can't see him staying. If one of the above mentioned coaches or someone of their ilk was coach their is NO way they let things get this bad. IMO Chizik should have seen this train wreck coming if he went to this new offense under an unproven OC. If he had hired a spread guy to work with Frazier's running ability we would probably be at least 4-3 right now. That decision is on Chizik, the attrition numbers are on Chizik, the FOUR YEAR defensive problems are on Chizik...and now perhaps the worst AU record in mine and a lot of others lifetime will be on Chizik as well. Sorry, but the answer to all the questions circle back to one person....Chizik.

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"Had we hired Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Les Miles, or Urban Meyer instead of Gene Chizik, do you think we would be 1-6 in the fourth year of his tenure here, regardless of circumstances?"

That might be the best point I have seen yet for not keeping Chizik. I have been on the fence most of the year but after the last two weeks I just can't see him staying. If one of the above mentioned coaches or someone of their ilk was coach their is NO way they let things get this bad. IMO Chizik should have seen this train wreck coming if he went to this new offense under an unproven OC. If he had hired a spread guy to work with Frazier's running ability we would probably be at least 4-3 right now. That decision is on Chizik, the attrition numbers are on Chizik, the FOUR YEAR defensive problems are on Chizik...and now perhaps the worst AU record in mine and a lot of others lifetime will be on Chizik as well. Sorry, but the answer to all the questions circle back to one person....Chizik.

To take that point further, look at their salaries. We're paying for Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Les Miles, or Urban Meyer. The only thing Chizik has in common with those four is a national championship team that he was the head coach of. At the college level, Spurrier had a losing season once. In 1987, 5-6 at Duke. Urban Meyer and Nick Saban have never had one. Gene Chizik has had one for half of time as a head coach.

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Had we hired Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Les Miles, or Urban Meyer instead of Gene Chizik, do you think we would be 1-6 in the fourth year of his tenure here, regardless of circumstances?

First...none of these guys were available when we hired Chiz so what's the point of the question?

Second...would we have that crystal ball and the memories of Cam and Nick without Chiz (and the coaches he brought with him) ?

Chiz has his problems seems some folks have selective memories.

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Had we hired Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Les Miles, or Urban Meyer instead of Gene Chizik, do you think we would be 1-6 in the fourth year of his tenure here, regardless of circumstances?

First...none of these guys were available when we hired Chiz so what's the point of the question?

Second...would we have that crystal ball and the memories of Cam and Nick without Chiz (and the coaches he brought with him) ?

Chiz has his problems seems some folks have selective memories.

I will forever remember that night in Glendale personally, but it really just illustrates the point further as to how far we have fallen in such a short time.

I don't think the point of the question was that we didn't hire one of those guys specifically, but if we had hired a proven winner with a track record like those guys we would not find ourselves 1-6 with consecutive losses to Arky, Ole Missy, and Vandy.

I think we have all seen coaches in our years watching college football that took less talent than AU has now, and organize and coach them up to play better than their talent. Chizik seems to have done the opposite for most of his tenure. I credit his patience and steady hand guiding that 2010 team through rough times, but remember we tried our best to give away a few games that year too. (MSU, Clemson, UK, Bama)

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Had we hired Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Les Miles, or Urban Meyer instead of Gene Chizik, do you think we would be 1-6 in the fourth year of his tenure here, regardless of circumstances?

First...none of these guys were available when we hired Chiz so what's the point of the question?

Second...would we have that crystal ball and the memories of Cam and Nick without Chiz (and the coaches he brought with him) ?

Chiz has his problems seems some folks have selective memories.

Chizik was not available either. All five were currently employed somewhere. The point of the question is stated quite clearly within it. More importantly, it remains unanswered.

As for the 2010 BCS National Championship, three of those men have won more than one of them. Urban Meyer, for example, would have likely still sought Cam Newton if he were here instead of Florida. Maybe we win it with one of those four in 2010, maybe we don't. Maybe we win it in 2011 or 2012 with them.

Point is, all four of them have built and maintained teams that are consistently in the hunt for it. None of them left everyone scratching their head when they were hired. They were established winners (as head coaches) elsewhere. None of them left people with legitimate concerns about the state and future of their programs in the fourth year of their tenure. I have no selective memory. Credit Chizik for that magical season, I'm fine with that. Credit Chizik for the nose-dive into the abyss that we have subsequently taken, as well. He gets both, you don't get to exclude one. When the stars align perfectly with both coordinators and two ridiculous players, he can preside over something that can win it all. When they don't, it plummets like the Titanic. I can do without having both extremes, with just mediocrity between them.

Edited by Strychnine
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"OnthePlains" In my view the 2010 team greatly over-achieved.

It was Cam and Nick and a bunch of other guys. Look now, two years later and how many of those 26 seniors are even on NFL squads, much less playing regularly. Four were drafted and far as I can tell, only Cam is starting anywhere. Instead of trying to give the games away, they showed tremendous guts and managed to win games when their backs were to the wall and they beat teams that had equal or greater talent in many cases.

Chiz and his coaches took two really good players and managed to build a national championship team around them. I waited 50 years for that to happen and I don't take it lightly and I'm not inclined to dump Chiz as a first resort...instead of a last resort.

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Urban Meyer, for example, would have likely still sought Cam Newton if he were here instead of Florida

That was intended as a joke..right? Urban basically ran him off from Fla.

And as for being "available"...there is quite a difference between being employed elsewhere and being available. Chiz had been at AU and had an attachement for the school....the other guys had absolutely no reason (including money) to leave their jobs for AU.

This "what if" argument IMO is the same foolishness I keep reading on AU sites....as if we can just go out and hire any coach we desire because...."after all...this is Auburn and every college or NFL coach is just dying to take the HC job". UTk thought that and got Dooley, Bama thought that and had Shula and Dubose and Price and 6 straight losses to AU and 16 years of probation .

Again, just my opinion, but AU has a better chance of Chiz turning things around than AU finding some mesiah out there who will come here and work wonders.

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"OnthePlains" In my view the 2010 team greatly over-achieved.

It was Cam and Nick and a bunch of other guys. Look now, two years later and how many of those 26 seniors are even on NFL squads, much less playing regularly. Four were drafted and far as I can tell, only Cam is starting anywhere. Instead of trying to give the games away, they showed tremendous guts and managed to win games when their backs were to the wall and they beat teams that had equal or greater talent in many cases.

Chiz and his coaches took two really good players and managed to build a national championship team around them. I waited 50 years for that to happen and I don't take it lightly and I'm not inclined to dump Chiz as a first resort...instead of a last resort.

I completely understand your point. Like I stated earlier I have been on the fence about firing him mostly because of that NC and the loss of a top ten recruiting class if he leaves. What bothers me is the seeming lack of discipline and lack of development of players over the whole four year period. It seems to be a pattern with costly penalties and stupid mistakes. I like Chizik, I respect the man, I will love him forever for 2010, but my question is what will be acceptable next season? The schedule turns over to the tough road games, still have QB questions, will the D be any better in year 5? So, if we scratch out 7 wins next year does that give Chizik ANOTHER year to turn it around?

If you give this exact same team to Saban and his staff are they 1-6 right now??? My guess is no, they are not. They wouldnt be 6-1 either granted, but they wouldnt look like a train wreck every week either. Look at what Bill Snyder has done at Kansas State.....AGAIN! No way KSTATE has better talent than AU right now, they do have a QB thats for sure.

I guess my question is this... how many games do we lose, bad records do we set, far behind our rivals we get before you are ready to change coaches and that NC credit runs out? Outside of 2010 he is 0-10 about to be 0-12 against our biggest rivals.

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"OnthePlains" In my view the 2010 team greatly over-achieved.

It was Cam and Nick and a bunch of other guys. Look now, two years later and how many of those 26 seniors are even on NFL squads, much less playing regularly. Four were drafted and far as I can tell, only Cam is starting anywhere. Instead of trying to give the games away, they showed tremendous guts and managed to win games when their backs were to the wall and they beat teams that had equal or greater talent in many cases.

Chiz and his coaches took two really good players and managed to build a national championship team around them. I waited 50 years for that to happen and I don't take it lightly and I'm not inclined to dump Chiz as a first resort...instead of a last resort.

I suspect all would agree that the 2010 squad greatly over-achieved. I hope they would, as no one that I can recall from anywhere predicted that one. In fact, throughout the season, we were always going to get derailed next week.

I don't discredit that teams' (including the coaches) accomplishment. I never wanted Chizik to fail, I like the guy. However, when you look at the team that he presided over building, you don't see the results of a national championship program-building coach. I don't see anything resembling that. What I see reminds me entirely too much of 1998. I don't see LSU, Florida, Alabama, or even current South Carolina, or that we're headed in that direction. I hear about it, but I certainly don't see it. As Paul Clark from the Cyclone Report said: "It's not hard to win at Texas or Auburn; it's hard to lose."

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"OnthePlains" In my view the 2010 team greatly over-achieved.

It was Cam and Nick and a bunch of other guys. Look now, two years later and how many of those 26 seniors are even on NFL squads, much less playing regularly. Four were drafted and far as I can tell, only Cam is starting anywhere. Instead of trying to give the games away, they showed tremendous guts and managed to win games when their backs were to the wall and they beat teams that had equal or greater talent in many cases.

Chiz and his coaches took two really good players and managed to build a national championship team around them. I waited 50 years for that to happen and I don't take it lightly and I'm not inclined to dump Chiz as a first resort...instead of a last resort.

I completely understand your point. Like I stated earlier I have been on the fence about firing him mostly because of that NC and the loss of a top ten recruiting class if he leaves. What bothers me is the seeming lack of discipline and lack of development of players over the whole four year period. It seems to be a pattern with costly penalties and stupid mistakes. I like Chizik, I respect the man, I will love him forever for 2010, but my question is what will be acceptable next season? The schedule turns over to the tough road games, still have QB questions, will the D be any better in year 5? So, if we scratch out 7 wins next year does that give Chizik ANOTHER year to turn it around?

If you give this exact same team to Saban and his staff are they 1-6 right now??? My guess is no, they are not. They wouldnt be 6-1 either granted, but they wouldnt look like a train wreck every week either. Look at what Bill Snyder has done at Kansas State.....AGAIN! No way KSTATE has better talent than AU right now, they do have a QB thats for sure.

I guess my question is this... how many games do we lose, bad records do we set, far behind our rivals we get before you are ready to change coaches and that NC credit runs out? Outside of 2010 he is 0-10 about to be 0-12 against our biggest rivals.

WAKE UP!!!!!!

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Speaking of Spurrier....look at what kind of BULLs**t he walked into over at S.Carolina. He started with jacks**t and has them a contender. Chizik has 10 times the talent and is going the opposite direction. And say what ya want about what TT left him but I think CGC was in pretty damn good shape to win when he was hired.

And as far as NC credit goes, that is all but used up with the way the program has conducted itself since. It's almost as if it didn't happen and that's sad!

Edited by leglessdan
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25 4th quarter possessions and no touchdowns... Only been in field goal range twice when applicable.

Please answer a simple question.

Would you be more likely to succeed if I gave you 6 months and a bunch of underclassmen or if I gave you over a year and a bunch of upperclassmen?

Its a simple question about you

Why is Roof and Gus making it work now opposed to last year????

I am happy for Roof and Gus!!!

Take a look at the opponents Gus has played please. Tell me how well Gus did in the first 3 qtrs against Oregon.

Take a look at Penn St. schedule? Now look at Penn St. defensive depth chart? Tell me if Roof has more seniors than we do upperclassmen on both sides of the ball.

You can say and compare all you want. The bottom line is: would we be 1-6 with Gus running the offense? Nooooo Way!

Would we be able to score in the 4th qtr with Gus running the show? Yes way!

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Urban Meyer, for example, would have likely still sought Cam Newton if he were here instead of Florida

That was intended as a joke..right? Urban basically ran him off from Fla.

And as for being "available"...there is quite a difference between being employed elsewhere and being available. Chiz had been at AU and had an attachement for the school....the other guys had absolutely no reason (including money) to leave their jobs for AU.

This "what if" argument IMO is the same foolishness I keep reading on AU sites....as if we can just go out and hire any coach we desire because...."after all...this is Auburn and every college or NFL coach is just dying to take the HC job". UTk thought that and got Dooley, Bama thought that and had Shula and Dubose and Price and 6 straight losses to AU and 16 years of probation .

Again, just my opinion, but AU has a better chance of Chiz turning things around than AU finding some mesiah out there who will come here and work wonders.

I admire your loyalty and do not for one minute think that you want anything but the best for Auburn. As Auburn people we can agree to disagree. I have read many posts just like these over the last several weeks and we are not gonna solve all Auburn's problems on here. I agree with you about hiring a messiah as well. Auburn has never gone for the home-run hire before and doubt they would this time either. But, without taking a chance where will we be in two more years?? Four of the last five seasons we have not beaten Arky, LSU, UGA or uat. One of those is on TT. The other three are on Chizik. If Auburn was just losing games I could live with that, but we are losing while looking lost half the time. Watch bammer play, watch UF play, watch Notre Dame for heavens sake, they all play with DISCIPLINE. I havn't seen that from Auburn during Chizik's whole time and that bothers me the most. The original questions on this post had to with youth and attrition and things like that, and the answer is always on the head coach. We can't blame TT anymore.

Again, I admire your loyalty and if Chizik stays I will cheer and hope for him to succeed more than anyone, but I don't want 6-6, or 7-5, that is not acceptable. Chizik raised his own bar by winning that NC, its on him to keep the team competitive.

Edited by OnthePlains
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Had we hired Steve Spurrier, Nick Saban, Les Miles, or Urban Meyer instead of Gene Chizik, do you think we would be 1-6 in the fourth year of his tenure here, regardless of circumstances?

First...none of these guys were available when we hired Chiz so what's the point of the question?

Second...would we have that crystal ball and the memories of Cam and Nick without Chiz (and the coaches he brought with him) ?

Chiz has his problems seems some folks have selective memories.

Coaches Chiz brought with him like Gus! Gus who JJ would not let CTT hire. Gus who won us the title in 2010! Gus who would not be 1-6, and Gus who would be able to score in the 4th qtr against Vandy, Ole Miss, Arky and La Monroe!

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Any of you that are on here right now: Would there be any possibility (money etc.) of getting Gus Malzahn back as head coach of Auburn?

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Any of you that are on here right now: Would there be any possibility (money etc.) of getting Gus Malzahn back as head coach of Auburn?

Slim to none IMO

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Any of you that are on here right now: Would there be any possibility (money etc.) of getting Gus Malzahn back as head coach of Auburn?

Slim to none IMO

My thinking too, but I guess I can always dream. LOL!

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I admire your loyalty and do not for one minute think that you want anything but the best for Auburn. As Auburn people we can agree to disagree. I have read many posts just like these over the last several weeks and we are not gonna solve all Auburn's problems on here. I agree with you about hiring a messiah as well. Auburn has never gone for the home-run hire before and doubt they would this time either. But, without taking a chance where will we be in two more years?? Four of the last five seasons we have not beaten Arky, LSU, UGA or uat. One of those is on TT. The other three are on Chizik. If Auburn was just losing games I could live with that, but we are losing while looking lost half the time. Watch bammer play, watch UF play, watch Notre Dame for heavens sake, they all play with DISCIPLINE. I havn't seen that from Auburn during Chizik's whole time and that bothers me the most. The original questions on this post had to with youth and attrition and things like that, and the answer is always on the head coach. We can't blame TT anymore.

In bold is the reason I asked the question that I asked.

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