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Is our athletic department "too religious"?


DyeHardAllTheWay

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I say kill this thread. I quit AE for it allowing shady (grey area posts) but deleting mentioning of God because of individuals like the one who started this. Don't take sides AUBURNEAGLE with the those who are Hateful. Integrity and honesty and clean wholesome living is still Good. Morality is still Good. If i am here preaching,i need to understand it is a sports forum and be warned..(and i understand that already)..BUT don't overreact like AE....Please KILL THIS THREAD AND DO NOT ALLOW SUCH..It destroys this forum.

This is why bama hates AU so much because we give praises to GOD and we all no who they praise over there. They also are very deep in secret societies in turdville. Jesus did say people will hate those that serve him, well I say let them hate!! WDE

And Auburn is so perfect? LOL! Sorry but I don't get the Bama is the devil and Auburn is so perfect arguments. We play in the SEC like everybody else and like it or not Auburn does some questionable things when it comes to football like every other SEC school. LOL.

I know Saban is called Satan b/c we hate them so much but people's hate for Bama/Saban clearly cloud their common sense. I'd like to know were people have read or seen that Saban isn't a Christian man. Just b/c he is not wearing a jesus cross or quoting bible verses means the man is the devil? LOL. Sorry but I don't believe ANY big time football coach is free from "sin" when it comes to running a big time football program...it just goes with the job IMO.

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Some folks in this thread are trolls of the highest caliber.

Others have offered valid and quite candid opinions of this topic. They did so without questioning others and I, for one, applaud those who approached it this way.

Shame on the folks who tried do derail this open topic with their head in the sand approach.

Try being pro-active instead of re-active.

Sorry, just a few dolts around here and its become the norm for them to dissect others rather than offer their own opinion.

/rant

Interesting comment. I don't think the topic has a right or wrong answer. Is Auburn's AD too religious? Its very interesting someone would be moved to post that. Personally, I'm not a religious person in any sense of the word but I have no problem allowing everyone a wide berth when it comes to matters of faith. I don't judge a person one way or the other whether they profess to be a believer an agnostic or a non-believer. That being said, if a coach is called to share his faith, its not going to be a matter of concern to me if another group of fans have an issue with that. That's on them and their need to judge. Here's what I think. I think what Auburn's coaches do is just fine with me and I have no problem with it. I would also have no problem if they felt no calling whatsoever to mention what they believe but obviously people see things from different perspectives. It could be, but I don't know, the people who don't like what the coaches are doing don't believe any of it anyway and you know what? That's not a problem either but I'm not going to make an issue of that by starting a thread about it.

Lots of times trolls are so intrenched in themselves that they don't even know they are trolls. I would imagine these people are probaby trolls in real life along with thier internet persona.
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As long as the coach doesnt force his views on the players(sharing isnt forcing) whats the problem?

If a coach were to share his views with me or a child of mine that I didnt believe in,I would not get bent out of shape as long as coercion wasnt going on.

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Some folks in this thread are trolls of the highest caliber.

Others have offered valid and quite candid opinions of this topic. They did so without questioning others and I, for one, applaud those who approached it this way.

Shame on the folks who tried do derail this open topic with their head in the sand approach.

Try being pro-active instead of re-active.

Sorry, just a few dolts around here and its become the norm for them to dissect others rather than offer their own opinion.

/rant

Interesting comment. I don't think the topic has a right or wrong answer. Is Auburn's AD too religious? Its very interesting someone would be moved to post that. Personally, I'm not a religious person in any sense of the word but I have no problem allowing everyone a wide berth when it comes to matters of faith. I don't judge a person one way or the other whether they profess to be a believer an agnostic or a non-believer. That being said, if a coach is called to share his faith, its not going to be a matter of concern to me if another group of fans have an issue with that. That's on them and their need to judge. Here's what I think. I think what Auburn's coaches do is just fine with me and I have no problem with it. I would also have no problem if they felt no calling whatsoever to mention what they believe but obviously people see things from different perspectives. It could be, but I don't know, the people who don't like what the coaches are doing don't believe any of it anyway and you know what? That's not a problem either but I'm not going to make an issue of that by starting a thread about it.

Lots of times trolls are so intrenched in themselves that they don't even know they are trolls. I would imagine these people are probaby trolls in real life along with thier internet persona.

I wouldn't know anything about being a troll. I expressed an opinion. Apparently, you didn't like it so you were compelled to implying that I'm a troll. By contrast, I feel no need whatsoever to resort to name calling. A troll you say? Have a nice day sir. I'm going to play golf.

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Some folks in this thread are trolls of the highest caliber.

Others have offered valid and quite candid opinions of this topic. They did so without questioning others and I, for one, applaud those who approached it this way.

Shame on the folks who tried do derail this open topic with their head in the sand approach.

Try being pro-active instead of re-active.

Sorry, just a few dolts around here and its become the norm for them to dissect others rather than offer their own opinion.

/rant

Interesting comment. I don't think the topic has a right or wrong answer. Is Auburn's AD too religious? Its very interesting someone would be moved to post that. Personally, I'm not a religious person in any sense of the word but I have no problem allowing everyone a wide berth when it comes to matters of faith. I don't judge a person one way or the other whether they profess to be a believer an agnostic or a non-believer. That being said, if a coach is called to share his faith, its not going to be a matter of concern to me if another group of fans have an issue with that. That's on them and their need to judge. Here's what I think. I think what Auburn's coaches do is just fine with me and I have no problem with it. I would also have no problem if they felt no calling whatsoever to mention what they believe but obviously people see things from different perspectives. It could be, but I don't know, the people who don't like what the coaches are doing don't believe any of it anyway and you know what? That's not a problem either but I'm not going to make an issue of that by starting a thread about it.

Lots of times trolls are so intrenched in themselves that they don't even know they are trolls. I would imagine these people are probaby trolls in real life along with thier internet persona.

I wouldn't know anything about being a troll. I expressed an opinion. Apparently, you didn't like it so you were compelled to implying that I'm a troll. By contrast, I feel no need whatsoever to resort to name calling. A troll you say? Have a nice day sir. I'm going to play golf.

Nowhere in anything I posted suggested YOU were a troll. Oddly enough you are the only one who felt compelled to quote what I posted and offer a defense.

If I call a duck, "duck", is that really name calling?

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I say kill this thread. I quit AE for it allowing shady (grey area posts) but deleting mentioning of God because of individuals like the one who started this. Don't take sides AUBURNEAGLE with the those who are Hateful. Integrity and honesty and clean wholesome living is still Good. Morality is still Good. If i am here preaching,i need to understand it is a sports forum and be warned..(and i understand that already)..BUT don't overreact like AE....Please KILL THIS THREAD AND DO NOT ALLOW SUCH..It destroys this forum.

This is why bama hates AU so much because we give praises to GOD and we all no who they praise over there. They also are very deep in secret societies in turdville. Jesus did say people will hate those that serve him, well I say let them hate!! WDE

I really hope this is sarcasm.

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Seeing that I believe not having God in our schools is one of our countries biggest problems no I don't have an issue with hiring men og faith

God is not in our schools?

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I'm sure lots of people would put me on the Christian radical right but I doubt God has time to intervene in the outcome of sporting events BUT if any of the participants think God was a help....who am I to tell them to think otherwise.I guess people get their personal strength from different sources but I do wonder when an atheist's worlb collapses in misery and pain, who does that person blame?

Do religious people blame God when their world "collapses in misery and pain"? Who do they "blame".

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As long as the coach doesnt force his views on the players(sharing isnt forcing) whats the problem?

If a coach were to share his views with me or a child of mine that I didnt believe in,I would not get bent out of shape as long as coercion wasnt going on.

It's called coercion by peer pressure. Most people who believe differently don't get "bent out of shape"; they are just careful to hide their true feelings because it's not worth the (social) cost of revealing them. So they just put up with it and go along with the crowd.

So, for anyone in a leadership position to simply assume that everyone wants - or needs - to participate - is very presumptuous and frankly, rude and inconsiderate.

IMO, this issue is not about the staff or anyone else being "too religious" per se', it's about incorporating (your) religion into team activities as a matter of course, simply because you can.

It's exactly the same reason why we shouldn't have religious ceremonies in public schools or any other public (government) activity. We don't all share the same religion.

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I, for one, think it's refreshing that religion is a factor. Don't get me wrong, I'm not blind to the fact that we'd hire satan if he would win football games, and I don't mean Saban. I mean we would hire questionable character to win, I think. If 'Man of God' is a good way to describe someone, then I'm glad we use it as a descriptor. Call me old fashioned, but I think this country could use more "Men of God" in public settings. At least they have some sort of something guiding decisions being made. (Don't misconstrue that last sentence, please. Yes, we all make mistakes, but at least some of us try.)

Does it not bother you that factoring religion into hiring practices at a public institution is illegal?

No!

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I say kill this thread. I quit AE for it allowing shady (grey area posts) but deleting mentioning of God because of individuals like the one who started this. Don't take sides AUBURNEAGLE with the those who are Hateful. Integrity and honesty and clean wholesome living is still Good. Morality is still Good. If i am here preaching,i need to understand it is a sports forum and be warned..(and i understand that already)..BUT don't overreact like AE....Please KILL THIS THREAD AND DO NOT ALLOW SUCH..It destroys this forum.

This is why bama hates AU so much because we give praises to GOD and we all no who they praise over there. They also are very deep in secret societies in turdville. Jesus did say people will hate those that serve him, well I say let them hate!! WDE

And Auburn is so perfect? LOL! Sorry but I don't get the Bama is the devil and Auburn is so perfect arguments. We play in the SEC like everybody else and like it or not Auburn does some questionable things when it comes to football like every other SEC school. LOL.

I know Saban is called Satan b/c we hate them so much but people's hate for Bama/Saban clearly cloud their common sense. I'd like to know were people have read or seen that Saban isn't a Christian man. Just b/c he is not wearing a jesus cross or quoting bible verses means the man is the devil? LOL. Sorry but I don't believe ANY big time football coach is free from "sin" when it comes to running a big time football program...it just goes with the job IMO.

Ur missing the point; I never insinuated that AU was perfect just stateing the obvious, we openly give praises above they give praises to one nick saban! Y do I say this? They have pictures of saban walking on water, now how do u feel about that? Oh yeah, ever heard of REC? Theres ur secret society right there, and they do exist all over this world
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I'm serious about my Christian faith, but I don't believe "Christian" talk correlates much with good character. And in a state university, defining a program in those terms is way out of line. I could do with less cheesiness.

On the other hand, I also believe people should have a right to be open about their faith.

So here is the OP delimma, which you authored...

In your opinion, what is the "acceptable" level of a coach/AD walking out their faith? Where is the standard? Who decides?... Al.com, Obama, congress, a nation-wide vote,???...

... this is not a relative issue, but is based upon absolute none changing standards as set and defined in the Bible... not open to being defined by personable preference... not based on a societal evolutionary sliding scale of morality or conduct...

And we are all probably at least a little intimidated by what this truth requires of each of us individually...

And yes, there is a great need for true Christian influence in every area of the market place today.

Look, I know a bit about the Bible. I teach New Testament in a denominational seminary (full professor, six academic books, national and international leadership responsibilities) and serve a local church p/t to boot. Doesn't mean my opinions are correct, but I'm informed.

The Bible doesn't say a thing about how a football coach should handle his job, how to do public relations, or even about how Christians should manage public roles. No such set of "standards" exists. You may interpret the Bible to address those contexts, and people should, but let's not pretend there's a "how-to" for coaches in there.

I've taught in secular contexts too. Students knew I was a Christian, as being a Christian informs my opinions. They could come to me for vocational or spiritual guidance, and some did. However, I did not -- I could not, ethically -- use that job as a platform to promote my faith. I could demonstrate that a reasonable, gracious person could excel as a scholar and a teacher. I could serve religious communities when invited. But I could not use my position, the stuff the state of South Carolina was paying me to do, to evangelize. Absolutely not.

My concern with the athletic department involves whether there's a culture that marginalizes unbelieving players and whether there's a bit of a good ole boy network that influences coaching decisions. I also believe it's wrong to project the image of a "Christian" program in a state university. Finally, there's the "cheesiness." There's no reason to tell the world you fired a coach after praying with him about it. And mercy, the "Satan" FB message last year was some moldy cheese.

As open as I am about my faith, I don't do "Christian" bumper stickers and the like. You know why? Because I make driving errors like everyone else, and I don't want my error to look like selfishness -- and then have someone associate it with my faith.

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I just feel bad for the non Christians on the team hearing about Jesus and god all the time from the coaches.

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Since the article was written when Tuberville was still at Auburn, I think it's a reach to find relevance. As for the question about factoring religion into hiring practices at a public institution, have you seen any evidence of that with the current coaching staff? I haven't, but then again I don't hang on every word during the off season.

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This is an interesting discussion and have to agree with those who would not want religion be part of the coaches job. Lets keep it to football and a college education.

In the same way, you wouldn't find it in any large global corporation.

I did work for the athletic department during my Auburn days, personally never felt any Religion being used (atleast not by any of the staff I was dealing with). So why wouldn't the coaches do the same..

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Hypothetical question: Would it be acceptable to eliminate a coaching candidate from consideration, because he has a strong Christian conviction? What about another religious conviction? What if he is an ardent atheist?

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Hypothetical question: Would it be acceptable to eliminate a coaching candidate from consideration, because he has a strong Christian conviction? What about another religious conviction? What if he is an ardent atheist?

Would anyone say yes? Why ask the question?

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I just feel bad for the non Christians on the team hearing about Jesus and god all the time from the coaches.

I feel bad for them because they aren't Christian. I believe nobody should be pushed into it but to choose for themselves. You don't have to beat someone over the head with a Bible, just being Godly men and men that these young boys can look up to. I believe the coaches are just trying to lead by example and that happens to be what a coach is. Yes, his main priority is football. That's his job. BUT from what I've seen and heard, I don't think anyone is going over the top.

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I say kill this thread. I quit AE for it allowing shady (grey area posts) but deleting mentioning of God because of individuals like the one who started this. Don't take sides AUBURNEAGLE with the those who are Hateful. Integrity and honesty and clean wholesome living is still Good. Morality is still Good. If i am here preaching,i need to understand it is a sports forum and be warned..(and i understand that already)..BUT don't overreact like AE....Please KILL THIS THREAD AND DO NOT ALLOW SUCH..It destroys this forum.

This is why bama hates AU so much because we give praises to GOD and we all no who they praise over there. They also are very deep in secret societies in turdville. Jesus did say people will hate those that serve him, well I say let them hate!! WDE

And Auburn is so perfect? LOL! Sorry but I don't get the Bama is the devil and Auburn is so perfect arguments. We play in the SEC like everybody else and like it or not Auburn does some questionable things when it comes to football like every other SEC school. LOL.

I know Saban is called Satan b/c we hate them so much but people's hate for Bama/Saban clearly cloud their common sense. I'd like to know were people have read or seen that Saban isn't a Christian man. Just b/c he is not wearing a jesus cross or quoting bible verses means the man is the devil? LOL. Sorry but I don't believe ANY big time football coach is free from "sin" when it comes to running a big time football program...it just goes with the job IMO.

Ur missing the point; I never insinuated that AU was perfect just stateing the obvious, we openly give praises above they give praises to one nick saban! Y do I say this? They have pictures of saban walking on water, now how do u feel about that? Oh yeah, ever heard of REC? Theres ur secret society right there, and they do exist all over this world

You've GOT to be kidding me with that statement! LOL! I'll take it as you're just messing with us b/c i CAN'T believe a real Auburn fan believes that crap! LOL!

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I say kill this thread. I quit AE for it allowing shady (grey area posts) but deleting mentioning of God because of individuals like the one who started this. Don't take sides AUBURNEAGLE with the those who are Hateful. Integrity and honesty and clean wholesome living is still Good. Morality is still Good. If i am here preaching,i need to understand it is a sports forum and be warned..(and i understand that already)..BUT don't overreact like AE....Please KILL THIS THREAD AND DO NOT ALLOW SUCH..It destroys this forum.

This is why bama hates AU so much because we give praises to GOD and we all no who they praise over there. They also are very deep in secret societies in turdville. Jesus did say people will hate those that serve him, well I say let them hate!! WDE

And Auburn is so perfect? LOL! Sorry but I don't get the Bama is the devil and Auburn is so perfect arguments. We play in the SEC like everybody else and like it or not Auburn does some questionable things when it comes to football like every other SEC school. LOL.

I know Saban is called Satan b/c we hate them so much but people's hate for Bama/Saban clearly cloud their common sense. I'd like to know were people have read or seen that Saban isn't a Christian man. Just b/c he is not wearing a jesus cross or quoting bible verses means the man is the devil? LOL. Sorry but I don't believe ANY big time football coach is free from "sin" when it comes to running a big time football program...it just goes with the job IMO.

Ur missing the point; I never insinuated that AU was perfect just stateing the obvious, we openly give praises above they give praises to one nick saban! Y do I say this? They have pictures of saban walking on water, now how do u feel about that? Oh yeah, ever heard of REC? Theres ur secret society right there, and they do exist all over this world

You've GOT to be kidding me with that statement! LOL! I'll take it as you're just messing with us b/c i CAN'T believe a real Auburn fan believes that crap! LOL!

What a simple minded comment ... you can't be serious.

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I say kill this thread. I quit AE for it allowing shady (grey area posts) but deleting mentioning of God because of individuals like the one who started this. Don't take sides AUBURNEAGLE with the those who are Hateful. Integrity and honesty and clean wholesome living is still Good. Morality is still Good. If i am here preaching,i need to understand it is a sports forum and be warned..(and i understand that already)..BUT don't overreact like AE....Please KILL THIS THREAD AND DO NOT ALLOW SUCH..It destroys this forum.

This is why bama hates AU so much because we give praises to GOD and we all no who they praise over there. They also are very deep in secret societies in turdville. Jesus did say people will hate those that serve him, well I say let them hate!! WDE

And Auburn is so perfect? LOL! Sorry but I don't get the Bama is the devil and Auburn is so perfect arguments. We play in the SEC like everybody else and like it or not Auburn does some questionable things when it comes to football like every other SEC school. LOL.

I know Saban is called Satan b/c we hate them so much but people's hate for Bama/Saban clearly cloud their common sense. I'd like to know were people have read or seen that Saban isn't a Christian man. Just b/c he is not wearing a jesus cross or quoting bible verses means the man is the devil? LOL. Sorry but I don't believe ANY big time football coach is free from "sin" when it comes to running a big time football program...it just goes with the job IMO.

Ur missing the point; I never insinuated that AU was perfect just stateing the obvious, we openly give praises above they give praises to one nick saban! Y do I say this? They have pictures of saban walking on water, now how do u feel about that? Oh yeah, ever heard of REC? Theres ur secret society right there, and they do exist all over this world

You've GOT to be kidding me with that statement! LOL! I'll take it as you're just messing with us b/c i CAN'T believe a real Auburn fan believes that crap! LOL!

What a simple minded comment ... you can't be serious.

Says another conspiracy theroist?! LOL. Yes i laugh at comments that have no logical common sense. If you would like to tell me more about the so called secret societies with Bama/Saban...go ahead and educate me. I would LOVE to hear the explanation.

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Has anyone thought that one of the reasons many student-athletes choose Auburn over other offers/institutions is because they LIKE the conversations---of all kinds---they have when they bond with the recruiters? And do you believe that football is all they talk about? I imagine not. We can discuss and agree/disagree all we want, but at the end of the day, what we say, think, and type do not matter in the least. Birds of a feather genuinely tend to flock together.

Do you think the author of the Auburn Creed was a bit too religious? "I believe in my Country, because it is a land of freedom and because it is my own home, and that I can best serve that country by "doing justly, loving mercy, and walking humbly with my God." (Micah 6:8...not cited in the Creed, but Micah 6:8 nonetheless.) And though we throw around the phrase "separation of church and state" quite often, it is most often taken out of context from what our Founding Fathers ever intended. Like a Rock:The Quest for Character (Andy Stanley) debunks our historical rewrites with a fantastic intellectual debate. But I digress.

We know psychology, surely! Nothing makes a college-age student more rebellious than being made to do something. But as the team bonds off and on the field, do know that genuine, overcoming faith IS contagious! They are sharing stories of life change, often laced with what they freely embrace as Divine intervention, that we cannot even imagine. If this is the case, then that's not forced...it's embraced freely. Brother Chette's book Hard-Fighting Soldiers outlines his own reluctance to have anything to do with anything "football-faith related" when he first came to Auburn...but that changed over time as HE changed, inspired by what he found in his fellow teammates. Nothing is more winsome than one who flies above the muck of the world we so easily mess up.

2010 was an absolute miracle in too many ways to count. I'd like to see more of it...and if more than we can humanly quantify went into it, then "let it be so."

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