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What might the IRS and 'friends' be so concerned about being discovered?


AUisAll

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Sure I work in a building with about 300-400 Users and we average maybe 4 a year...

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Lois Lerner showed the entire IRS that the lost e-mail scam works. No accountability, no follow up by the MSM, no stones on the Hill to actually DO anything about it.

Move on. Stop bashing women. It was just a isolated incident. This is only being investigated because Obama is black....

The story line has been firmly established. It would take a truly remarkable and stunning act, and those simply don't exist any more from the Right side of the aisle.

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If this BS is allowed to go unpunished, can you imagine the wailing we will hear from the lefties when Republicans are in charge? We are supposed to be a country with the rule of law and using government agencies to target political opponents will help lead to the crash of the greatest country to ever exist.

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If this BS is allowed to go unpunished, can you imagine the wailing we will hear from the lefties when Republicans are in charge? We are supposed to be a country with the rule of law and using government agencies to target political opponents will help lead to the crash of the greatest country to ever exist.

That, and the ignorant.

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If this BS is allowed to go unpunished, can you imagine the wailing we will hear from the lefties when Republicans are in charge? We are supposed to be a country with the rule of law and using government agencies to target political opponents will help lead to the crash of the greatest country to ever exist.

It would only be the latest in a very long sequence of politicians using the machinery of state to the end of a political goal. If you think this kind of thing is particular to Obama, or that Republicans are going to somehow eliminate it, I suggest you look into the history of political scandals in the United States. You will not find many that are actually opposed to corruption in either party.

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If this BS is allowed to go unpunished, can you imagine the wailing we will hear from the lefties when Republicans are in charge? We are supposed to be a country with the rule of law and using government agencies to target political opponents will help lead to the crash of the greatest country to ever exist.

It would only be the latest in a very long sequence of politicians using the machinery of state to the end of a political goal. If you think this kind of thing is particular to Obama, or that Republicans are going to somehow eliminate it, I suggest you look into the history of political scandals in the United States. You will not find many that are actually opposed to corruption in either party.

Home run!

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If this BS is allowed to go unpunished, can you imagine the wailing we will hear from the lefties when Republicans are in charge? We are supposed to be a country with the rule of law and using government agencies to target political opponents will help lead to the crash of the greatest country to ever exist.

It would only be the latest in a very long sequence of politicians using the machinery of state to the end of a political goal. If you think this kind of thing is particular to Obama, or that Republicans are going to somehow eliminate it, I suggest you look into the history of political scandals in the United States. You will not find many that are actually opposed to corruption in either party.

Home run!

Gets it!

The problem isnt the two parties. Its that some people think there is any difference between them.

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If this BS is allowed to go unpunished, can you imagine the wailing we will hear from the lefties when Republicans are in charge? We are supposed to be a country with the rule of law and using government agencies to target political opponents will help lead to the crash of the greatest country to ever exist.

It would only be the latest in a very long sequence of politicians using the machinery of state to the end of a political goal. If you think this kind of thing is particular to Obama, or that Republicans are going to somehow eliminate it, I suggest you look into the history of political scandals in the United States. You will not find many that are actually opposed to corruption in either party.

Please let me know when anything like the IRS targeting has happened under previous Presidents, Republican or Democrat.
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House investigators said Tuesday that the computer hard drive of ex-agency official Lois Lerner -- a key figure in the IRS targeting scandal -- was only “scratched,” not irreparably damaged, as Americans have been led to believe.

GOP-led Ways and Means Committee investigators, in their quest to recover missing Lerner emails, learned her hard drive was damaged but recoverable by talking to IRS information-technology experts, after the government originally refused to make them available, according to the committee.

“It is unbelievable that we cannot get a simple, straight answer from the IRS about this hard drive,” said committee Chairman Dave Camp.

The Michigan Republican said the new information also raises more questions about potential criminal wrongdoing at the IRS because the committee was told no data was recoverable and the physical hard drive was recycled and potentially shredded.

In addition, learning that the hard drive was only scratched also raises questions about why the IRS refused to use outside experts to recover the data.

“In fact, in-house professionals at the IRS recommended the agency seek outside assistance in recovering the data,” the committee said Tuesday in a release.

House investigators said they also are trying to determine whether the scratch was accidental or deliberate.

“If the IRS would just come clean and tell Congress and the American people what really happened, we could put an end to this,” Camp said. “Our investigators will not stop until we find the full truth.”

Lerner was the IRS’s exempt organizations director during the period of 2009 to mid-2011 -- when applications for tax-exempt status from Tea Party groups and other conservative organizations were held up for extra scrutiny.

The committee also said the information gleamed from the new interviews conflicts with a July 18 IRS court filing that states the data on the hard drive was unrecoverable -- including years of missing emails.

On June 13, more than one year into the investigation, and one month after the committee was promised it would receive all of Lerner’s emails, Congress learned that potentially thousands of them, over roughly two years, were destroyed as a result of a 2011 computer crash.

The recent interviews are bolstered by former federal law-enforcement and Defense Department forensic experts also telling investigators that most of the data on a scratched drive should be recoverable, the committee said.

A declaration filed Friday by the IRS stated the agency tried but failed to recover the data. The agency also said it is not sure what happened to the hard drive, other than saying they think it was recycled, which according to the court filing means “shredded.”

The committee also said a review of internal IRS documents found Lerner’s computer was actually described as “recovered.”

The targeting to the groups applying to the IRS was made public in May 2013 by Lerner. She has since refused to testify before Congress, invoking the Fifth Amendment, and resigned in September 2013.

The IRS has turned over tens of thousands of emails to and from Lerner’s account and says it has recovered thousands of others that were lost when her government-issued computer crashed.

Democrats say there is no scandal and that Republicans are trying to turn it into an election-year issue.

Maryland Rep. Elijah Cummings, the top Democrat on the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, protested Monday about the continuing House investigations, including his committee’s plans to call IRS Commissioner John Koskinen to testify on Wednesday, for the third time over the past month.

"This public harassment of an agency head is not only an abuse of authority, but a dereliction of the committee's obligation to conduct responsible oversight on a host of other critical issues within our jurisdiction," he said.

Investigators also are still trying to learn whether the targeting of conservative groups was ordered by the White House.

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Please let me know when anything like the IRS targeting has happened under previous Presidents, Republican or Democrat.

You could have simply looked into it yourself, as I suggested.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=history+of+of+irs+abuse+by+presidents

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Please let me know when anything like the IRS targeting has happened under previous Presidents, Republican or Democrat.

You could have simply looked into it yourself, as I suggested.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q...e by presidents

Thanks for the link. I see several allegations against Presidents both Democrat and Republicans but I only see one that was proven to do this and he (Nixon) was forced to resign. Obama is guilty as hell, not only on this but Fast and Furious, NSA snooping etc etc etc but the simpletons just keep 'sheepeling'.

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You all are falling for the master plan. It is my opinion that none of the recovered e-mail will show any wrongdoing. The republicans are going to start crowing since some of the e-mails will be able to be recovered. Then, the e-mails will not show anything incriminating. This will give the democrats a big boost shortly before the election. The incriminating e-mails will never be found.

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Thanks for the link. I see several allegations against Presidents both Democrat and Republicans but I only see one that was proven to do this and he (Nixon) was forced to resign. Obama is guilty as hell, not only on this but Fast and Furious, NSA snooping etc etc etc but the simpletons just keep 'sheepeling'.

Again, you are making a partisan issue where none exists. The concepts of Fast and Furious began while Bush was in office, but it was called Operation Wide Receiver. Gunwalking is not some tactic that the ATF only started using when Obama took office. If you want to be outraged about it, direct that anger toward the field offices that actually came up with the idea. In other words, it is not a Bush or Obama issue. The same holds true with "NSA snooping".

They are both things to be legitimately angry about, but making them partisan issues polarizes them and that is precisely what the politicians from both defunct parties want. If it is Democrat-spying or Republican-spying, then the outrage is focused on a party rather than dismantling the apparatus itself.

Fast and Furious: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Fast_and_Furious

"NSA snooping": https://www.eff.org/nsa-spying/timeline

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_surveillance_disclosures_(1970%E2%80%932013)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSA_warrantless_surveillance_(2001%E2%80%9307)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_surveillance_disclosures_(2013%E2%80%93present)

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Typical MO, when there is scandal punt back to Bush. OK, for the sake of discussion I will agree Bush was a scoundrel. But that's history and Obama has had 8 years to correct some known things like the VA but has not done so and in fact has just had more scandals of his own.

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Typical MO, when there is scandal punt back to Bush. OK, for the sake of discussion I will agree Bush was a scoundrel. But that's history and Obama has had 8 years to correct some known things like the VA but has not done so and in fact has just had more scandals of his own.

And under Operation Wide Receiver the guns were tracked and under Fast and Furious they were not.

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Typical MO, when there is scandal punt back to Bush. OK, for the sake of discussion I will agree Bush was a scoundrel. But that's history and Obama has had 8 years to correct some known things like the VA but has not done so and in fact has just had more scandals of his own.

PT, I was not "punting back to Bush", I was making the point that this kind of nonsense existed under Bush just as it exists now. That means it is not a conservative vs. liberal or Republican vs. Democrat crusade. It is a pattern of government incompetence, corruption, and unconstitutionality that crosses both parties, and clearly illustrates that the only thing you can expect from either as they exist today is more of the same.

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And under Operation Wide Receiver the guns were tracked and under Fast and Furious they were not.

Even the Wiki article that I linked previous states the following of Operation Wide Receiver:

Operation Wide Receiver

The suspicious sale of AR-15s led to Operation Wide Receiver.

The first known ATF "gunwalking" operation to Mexican drug cartels, named Operation Wide Receiver, began in early 2006 and ran into late 2007. Licensed dealer Mike Detty of Mad Dawg Global informed the ATF of a suspicious gun purchase that took place in February 2006 in Tucson, Arizona. In March he was hired as a confidential informant working with the ATF's Tucson office, part of their Phoenix, Arizona field division.

With the use of surveillance equipment, ATF agents monitored additional sales by Detty to straw purchasers. With assurance from ATF "that Mexican officials would be conducting surveillance or interdictions when guns got to the other side of the border", Detty would sell a total of about 450 guns during the operation. These included AR-15s, semi-automatic AK-pattern rifles, and Colt .38s. The majority of the guns were eventually lost as they moved into Mexico.

As the later DOJ OIG Report documented, under Wide Receiver coordination of ATF Tucson with the ATF Mexico City Office (MCO) and with Mexican law enforcement had been haphazard. Discussions of getting tracking devices from Raytheon were not followed up. ATF field agents and the cooperating gun dealer had been told by ATF supervisors that the guns were being interdicted before they could reach Mexico, but only 64 of the 474 guns had actually been seized. The kingpin sought by walking the guns, Israel Egurrola-Leon, turned out to be the target of a larger drug case Operation Iron River run by OCDETF. After Operation Wide Receiver was ended, several attorneys at the Phoenix USAO who reviewed the Wide Receiver cases for prosecution found the cases had been so poorly managed that they were reluctant to bring any of them to trial.

At the time, under the Bush administration Department of Justice (DOJ), no arrests or indictments were made. After President Barack Obama took office in 2009, the DOJ reviewed Wide Receiver and found that guns had been allowed into the hands of suspected gun traffickers. Indictments began in 2010, over three years after Wide Receiver concluded. As of October 4, 2011, nine people had been charged with making false statements in acquisition of firearms and illicit transfer, shipment or delivery of firearms. As of November, charges against one defendant had been dropped; five of them had pled guilty, and one had been sentenced to one year and one day in prison. Two of them remained fugitives.

If Operation Wide Receiver successfully tracking firearms is what you inferred from that, you should read it again.

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And under Operation Wide Receiver the guns were tracked and under Fast and Furious they were not.

Even the Wiki article that I linked previous states the following of Operation Wide Receiver:

Operation Wide Receiver

The suspicious sale of AR-15s led to Operation Wide Receiver.

The first known ATF "gunwalking" operation to Mexican drug cartels, named Operation Wide Receiver, began in early 2006 and ran into late 2007. Licensed dealer Mike Detty of Mad Dawg Global informed the ATF of a suspicious gun purchase that took place in February 2006 in Tucson, Arizona. In March he was hired as a confidential informant working with the ATF's Tucson office, part of their Phoenix, Arizona field division.

With the use of surveillance equipment, ATF agents monitored additional sales by Detty to straw purchasers. With assurance from ATF "that Mexican officials would be conducting surveillance or interdictions when guns got to the other side of the border", Detty would sell a total of about 450 guns during the operation. These included AR-15s, semi-automatic AK-pattern rifles, and Colt .38s. The majority of the guns were eventually lost as they moved into Mexico.

As the later DOJ OIG Report documented, under Wide Receiver coordination of ATF Tucson with the ATF Mexico City Office (MCO) and with Mexican law enforcement had been haphazard. Discussions of getting tracking devices from Raytheon were not followed up. ATF field agents and the cooperating gun dealer had been told by ATF supervisors that the guns were being interdicted before they could reach Mexico, but only 64 of the 474 guns had actually been seized. The kingpin sought by walking the guns, Israel Egurrola-Leon, turned out to be the target of a larger drug case Operation Iron River run by OCDETF. After Operation Wide Receiver was ended, several attorneys at the Phoenix USAO who reviewed the Wide Receiver cases for prosecution found the cases had been so poorly managed that they were reluctant to bring any of them to trial.

At the time, under the Bush administration Department of Justice (DOJ), no arrests or indictments were made. After President Barack Obama took office in 2009, the DOJ reviewed Wide Receiver and found that guns had been allowed into the hands of suspected gun traffickers. Indictments began in 2010, over three years after Wide Receiver concluded. As of October 4, 2011, nine people had been charged with making false statements in acquisition of firearms and illicit transfer, shipment or delivery of firearms. As of November, charges against one defendant had been dropped; five of them had pled guilty, and one had been sentenced to one year and one day in prison. Two of them remained fugitives.

If Operation Wide Receiver successfully tracking firearms is what you inferred from that, you should read it again.

Out of curiosity, can you provide a link to guns in the Operation Wide Receiver that were used in murders of Mexicans and US Border Patrol agents? There has been hundreds of deaths linked to guns in Fast and Furious.

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Out of curiosity, can you provide a link to guns in the Operation Wide Receiver that were used in murders of Mexicans and US Border Patrol agents? There has been hundreds of deaths linked to guns in Fast and Furious.

Considering that the current casualty estimates in Mexico's drug war are over 100,000, and only 64 of 474 firearms from Operation Wide Receiver were recovered, do you really find it likely that all of the firearms in that war are actually being traced or that ones still being used can be traced? You are trying to rationalize Operation Wide Receiver that took place while Bush was President as a good idea, while Operation Fast and Furious that place while Obama was President is a bad idea. The fact of the matter is that both operations were bad ideas, they both failed miserably, and they both resulted in firearms ending up across the border in Mexico because firearms dealers were ordered by the ATF to allow straw purchases. They both failed to properly liaise with Mexican officials, or interdict the smugglers before crossing the border.

They do not restaff the ATF field offices every time there is a regime change in Washington to make sure that they are filled with loyal party members, and the field offices are where both operations came from. In other words, Democrats trying to pin Wide Receiver on Bush or Republicans trying to pin Fast and Furious on Obama miss the point. I doubt the details of either operation even crossed the agency director's desk, much less either President's, until it had blown up in their face.

What I see when I look at the two operations is that some people in southwest US ATF field offices thought they had a good idea in Wide Receiver that failed due to poor execution, so they decided to double down and increase the scale when they tried again with Fast and Furious. However, they failed to address the root cause of why Wide Receiver failed, thus ensuring Fast and Furious the same fate. They are both fine examples of government agency incompetence, but they are not political issues aside from people that want to use them as partisan ammunition to slam the opposition.

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Some may not like the source,but here is a good comparison of Operations Wide Receiver and Fast and Furious. Yes there is a partisan slant but the facts are there. http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2012/06/26/the-5-biggest-differences-between-operation-fast-and-furious-and-operation-wide-receiver/

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