Islamic Idiots

[Weegle777 78]

Here is my question. If you know these morons are liars, murderers, and thieves, why do you let them humiliate you, strip you down, make you march through the desert, and make you chant some islamic incoherent BS, when you know you are going to die? I will say this, if I were to fall into the hands of these imbeciles, you can bet everything you have on the fact that you will NEVER see me on a video with some masked coward holding a knife. You will either kill me where you find me, or you will have an issue when you get me where you take me. I will not go easy. Why the passivity with these people? Why are they not fighting back? You are going to die anyway! Can anybody explain this to me?

[AURaptor 1,121]

My only guestimation is that escape is not possible, and if you resist, they'll only make your death more grizzly and last longer.

And from what I can imagine, examples have been made, many times over, to make clear it's understood what happens to those who resist. Of course, they may claim they'll spare your family, not rape your sister, wife, daughter, etc... and then do exactly that as they are killing you.

The Khmer Rouge or NAZIS take a back seat to such atrocities being committed, I suspect.

[TexasTiger 12,796]

Here is my question. If you know these morons are liars, murderers, and thieves, why do you let them humiliate you, strip you down, make you march through the desert, and make you chant some islamic incoherent BS, when you know you are going to die? I will say this, if I were to fall into the hands of these imbeciles, you can bet everything you have on the fact that you will NEVER see me on a video with some masked coward holding a knife. You will either kill me where you find me, or you will have an issue when you get me where you take me. I will not go easy. Why the passivity with these people? Why are they not fighting back? You are going to die anyway! Can anybody explain this to me?

Let's not judge this guy.

[cptau 169]

Here is my question. If you know these morons are liars, murderers, and thieves, why do you let them humiliate you, strip you down, make you march through the desert, and make you chant some islamic incoherent BS, when you know you are going to die? I will say this, if I were to fall into the hands of these imbeciles, you can bet everything you have on the fact that you will NEVER see me on a video with some masked coward holding a knife. You will either kill me where you find me, or you will have an issue when you get me where you take me. I will not go easy. Why the passivity with these people? Why are they not fighting back? You are going to die anyway! Can anybody explain this to me?

I think they hold out some slight hope that they will be held hostage or allowed to convert or some other thing. These are not well trained soldiers on either side. The ISIS have an advantage in that they are thugs who enjoy killing for various reasons. Most of these Arab government forces are just there for a pay check. When the going get tough, they desert or surrender. Surrendering to ISIS is a bad choice. The Imperial Japanese Army would be a better match for ISIS.

[Weegle777 78]

Yep surrendering is the worst choice you can make. Better to go out fighting than to allow these morons to cowardly tie your hands and feet. If you let them take you, they will make your death as painful as they can. Especially if you are an American. Better to at least kill one of them if you are going out.

[AURaptor 1,121]

Of course, there was the Italian ( journalist ? I think ) who defiantly refused to beg for his life, and said ' THIS is how an ITALIAN dies! ', right before the put a bullet into his skull.

[Weegle777 78]

At least he went out with honor.

[quietfan 233]

Technically, if one accepts the opening premise, it seems to imply that the victims are the idiots. Some of these were non-Sunni Muslims (and probably some Sunnis if they resisted ISIS too much), but many were Yazidis and/or Christians, so perhaps the thread title should just read "Idiots".

I'm no psychologist, but it should be noted that many victims of the Holocaust, the Khmer Rouge, and other psychotic despots also went passively to their deaths. There may be some basic psychological effect involved, I don't know.

Something I struggle with is Christ's commandment to "turn the other cheek". I admit myself that reconciling that commandment with basic self-defense and resisting evil is a paradox that I don't have a good rational answer to. However, I think it behooves everyone, or at least everyone claiming to be a Christian, to at least consider Christ's teaching in their decision-making. I haven't noticed it being mentioned in any of the threads in this forum. In fact, it is quite possibly the most ignored of all of Christ's commandments, in my opinion.

I don't think any of us can know for sure what we would actually do in such a situation. It's fine to talk about, or anticipate, the reaction/resistance we hope we'd put up, but I don't think any of us can know with certainty what would happen unless/until in the moment.

[Weegle777 78]

You have to understand why Jesus gave the sermon on the mount, to understand the words therein. Not everything in the bible was directed to the gentiles.

[quietfan 233]

You have to understand why Jesus gave the sermon on the mount, to understand the words therein. Not everything in the bible was directed to the gentiles.

I agree that a key part of understanding any speech is understanding the purpose of it and the audience to whom it was addressed.

As for why Jesus gave the Sermon on the Mount, or to whom it was directed, I find nothing specific in the Scriptures*. With no clear statement regarding these questions (why? to whom?), it becomes a matter of interpretation, and there could be as many different interpretations as there are Christian denominations or individual Christians. My belief is that "turn the other cheek", and indeed the entire Sermon on the Mount, was a message to all human beings. You are certainly entitled to your own interpretation.

-----

*The most I can find is Matthew 5:1-2: "And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain; and when he was set, his disciples came unto him. And he opened his mouth, and taught them...", and Matthew 7:28: "....the people were astonished..." So presumably the Sermon on the Mount was addressed to either "the multitudes", "his disciples", or "the people", but none of those terms is precisely defined or differentiates between Gentile and Jew. Nor do any of these verses address the question of why he gave it.

I am, however, open to enlightenment if I have overlooked some other scripture that more clearly answers the question of to whom and why.

[homersapien 11,347]

I think the real issue here is whether or not Weegle meant to call the people being massacred without resisting idiots while assuming they were all Muslims.

I'd ask for clarification but I don't want to piss him off, much less convince him I am trying to "drag him into my delusion".

[Weegle777 78]

The key words that tell you who Jesus was addressing are, "You have heard it said....". Gentiles weren't given the law, the jews were. Gentiles had no hope until Jesus died, and were excluded until Paul's ministry. Remember, Paul initiated the spreading of the gospel to the gentiles. The sermon on the mount was what Jesus used to set the bar so high for jews that thought that they had it all together, so He could show them how much they needed Him. That sermon was for the jews not gentiles.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

I'm with you Weegle. Better to die when the capture you than stay in a rotten prison cell for years and then get your head chopped off. I would go down trying to take oe or two with me if I could. That way I could maybe have one of their 17 virgins (LOL).

[Weegle777 78]

[quietfan 233]

The key words that tell you who Jesus was addressing are, "You have heard it said....". Gentiles weren't given the law, the jews were. Gentiles had no hope until Jesus died, and were excluded until Paul's ministry. Remember, Paul initiated the spreading of the gospel to the gentiles. The sermon on the mount was what Jesus used to set the bar so high for jews that thought that they had it all together, so He could show them how much they needed Him. That sermon was for the jews not gentiles.

"You have heard it said" means only Jews have heard this?? Almost everyday I hear things that have been said, regardless of my religion, politics, ethnicity, or locality. Given that Galilee was something a backwater of Roman Empire at the time, I would suspect that any Gentile residing there knew as much about Judaism as you or I know about Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism,...or the pagan Greco-Roman gods, local politics, or the gossip at the dinner party last night. If I chose to reside in a foreign culture I would want to know traditions, stories, ethical beliefs, and local gossip--either out of respect in order to fit in, or just to understand whom I was living/competing/doing business with. So just as we've heard all those things, the residents of Galilee--Jewish or not--probably had heard what Jesus was referring to. And many of the teachings He prefaced with "you have heard it said" reflected universal ideas/questions found in almost every culture on earth.

Also, given that the overwhelming majority of the Sermon on the Mount reflects universal truths that are applicable in all cultures/groups, would it makes sense that somewhere in the middle He stopped to say: "Oh, and by the way, only for you Jews: Turn the other cheek!"?

(It's sometimes hard for me to tell when I've crossed the line from friendly debate to stepping on toes/offending, perhaps because I hardly ever find reason to take offense myself. ..Hope I haven't offended you. I respect your right to your beliefs and your interpretation.)