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Is our athletic department "too religious"?


DyeHardAllTheWay

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I'm not even going to pretend I read through 12 pages worth of peoples opinions so if this has been beat to death... Oh well. I think its refreshing in a sense that, in this world, where God is being pushed out of everything, that Auburn has some sort of stance on it, with athletics and the way our students and alum act. Men of God also does not need to be taken as just Christian. Muslims, Jews, Christians and the like all worship the same God. I for one am sick and tired that the other groups, and i wont single any one out, believe that the elimination of religion is equality. Also, If a lot of people have such strong views against it, please show me any proof that our players, student, coaches, or anyone associated with the University in any fashion, is being forced to participate in on field,class,practice or whatever, prayers or religious celebrations of any kind. I went to a non-religious school all through my education except for middle school. Through all of the practices for swimming and basketball, their were some of us, me included, that would pray before and after games and practice. We never forced anyone to be involved and would not let anyone try to stop us from collecting. I feel like this is exactly what is being done here at Auburn. Just that the majority participates is not a reason to damn Auburn and label them "too religious".

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Wait a minute, time out.

In the article Tony Franklin says "all they do at Auburn is pray or talk about praying". Really? All we do?

He must have done zero due-diligence before coming to Auburn since it's not exactly a well kept secret the Auburn community cultivates prayer before, during, and after as many activities as possible. Butt-hurt former OC. Move on (.org).

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I have no personal view on this subject, other than to say Auburn is "different" than many/most institutions. That "difference" is exactly why I chose to attend Auburn University. But I've always been the "swim against the current" kind of person.

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I, for one, think it's refreshing that religion is a factor. Don't get me wrong, I'm not blind to the fact that we'd hire satan if he would win football games, and I don't mean Saban. I mean we would hire questionable character to win, I think. If 'Man of God' is a good way to describe someone, then I'm glad we use it as a descriptor. Call me old fashioned, but I think this country could use more "Men of God" in public settings. At least they have some sort of something guiding decisions being made. (Don't misconstrue that last sentence, please. Yes, we all make mistakes, but at least some of us try.)

Does it not bother you that factoring religion into hiring practices at a public institution is illegal?

If it was a requirement it might be. If it is a preference to the type person a coach wants to work with; that is a different situation. I don`t think Malzahn used it as more than part of his criteria and was lucky enough to find that type person in good coaches.

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The way some speak of Auburn reminds me of churches who have recreational sport teams.

The only time I take issue with someone's religious views is when it becomes a problem to those that surround him. Auburn exists to help their student body increase their likelihood of success in their future. If it's proven that religious discrimination in hiring and creating an uncomfortable atmosphere for the players is why the athletic department is failing, then it needs to be addressed.

Personally I don't believe religion is Auburn's problem. Notre Dame is pretty religious, and even tho they got destroyed in the BCS NC, they were there.

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Let's just bring religion out of football. It's very disturbing that you hear coaches in interviews talking about their faith so adamantly and talking about trying to impress it upon young student athletes. Quite frankly, it's disrespectful to the role of the parent or guardian, whose job it is to teach those things to a kid. We're not a private, Christian college, we are a public university whose sole purpose is to educate students and provide winning products in regards to athletics. Using that job to promote an agenda is out of line.

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Has anyone thought that one of the reasons many student-athletes choose Auburn over other offers/institutions is because they LIKE the conversations---of all kinds---they have when they bond with the recruiters? And do you believe that football is all they talk about? I imagine not. We can discuss and agree/disagree all we want, but at the end of the day, what we say, think, and type do not matter in the least. Birds of a feather genuinely tend to flock together.

Do you think the author of the Auburn Creed was a bit too religious? "I believe in my Country, because it is a land of freedom and because it is my own home, and that I can best serve that country by "doing justly, loving mercy, and walking humbly with my God." (Micah 6:8...not cited in the Creed, but Micah 6:8 nonetheless.) And though we throw around the phrase "separation of church and state" quite often, it is most often taken out of context from what our Founding Fathers ever intended. Like a Rock:The Quest for Character (Andy Stanley) debunks our historical rewrites with a fantastic intellectual debate. But I digress.

We know psychology, surely! Nothing makes a college-age student more rebellious than being made to do something. But as the team bonds off and on the field, do know that genuine, overcoming faith IS contagious! They are sharing stories of life change, often laced with what they freely embrace as Divine intervention, that we cannot even imagine. If this is the case, then that's not forced...it's embraced freely. Brother Chette's book Hard-Fighting Soldiers outlines his own reluctance to have anything to do with anything "football-faith related" when he first came to Auburn...but that changed over time as HE changed, inspired by what he found in his fellow teammates. Nothing is more winsome than one who flies above the muck of the world we so easily mess up.

2010 was an absolute miracle in too many ways to count. I'd like to see more of it...and if more than we can humanly quantify went into it, then "let it be so."

There is much wisdom in your comments.

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Let's just bring religion out of football. It's very disturbing that you hear coaches in interviews talking about their faith so adamantly and talking about trying to impress it upon young student athletes. Quite frankly, it's disrespectful to the role of the parent or guardian, whose job it is to teach those things to a kid. We're not a private, Christian college, we are a public university whose sole purpose is to educate students and provide winning products in regards to athletics. Using that job to promote an agenda is out of line.

If they live out their faith in front of others, how is that promoting an agenda? It is a constitutional right to NOT be stopped from the "free exercise thereof" of any faith that you choose. Not just Christianity. The only agenda I see is the attempt to de-Christianize America. Which will never happen by the way.
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Let's just bring religion out of football. It's very disturbing that you hear coaches in interviews talking about their faith so adamantly and talking about trying to impress it upon young student athletes. Quite frankly, it's disrespectful to the role of the parent or guardian, whose job it is to teach those things to a kid. We're not a private, Christian college, we are a public university whose sole purpose is to educate students and provide winning products in regards to athletics. Using that job to promote an agenda is out of line.

If they live out their faith in front of others, how is that promoting an agenda? It is a constitutional right to NOT be stopped from the "free exercise thereof" of any faith that you choose. Not just Christianity. The only agenda I see is the attempt to de-Christianize America. Which will never happen by the way.

You're not hearing what I'm saying. It's great to be a Christian, or be any religion you choose. However, it's not their job to be teaching those things to young people. It's completely inappropriate relative to their job - FOOTBALL, and if they wanted to promote Christianity they should have gone to seminary instead to seek a career in that direction.

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Let's just bring religion out of football. It's very disturbing that you hear coaches in interviews talking about their faith so adamantly and talking about trying to impress it upon young student athletes. Quite frankly, it's disrespectful to the role of the parent or guardian, whose job it is to teach those things to a kid. We're not a private, Christian college, we are a public university whose sole purpose is to educate students and provide winning products in regards to athletics. Using that job to promote an agenda is out of line.

If they live out their faith in front of others, how is that promoting an agenda? It is a constitutional right to NOT be stopped from the "free exercise thereof" of any faith that you choose. Not just Christianity. The only agenda I see is the attempt to de-Christianize America. Which will never happen by the way.

You're not hearing what I'm saying. It's great to be a Christian, or be any religion you choose. However, it's not their job to be teaching those things to young people. It's completely inappropriate relative to their job - FOOTBALL, and if they wanted to promote Christianity they should have gone to seminary instead to seek a career in that direction.

So they should shut their mouths and modify their behavior in front of others?
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Let's just bring religion out of football. It's very disturbing that you hear coaches in interviews talking about their faith so adamantly and talking about trying to impress it upon young student athletes. Quite frankly, it's disrespectful to the role of the parent or guardian, whose job it is to teach those things to a kid. We're not a private, Christian college, we are a public university whose sole purpose is to educate students and provide winning products in regards to athletics. Using that job to promote an agenda is out of line.

If they live out their faith in front of others, how is that promoting an agenda? It is a constitutional right to NOT be stopped from the "free exercise thereof" of any faith that you choose. Not just Christianity. The only agenda I see is the attempt to de-Christianize America. Which will never happen by the way.

You're not hearing what I'm saying. It's great to be a Christian, or be any religion you choose. However, it's not their job to be teaching those things to young people. It's completely inappropriate relative to their job - FOOTBALL, and if they wanted to promote Christianity they should have gone to seminary instead to seek a career in that direction.

Please tell us who on this "current" Auburn football staff is teaching Chrisianity to AU football players. You originally sourced an article from Tommy Tuberville's staff and Tony Franklin's comments about praying, that's old news. I haven't read where anyone ever complained about praying/coaching for Tubs since AU let him go.

Do you have evidence that the current football staff is forcing religion and Christianity onto the AU players?

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Let's just bring religion out of football. It's very disturbing that you hear coaches in interviews talking about their faith so adamantly and talking about trying to impress it upon young student athletes. Quite frankly, it's disrespectful to the role of the parent or guardian, whose job it is to teach those things to a kid. We're not a private, Christian college, we are a public university whose sole purpose is to educate students and provide winning products in regards to athletics. Using that job to promote an agenda is out of line.

If they live out their faith in front of others, how is that promoting an agenda? It is a constitutional right to NOT be stopped from the "free exercise thereof" of any faith that you choose. Not just Christianity. The only agenda I see is the attempt to de-Christianize America. Which will never happen by the way.

You're not hearing what I'm saying. It's great to be a Christian, or be any religion you choose. However, it's not their job to be teaching those things to young people. It's completely inappropriate relative to their job - FOOTBALL, and if they wanted to promote Christianity they should have gone to seminary instead to seek a career in that direction.

So they should shut their mouths and modify their behavior in front of others?

You're implying that they're acting out this behavior in front of others. What's been going on at Auburn is a lot of talk from the coaches and a lot of imposing their views on other people. It's perfectly fine to act like Godly men, but the last three coaching staffs have tried to impose these views on their kids, and that's not fair to the student athletes. I would be saying the same thing if one of our coaches was a Muslim teaching the Quran to players.

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I honestly laughed out loud when I read the title of this thread. I didn't waste my time reading all 13 pages, because we all have had this argument many times. What is interesting to me is the full range of the allegations. Like was mentioned earlier. AU is different than most. Some think it must obviously be because we lie, cheat, steal, pay players, and do drugs. Others think we may be "too religious". What makes the arguments interesting is that it is funny the two are going on at the same time. Smh.

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As a true Auburn fan I want the coaches working hard to win and recruit and not have to worry that they do it the wrong way. I am not a turd fan and would not sacrifice honesty and a commitment to the STUDENT athlete just to win games. Yes I want Auburn to win, very badly in fact. But most of those kids will be leaving school to find jobs not located in the NFL and I want to see them do well in life and be good ambassadors for Auburn down the road. I also would not want anyone who would cheat to win football games. Having a coach with faith(which we usually do) only helps to keep the program honest. How can anyone say it does not work anyway? Look at the recruiting classes we have had lately. Why did most come here? Family. Tuberville had a great record winning games and he was about family. Plus who even can 100% say why Gus got the job? Does anyone here think he got it because he has high Christian values or because he is a good coach. I mean come on. People are acting like that is the only reason he got hired. And why does it disturb someone that a coach talks about his faith in an interview? Sure I do not think it should be a focus but how many players who commit on tv thank God? How many professionals, regardless of sport thank God for winning? How many actors thank God for winning? Most do so why is it wrong for our coaches to speek alittle about it?

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It sounds like some of the Johnny Come Lately Tiger Fans might need to do a little research on the history of Auburn University. It was founded as a Methodist School and has maintained a faith based tradition. A large number of high school athletes are members of FCA so I see any faith sharing as being a continuation of that.

I see no problems as long as no one is force fed anything. Athletes are young adults and can always exercise their option to not participate in such discussions. If its a major issue for an athlete, then maybe they belong elsewhere.

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Let's just bring religion out of football. It's very disturbing that you hear coaches in interviews talking about their faith so adamantly and talking about trying to impress it upon young student athletes. Quite frankly, it's disrespectful to the role of the parent or guardian, whose job it is to teach those things to a kid. We're not a private, Christian college, we are a public university whose sole purpose is to educate students and provide winning products in regards to athletics. Using that job to promote an agenda is out of line.

Well stated.

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Let's just bring religion out of football. It's very disturbing that you hear coaches in interviews talking about their faith so adamantly and talking about trying to impress it upon young student athletes. Quite frankly, it's disrespectful to the role of the parent or guardian, whose job it is to teach those things to a kid. We're not a private, Christian college, we are a public university whose sole purpose is to educate students and provide winning products in regards to athletics. Using that job to promote an agenda is out of line.

If they live out their faith in front of others, how is that promoting an agenda? It is a constitutional right to NOT be stopped from the "free exercise thereof" of any faith that you choose. Not just Christianity. The only agenda I see is the attempt to de-Christianize America. Which will never happen by the way.

You're not hearing what I'm saying. It's great to be a Christian, or be any religion you choose. However, it's not their job to be teaching those things to young people. It's completely inappropriate relative to their job - FOOTBALL, and if they wanted to promote Christianity they should have gone to seminary instead to seek a career in that direction.

So they should shut their mouths and modify their behavior in front of others?

Like it or not, proselytizing at work is likely to create issues with performance and morale. It's really not the best place to promote your particular religion. And it's certainly not recommended for anyone who wants to get ahead (at least in the secular world). ^-^

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I honestly laughed out loud when I read the title of this thread. I didn't waste my time reading all 13 pages, because we all have had this argument many times. What is interesting to me is the full range of the allegations. Like was mentioned earlier. AU is different than most. Some think it must obviously be because we lie, cheat, steal, pay players, and do drugs. Others think we may be "too religious". What makes the arguments interesting is that it is funny the two are going on at the same time. Smh.

LOL!! Good point.

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It sounds like some of the Johnny Come Lately Tiger Fans might need to do a little research on the history of Auburn University. It was founded as a Methodist School and has maintained a faith based tradition. A large number of high school athletes are members of FCA so I see any faith sharing as being a continuation of that.

I see no problems as long as no one is force fed anything. Athletes are young adults and can always exercise their option to not participate in such discussions. If its a major issue for an athlete, then maybe they belong elsewhere.

What if he is just a basically good kid who happens to be an independent-minded agnostic and can run a 4.25? :big:

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This may be the hardest of all conversations to take sides with for me. I have my own beliefs that push me to say religion has no place at a public university. However, I'm not arrogant enough to say it has no purpose. My beliefs may not be those of our players, students, but I refuse to push my ideology on anyone else. To each his own.

Someone will take issue with this. They always do; siting how religion has been at the root of most war on this planet. I'll state this as simply as possible. The average church goer, statistically, is much less likely to commit a crime against his fellow man than a non church goer. Therefore, as someone who is not religious, I view religion in a different light as atheist.

Have fun with this one...

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It sounds like some of the Johnny Come Lately Tiger Fans might need to do a little research on the history of Auburn University. It was founded as a Methodist School and has maintained a faith based tradition. A large number of high school athletes are members of FCA so I see any faith sharing as being a continuation of that.

I see no problems as long as no one is force fed anything. Athletes are young adults and can always exercise their option to not participate in such discussions. If its a major issue for an athlete, then maybe they belong elsewhere.

What if he is just a basically good kid who happens to be an independent-minded agnostic and can run a 4.25? :big:/>

Sounds like he would fit in better elsewhere. Auburn is traditionally conservative school and I see no reason to sell out to a kid that is an unproven commodity.

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All these hypothetical what ifs about offending agnostics. LOL....I would be surprised if there were more than a half a dozen guys on Auburn's roster who could give a concise definition of agnosticism..

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It sounds like some of the Johnny Come Lately Tiger Fans might need to do a little research on the history of Auburn University. It was founded as a Methodist School and has maintained a faith based tradition. A large number of high school athletes are members of FCA so I see any faith sharing as being a continuation of that.

I see no problems as long as no one is force fed anything. Athletes are young adults and can always exercise their option to not participate in such discussions. If its a major issue for an athlete, then maybe they belong elsewhere.

What if he is just a basically good kid who happens to be an independent-minded agnostic and can run a 4.25? :big:

How tall and what position?
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For centuries, good men such as ourselves, have stormed the internet and taken to the message boards and chatrooms to discuss the role religion should play in our daily lives...

I have no idea why people debate religion....(of course even sillier is a guy who comes on message boards and reads debates about religion and then criticizes those who participate in said debate....Dansby takes long look in mirror....Aaaaand SCENE!)

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