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Jordan-Hare Stadium Renovation


logan adams

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18 minutes ago, JwgreDeux said:

I think every one agrees the north endzone support structure is not attractive. However, the rest of the exterior and the interior are far from ugly. I have seen nicer stadiums (NFL) and certainly think we can improve what we have, but lets at least frame the discussion more accurately. We would like to keep JH as one of the largest on campus stadiums that is routinely ranked as a great gameday atmosphere; we are nowhere near getting left behind in the stadium arms race. 

 

Again I would say, butts in seats make every stadium look better. So everyone go to a game, its a win - win. 

we are getting LAPPED BROTHER LAPPED!!!!! schools with way less tradition than us are running circles around us in the arms race and laughing at us. Jordan Hare desperately needs a face lift and we desperately need a new football ops only facility.

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28 minutes ago, GwillMac6 said:

we are getting LAPPED BROTHER LAPPED!!!!! schools with way less tradition than us are running circles around us in the arms race and laughing at us. Jordan Hare desperately needs a face lift and we desperately need a new football ops only facility.

 I am curious about how many other stadiums you have personally visited to make this comparison . Some of the other stadiums in the conference are down right ancient and while the schools have spent a lot of money on them , they are often just putting lipstick on the pig. JMO.   People come to the winning football teams, not fancy stadiums . In my view, Alburn pretty well has its priorities in the right order. 

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1 minute ago, AU64 said:

 I am curious about how many other stadiums you have personally visited to make this comparison . Some of the other stadiums in the conference are down right ancient and while the schools have spent a lot of money on them , they are often just putting lipstick on the pig. JMO.   People come to the winning football teams, not fancy stadiums . In my view, Alburn pretty well has its priorities in the right order. 

Ole Miss stadium this weekend is downright beautiful with what they have done to the place with all the updates. They have o about 95% less of the tradition than us. UMMMMM why can we not have both? be a winning football program which we def are AND have one of the nicest facilities? I do not want to get bigger just nicer!

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3 hours ago, GwillMac6 said:

we are getting LAPPED BROTHER LAPPED!!!!! schools with way less tradition than us are running circles around us in the arms race and laughing at us. Jordan Hare desperately needs a face lift and we desperately need a new football ops only facility.

We're not getting lapped and no reason to shout. Yes JH could be better and it will be your just going to have to wait until JJ and JG have retired/left. Money is there and the big money guys are ready just not at this time. We will be fine. If you don't know Ole Miss does have a good bit of tradition.

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4 minutes ago, augolf1716 said:

We're not getting lapped and no reason to shout. Yes JH could be better and it will be your just going to have to wait until JJ and JG have retired/left. Money is there and the big money guys are ready just not at this time. We will be fine. If you don't know Ole Miss does have a good bit of tradition.

I mean sure from over 50 years ago. Not 1 conference title since 63 and the only sec west team besides the new kids on the block TAMU to never participate in the SEC title game.

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5 minutes ago, GwillMac6 said:

I mean sure from over 50 years ago. Not 1 conference title since 63 and the only sec west team besides the new kids on the block TAMU to never participate in the SEC title game.

Well.. they are getting investigated by the NCAA, so that puts them up there with the big dogs in the SEC.

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12 minutes ago, GwillMac6 said:

I mean sure from over 50 years ago. Not 1 conference title since 63 and the only sec west team besides the new kids on the block TAMU to never participate in the SEC title game.

ok you know better carry on but JH ain't changing for a  while

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So JH isnt that bad, but it could certainly look way better (personally i love the concrete cathedral look on the sides- beautiful). I was at the TCU game this past weekend (vs texas tech). Their stadium is pretty nice, very small (45k) but very well done. Their field house is embedded into one endzone and gives it a spanish arena type look. Id love to see Auburn just do something that enhances the exterior or spruce up the interior with better TVs & Sound system- to me those are little details that go a long way

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At this point nothing JJ says about the stadium means anything. It's all used car salesman talk. He has zero credibility with the fans on it so he needs to just stop bringing it up. We don't need any more fan surveys about it either.

 

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7 hours ago, IronMan70 said:

At this point nothing JJ says about the stadium means anything. It's all used car salesman talk. He has zero credibility with the fans on it so he needs to just stop bringing it up. We don't need any more fan surveys about it either.

 

Not sure this is true.....and I would not be surprised if it is the BOT that wants all the verification that the fans are willing to pay for the work and not some tactic by JJ.  More likely in my view is that he wants to do the work and the BOT is telling him to confirm there is a need or demand from ticket holders and that the money is available. 

I keep reading that "the money is there"....but I'm waiting on a link or something to confirm that.   It's pretty easy to get excited , or insistent about spending other people's money but I'm seriously skeptical that there is this big pot of money available for a project that probably has a miniscule ROI.

Once again I point out that AU is still in a billion dollar fund raising campaign and I doubt the BOT is eager to establish a campaign that would compete with it .....especially for stadium improvements that might not have that much financial support.  Noise on the internet proves nothing.

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47 minutes ago, AU64 said:

Not sure this is true.....and I would not be surprised if it is the BOT that wants all the verification that the fans are willing to pay for the work and not some tactic by JJ.  More likely in my view is that he wants to do the work and the BOT is telling him to confirm there is a need or demand from ticket holders and that the money is available. 

I keep reading that "the money is there"....but I'm waiting on a link or something to confirm that.   It's pretty easy to get excited , or insistent about spending other people's money but I'm seriously skeptical that there is this big pot of money available for a project that probably has a miniscule ROI.

Once again I point out that AU is still in a billion dollar fund raising campaign and I doubt the BOT is eager to establish a campaign that would compete with it .....especially for stadium improvements that might not have that much financial support.  Noise on the internet proves nothing.

There is no link but you know this. 

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21 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

There is no link but you know this. 

Actually I don't know that....though it might be the case after the BECAUSE campaign wraps up. :dunno:

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The money is there.  Hell, the SECNetwork has hauled in over $50mm the last couple of years, the AU recent contracts with Fox and UA are very lucrative as well, increasing revenue to AU Athletics.

The folks running the show at AU don't want the man in charge of the Athletic Department to head up this renovation project, period.

I've resolved to the fact that "it is what it is".  Jay would be better served to just make a statement that ends all discussion once and for all.  When and if he ever gets approval to pull the project off the shelf and start slinging brink & mortar then he can address the public.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, AU64 said:

Actually I don't know that....though it might be the case after the BECAUSE campaign wraps up. :dunno:

 there's not going to be a published link for something like that since it's a big boosters form of a vote of no confidence in JJ. You just going to have to choose to trust the Insiders on this one or not to.

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So we're in a billion dollar campaign, but youre skeptical we have the money for a stadium reno? The money is there. The fans are there, theres one big, white dude holding it back from happening

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6 hours ago, Auhud08 said:

So we're in a billion dollar campaign, but you're skeptical we have the money for a stadium reno? The money is there. The fans are there, there's one big, white dude holding it back from happening

The money is earmarked, as I understand, as a capital campaign.  AU can then borrow for stadium using the campaign money as security (or even borrow from the capital account as a strict note payable) but you just don't go in and snatch up capital campaign money for pet projects.  

For those who actually read this, put your bias aside and read it straight up - as-is.  Learn your lesson from that school to the west of us.  UA is a financial mess because they cratered their capital fund.  At this time, UA is admitting a disproportionate number of out-of-state vs. in-state students because of oos tuition is higher.  Really?  You have a state university that has so mangled their financials that they are not serving the in-state students.  That is a fail and it is sad.  It's not that they have forgotten that they are a state educational institution - it's just they did not manage their resources well.  Can you imagine a dependence on football revenue as a [small yet ] core element of your operating budget?  A bad day with the NCAA can damage your operations.  What kind of idiot puts you into that situation?

Capital campaign contributors (at least from my perspective|for me) are funding core Auburn University the education institution - not Auburn University the sports mill. I have no problem funding the sports complexes with initiatives earmarked for such.  I went to Auburn.  I have a son there now.  I have given to the school. It is an excellent academic institution (in a number of areas I'd legitimately use elite) and I will dig in to fight to maintain the institutional integrity.  

I will give you my big concern.  As UA has known financial issues, I half expect a successful capital campaign at Auburn could cause some Alabama legislators to shift state funds from a financially healthy Auburn to a financially troubled UA.

"The [Alabama] University’s “non-current liabilities” – mostly long-term debt – were $951.8 million as of Sept. 30, 2014, up an incredible 169 percent (from $353 million) in just five years. [editor note: I believe the author typo 169% should be 269%]

"In short, it appears that the [Alabama] University is trying to grow its way out of debt, but it’s not working. From 2006 to 2013, it added nearly 11,000 students while adding only 62 tenured/tenure-track faculty lines (net) – ditching the tier-one research university strategy in favor of packing the classrooms with out-of-state tuition dollars and inexpensive temporary instructors. But the debt is exploding anyway. To some of us academics on the outside, the Witt plan looks like a failure and a bubble that will eventually burst.

"The University of Alabama is nowhere close to being a tier-one research university. Ask your professors, they know. In 2013, the National Science Foundation ranked the University 190th in the nation among research universities in terms of research and development dollars, well below UAB (#44), UAH (#146) [editor: the UA network] and every flagship university in the nation except The University of South Dakota.   Link

Numbers 2015    Auburn                   UA

student body       21,786               31,958

tuition revenue      395.6             633.4 M ,<- Gross, not net, which is how ours is measured. 

research/grants     120.5               31.7 M

The financial statements below Auburn has a 100 M upside in direct balance sheet costs.  UA 33 M.  In short - they can't retire their debt.  A complete loss of auxilliary goes -33 M Auburn, -140M+ UA. BTW, I'm not business - I am engineer.  

AU_2016_11_03_12_41_06.png

UA_2016_11_03_12_40_25.png

Another interesting element of UA's financial statement is UA's burn of 38.7M in investment loss and 39.6M in interest expense (add non-specific 2.7M.)  Over 80M in non-operating expenses.  I also notice that depreciation expense is not showing up on UA means no balance sheet allowance for depreciated asset replacement.  Hey, they have a billion dollar stadium!*  Color me not impressed.

* Went back to verify - 1 billion this is a figure I've heard thrown around.  I really can't determine the actual cost because of the 90 years, multiple phases and current year cost equivalency (I am just not that enthusiastic to go through that exercise.)  You get the point.

Auburn has 951.3 income - 851.8 expenses for right at 100M for campus projects

UA has 770M income and 887 expenses and are operating upside down -117,334,480 (deficit).  Non-operating income is keeping them afloat. They are sucking wind. Badly. The economy is not back to "robust" by any means.  Be smart not showy.

 

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Great post oldaufellow.     As I noted elsewhere, I think that basically AU has its priorities in good order....which means emphasizing its primary role as an educational institution and not primarily as a host for a pre-NFL sports programs.

And as a person with some experience in raising funds for "worthwhile" and publicly supported projects I have learned that there is a difference between people who say they will contribute and those who actually do so when the time comes to write a check.    It's probably really easy to get AU alums and fans to give positive answers on surveys and indicate that they are willing to donate.....and getting that money out of them later on.   So while the "insiders" are confident the money is there....just color me skeptical for the time being.

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One thing that also bothers me is that Jacobs hasn't even finished projects that have already started. The backside of the video board has just been left completely open for over a year now. Temporary tarps were placed over it, but only to cover-up the incompletions. Finish the damn projects. 

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On ‎11‎/‎3‎/‎2016 at 0:27 AM, IronMan70 said:

At this point nothing JJ says about the stadium means anything. It's all used car salesman talk. He has zero credibility with the fans on it so he needs to just stop bringing it up. We don't need any more fan surveys about it either.

 

 

17 hours ago, AU64 said:

Not sure this is true.....and I would not be surprised if it is the BOT that wants all the verification that the fans are willing to pay for the work and not some tactic by JJ.  More likely in my view is that he wants to do the work and the BOT is telling him to confirm there is a need or demand from ticket holders and that the money is available. 

I keep reading that "the money is there"....but I'm waiting on a link or something to confirm that.   It's pretty easy to get excited , or insistent about spending other people's money but I'm seriously skeptical that there is this big pot of money available for a project that probably has a miniscule ROI.

Once again I point out that AU is still in a billion dollar fund raising campaign and I doubt the BOT is eager to establish a campaign that would compete with it .....especially for stadium improvements that might not have that much financial support.  Noise on the internet proves nothing.

Not sure that's true....;D

But I am quite sure that....JJ's words on the stadium mean nothing, he has lost all fan credibility on it and he needs to not talk about it. Oh yes and he can the surveys.

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12 hours ago, oldaufeller said:

The money is earmarked, as I understand, as a capital campaign.  AU can then borrow for stadium using the campaign money as security (or even borrow from the capital account as a strict note payable) but you just don't go in and snatch up capital campaign money for pet projects.  

For those who actually read this, put your bias aside and read it straight up - as-is.  Learn your lesson from that school to the west of us.  UA is a financial mess because they cratered their capital fund.  At this time, UA is admitting a disproportionate number of out-of-state vs. in-state students because of oos tuition is higher.  Really?  You have a state university that has so mangled their financials that they are not serving the in-state students.  That is a fail and it is sad.  It's not that they have forgotten that they are a state educational institution - it's just they did not manage their resources well.  Can you imagine a dependence on football revenue as a [small yet ] core element of your operating budget?  A bad day with the NCAA can damage your operations.  What kind of idiot puts you into that situation?

Capital campaign contributors (at least from my perspective|for me) are funding core Auburn University the education institution - not Auburn University the sports mill. I have no problem funding the sports complexes with initiatives earmarked for such.  I went to Auburn.  I have a son there now.  I have given to the school. It is an excellent academic institution (in a number of areas I'd legitimately use elite) and I will dig in to fight to maintain the institutional integrity.  

I will give you my big concern.  As UA has known financial issues, I half expect a successful capital campaign at Auburn could cause some Alabama legislators to shift state funds from a financially healthy Auburn to a financially troubled UA.

"The [Alabama] University’s “non-current liabilities” – mostly long-term debt – were $951.8 million as of Sept. 30, 2014, up an incredible 169 percent (from $353 million) in just five years. [editor note: I believe the author typo 169% should be 269%]

"In short, it appears that the [Alabama] University is trying to grow its way out of debt, but it’s not working. From 2006 to 2013, it added nearly 11,000 students while adding only 62 tenured/tenure-track faculty lines (net) – ditching the tier-one research university strategy in favor of packing the classrooms with out-of-state tuition dollars and inexpensive temporary instructors. But the debt is exploding anyway. To some of us academics on the outside, the Witt plan looks like a failure and a bubble that will eventually burst.

"The University of Alabama is nowhere close to being a tier-one research university. Ask your professors, they know. In 2013, the National Science Foundation ranked the University 190th in the nation among research universities in terms of research and development dollars, well below UAB (#44), UAH (#146) [editor: the UA network] and every flagship university in the nation except The University of South Dakota.   Link

Numbers 2015    Auburn                   UA

student body       21,786               31,958

tuition revenue      395.6             633.4 M ,<- Gross, not net, which is how ours is measured. 

research/grants     120.5               31.7 M

The financial statements below Auburn has a 100 M upside in direct balance sheet costs.  UA 33 M.  In short - they can't retire their debt.  A complete loss of auxilliary goes -33 M Auburn, -140M+ UA. BTW, I'm not business - I am engineer.  

 

 

Another interesting element of UA's financial statement is UA's burn of 38.7M in investment loss and 39.6M in interest expense (add non-specific 2.7M.)  Over 80M in non-operating expenses.  I also notice that depreciation expense is not showing up on UA means no balance sheet allowance for depreciated asset replacement.  Hey, they have a billion dollar stadium!*  Color me not impressed.

 

* Went back to verify - 1 billion this is a figure I've heard thrown around.  I really can't determine the actual cost because of the 90 years, multiple phases and current year cost equivalency (I am just not that enthusiastic to go through that exercise.)  You get the point.

 

Auburn has 951.3 income - 851.8 expenses for right at 100M for campus projects

 

Then JJ shouldn't bring it up. That's easy.

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5 hours ago, IronMan70 said:

Then JJ shouldn't bring it up. That's easy.

A conspiracy theorist might consider that JJ keeps this issue alive to put pressure on the BOT to approve or fund it?   But yes.....sounds like he ought to just let it drop for a while....... though I doubt people favoring a big stadium project will just quit lobbying for it.  

Contrary to popular view, I figure that JJ is in favor of the project but can't get it improved by his bosses.    After all,  what guys like JJ usually have as a legacy is some huge capital project that they got done.  I never saw a bureaucratic leader who was not fully engaged in leaving some monument to his/her time on the job.

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6 hours ago, IronMan70 said:

Then JJ shouldn't bring it up. That's easy.

JJ's business responsibility is athletics. Even so, he's fishing for support during a massive capital campaign.  I agree - he should wait.

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23 minutes ago, oldaufeller said:

JJ's business responsibility is athletics. Even so, he's fishing for support during a massive capital campaign.  I agree - he should wait.

He has no support and is not getting it for any major renovations. he is the reason  boosters have not put up any capital for any major projects.

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oldaufeller

Thanks for providing insight into UA's finances.  I find it odd that they are still building, renovating, and expanding academic buildings, student housing, etc. in the midst of a severe debt crisis.  I read where they topped 37,000 in enrollment this academic year.

I guess it's better keep Auburn "as is", small in student population and in much better financial standing.

As to Jay Jacobs,  silence on the subject of a JHS renovation project would serve him better IMO.

 

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1 hour ago, keesler said:

oldaufeller

Thanks for providing insight into UA's finances.  I find it odd that they are still building, renovating, and expanding academic buildings, student housing, etc. in the midst of a severe debt crisis.  I read where they topped 37,000 in enrollment this academic year.

I guess it's better keep Auburn "as is", small in student population and in much better financial standing.

As to Jay Jacobs,  silence on the subject of a JHS renovation project would serve him better IMO.

 

Appreciate it.  I heard  Auburn President Jay Gogue a few years back talking about taking the Auburn position.  He said his first advice came from his wife ... I can't remember the exact wording, something akin to "Auburn is already great, don't mess it up." :) 

As far as Jay Jacobs, I'd like to think that our department heads are forward thinking.  A plan and vision are desired but this whole idea (in my opinion) should be vision and not be proposal - yet.  A subtle yet distinct approach to acknowledging we have a direction to go but we're going to do it right - and at the right time.  It actually takes pretty decent management and people skills to pull that off successfully.  I don't fault him, he just might need a little "help" to polish the PR and expectations.

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