Purifoy completely clear to play 2016-17 season

[tigermac 11]

Purifoy at the 4 will be fine especially the way Pearl will use him. He will handle the ball as much as 3s would in any other system, especially with our lack of play making at PG. He'll also play some 3 in certain lineups, but for pure spacing reasons we need him more at the 4. Playing two bigs who can't shoot would hurt our ability to penetrate (Dunans' strength) and kick for open looks (Brown/Lang). 

The game is evolving into more "positionless" basketball. These 6-7 6-8 230-240 guys now play a ton of 4 in the NBA. Melo, who is a traditional 3 in ever sense of the word thrives at the 4 in the league now because of how the game is played. LeBron plays the 3 but he's more devestating when he's at the 4, playing with 3 shooters around him. And we can't say other schools don't do it with 5 star talent because that just ain't true. Jabari Parker played the 5 most of his freshman year at Duke and NBA scouts had no problem projecting him at the hybrid 3/4 he plays. He still got drafted top 5. Now, I'm not saying Danjel is the caliber of any of those guys but he better learn how to show the skillset to play some 4 if he wants to play in the NBA. If he can show that ability it will help his stock and not hurt it at all. If he shows the requisite skills to still play his primary NBA position of small forward he'll be alright.

[WarTiger 3,896]

13 minutes ago, tigermac said:

Purifoy at the 4 will be fine especially the way Pearl will use him. He will handle the ball as much as 3s would in any other system, especially with our lack of play making at PG.   How do you know we are lacking play making ability at the point?  We have NEW players coming in to run that position.  He'll also play some 3 in certain lineups, but for pure spacing reasons we need him more at the 4. Playing two bigs who can't shoot would hurt our ability to penetrate (Dunans' strength) and kick for open looks (Brown/Lang). 

The game is evolving into more "positionless" basketball. These 6-7 6-8 230-240 guys now play a ton of 4 in the NBA. Melo, who is a traditional 3 in ever sense of the word thrives at the 4 in the league now because of how the game is played. LeBron plays the 3 but he's more devestating when he's at the 4, playing with 3 shooters around him. And we can't say other schools don't do it with 5 star talent because that just ain't true. Jabari Parker played the 5 most of his freshman year at Duke and NBA scouts had no problem projecting him at the hybrid 3/4 he plays. He still got drafted top 5. Now, I'm not saying Danjel is the caliber of any of those guys but he better learn how to show the skillset to play some 4 if he wants to play in the NBA. If he can show that ability it will help his stock and not hurt it at all. If he shows the requisite skills to still play his primary NBA position of small forward he'll be alright.

 

[ellitor 33,062]

18 minutes ago, WarTiger said:

How do you know we are lacking play making ability at the point?  We have NEW players coming in to run that position.

They could turn into play makers I suppose but neither PG we are bringing in were play makers at their previous stop. Johnson is basketball's version of a game managing QB. Harper is a 3 point bomber who also passes well.

[tigermac 11]

19 minutes ago, WarTiger said:

We absolutely are lacking playmaking at that position. Last year we had two guys who could consistently make plays for others at PG (Canty and TSD). They're both gone and will be replaced by Jared Harper and Johnson the transfer. I've seen Harper play probably a dozen times in high school and AAU,  and while I think he is going to be a hell of a player he's more of a scorer than he is a creator. And he's the closest thing we'll have to a pure PG. Johnson may be good but he didn't exactly set it on fire at Houston. Not enough to make me think he's gonna come in here and give us 5-6 assists per game.

 

[ellitor 33,062]

The good news there @tigermac is Pearl likes to have essentially have a point forward. He has done that many many times in his career.

[tigermac 11]

1 minute ago, ellitor said:

The good news there @tigermac is Pearl likes to have essentially have a point forward. He has done that many many times in his career.

Yep that's exactly what I'm saying. Purifoy will have ample opportunities to show his ability to make plays for himself and others.

[cole256 17,039]

On 7/17/2016 at 9:03 AM, tigermac said:

Purifoy at the 4 will be fine especially the way Pearl will use him. He will handle the ball as much as 3s would in any other system, especially with our lack of play making at PG. He'll also play some 3 in certain lineups, but for pure spacing reasons we need him more at the 4. Playing two bigs who can't shoot would hurt our ability to penetrate (Dunans' strength) and kick for open looks (Brown/Lang). 

The game is evolving into more "positionless" basketball. These 6-7 6-8 230-240 guys now play a ton of 4 in the NBA. Melo, who is a traditional 3 in ever sense of the word thrives at the 4 in the league now because of how the game is played. LeBron plays the 3 but he's more devestating when he's at the 4, playing with 3 shooters around him. And we can't say other schools don't do it with 5 star talent because that just ain't true. Jabari Parker played the 5 most of his freshman year at Duke and NBA scouts had no problem projecting him at the hybrid 3/4 he plays. He still got drafted top 5. Now, I'm not saying Danjel is the caliber of any of those guys but he better learn how to show the skillset to play some 4 if he wants to play in the NBA. If he can show that ability it will help his stock and not hurt it at all. If he shows the requisite skills to still play his primary NBA position of small forward he'll be alright.

Parker playing 5 a majority of his freshman year isn't true at all. But we'll see....as far as when he was at UT Pearl used one guy as a point forward and that guy could have actually been classified a 2 guard as well. And I don't know about liking it but when that first started was because the guard that forward was paired up with was literally the best shooter in the SEC. It really was just a way to get your best shooter off the ball, exactly what you see golden state do with curry to free him up more.

Lastly it's more about the skill set of a player than what a coach likes. In this thread people have assumed purifoy is an excellent rebounder able to off set being 3-4 inches undersized, he's a good to great outside shooter, a good to great finisher, a good to great ball handler, a good to great decision maker, and a good to great post defender all without even seeing him play....talking about what LeBron andCarmello does???? Really. LeBron is literally regarded as the best passer in the NBA, and Carmello is regarded as having the best low post footwork minus Tim Duncan in the NBA......

Look I can do that too then, if dunnans grew to 6'6" and since he played guard he can be one of the greatest players ever, remember Michael Jordan was 6'6"and look at what he did in the NBA...

[AuburnNTexas 7,127]

5 hours ago, cole256 said:

Parker playing 5 a majority of his freshman year isn't true at all. But we'll see....as far as when he was at UT Pearl used one guy as a point forward and that guy could have actually been classified a 2 guard as well. And I don't know about liking it but when that first started was because the guard that forward was paired up with was literally the best shooter in the SEC. It really was just a way to get your best shooter off the ball, exactly what you see golden state do with curry to free him up more.

Lastly it's more about the skill set of a player than what a coach likes. In this thread people have assumed purifoy is an excellent rebounder able to off set being 3-4 inches undersized, he's a good to great outside shooter, a good to great finisher, a good to great ball handler, a good to great decision maker, and a good to great post defender all without even seeing him play....talking about what LeBron andCarmello does???? Really. LeBron is literally regarded as the best passer in the NBA, and Carmello is regarded as having the best low post footwork minus Tim Duncan in the NBA......

Look I can do that too then, if dunnans grew to 6'6" and since he played guard he can be one of the greatest players ever, remember Michael Jordan was 6'6"and look at what he did in the NBA...

I think most of us are basing his capability on word that came from coaches and other players last year about how good he was.  All players who play similar positions to the greats get compared to them that does not mean we think they are as good as those players they are more like the yardsticks to compare people to.  In college ball you could be a lot less talented than LeBron or Carmello and still be a great player.  You are correct we haven't seen him play and it might be wishful thinking as in the eyes of most fans the team is much better before the season starts and reality sets in.

If however what we heard about him from the other players on the team last year are true he will be a big help even if not playing his ideal position. With the exception of a few teams nobody has all 5 players plus backups that fit the ideal size, speed and ball handling skills for each position. He will play against 4's who have the height but are slow or have bad footwork, he will play against 4's who are shorter like him. He will also play against some really good 4's.  Not every team will have a great 4 that he will play against but when he does play against a great 4 we are hoping his offensive skills will allow him to score points and force the other 4 to play more d. Sometimes but not always when you play against a great player by holding his scoring and rebounding down a little and by scoring and rebound some yourself it is enough. Some times containing a great player is a win.

What I forsee is that Auburn this year is we will have the ability to put 5 players on the floor with some skill even if not always perfect for the position and we will have backups for all 5 starters with some skill most teams can't say the same. I don't think many teams in the SEC will have our depth. A couple of injuries and that changes quickly but as of now I think we will be a very solid team I don't know if we will be great. But season hasn't started yet so it is easy to dream.

 

 

[cole256 17,039]

It's not even the comparison really it's the fact that the guys mentioned are very VERY unique players with unique skill sets. Saying how LeBron can guard some 4's just doesn't make sense since he is literally a freak of nature.

But I just feel DJ is getting built up to be on a level he's not going to be able to perform next year and people will start attacking him. 

And lastly him playing out of position in the post at times and he's never played the position before, just seems like he will end up in foul trouble alot

[tigermac 11]

Maybe you missed the part where I said I'm not saying Danjel is either LeBron or Carmelo. I know he's not that caliber of player and I'm not in the camp of people that expects him to be this world beater. I think he'll be a good college player with the chance to play in the NBA. Most NBA 3s now play some at the 4, therefore it's not going to kill him to get experience playing 4 I'm college...where playing "out of position" won't be as glaring as it would at the professional level. If he's a capable NBA talent at the 3 then he's fine playing the 4 in college. And Parker absolutely played a lot of 5 at Duke. Sure they started Amile Jefferson there but Parker ended up playing a ton of minutes at that spot. 

[cole256 17,039]

I'm not going to argue but no just because you're a capable NBA 3 doesn't mean you can automatically be a college 4. No not most 3's play 4 but 3's with some mass and length might, and that's only if they can present a mismatch. And like I said the problem isn't the generic comparing him to great players, it's using players that are unique in their skill set to make a point for him. Ben Simmons is basically a 6'10" pg....no you can't use him to say 6'10" players can play pg....look at Ben Simmons....that's extremely misleading. And also too look at the mass of Anthony and LeBron James, DP does not have that body type. Nic Batum is probably the most under rated 3 in the league. He can score inside and out, a great passer and one of the best defenders in the league. They don't play him at the 4 because of his body type. They don't play the kid in Milwaukee at the 4 and he's longer than damn near everybody in the league. They moved the Morris twin on the pistons from four to three because he can't defend the post, and Stan van Gundy is one of the FIRST coaches that will play an untraditional style to create mismatches.

[NoALtiger 3,849]

Cole has forgotten more about basketball than I'll ever know, just wanna throw that out there. 

[augolf1716 21,093]

He knows BB

[tigermac 11]

I'm glad you brought Marcus Morris up. Exactly. In college he was an All-American at the 4. Like you said, he plays the 3 for Detroit now. So, it's not some major hindrance to a guy to play out of position in college.

Of course the position you play is more based on skill set than just pure height/weight, I didn't say that size is the only indicator of position. I used the example of Bron/Melo because those are two NBA 3s who play a lot of 4. Yeah their skill sets are rare and allow them to play the 4 more effectively on that level. But any NBA caliber 3 can be an effective 4 on the college level. 

[cole256 17,039]

That's ridiculous to say any 3 can be a 4 that's not true. And Morris played 3 more than 4 in college playing along side his brother, meanwhile his brother can't play. It is a major hindrance on any level if you don't develop a skill set needed to play the position you play. 

You used LeBron and Melo but they are once in generational players with particular skill sets that set them apart but none greater than actually being stronger than normal 4's. You either going to make up for playing D down low by mass or length. That's it.

Also look at how many people have been trying to find another Dirk. Usually at least one guy per draft since he's been in the league. But if you can't shoot like Dirk then you're not going to be productive like Dirk. There isn't a yeah Dirk does it so everybody can button. Just like you can't say Jordan is 6'6" so all guys with his frame and weight can all be 1st team NBA defenders

[tigermac 11]

I didn't say any 3 can be a 4. I said any NBA caliber 3 can play the COLLEGE 4. Go down all 30 NBA starters at small forward and show me one whose game couldn't be effective in college at the 4. Marcus Morris played the 4 at Kansas and his twin brother was the 5. They typically ran three guards around them (Reed, Taylor, Morningstar). IF Danjel is 6-7 225ish, he should have the requisite mass that you said is needed...which is what I was saying in the first post. Regardless...no sense in arguing it...we'll find out soon enough if the kid is the pro prospect most think he can be and if he's capable of playing 4 at this level. 

[Tiger 8,817]

How do you guys feel about Tobias Harris? How does Purifoy's game compare to his? They seem to be around the same height. I know skillset is more important than just the measureables. But Harris played the 4 for Pearl at UT but has played both 3 and 4 in the NBA with 3 being his more natural position. When Harris was at UT Pearl started 3 guards, Harris and a Center. 

I see what Cole is saying and I also see what tigermac is saying but I don't think it's cut and dry one way or the other. I think even if Purifoy is a natural 3, and his projected position at the next level, he can be put in a position to succeed at AU, even if it's not 100% ideal (or if he's 100% maximizing his potential here because of roster shortcomings) that he's not playing exclusively the 3. This is all assuming he's going to meet the expectations of how good he is, obviously. But the NBA can identify that he's better suited for the 3 and his draft stock will be based on that, not necessarily his production, or lack thereof, of playing the 4 spot.

[cole256 17,039]

On 7/23/2016 at 10:52 PM, tigermac said:

I didn't say any 3 can be a 4. I said any NBA caliber 3 can play the COLLEGE 4. Go down all 30 NBA starters at small forward and show me one whose game couldn't be effective in college at the 4. Marcus Morris played the 4 at Kansas and his twin brother was the 5. They typically ran three guards around them (Reed, Taylor, Morningstar). IF Danjel is 6-7 225ish, he should have the requisite mass that you said is needed...which is what I was saying in the first post. Regardless...no sense in arguing it...we'll find out soon enough if the kid is the pro prospect most think he can be and if he's capable of playing 4 at this level. 

Mike dunleavy, Kyle korver, Andre Robertson, Alan crabbe, Andre igudola, Jimmy butler, kwai Leonard, Richard Jefferson, Joe Johnson, terrace Ross, in his day Stephan Jackson, the Milwaukee guy a mentioned. Paul George, Vince Carter, tyreek Evans, Paul pierce, Andrew Wiggins, Jamal Dudley and that's people off the top of my head if I actually looked at a roster I'd name many more. 

[AuburnNTexas 7,127]

Tigermac and Cole both have legitimate points.  On basketball I usually side with Cole as he has forgotten more than I ever knew. In this case I agree that Purifoy best position is 3 but I don't think it will hurt him in the Pearl offense to play 4. The good news is with Wiley coming in one year later it could be a mute argument as we might have enough big man to allow Purifoy to play 3 on a regular basis.

If Spencer has improved his inside game and can become an offense option this year I could see us using Smith Spencer and Purifoy for short periods of time this year allowing Purifoy to play 3.  With the number of able bodies that we theoretically have this year I expect to see many different lineups and at times very non-traditional lineups. 

Now we get to wait till season starts and see who is really correct. My big hope though is that all the hype about Purifoy is true and that we see the Purifoy that his teammates last year talked about. If he is really that good then I am not worried about whether Cole or Tigermac is correct.

 

[cole256 17,039]

I'm worried about purifoy guarding the post more than offense. As far as offense he will need to show a skill set to be in the NBA and that skill set will need to be skills of a perimeter player. Like all things in life, to develop you need to put your skills to task in real situations. But once again playing defense in the post is as much feel for the position than anything and it's a position he has not played, so I worry about him getting in foul trouble too quick.

[cole256 17,039]

On 7/22/2016 at 8:38 AM, NoALtiger said:

Cole has forgotten more about basketball than I'll ever know, just wanna throw that out there. 

Thanks! Spent most of my life on a court against some great players. Now I'm living through the younger players and family that has told me I've influenced them some. I can only imagine what having a child is like because I feel so invested lol

[tigermac 11]

On 7/25/2016 at 7:56 PM, cole256 said:

Mike dunleavy, Kyle korver, Andre Robertson, Alan crabbe, Andre igudola, Jimmy butler, kwai Leonard, Richard Jefferson, Joe Johnson, terrace Ross, in his day Stephan Jackson, the Milwaukee guy a mentioned. Paul George, Vince Carter, tyreek Evans, Paul pierce, Andrew Wiggins, Jamal Dudley and that's people off the top of my head if I actually looked at a roster I'd name many more. 

Lol let's agree to disagree. A lot of those dudes play some 4 in the NBA so they definitely could have/did in college. We'll see how Danjel handles it. Again, I'd prefer to see him play his natural 3 also, but I see why Bruce would like him at 4 especially with the current roster. I don't think it will stunt his growth all that much. Moving on...I watched him a handful of times in high school/AAU and got the impression he could eventually develop into an NBA player. I don't know if he's just a surefire NBA pick. I'm sure you've also seen him play, did you get the feeling that he is definitely 100% going to get drafted in a couple years? I saw people talking one and done last year and didn't quite think he was THAT good.