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ellitor

AU attrition from 8/1/16-7/31/17

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2 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

I'd say no. Kozan is going to play on Sundays. Why risk another injury? 

Was not expecting a serious answer.

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18 minutes ago, AUDevil said:

What about a player who leaves after playing all 4 years?  They could've redshirted their 5th year...is that attrition, too?

Sure.  They could be on the scout team if they stayed.

Edited by triangletiger

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9 hours ago, Mikey said:

Not exactly and certainly not for all Power 5 teams. However, every time I've bothered to check some teams other than Auburn their numbers have been roughly the same as ours. I see no reason to think any are significantly different.

Over the years our attrition has normally been in the range of 7 to 11 each year , so the 15 in 2014/15 and 14 in 2015/16 are historically high. It's hard to get to the full 85 limit when there is a 25 annual limit on signees and grads+attrition can easily surpass 25.

I still don't understand all this 25- 85 limits. I'm old school. How can some teams get and sign 29 or 30 in some years say for example like Tenn. this year? they already have 29 commits this year. Just asking folks. Seems like to me that if a school is allowed 85 schollys then they should be able to fill their roster regardless of the 25 limit.

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1 minute ago, cctiger said:

I still don't understand all this 25- 85 limits. I'm old school. How can some teams get and sign 29 or 30 in some years say for example like Tenn. this year? they already have 29 commits this year. Just asking folks. Seems like to me that if a school is allowed 85 schollys then they should be able to fill their roster regardless of the 25 limit.

If a school didn't sign 25 the previous class, they can count early enrollees back to the previous class; thereby ending up with more than 25 in a given class.

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12 hours ago, auburn4ever said:

Seems like Gus has problems keeping players because he doesn't play them enough. That's pretty clear.

That's clearly not the case so far this "attrition year."  

Jovon Robinson - series of attitude and off the field issues

Rashad Kennion -  playing time, but then again he was competing with Lawson, Cowart and Davidson for PT.  Hard to fault the coaches on that.

Landon Rice - sexual assault allegations

Stanton Truitt - playing time

Carl Lawson - NFL

 

So, only two of the five are PT issues so far and one is simply because he wasn't good enough to beat out the more talented guys ahead of him.  Frankly, that may be the case with Truitt as well.

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57 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

 

And is Lawson really considered attrition? 

Absolutely. He could have played another year and will not. Quoted from the OP: "Note that I count as attrition any player that left with eligibility remaining." The reason they left matters not at all. Part of the benefit of keeping this is to estimate future scholarship slots available. Jovon Robinson and Carl Lawson both opened a slot, did they not? There's no difference, both are attrition.

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I was looking at previous recruiting classes and 2014 stuck out. 

Signed 25, still on team as of 1/5/17 - 16.  Nine total players gone for 36% attrition.  Not sure what average is, but it seems high. 

Players no longer on team:

D'haquille Williams

WR

Perkinston, MS

6'3"

200

   

6.1

7/21/13

Racean Thomas

RB

Oxford, AL

5'11"

198

   

6.1

8/2/13

Derrick Moncrief

DB

Perkinston, MS

6'3"

226

   

5.8

5/10/13

Justin Thornton

DE

Prichard, AL

6'6"

220

   

5.9

5/12/13

Nicholas Ruffin

DB

Atlanta, GA

6'0"

172

   

5.8

5/26/13

Stanton Truitt

ATH

Monroe, GA

5'9"

177

   

5.8

7/17/13

Kalvaraz Bessent

DB

Kingsland, GA

6'1"

188

   

5.8

12/10/13

Chris Laye

TE

Suwanee, GA

6'6"

225

   

5.5

4/8/13

Jakell Mitchell

TE

Opelika, AL

6'4"

210

   

5.5

5/25/13

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2 hours ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

Kennion was a project from the beginning. Kid couldn't put on any weight. 

And is Lawson really considered attrition? 

There is such a thing as good attrition and that's Carl.

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2 hours ago, AUDevil said:

What about a player who leaves after playing all 4 years?  They could've redshirted their 5th year...is that attrition, too?

If you play all 4 year you don't have a 5th year. The 5th year is typically to play a 4th season.

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1 hour ago, douggwilliams said:

I was looking at previous recruiting classes and 2014 stuck out. 

Signed 25, still on team as of 1/5/17 - 16.  Nine total players gone for 36% attrition.  Not sure what average is, but it seems high. 

Players no longer on team:

Nicholas Ruffin

 

 

DB

 

Atlanta, GA

 

 

6'0"

 

 

172

 

 

   

5.8

 

 

5/26/13

 

 

                 

 

Did I miss Nick leaving the team?  Last I checked he was going to be one of our Senior DBs next year.  He had 4 solo tackles in the Sugar Bowl.

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39 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

Did I miss Nick leaving the team?  Last I checked he was going to be one of our Senior DBs next year.  He had 4 solo tackles in the Sugar Bowl.

Pretty sure Nick said he is returning

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43 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

Did I miss Nick leaving the team?  Last I checked he was going to be one of our Senior DBs next year.  He had 4 solo tackles in the Sugar Bowl.

Pretty sure Nick said he is returning when Stephen Roberts said he would return. 

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2 hours ago, cctiger said:

I still don't understand all this 25- 85 limits. I'm old school. How can some teams get and sign 29 or 30 in some years say for example like Tenn. this year? they already have 29 commits this year. Just asking folks. Seems like to me that if a school is allowed 85 schollys then they should be able to fill their roster regardless of the 25 limit.

What most people do not realize and understand and I didn't either til I read it from a Florida recruiting reporter a few months ago is there are 2 25 lists each year. There's the signed NLI 25 limit. That one usually does not reach it's limit as high school January enrollies do not sign NLIs. The other and more important 25 limit is the actual enrollie limit which are called Initial Counters by the NCAA. On this 25 limit everyone who gets a 1st time scholly before they are at a new school for 2 years has to count to the 25 IC limit. This includes grad transfers. There is a big difference between the 2 25 lists. The signee list can not have another player to replace a player that left the program on that list. It doesn't matter anyway since teams rarely reach that 25 limit now a days. On the actual enrolled IC list you can replace a 1st year scholarship player who counted in the prior year's class by a January enrollee if that player does not complete his 1st year of school. For example Bama can enroll 29 new players counting 4 back to their 2016 IC list. Looking at their numbers it looks like they counted Blake Barnett in their 2016 IC list even though he was a mid year enrollee last year. Mid year/January enrollies don't automatically count to prior year 25 IC limits. If they indeed counted BB in the 2016 IC list 1 of their January enrollies from this January can count on the 2016 IC list to fill BB's spot.

From reading this some of you may be wondering about Landon Rice and can we fill his spot since he was a 1st year scholarship player that left early. I don't think so as all AU sites are saying 25 is still our max. It true that means Landon Rice, who was a January enrollee last year, was counted by AU back to the 2015 IC list. A January 2017 enrolee can not count back to a 2015 IC list even if there is a spot because January enroilles can only count on the current Ic list or to the IC list from 1 year prior.

I had wondered how we brought in or put 32 new players on scholly 2 years ago and the 2nd 25 limit for ICs separate from the 25 signee limit is the only way that explains the numbers.  We filled gaps for a few years on players who left before their 1st year was over or players who signed but did not enroll (Earnest Robinson, Jason Smith, JaQuay Williams-Savage) to the point where it built up basically 7 extra spots in 2015.

Sorry that was lengthy and probably confusing but I hope that helps.

Edited by ellitor
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2 hours ago, triangletiger said:

If a school didn't sign 25 the previous class, they can count early enrollees back to the previous class; thereby ending up with more than 25 in a given class.

The signed number is not what is important. It's the enrolled number that's important.

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1 hour ago, ellitor said:

The signed number is not what is important. It's the enrolled number that's important.

Thanks for the clarification.

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3 hours ago, douggwilliams said:

I was looking at previous recruiting classes and 2014 stuck out. 

Signed 25, still on team as of 1/5/17 - 16.  Nine total players gone for 36% attrition.  Not sure what average is, but it seems high. 

Players no longer on team:

D'haquille Williams

 

 

WR

 

 

Perkinston, MS

 

 

6'3"

 

 

200

 

 

   

6.1

 

 

7/21/13

 

 

Racean Thomas

 

 

RB

 

 

Oxford, AL

 

 

5'11"

 

 

198

 

 

   

6.1

 

 

8/2/13

 

 

Derrick Moncrief

 

 

DB

 

 

Perkinston, MS

 

 

6'3"

 

 

226

 

 

   

5.8

 

 

5/10/13

 

 

Justin Thornton

 

 

DE

 

 

Prichard, AL

 

 

6'6"

 

 

220

 

 

   

5.9

 

 

5/12/13

 

 

Nicholas Ruffin

 

 

DB

 

 

Atlanta, GA

 

 

6'0"

 

 

172

 

 

   

5.8

 

 

5/26/13

 

 

Stanton Truitt

 

 

ATH

 

 

Monroe, GA

 

 

5'9"

 

 

177

 

 

   

5.8

 

 

7/17/13

 

 

Kalvaraz Bessent

 

 

DB

 

 

Kingsland, GA

 

 

6'1"

 

 

188

 

 

   

5.8

 

 

12/10/13

 

 

Chris Laye

 

 

TE

 

 

Suwanee, GA

 

 

6'6"

 

 

225

 

 

   

5.5

 

 

4/8/13

 

 

Jakell Mitchell

 

 

TE

 

 

Opelika, AL

 

 

6'4"

 

 

210

 

 

   

5.5

 

 

5/25/13

 

 

Nick Ruffin didn't leave.  He played for us this year in fact.

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Al.com says Jason Smith is staying despite graduating this year. 

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Not going to mention any names but looking down the roster I see 4 or 5 Sophomores or Juniors who had little or no playing time this year. Would expect one or more of them to move on one way or another before or after spring practice. However we always seem to have a surprise or two to leave the team.  Hopefully we won't lose impact players (other than Lawson of course) this time like we did in 2016.

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4 hours ago, ellitor said:

What most people do not realize and understand and I didn't either til I read it from a Florida recruiting reporter a few months ago is there are 2 25 lists each year. There's the signed NLI 25 limit. That one usually does not reach it's limit as high school January enrollies do not sign NLIs. The other and more important 25 limit is the actual enrollie limit which are called Initial Counters by the NCAA. On this 25 limit everyone who gets a 1st time scholly before they are at a new school for 2 years has to count to the 25 IC limit. This includes grad transfers. There is a big difference between the 2 25 lists. The signee list can not have another player to replace a player that left the program on that list. It doesn't matter anyway since teams rarely reach that 25 limit now a days. On the actual enrolled IC list you can replace a 1st year scholarship player who counted in the prior year's class by a January enrollee if that player does not complete his 1st year of school. For example Bama can enroll 29 new players counting 4 back to their 2016 IC list. Looking at their numbers it looks like they counted Blake Barnett in their 2016 IC list even though he was a mid year enrollee last year. Mid year/January enrollies don't automatically count to prior year 25 IC limits. If they indeed counted BB in the 2016 IC list 1 of their January enrollies from this January can count on the 2016 IC list to fill BB's spot.

From reading this some of you may be wondering about Landon Rice and can we fill his spot since he was a 1st year scholarship player that left early. I don't think so as all AU sites are saying 25 is still our max. It true that means Landon Rice, who was a January enrollee last year, was counted by AU back to the 2015 IC list. A January 2017 enrolee can not count back to a 2015 IC list even if there is a spot because January enroilles can only count on the current Ic list or to the IC list from 1 year prior.

I had wondered how we brought in or put 32 new players on scholly 2 years ago and the 2nd 25 limit for ICs separate from the 25 signee limit is the only way that explains the numbers.  We filled gaps for a few years on players who left before their 1st year was over or players who signed but did not enroll (Earnest Robinson, Jason Smith, JaQuay Williams-Savage) to the point where it built up basically 7 extra spots in 2015.

Sorry that was lengthy and probably confusing but I hope that helps.

Thanks ellitor and Triangle.

Edited by cctiger

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2 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

Al.com says Jason Smith is staying despite graduating this year. 

He redshirted his 1st year at juco. He will be a 5th year Sr in 2017. In my post that referenced him I was talking about him signing but not enrolling out of high school.

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16 minutes ago, ellitor said:

He redshirted his 1st year at juco. He will be a 5th year Sr in 2017. In my post that referenced him I was talking about him signing but not enrolling out of high school.

I don't know what you're talking about. All I'm saying is he is staying.

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22 minutes ago, ellitor said:

He redshirted his 1st year at juco. He will be a 5th year Sr in 2017. In my post that referenced him I was talking about him signing but not enrolling out of high school.

Glad to hear Jason is staying. I hope he stays on Gus's good side and gets on the field. Maybe another guy who could be returning kicks effectively in addition to catching balls. 

Edited by McLoofus
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2 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

Al.com says Jason Smith is staying despite graduating this year. 

Good... maybe we'll finally get to see the plan that Rhett promised for utilizing him.

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3 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Glad to hear Jason is staying. I hope he stays on Gus's good side and gets on the field. Maybe another guy who could be returning kicks effectively in addition to catching balls. 

He was never on his bad side. 

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8 minutes ago, aujeff11 said:

I don't know what you're talking about. All I'm saying is he is staying.

Lol. I just told you what I was talking about. Wasn't sure then if you brought Jason up because I mentioned him so I was just clarrifying.

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