South Carolina Post Game Thread

[AuburnNTexas 7,128]

Last night we saw what many have said would happen with this team. A young team without established leaders got blown out. It was a combination of things an ongoing issue with weak rebounding and ft shooting, a team that got away from its game plan of trying to work the ball inside to Wiley or driving and picking up fouls, careless ball handling against a really tough SC team, taking 3's that were long 3's by NBA standards and not playing good Defense against a team that also had one of those nights where you can't miss.

A game like this is to be expected when you only have one contributing Senior (Dunans) who is only in his second year with this team.  They played so hard at home against bama and in the second half against LSU it was probably to much to expect the same level of effort for a young team away from home.  A more mature team would not have had so many turnovers and would have been better able to handle when another team got hot.  I am disappointed but not surprised by this game,

I am still very proud of these kids it takes games like this for young players to learn from. It takes a level of maturity to handle a bad night and that is all this was. I am hoping that playing a team like SC that sells out on playing good defense and rebounding will help these kids to understand that is where games are won.

Don't get down on this team they have improved this year and are slowly developing an identity they will have some more good games and probably will have some more bad games that is part of the growth process.

 

[FoundationEagle 637]

23 minutes ago, AuburnNTexas said:

 

Don't get down on this team they have improved this year

 

Last night was one of the worst performances I've ever witnessed.  This team is taking 1 step forward and 2 steps back all year.  I hope it is just youth.  My concern is that we seem so ill prepared for how to play certain teams.  I'm hoping it is just due to young guys not playing within the gameplan, but I have my doubts.  Yes we are young and yes we play well at times so there is a light at the end of the tunnel, yet I find myself cheering when the staff actually realizes the team needs a timeout or finally pulls a player that is playing horribly.  Its mind boggling trying to determine the reason the coaches let a 20-2 type run happen without a single timeout or leave players in that are completely lost for long periods and costing the team points on both ends of the court.  Of course the next bball game I coach will be the first so I understand that while I expect certain things I may not always be in the correct line of thinking.  Its just frustrating I suppose.  We are very close to giving up any chance of making even the CBI this year.  No one would have believed 3 years ago after hiring Bruce that in his 3rd year he'd still not have a team capable of making the worst postseason tourney.  I do think he gets a pass this year, but next year if there is no improvement then he had better make some staff changes.  Have to admit I was a little concerned when his major hires were (1) his son and (2) an ex Auburn guy that had worked his way down from the NBA to the Korean basketball league after being fired from the NBA.  While it seems to have paid dividends in recruiting, there may be a lacking in on the court abilities.  Of course again...Im not a coach so this is all speculation and likely unfounded, its just the appearance I am getting.  In no way shape or form do I think Bruce is anywhere close to being on any type of hot seat nor should he be even after next year.  However, his assistants next year should be coaching for their jobs iyam.  There will be no more reasons for excuses next year as this team will be almost completely in tact and in their second year of building chemistry.  There will be few teams that lose less than we do this off season.  Next year is the year there should be expectations and consequences.  If this up and down play is merely young players, that should be all but gone next year.  If it is coaching, then a change somewhere needs to be made.  Unfortunately, the only way to get that answer is to wait and see the results over a year from now...

[tigerbrotha12 2,362]

30 minutes ago, FoundationEagle said:

Last night was one of the worst performances I've ever witnessed.  This team is taking 1 step forward and 2 steps back all year.  I hope it is just youth.  My concern is that we seem so ill prepared for how to play certain teams.  I'm hoping it is just due to young guys not playing within the gameplan, but I have my doubts.  Yes we are young and yes we play well at times so there is a light at the end of the tunnel, yet I find myself cheering when the staff actually realizes the team needs a timeout or finally pulls a player that is playing horribly.  Its mind boggling trying to determine the reason the coaches let a 20-2 type run happen without a single timeout or leave players in that are completely lost for long periods and costing the team points on both ends of the court.  Of course the next bball game I coach will be the first so I understand that while I expect certain things I may not always be in the correct line of thinking.  Its just frustrating I suppose.  We are very close to giving up any chance of making even the CBI this year.  No one would have believed 3 years ago after hiring Bruce that in his 3rd year he'd still not have a team capable of making the worst postseason tourney.  I do think he gets a pass this year, but next year if there is no improvement then he had better make some staff changes.  Have to admit I was a little concerned when his major hires were (1) his son and (2) an ex Auburn guy that had worked his way down from the NBA to the Korean basketball league after being fired from the NBA.  While it seems to have paid dividends in recruiting, there may be a lacking in on the court abilities.  Of course again...Im not a coach so this is all speculation and likely unfounded, its just the appearance I am getting.  In no way shape or form do I think Bruce is anywhere close to being on any type of hot seat nor should he be even after next year.  However, his assistants next year should be coaching for their jobs iyam.  There will be no more reasons for excuses next year as this team will be almost completely in tact and in their second year of building chemistry.  There will be few teams that lose less than we do this off season.  Next year is the year there should be expectations and consequences.  If this up and down play is merely young players, that should be all but gone next year.  If it is coaching, then a change somewhere needs to be made.  Unfortunately, the only way to get that answer is to wait and see the results over a year from now...

When we've gone roughly six years now without even having a record over .500, Bruce Pearl is going to get a pass for a while at Auburn. Until he has truly changed the culture of losing at Auburn, and we expect to beat ranked teams on the road, he should get all the passes in the world. Pearl has a history of winning some games that he's not supposed to every year. ( See Xavier (2014), SEC tournament run (2014), Kentucky (2016), @Arkansas (2016), Texas Tech (2016-2017 season)) I'm expecting him to pick up 1 or 2 more wins that some are not expecting this year ( @TCU, @ Arkansas, Florida, @Mississippi State, @Ole Miss, @UGA, etc...). He does that, and takes care of business that he can handle like UT, Bama, LSU, we should end up with around 9 SEC wins and 19-20 overall wins. Of course, we've still got to go do it, but I think Pearl has done wonders with making this team much improved. With a program as down as ours in a conference as strong as ours, it was takes much more time to build up a program than it does, say, at a mid-major school. Patience is key. 

[FoundationEagle 637]

21 minutes ago, tigerbrotha12 said:

When we've gone roughly six years now without even having a record over .500, Bruce Pearl is going to get a pass for a while at Auburn. Until he has truly changed the culture of losing at Auburn, and we expect to beat ranked teams on the road, he should get all the passes in the world. Pearl has a history of winning some games that he's not supposed to every year. ( See Xavier (2014), SEC tournament run (2014), Kentucky (2016), @Arkansas (2016), Texas Tech (2016-2017 season)) I'm expecting him to pick up 1 or 2 more wins that some are not expecting this year ( @TCU, @ Arkansas, Florida, @Mississippi State, @Ole Miss, @UGA, etc...). He does that, and takes care of business that he can handle like UT, Bama, LSU, we should end up with around 9 SEC wins and 19-20 overall wins. Of course, we've still got to go do it, but I think Pearl has done wonders with making this team much improved. With a program as down as ours in a conference as strong as ours, it was takes much more time to build up a program than it does, say, at a mid-major school. Patience is key. 

Bruce has a long leash yes. His assistants may be a different story.   Add in the immense meddling our PTB do and I wouldn't be surprised st all if some new assistants are tapped following a rough season next year. Of course if we improve next year then it won't be needed and won't happen

 

also, 9 SEC wins means we win 6 out of the next 10. While that would be impressive from here, I wouldn't count on it. That's expecting a lot out of a 3-5 team currently

[WeagleTheBeagle 60]

I cant keep sugar coating our team's play.  We played our best game of the year followed by our worst game.  A lot of this is coaching and coaching decisions.  Purifoy should not be playing.  He isnt healthy and gave up more 3's than I could count last night bc he is a step slow.  McLemore should start and get 20+ mins a game.  Ronnie Johnson should be our starting PG.  

Sometimes I do feel like Bruce is coaching for the future and not this season.  Not calling TO's on big runs by the other team is a head scratcher but maybe he is trying to get them mentally tough for next year.  We gotta see more consistency from this team.  Last night was humiliating for the players and fans.  No excuse to lose by 30.  

[AUTigersfan89 256]

I wouldn't mind seeing us get a new defensive coach on the staff and move on from Chuck Person. The defense has just been too much of a liability going on three years now, and I don't think our defensive play is reflective of the talent we have.

If it takes getting Tony Jones back on Pearl's staff, then let's make it happen.

[Tiger 8,818]

Guys this is the growth process. Consistency comes with age and experience and right now we have neither. And our 3 most experienced players haven't even been on campus for a combined 4 years, 1 of which doesn't even play anymore in Laron Smith.

We are not as bad as we played last night, and we are not consistently good enough to say we are as good of a team that showed up against Bama.

Bruce is telling them the right things but he can't do it for them. You can even hear him on the broadcast yelling proper instructions but sometimes our guys just start ball watching. Even in the post game interviews he is saying what needs to be done and he's trying to get our team to think properly during the game. We have put a ton of responsibility on guys who only have 1/2 a season under their belts and when that's the case we have nights like last night when you aren't dipping into the 1 and done pool. It's just the way of the world

We started 4 freshman (1 is a 17 year old who should still be technically still be in high school) and a senior who has only been in the program for 1.5 seasons. That is just nuts.

[Tiger 8,818]

1 minute ago, AUTigersfan89 said:

I wouldn't mind seeing us get a new defensive coach on the staff and move on from Chuck Person. The defense has just been too much of a liability going on three years now, and I don't think our defensive play is reflective of the talent we have.

If it takes getting Tony Jones back on Pearl's staff, then let's make it happen.

This is an interesting post. Why did Jones ACTUALLY leave? I have my doubts about him wanting to be a HS coach. How does our staff compare to BP's UT staff? Maybe we need to shuffle responsibilities because Person as "defensive coordinator" has not really shown us anything in the last 3 years. Is it the players? It could be. He can be a great asset to us because he obviously can coach or else he wouldn't have been coaching in the NBA. We have a great HC, but do we have a great staff behind him? Is Steven Pearl getting a Rhett Lashlee-type treatment? It's easier in football to see who's unit is not doing well because a coach heads a specific position group or side of the ball. I'm not sure who's responsible for what on our bball staff except the Rifleman is our DC. Anybody with insider knowledge have any opinion on our staff outside of Pearl?

 

*Not accusing or saying any one guy isn't pulling their weight, I really have no idea. Just curious

[steeleagle 2,945]

I think the problem is compounded by two things for sure:

youth and inexperience

Poor defense

It showed last night and at other times that we are not good perimeter defenders or offensive rebounders, and it requires a lot of energy and intensity. Our guards and Purifoy are NOT good defenders because they don't think defense first.

Our guards did not have even ONE assist last night. They simply did not execute what PEarl stated he needed from them. That is youth and inexperience.

But although it is hard to choose between getting these freshmen of the future playing time and experience, it is obvious too that Johnson and McLemore are two of our best defenders along with Brown, but our best offensive players and rebounder is Purifoy and Heron (who are two weakest defenders too) and Harper too.

So i think PEarl is making them play to get them as much experience as possible. 

[WeagleTheBeagle 60]

Just one guys opinion but Purifoy is not healthy and is wasting minutes playing.  Take a look at the highlights last night and see how many made threes were bc he was a step slow on D.  

[cole256 17,039]

Sigh, Smh

[jared52 4,354]

Good grief. Yeah, last night was abysmal, but you guys have to be kidding me with some of this. AU has very little experience. They are getting it. Bruce and co are doing a good job with this team. They have basically had a new team every year since he's been here. This is the first that will be built around young players, not band aids. Yes, next year I would expect more consistency. Getting over .500 this year and being an NIT bubble team is a good next step.

[WeagleTheBeagle 60]

Listen, I get it...there will be differences of opinion on the season so far and the trajectory of this program.  I dont think anyone on this thread is being irrational or unreasonable with their thoughts.  I dont think any assistants should have their jobs in jeopardy unless we implode the rest of the season.  And of course I get that Bruce has had "new"teams every season and this will be the first that can be built upon.  

All I care about at the moment is this season and even the next few games.  So what can be done to better our chances?  Purifoy is not healthy and is a liability, McLemore needs big minutes (24+), and Ronnie Johnson should start.  Just what Im seeing.  Doesnt mean I think the sky is falling.  

[AuburnNTexas 7,128]

At the beginning of the game last night we fell behind early 9-0 then we started either passing into Wiley or driving and scoring or dumping to Wiley and we got back into the game. This was the game plan that worked so well in second half against LSU and bama. We were forcing a little temp as seen with Dunans with a steal and taking ball to score then the wheels fell off.

We had multiple turnovers more do to carelessness then to the defense at the same time SC got hot on the 3 in a short period of time we were down 20. There is a variety of reasons for this. Many Freshman hit a bit of a wall about halfway through a college Season it is quite an adjustment way different from HS. Harper needs to be a facilitator first scorer second but early on he had to be a scorer to often to help us win games, other teams now have good scouting reports on our players tendencies and do their game plans around forcing us away from our strengths. HS players are used to practicing their basic same offense and defense week after week. In college you have to game plan around the other team older teams are used to this type of game planning and handle it better.

At beginning of the season we had good one on one players that other teams did not know so we got away with a few things. We have improved we finally have a post player that we are starting to use and will need to use more, that has made the drive and score or drive and dump to Wiley or Spencer more effective and when doing both of these the kick out to an open three has worked look at end of bama game.

Everybody is correct about rebounding we have to improve we are so intent on Blocking shots that we often have 2 or 3 players sliding over to block and that leaves the boards open. We also have a bad habit of getting under the basket and most long rebounds go to the other teams guards. We have had stretches where we do a good job but we need to do it the whole game. In HS they just out jumped everybody and got the rebound. Look at Thornwell from SC  and compare how he played as a freshman, sophomore, Junior to how he is playing as a senior. He has improved every part of his game each year until he is a complete player.

I hear posters saying they are tired of hearing the excuse about youth well live with the excuse it is not only an excuse but it is the reason behind the inconsistent play. Dunans is the only older player that has any impact on this team and he has only been in the system for really 1 season if you count how much of last year he missed.

The people who know basketball will tell you the team that is playing now is better that the team at the beginning of the year and they will also tell you to be patient it takes time especially when new players don't have experienced quality players to look up to and learn from.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

I recall at the beginning of the season @cole256 telling us that he didn't like what he saw from our D.  Seems to me that last night was a prime example of exactly what he was talking about.

[Charhair 345]

The negatives from last night are obvious. So, on a positive note, Wiley finished with 10 points, 11 boards, 2 blocks and steal to only one turnover in 24 minutes. Watching him improve has been fun, even with the blowouts we've suffered down that stretch. Not only were we feeding him early and often against USC but it appeared to me that Wiley was walking around to our players asking for the ball during free throws early on and that's when we saw a streak of touches by him. 

[AU64 10,122]

1 hour ago, lionheartkc said:

I recall at the beginning of the season @cole256 telling us that he didn't like what he saw from our D.  Seems to me that last night was a prime example of exactly what he was talking about.

JMO but the problem with our D is not scheme....it is just guys standing around not guarding anyone much of the time....looked like we might have been playing a zone often but sure not the way Beheim teaches it.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

14 minutes ago, AU64 said:

JMO but the problem with our D is not scheme....it is just guys standing around not guarding anyone much of the time....looked like we might have been playing a zone often but sure not the way Beheim teaches it.

I don't have time to dig up the direct quote form cole, but I recall it being less about scheme and more about effort.

[AU64 10,122]

23 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

I don't have time to dig up the direct quote form cole, but I recall it being less about scheme and more about effort.

That could be ....just reacting to the comment about a change among assistant coaches with the suggestion that such a change might improve defensive results.  

Just thinking that if the problem is effort, not sure why a different assistant would improve things ....strikes me that BP is the guy who would bring the hammer down if effort is lacking?   

[jared52 4,354]

1 hour ago, lionheartkc said:

I don't have time to dig up the direct quote form cole, but I recall it being less about scheme and more about effort.

Bruce said as much in one of his "This is Auburn Basketball" videos in the preseason. He was concerned about defense. And he still is.

[boomstick 1,315]

1 hour ago, lionheartkc said:

I don't have time to dig up the direct quote form cole, but I recall it being less about scheme and more about effort.

He's right. Effort has been an issue all year. It's by far the most frustrating part of this team. And I think the coaches need to bare a significant amount of criticism for that problem. The effort just comes and goes and usually only comes when things are going well. Some players let their offensive woes get to them. Some just don't do more than the bare minimum. Harper and Heron have been back cut on more because of being flat footed and their eye discipline than I can remember in a long time. The whole team loves to ball watch.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

Just now, AU64 said:

That could be ....just reacting to the comment about a change among assistant coaches with the suggestion that such a change might improve defensive results.  

Just thinking that if the problem is effort, not sure why a different assistant would improve things ....strikes me that BP is the guy who would bring the hammer down if effort is lacking?   

That post left me shaking my head too, and I'm an admitted neophyte when it comes to basketball (even if I played when I was a kid). I doubt you'll hear anything about replacing staff from the basketball gurus around here.

As for coach bringing the hammer down... you can bring the hammer down all you want and it won't matter if the kids don't execute. If that's one thing I've learned about managing millennials, it's that they do not respond well to negative reinforcement.

[AU64 10,122]

1 minute ago, lionheartkc said:

That post left me shaking my head too, and I'm an admitted neophyte when it comes to basketball (even if I played when I was a kid). I doubt you'll hear anything about replacing staff from the basketball gurus around here.

As for coach bringing the hammer down... you can bring the hammer down all you want and it won't matter if the kids don't execute. If that's one thing I've learned about managing millennials, it's that they do not respond well to negative reinforcement.

So I hear....my thought of bringing the hammer down is some time on the bench but maybe that doesn't work either?   Just noting that our defensive effort seems far more lackadaisical than most of our opponents.   

[cole256 17,039]

5 hours ago, lionheartkc said:

I recall at the beginning of the season @cole256 telling us that he didn't like what he saw from our D.  Seems to me that last night was a prime example of exactly what he was talking about.

Man @lionheartkc, so far this season has went EXACTLY the way I said. I remember what you are referring to and that was from the scrimmage right before the season. Since then, I've talked about us going to have hot and cold games because we didn't have a post presence before Wiley. I talked about how guys would have a little trouble knowing roles this year, I talked about it not being a leader yet; I talked about how we were going to be small and we didn't have the defense this year to make up for bad shooting nights; talked about how our jump shooters would face harder time now they would be keyed on instead of looked at as supporting players; I even talked about how the freshmen such as Harper would hit a wall around SEC play.....And what's happened the last 4 games? 

And I said all of this BEFORE the season even started....only about 3-4 listen to me though. Now I try to tell stuff what I see and every so often Bruce Pearl will say something to confirm what I'm thinking....I think I even said last game we will have games like this....All I can do is keep posting though.

[cole256 17,039]

4 hours ago, AU64 said:

JMO but the problem with our D is not scheme....it is just guys standing around not guarding anyone much of the time....looked like we might have been playing a zone often but sure not the way Beheim teaches it.

Boeheim runs a match up zone, and he makes a point, I mean an absolute must to recruit long athletic players. Length in a zone is like length with a corner, it really makes up for mistakes. This is one of the reasons I prefer size on the court. When players get tired and when fatigue sets in and mistakes happen just getting your arms up can make a world of difference