AU QB issues over the years

[aubiefifty 16,761]

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Recruiting or development: A look at Auburn's quarterback issues in recent years

Four sentences into his introduction of Chip Lindsey as Auburn's new offensive coordinator, coach Gus Malzahn got to the core of why he chose Lindsey to man the Tigers' offense moving forward.

The fifth-year Auburn coach rattled off three criteria he was searching for in an offensive coordinator. The first one was, perhaps, the most telling.

"I just felt like I needed to find somebody that could develop and evaluate quarterbacks," Malzahn said.

Since Malzahn took over the program after the 2012 season, the Tigers have experienced a mixed bag when it comes to their quarterbacks. Nick Marshall was a roaring success in 2013 and 2014 while running Malzahn's zone-read offense after transferring from junior college, but the last two seasons have left plenty to be desired as the most important position on that side of the ball. At quarterback, Marshall accounted for 4,508 passing yards and 34 touchdowns along with 1,866 rushing yards and 23 scores in two seasons. In the two years since, Auburn's quarterbacks have combined to throw for 4,416 yards and 22 touchdowns while rushing for 798 yards and 12 scores.

When it comes to diagnosing Auburn's struggles at quarterback at times during the Malzahn era, the question is whether it is an issue with the team's recruiting of the position or an issue with development once players are on campus, where Malzahn has traditionally not allowed his quarterbacks to work with private coaches or quarterback gurus in the offseason. Malzahn said that may change under Lindsey, who has full control of the offense moving forward.

RELATED: Gus Malzahn's quarterback island

Malzahn's primary criteria when introducing Lindsey hinted that both of those areas, recruitment and development, contributed to Auburn's inconsistent quarterback play in recent years. His decision to allow Lindsey to decide if quarterbacks can work with private gurus also appears telling in that the head coach seems more open to outside development after years of opposition.

It's difficult to pinpoint which factor affected the Tigers more at that position, but they likely aren't the only contributing causes for the team's quarterback quandary since Marshall graduated.

During Malzahn's tenure as Auburn's head coach, the Tigers have signed nine quarterbacks, with two of them in the 2017 class and already on campus: Jarrett Stidham and Malik Willis. Of the other seven quarterbacks to ink a letter of intent with Auburn, five have attempted at least one pass at Auburn and four have started at least one game, including three of them starting over the last two seasons.

That collective group has included three-pro-style quarterbacks and six dual-threat options, with three of those classified as athletes in recruiting rankings.

"I hesitate to say (Auburn's quarterback recruiting) has been bad because you can't really argue with some of the results, but obviously there's been some misses," said J.C. Shurburtt, the former national recruiting director at 247Sports. "How I kind of see it is this: They're all different types of quarterbacks. The offensive scheme, the one Gus ran, was sort of set up to take advantage of different guys."

In 2013, Malzahn signed Marshall out of a junior college as well as four-star pro-style quarterback Jeremy Johnson, who was the No. 11 prospect at his position according to the 247Sports Composite rankings. Marshall earned the starting job in fall camp and developed into a dangerous dual-threat option for two seasons.

With Malzahn's second class, Auburn signed four-star signal-caller Sean White, who was the No. 8 pro-style quarterback in the nation. White was highly regarded after being an Elite 11 quarterback and the MVP of the Under Armour All-America Game, but Auburn was easily his best offer, even if it wasn't necessarily the best offensive fit for him.

In 2015, the Tigers added Tyler Queen, the No. 15 pro-style quarterback, and Jason Smith, the No. 1 JUCO athlete. Queen has been a career backup so far, while also being plagued by elbow and shoulder injuries. Smith came to Auburn to compete for the starting job, but quickly changed position to wide receiver.

Last signing day, Auburn landed four-star quarterback Woody Barrett, who was the No. 6 dual-threat option in the nation, as well as John Franklin III, the No. 1 JUCO athlete. Barrett redshirted in 2016, while Franklin competed for the starting job during spring and fall practices before being relegated to the backup role behind White.

"Obviously, you have to give (Auburn's quarterback recruiting) about a C-minus," said Mike Farrell, the national recruiting director for Rivals. "You can't give it a true failing grade because of Marshall.... White is serviceable but certainly not a guy you want to rely on to win football games for you. They've been successful, obviously with that power running attack, but the other guys have not done well."

During that same time frame, Auburn has had a few notable misses with quarterbacks it recruited but was unable to land. Those are fewer than you might expect, however.

Without a doubt, Auburn did its best with the 2013 class when it plucked Marshall from the JUCO ranks.

In 2014, when Auburn signed White, the Tigers' most notable miss was Clemson's Deshaun Watson, who took a secretive trip to Auburn in May 2013 while committed to Clemson. Missing out on Watson, who became a two-time Heisman finalist and guided Clemson to the College Football Playoff title earlier this month, has become a bit of a what-if scenario for Auburn fans.

"With Watson, they didn't really have a shot," Shurburtt said. "A player of that magnitude, you just try your best and let the chips fall where they may."

When Auburn signed Queen and Smith in 2015, the Tigers had some other misses on the recruiting trail. Auburn had offers out to No. 1 pro-style passer Deondre Francois, whose final two was comprised of Auburn and Florida State; No. 1 dual-threat option Stidham, who originally signed with Baylor before landing at Auburn last month; and Lamar Jackson, the No. 13 dual-threat passer who signed with Louisville and won the Heisman last season.

"Certainly you look at him, look at his skillset and look at what Auburn has been trying to do under Malzahn on offense and you think, man, you probably just should have gone down there and tried to get him," Shurburtt said.

After those three recruiting cycles and the departure of Marshall, Auburn rolled with Johnson heading into 2015.

Groomed to be the heir apparent to Marshall, Johnson spent more time under Malzahn than any previous quarterback and was a trendy Heisman pick ahead of the 2015 season. Auburn was all-in on the former Alabama Mr. Football winner.

Johnson experienced a turbulent final two seasons on the Plains and never lived up to the immense expectations bestowed upon him. Following his final game at Auburn, a loss to Oklahoma in the Sugar Bowl in which he made a relief appearance, Johnson remarked that he was ready to "get coached up a little more" while working with a private quarterback coach in Orlando, Florida, and preparing for Pro Day and a possible shot at the NFL.

Johnson's words, which came after his revelation that he spent most of the year away from the first- and second-team offenses while working with the scout team, seemed to imply a lack of development from the coaching staff during his time at Auburn. His high school coach, Billy Gresham, said he "didn't think" that Johnson was insufficiently developed while at Auburn, but added that he only saw what happened on game days and not during practices and meetings.

"I don't think 'just getting coached up' means that says anything about being developed," Gresham said. "He understands it was a combination of a lot of things, the reason he wasn't as successful as he wanted to be and a lot of people wanted him to be. I don't think it was a development deal. In the past, Auburn has done a good job of developing successful quarterbacks, so I just think success is all about timing and a combination of everything."  

The dawn of the Johnson era quickly went south in 2015, and Johnson was benched after an error-filled three-game start to the year when he threw more interceptions (six) than touchdowns (five). That led to White, a redshirt freshman, earning the starting job ahead of his time. White started the next five games before an injury forced Johnson back into the starting role, but White regained the starting job ahead of the Birmingham Bowl.

"It wasn't like they went out on a ledge and despite all this evidence and everyone else's opinion said Jeremy Johnson is a great quarterback," Shurburtt said. "But some guys, it just doesn't click, and that was unfortunate. Maybe they did put a lot of stock in Johnson, but you know what? I don't know that you could blame them for it. That's sort of what's beautiful and tragic at the same time about football and evaluations is you can have a guy that everybody's on the same page with that has everything you want, then it just doesn't work out.

"That happens. I've seen it happen over and over, especially at that position."

 

 

[ToomersStreet 795]

Well sunshine pumping and harsh criticism aside, time will tell now.  I for one plan on closely paying attention to Rhett at UCONN.  Particularly, players that HE recruits and develops.  I am frustrated with the injuries Auburn has at QB.  Sean is hurt, IDK if Barrett and Queen are still injured.  BUT, I am still waiting for Gus to bring in a guy from high school and develop him into a solid QB.  STILL HAS NOT HAPPENED.  Will it in the future?????

[lionheartkc 6,150]

Here's the failure... In 2014, Auburn signed White. In 2015 Auburn signed Queen and #1 JUCO Athlete Jason Smith. In 2016 Auburn signed Barrett and #1 JUCO Athlete John Franklin III. (we may see a trend that lead them to taking Franklin)

All 3 years, we should have signed 2 QBs... not a QB and an athlete. Gus figured that out this year and signed 2 QBs... one great and one with great potential. I think that bodes well for the future.

[I_M4_AU 7,801]

19 hours ago, lionheartkc said:

Here's the failure... In 2014, Auburn signed White. In 2015 Auburn signed Queen and #1 JUCO Athlete Jason Smith. In 2016 Auburn signed Barrett and #1 JUCO Athlete John Franklin III. (we may see a trend that lead them to taking Franklin)

All 3 years, we should have signed 2 QBs... not a QB and an athlete. Gus figured that out this year and signed 2 QBs... one great and one with great potential. I think that bodes well for the future.

This is one perspective, another is Gus was totally into JJ for 2015 and White was a good option to learn while JJ lead us to multiple championships.  That year (2014 recruiting year) he missed on DW and Harris before he got White (Harris was in the fold and then talked to LSU and became iffy as a commit).  Gus doesn't do well with contingency plans.  2015, JJ was still the man at signing time and Queen looked good, therefore, Gus picked up Jason Smith as an athlete with a shot at QB.  Jason was not a serious QB candidate in Gus' eyes as JJ was the man.

Then 2015 happened, Queen was hurt, Smith was a receiver with no QB reps, and we only had a RS Freshman as a backup plan.  Again, Gus doesn't do contingency plans well, so we muddled through 2015.  2016 we get Barret, who is a project and JFIII who was recruited as a QB not an athlete.  The difference between Jason Smith and JFIII's recruitment was a dire need, Gus was desparate (why he chose JFIII will always be a mystery).

You're correct that we signed 2 QBs this year, but one is a project and the other a "can't lose" QB that will take us to multiple championships (sound familiar) and this was done before CRL departed.  I do believe Gus will have more of a contingency plan this year at QB and that the future looks bright if Gus can concentrate on just being an HC.  Just my opinion.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

On 02/04/2017 at 10:18 AM, I_M4_AU said:

This is one perspective, another is Gus was totally into JJ for 2015 and White was a good option to learn while JJ lead us to multiple championships.  That year (2014 recruiting year) he missed on DW and Harris before he got White (Harris was in the fold and then talked to LSU and became iffy as a commit).  Gus doesn't do well with contingency plans.  2015, JJ was still the man at signing time and Queen looked good, therefore, Gus picked up Jason Smith as an athlete with a shot at QB.  Jason was not a serious QB candidate in Gus' eyes as JJ was the man.

Then 2015 happened, Queen was hurt, Smith was a receiver with no QB reps, and we only had a RS Freshman as a backup plan.  Again, Gus doesn't do contingency plans well, so we muddled through 2015.  2016 we get Barret, who is a project and JFIII who was recruited as a QB not an athlete.  The difference between Jason Smith and JFIII's recruitment was a dire need, Gus was desparate (why he chose JFIII will always be a mystery).

You're correct that we signed 2 QBs this year, but one is a project and the other a "can't lose" QB that will take us to multiple championships (sound familiar) and this was done before CRL departed.  I do believe Gus will have more of a contingency plan this year at QB and that the future looks bright if Gus can concentrate on just being an HC.  Just my opinion.

I just believe that, every year, you should try to land a top QB and a 3-star with potential.  that's the only way to insure not ending up too thin with a combination of failure to transition, injury, and people leaving.

[corchjay 5,311]

JJ6 happened.  Rest is all still the same. Sean is fine when healthy.  Depth is/was the issue and that depth issue was from the JJ6 fiasco.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 hour ago, corchjay said:

JJ6 happened.  Rest is all still the same. Sean is fine when healthy.  Depth is/was the issue and that depth issue was from the JJ6 fiasco.

That, and a perpetually broken Queen.

[auburnphan 6,050]

Nobody capable of developing a QB, that was the issue.  It really is that simple.  Said it for years, decision was made, hence a OC search and list by the PTB

[Strychnine 1,802]

On 2/3/2017 at 3:39 PM, lionheartkc said:

Here's the failure... In 2014, Auburn signed White. In 2015 Auburn signed Queen and #1 JUCO Athlete Jason Smith. In 2016 Auburn signed Barrett and #1 JUCO Athlete John Franklin III. (we may see a trend that lead them to taking Franklin)

All 3 years, we should have signed 2 QBs... not a QB and an athlete. Gus figured that out this year and signed 2 QBs... one great and one with great potential. I think that bodes well for the future.

 

I think QB recruiting also suffered from running the ball so much.  If the offense starts heading in the direction of balance, thus throwing the ball more, landing the great QB targets should become easier.  It had to be difficult to sell a 4-5* QB on Auburn when all rival offers could easily point out that his skills would most likely be underutilized.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 hour ago, Strychnine said:

 

I think QB recruiting also suffered from running the ball so much.  If the offense starts heading in the direction of balance, thus throwing the ball more, landing the great QB targets should become easier.  It had to be difficult to sell a 4-5* QB on Auburn when all rival offers could easily point out that his skills would most likely be underutilized.

Also totally agree with you, here. Had Cam stayed for an extra year and then we transitioned into Frazier, and so on, I think we could have established ourselves as a school like Florida State or Clemson, at the QB spot, but when Cam left and Malzahn didn't have a solid back-up plan, everything kind of fell apart on the QB front, and the fixes turned us into an offense that should be very attractive to backs (not sure why we aren't landing 5-stars there), but is mildly intriguing at best to most QBs. I think Gus/Rhett sold Stidham on him being the one to turn it around.  Hope he is.

[Tiger 8,819]

We need to win and put up gobs of points BADLY this season. We run such an unconventional offense that when it's not working up to par (majority of the past 2 years) it's easy for other schools to say "why would you go to that school that doesn't prepare you for the NFL and is more hype than substance?" The aura around the program right now is still giving off the vibes of Gus' job security as somewhat iffy from the last 2 years so if we get back on track offensively I think we can convince top caliber QBs/RBs/WRs to start coming to AU at a higher rate (although we should be good at WR for the next year or 2).

It also would help our reputation a lot if our productive guys start having productive careers in the NFL. But the system we run isn't doing our guys many favors down the road which is probably a big negative that our rivals touch on in living rooms of prospects. But if we start putting up tons of points again lots of studs on the offensive side of the ball will want to play for our staff. JMO

[aucanucktiger 1,791]

We had a 4th or 5th string QB in the 1980s (klein?) transfer out (to TCU?) and promptly break the NCAA record for something like yards in a game. 

Numerically, Bama has a history of abysmal QB development. Going back to Freddie Kitchens and Hollingsworth they had an impressive parade of top ranked high school QBs enjoying mediocre careers at the crapstone. Even some state media used to shockingly comment about it.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 hour ago, aucanucktiger said:

Numerically, Bama has a history of abysmal QB development. Going back to Freddie Kitchens and Hollingsworth they had an impressive parade of top ranked high school QBs enjoying mediocre careers at the crapstone. Even some state media used to shockingly comment about it.

But they had Joe Namath, which using bama math means that they had at least 30 great QBs.

[oracle79 3,569]

2 minutes ago, lionheartkc said:

But they had Joe Namath, which using bama math means that they had at least 30 great QBs.

Starr won 3 NFL titles and 2 Super Bowls,  Namath won a guaranteed Super Bowl and is the only NFL QB to pass for over 4000 yards in a 14 game season, when OL couldn't use their hands to block and DB's could bump and run all over the field. Snake won a Super Bowl.  It's been awhile, but you can't really dog them on NFL QB's.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

2 minutes ago, oracle79 said:

Starr won 3 NFL titles and 2 Super Bowls,  Namath won a guaranteed Super Bowl and is the only NFL QB to pass for over 4000 yards in a 14 game season, when OL couldn't use their hands to block and DB's could bump and run all over the field. Snake won a Super Bowl.  It's been awhile, but you can't really dog them on NFL QB's.

A while? The last Major NFL QB to play for them was before I was born... unless you count the one who was famous for throwing more INTs than Touchdowns in 5 years.

[oracle79 3,569]

7 hours ago, lionheartkc said:

A while? The last Major NFL QB to play for them was before I was born... unless you count the one who was famous for throwing more INTs than Touchdowns in 5 years.

Good one on Richard Todd.  But, has there been a recent Jets QB that has thrown more TD's than INT's?    I didn't bother to check because I know bama hasn't put a decent QB in the league since Stabler.

[ToomersStreet 795]

On ‎2‎/‎5‎/‎2017 at 9:27 PM, lionheartkc said:

I just believe that, every year, you should try to land a top QB and a 3-star with potential.  that's the only way to insure not ending up too thin with a combination of failure to transition, injury, and people leaving.

Goes back to that Head Coach in training.  Which frustrates me.  4.75 a year to be in training should have already had it down.  We will see if he has learned anything from these last three seasons.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

27 minutes ago, ToomersStreet said:

Goes back to that Head Coach in training.  Which frustrates me.  4.75 a year to be in training should have already had it down.  We will see if he has learned anything from these last three seasons.

I can only surmise from what I've seen, but he's made several moves this off-season that make me think he has learned a lot. Hope I'm right. I really like him as a person and a representative of Auburn... it would be great if he became the top coach everyone expected him to be.