NSD 2017 discussion thread

[meh130 1,043]

On 2/1/2017 at 2:16 PM, AuburnTiger4Life said:

Each year 3 star players out play many 5 stars in college football yet people still buy the rankings BS. It's all about player development. I think one reason for this is a lot of the top 300 players didn't have hard competition in high school (small region, small school, etc.) so they're obviously gonna be 10X bigger and better than everyone in HS. Just my opinion. 

You hit the nail on the head. It is a big transition going from high school to a Power 5 college. Probably as big as going from college to the NFL. Perhaps more.

The star process is somewhat flawed. 4 and 5 stars skew disproportionately towards QBs and RBs, and to a lesser extent WRs. Interior linemen, TEs, and FBs are under-represented in the 4 and 5 star counts. You never see a 5-star TE or FB, and the best PK in the country is only going to rate 3 stars.

The recruiting services get a lot wrong. We have had our share 5-star busts, and we have also had quite a few 3-stars who did very well.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

1 hour ago, meh130 said:

The star process is somewhat flawed. 4 and 5 stars skew disproportionately towards QBs and RBs, and to a lesser extent WRs. Interior linemen, TEs, and FBs are under-represented in the 4 and 5 star counts. You never see a 5-star TE or FB, and the best PK in the country is only going to rate 3 stars..

Did you see the 5* list this year?  6 Offensive Tackles, 3 of which were in the top 5.  Oh and 5* TE Colby Parkinson signed with Stanford. 

 

[BamaFanOnBeach 4]

On ‎2‎/‎1‎/‎2017 at 1:16 PM, AuburnTiger4Life said:

Each year 3 star players out play many 5 stars in college football yet people still buy the rankings BS. It's all about player development. I think one reason for this is a lot of the top 300 players didn't have hard competition in high school (small region, small school, etc.) so they're obviously gonna be 10X bigger and better than everyone in HS. Just my opinion. 

The rating given to a senior in HS is his "High School Rating", not his "career" rating.  I had an NFL scout tell me several years back that a 5 star rating meant the scout who evaluated him simply felt they had the talent, conditioning, and technique to be able to contribute/compete in their first year in college at a D1 school.  a 4 star rating meant that they needed a year of development, 3 stars meant that scout felt like they needed 2 years of development, etc.    5 star guys are easier to evaluate, the 3 star guys are much more difficult as, depending on the coaching and tools available, it is very difficult to predict how kids will respond to what they get in college compared to high school, especially if they are from a smaller school.  There are many 3 star players who respond well to the high dollar training facility and coaching expertise who are ready and do contribute in the 1st and 2nd year.  There are also 5 star players who are somewhat "maxed out" as high school seniors and don't develop as much at the college level, and get passed by developing 3 and 4 star kids.

There are PLENTY of 3 star recruits who are better players on the field as 4th and 5th yr seniors than 5 star true freshman players.  That is why I feel you see so many teams who "rank" so much higher year after year in the standings than they recruit - they keep and develop their guys, and get just enough of the blue chip guys to give solid depth to the team.  

Too many people put too much emphasis on how they were ranked in HS for the rest of their college careers IMHO.   AU's class was solid, and if the majority of them are still there in 4 years as seniors as starters, will have the potential to be better than the starting sophomore and junior 4/5 star players bama will be (hoping to) signing in the next class or two, as most of these guys will most likely be gone after their junior year.

Just my 2c

[Southwest 186]

8 minutes ago, BamaFanOnBeach said:

The rating given to a senior in HS is his "High School Rating", not his "career" rating.  I had an NFL scout tell me several years back that a 5 star rating meant the scout who evaluated him simply felt they had the talent, conditioning, and technique to be able to contribute/compete in their first year in college at a D1 school.  a 4 star rating meant that they needed a year of development, 3 stars meant that scout felt like they needed 2 years of development, etc.    5 star guys are easier to evaluate, the 3 star guys are much more difficult as, depending on the coaching and tools available, it is very difficult to predict how kids will respond to what they get in college compared to high school, especially if they are from a smaller school.  There are many 3 star players who respond well to the high dollar training facility and coaching expertise who are ready and do contribute in the 1st and 2nd year.  There are also 5 star players who are somewhat "maxed out" as high school seniors and don't develop as much at the college level, and get passed by developing 3 and 4 star kids.

There are PLENTY of 3 star recruits who are better players on the field as 4th and 5th yr seniors than 5 star true freshman players.  That is why I feel you see so many teams who "rank" so much higher year after year in the standings than they recruit - they keep and develop their guys, and get just enough of the blue chip guys to give solid depth to the team.  

Too many people put too much emphasis on how they were ranked in HS for the rest of their college careers IMHO.   AU's class was solid, and if the majority of them are still there in 4 years as seniors as starters, will have the potential to be better than the starting sophomore and junior 4/5 star players bama will be (hoping to) signing in the next class or two, as most of these guys will most likely be gone after their junior year.

Just my 2c

Well said

[Southwest 186]

On 2/1/2017 at 3:37 PM, bigbird said:

We also need to prepare ourselves that we are now going up against 3 of the best recruiters in the business and they happen to be at our 3 biggest rivals. O will have his choice of LA and Mobile, Kirby will have his choice of GA, and Nick will ride the Red machine to whomever he wants.  We won't consistently out recruit them, but we can out coach them.  The wins on the field will be the only way to dampen their recruiting and bolster ours.

Also if Bamma adds CDC,that will be another thorn in the side. Sigh

[bigbird 60,496]

20 minutes ago, Southwest said:

Also if Bamma adds CDC,that will be another thorn in the side. Sigh

A HUGE one!

[au_bsci_04 407]

I think he'd fit in well on Taggert's staff with Cristobal. They'd be hellacious on the recruiting trail!

[milehighfan 1,240]

35 minutes ago, bigbird said:

A HUGE one!

One of CDC's first jobs was with  Saban so it wouldn't be anything new for Craig to join him again. And it wouldn't be anything new for Satan to find a spot for him on his staff.

[Mikey 16,576]

5 hours ago, Southwest said:

Also if Bamma adds CDC,that will be another thorn in the side. Sigh

Why? He cannot possibly make them recruit any higher than they are already recruiting and maybe his receivers over there will drop as many passes as they did here.

[milehighfan 1,240]

I just read an article listing the top  25 recruiting classes for 2017. In the article which was USA Today, Auburn was ranked 11th. I thought Auburn was ranked 9th. So, which is it?

[oracle79 3,569]

1 hour ago, milehighfan said:

I just read an article listing the top  25 recruiting classes for 2017. In the article which was USA Today, Auburn was ranked 11th. I thought Auburn was ranked 9th. So, which is it?

Last I saw we were 9th in the 247 composite ranking which combines all 4.  So, you could look at any of the 4 and find a different ranking.

[Southwest 186]

6 hours ago, Mikey said:

Why? He cannot possibly make them recruit any higher than they are already recruiting and maybe his receivers over there will drop as many passes as they did here.

 

Since our receivers still drop more than their share of passes I don't see how that translate to us. As far as a  thorn, I'm pretty sure CDC will make some plays on recruits that normally bama wouldn't approach or sway some kids high on us.

[AUApostle 7,651]

How come they don't use the full scale to rate players?  Some should be 0 star or 1 star players.  2 stars are guys that are not evaluated right?  Those guys should really be 0 star players.

[Gowebb11 9,314]

2 hours ago, Southwest said:

Since our receivers still drop more than their share of passes I don't see how that translate to us. As far as a  thorn, I'm pretty sure CDC will make some plays on recruits that normally bama wouldn't approach or sway some kids high on us.

Regardless of where CDC ends up, we definitely need to regain a foothold in Mobile. After Joe Whitt retired, Tubs waived the white flag and surrendered it to Bama (and LSU, UF, and FSU). CDC was reestablishing us there. We've signed one player from there the last 3 years. That, coupled with Kirby tightening Georgia up will not bode well for us if we don't do something now. 

[ClaytonAU 4,606]

3 hours ago, Southwest said:

Since our receivers still drop more than their share of passes I don't see how that translate to us. As far as a  thorn, I'm pretty sure CDC will make some plays on recruits that normally bama wouldn't approach or sway some kids high on us.

Our drop rate was significantly down from this past season.

[bigbird 60,496]

And will decrease this year as well, but its not coaching, its upgraded talent. 

[AUApostle 7,651]

54 minutes ago, Gowebb11 said:

Regardless of where CDC ends up, we definitely need to regain a foothold in Mobile. After Joe Whitt retired, Tubs waived the white flag and surrendered it to Bama (and LSU, UF, and FSU). CDC was reestablishing us there. We've signed one player from there the last 3 years. That, coupled with Kirby tightening Georgia up will not bode well for us if we don't do something now. 

...And Richt gaining traction in Miami.

[Southwest 186]

1 hour ago, ClaytonAU said:

Our drop rate was significantly down from this past season.

Still dropped balls, which I still don't see how you tie that into coaching. I will go out on a limb and say if kodi had Louis and Coates now they would still drop passes. Hell watch Coates this year. 

[steeleagle 2,945]

23 minutes ago, Southwest said:

Still dropped balls, which I still don't see how you tie that into coaching. I will go out on a limb and say if kodi had Louis and Coates now they would still drop passes. Hell watch Coates this year. 

Ugh...I'm a Steeler fan..and you HAD to remind me about Coates and his hands of Steel :)....

[ClaytonAU 4,606]

51 minutes ago, Southwest said:

Still dropped balls, which I still don't see how you tie that into coaching. I will go out on a limb and say if kodi had Louis and Coates now they would still drop passes. Hell watch Coates this year. 

So WR coaches don't improve and teach proper catching methods? 

[metafour 4,968]

16 minutes ago, ClaytonAU said:

So WR coaches don't improve and teach proper catching methods? 

Any football player that earns a scholarship to Auburn will have learned how to catch a football as a pre-teen.  There are no "magic techniques" to catching a football; therefore to suggest that a WR coach is going to come in and significantly change drop rate in either direction is asinine.  For a guy who claims he knows so much about football, Mikey is clueless.  There are a few rare cases wherein a guy can be taught to do something differently; but an entire team does not have drop-issues because the WR coach doesn't know how to teach the complicated art of catching a football.  Most receivers who drop balls will do so throughout their entire career.  Terrell Owens is a HOF receiver and he was among the league leaders in drops every season he played; he also played under multiple coaches and no one could "fix" his drop issues.

Our drop issues are a direct result of a lack of repetition and a piss-poor amount of balls thrown.  This is a flaw in Malzahn's offense, which is why you are now hearing so much about Lindsey bringing more passing elements.  Our receivers spend far too much time blocking in practice, then they spend all game blocking and you expect them to catch every one of the few balls that actually come their way? Some of these guys go ~2 game stretches without even having a ball thrown at them.

Ever notice how Air Raid teams never have any issues whatsoever with dropped balls? Its repetition; those guys catch hundreds of balls in practice thus when they actually get into a game scenario its like they're sleep walking.

[milehighfan 1,240]

14 hours ago, oracle79 said:

Last I saw we were 9th in the 247 composite ranking which combines all 4.  So, you could look at any of the 4 and find a different ranking.

OK, thanks. I just wondered what we were ranked.

[Southwest 186]

6 hours ago, ClaytonAU said:

So WR coaches don't improve and teach proper catching methods? 

What Metafour said above....

[Southwest 186]

6 hours ago, steeleagle said:

Ugh...I'm a Steeler fan..and you HAD to remind me about Coates and his hands of Steel :)....

Have a few friends who are die hard steelers fans,so I have heard a few choice words said about Coates lol

[lutzcammed 469]

On Friday, February 03, 2017 at 7:51 AM, AUDevil said:

How come they don't use the full scale to rate players?  Some should be 0 star or 1 star players.  2 stars are guys that are not evaluated right?  Those guys should really be 0 star players.

Wow.  Yay me.  I had no idea coming out of high school that I was a 2 star defensive back and kicker.

I need to put that on a plaque or somwthing.maybe with a footnote that I choose not to sign with anybody and concentrate on academics.