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Who Do You Want?

ClaytonAU

By ClaytonAU
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DAG Founding Father

DAG 33,964

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9 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

He had a recruiting class that was the best in MAC history which included a couple four star recruits and a bunch of three stars at Western Michigan.  Ever been to Kalamazoo?  I have.  Ain't much there.  Dude can flat out recruit.  His teams never had character issues but he got some great talent, including a top ten pick in the draft this past year.

The only thing about him is what does he bring that is different than CGM? He is still a relatively unknown at the power 5 level. I can't see the head honchos taking a chance on another very, very green head coach. In fact, he is more green than CGM

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Brad_ATX Founding Father

Brad_ATX 13,654

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12 minutes ago, DAG said:

The only thing about him is what does he bring that is different than CGM? He is still a relatively unknown at the power 5 level. I can't see the head honchos taking a chance on another very, very green head coach. In fact, he is more green than CGM

Fair.  I think he brings a little more than Gus because he has taken a program that was nothing and built them into the best non-Power 5 team in the country last year.  And that was accomplished in a state not known for producing a lot of high school talent.  He was at WMU for four years before taking the Minnesota job, so that's already three more years of HC experience than Gus had when got the AU gig.  Gus walked into a perfect situation at Arkansas State that required nothing of him.  I also love PJs youth and energy.

I don't think we have a chance to get a known commodity head coach at the P-5 level, nor do I necessarily want one.  I'm not convinced that the ones we could get would be upgrades at all.  We'll be looking at a rising assistant from a P-5 school or a group of 5 head coach if Gus is gone.

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AUEngineer2016 Veteran

AUEngineer2016 407

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Y'all. I don't care if you start thinking about names, but let's be realistic about it, okay?

  • Dabo has built a program that is competing for national titles year in and year out, and he played at Bama. He's not coming.
  • Clay Helton is HC at a blue blood (USC). Also competing for championships. No-go.
  • Fleck just got to a program that he feels can compete in the Big 10. He's not the kind of coach that would jump ship after 1 year. Cross him off the list.
  • If Patterson hasn't left TCU yet, he's not going. 
  • I doubt Stoops would come out of retirement. He retired because heart problems run in his family (his dad had a heart attack and died while coaching). 

Most realistic names I've heard are Mullen and Durkin, and even those aren't really realistic. Durkin has great support from fans and the school at Maryland and is in a talent-rich area. Mullen coaches for a conference opponent, also has full backing from the university, and has built that program.

You want more realistic names?

  • Chad Morris, HC SMU (assuming he doesn't take Texas A&M)
  • Charlie Strong, HC USF (I don't want him, but we could get him)
  • Dave Aranda, DC LSU (Strong pedigree, well respected)
  • Jeremy Pruitt, DC Bama
  • Larry Fedora, HC UNC (long-shot. I don't think he'd leave)
  • Frank Wilson, HC UTSA (fantastic recruiter, SEC experience)
  • Bill Clark, HC UAB (again, doubt he'd come. I want him though)

 

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DAG Founding Father

DAG 33,964

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26 minutes ago, AUEngineer2016 said:

Y'all. I don't care if you start thinking about names, but let's be realistic about it, okay?

  • Dabo has built a program that is competing for national titles year in and year out, and he played at Bama. He's not coming.
  • Clay Helton is HC at a blue blood (USC). Also competing for championships. No-go.
  • Fleck just got to a program that he feels can compete in the Big 10. He's not the kind of coach that would jump ship after 1 year. Cross him off the list.
  • If Patterson hasn't left TCU yet, he's not going. 
  • I doubt Stoops would come out of retirement. He retired because heart problems run in his family (his dad had a heart attack and died while coaching). 

Most realistic names I've heard are Mullen and Durkin, and even those aren't really realistic. Durkin has great support from fans and the school at Maryland and is in a talent-rich area. Mullen coaches for a conference opponent, also has full backing from the university, and has built that program.

You want more realistic names?

  • Chad Morris, HC SMU (assuming he doesn't take Texas A&M)
  • Charlie Strong, HC USF (I don't want him, but we could get him)
  • Dave Aranda, DC LSU (Strong pedigree, well respected)
  • Jeremy Pruitt, DC Bama
  • Larry Fedora, HC UNC (long-shot. I don't think he'd leave)
  • Frank Wilson, HC UTSA (fantastic recruiter, SEC experience)
  • Bill Clark, HC UAB (again, doubt he'd come. I want him though)

 

Charlie Strong? Jeremy Pruitt? Frank Wilson? Cmon man.

Dan Mullen is way more realistic than Frank Wilson and Charlie Strong.

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wdefromtx Founding Father

wdefromtx 3,159

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3 minutes ago, DAG said:

Charlie Strong? Jeremy Pruitt? Frank Wilson? Cmon man.

His point was realistic coaches we could get....not necessarily the ones any of us would like to get. 

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DAG Founding Father

DAG 33,964

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2 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

His point was realistic coaches we could get....not necessarily the ones any of us would like to get. 

I know his point. why the hell would AU want frank freaking wilson? He hasn't even been a HC  for two years. Realistically, AU could get Jay Hopson too but why would the big money guys do that?

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Brad_ATX Founding Father

Brad_ATX 13,654

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11 minutes ago, DAG said:

I know his point. why the hell would AU want frank freaking wilson? He hasn't even been a HC  for two years. Realistically, AU could get Jay Hopson too but why would the big money guys do that?

This is flawed thinking.  It doesn't matter how a long someone has been a HC for, you need the BEST coach.  I'm not advocating for Wilson, just that the best coach isn't necessarily a current HC.  Many great coordinators that become great HCs get their first crack at their own program and succeed at a big school.  That's why I'm very much in favor of Venables.

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DAG Founding Father

DAG 33,964

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12 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

This is flawed thinking.  It doesn't matter how a long has been a HC for, you need the BEST coach.  I'm not advocating for Wilson, just that the best coach isn't necessarily a current HC.  Many great coordinators that become great HCs get their first crack at their own program and succeed at a big school.  That's why I'm very much in favor of Venables.

Name them. Name the many great coaches who started off coaching at a big school as their first job and succeeded at the big school. I can only think of 4 coaches right now out of all these big schools.  And 2 of them I would consider blue blood schools. And mind you, I don't mind having a coordinator, but you need to have extensive experience IMO, preferably at the power 5 level.  I would love to have Dave Aranda. He has extensive coaching experience and has been a DC at two big power 5 schools now.

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Brad_ATX Founding Father

Brad_ATX 13,654

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4 minutes ago, DAG said:

Name them. Name the many great coaches who started off coaching at a big school as their first job and succeeded at the big school. I can only think of 4 coaches right now out of all these big schools.  And 2 of them I would consider blue blood schools.

Just off the top of my head:

Dabo Swinney

Bob Stoops

David Shaw

Jimbo Fisher

Gary Patterson

Dan Mullen (does a ton with a less than desirable situation)

Mike Gundy (current top 10 ranking, favorite to win Big 12 this year)

Dana Holgerson (not my favorite, but has two 10 win seasons under his belt at WVU)

 

Not to mention that Kirby Smart, Clay Helton and Lincoln Riley are off to good starts.  Riley specifically showed more creativity last week than Gus has in 2 years.

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meh130 Veteran

meh130 1,043

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1 hour ago, AUEngineer2016 said:

Y'all. I don't care if you start thinking about names, but let's be realistic about it, okay?

  • Dabo has built a program that is competing for national titles year in and year out, and he played at Bama. He's not coming.
  • Clay Helton is HC at a blue blood (USC). Also competing for championships. No-go.
  • Fleck just got to a program that he feels can compete in the Big 10. He's not the kind of coach that would jump ship after 1 year. Cross him off the list.
  • If Patterson hasn't left TCU yet, he's not going. 
  • I doubt Stoops would come out of retirement. He retired because heart problems run in his family (his dad had a heart attack and died while coaching). 

Most realistic names I've heard are Mullen and Durkin, and even those aren't really realistic. Durkin has great support from fans and the school at Maryland and is in a talent-rich area. Mullen coaches for a conference opponent, also has full backing from the university, and has built that program.

You want more realistic names?

  • Chad Morris, HC SMU (assuming he doesn't take Texas A&M)
  • Charlie Strong, HC USF (I don't want him, but we could get him)
  • Dave Aranda, DC LSU (Strong pedigree, well respected)
  • Jeremy Pruitt, DC Bama
  • Larry Fedora, HC UNC (long-shot. I don't think he'd leave)
  • Frank Wilson, HC UTSA (fantastic recruiter, SEC experience)
  • Bill Clark, HC UAB (again, doubt he'd come. I want him though)

 

Fair points. Let me ask you this:

Who is the next P.J. Fleck, Justin Fuente, or Jeff Brohm?

Who are the top, young, up and coming, Group of 5 head coaches we could target?

If there are none, if the wave has passed, we have no choice but to either go after a Power 5 head coach, or a Power 5 assistant.

Another one who intrigues me is Joe Moorhead, the OC for Penn State, who was the former HC of Fordham (FCS). He was very successful as an FCS HC, and his offensive philosophy sounds like it would fit our players (Spread Option with heavy RPO emphasis). In other words, what we are supposed to be doing.

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AUEngineer2016 Veteran

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56 minutes ago, DAG said:

Charlie Strong? Jeremy Pruitt? Frank Wilson? Cmon man.

Dan Mullen is way more realistic than Frank Wilson and Charlie Strong.

I disagree completely because:

  • Both Strong and Wilson are at non-P5 programs. Mullen is at an SEC program.
  • Both Strong and Wilson have been at their programs for less than 2 years (Wilson - 2016, Strong - 2017). Mullen has been with State for 8 years (2009)
  • Strong has been a P5 coach and will look to get back. Wilson is an up-and-comer who is looking for his first P5 opportunity. Meanwhile, Mullen is an established P5 coach and has no reason to try and move.

How in the world is Mullen a more realistic hire than Wilson or Strong? If you're thinking in terms of the "best" coach of the three, I agree. However if you're thinking in terms of coaches that would actually come in and find success at Auburn, I disagree. 

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DAG Founding Father

DAG 33,964

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Just now, Brad_ATX said:

Just off the top of my head:

Dabo Swinney

Bob Stoops

David Shaw

Jimbo Fisher

Gary Patterson

Dan Mullen (does a ton with a less than desirable situation)

Mike Gundy (current top 10 ranking, favorite to win Big 12 this year)

Dana Holgerson (not my favorite, but has two 10 win seasons under his belt at WVU)

 

Not to mention that Kirby Smart, Clay Helton and Lincoln Riley are off to good starts.  Riley specifically showed more creativity last week than Gus has in 2 years.

Ok, David Shaw falls under Jim Harbaugh. He didn't come in and reinvent the wheel. He surely didn't build Stanford. He did follow the blueprint though. Gary Patterson is one of the four I was thinking of and also who I want, preferably because he has HC experience and has been successful at TCU. Bob Stoops is another one of my four. Dan Mullen is a good coach. But again, he falls under that paradigm of having HC experience, so I have no quips about him coming to AU. Mike Gundy is a good coach. I wouldn't consider him a great coach. 1 BIG 12 championship out of his coaching tenure. Art Briles had 2 coaching at Baylor in just 7 years. Dabo is great. He has proven himself.  Dana Holgerson is nowhere near a great coach.  Yes, he has two ten win seasons at WVU. He also has two 7 wins and a 4 win season.

So realistically four who have been great and two of those schools are blue blood schools. Kirby Smart and Lincoln have just started. We have no clue where they will be in year 5. But let me mention again, Lincoln Riley has taken a program that is solidified and that he has already been in. That is not the same thing as a Venable coaching at AU. Although I wouldn't be against him either.

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Brad_ATX Founding Father

Brad_ATX 13,654

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9 minutes ago, meh130 said:

Who are the top, young, up and coming, Group of 5 head coaches we could target?

 

Some names from this group.  Fickell would be my #1 choice.

Luke Fickell - Cincinnati

Mike Bobo - Colorado State

Mike Norvell - Memphis

Chad Morris - SMU

Jay Hopson - Southern Miss

Mike Sanford Jr - Western Kentucky

Scott Satterfield - Appalachian State

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Brad_ATX Founding Father

Brad_ATX 13,654

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7 minutes ago, DAG said:

Ok, David Shaw falls under Jim Harbaugh. He didn't come in and reinvent the wheel. He surely didn't build Stanford. He did follow the blueprint though. Gary Patterson is one of the four I was thinking of and also who I want, preferably because he has HC experience and has been successful at TCU. Bob Stoops is another one of my four. Dan Mullen is a good coach. But again, he falls under that paradigm of having HC experience, so I have no quips about him coming to AU. Mike Gundy is a good coach. I wouldn't consider him a great coach. 1 BIG 12 championship out of his coaching tenure. Art Briles had 2 coaching at Baylor in just 7 years. Dabo is great. He has proven himself.  Dana Holgerson is nowhere near a great coach.  Yes, he has two ten win seasons at WVU. He also has two 7 wins and a 4 win season.

So realistically four who have been great and two of those schools are blue blood schools. Kirby Smart and Lincoln have just started. We have no clue where they will be in year 5. But let me mention again, Lincoln Riley has taken a program that is solidified and that he has already been in. That is not the same thing as a Venable coaching at AU. Although I wouldn't be against him either.

It kind of is the same in many ways for some of those names.  Whoever we bring in here doesn't have to reinvent the wheel.  The cupboard is stocked and it wouldn't take much to be successful early for anyone who takes over.  My point remains though that there are numerous cases of blue blood programs handing the reigns to an unproven guy, yet succeeding.  Heck, look at the NFL now.  The trend is to go away from those with previous head coaching experience and instead look for the young up and comer.  Just wish Auburn would have the foresight to do this once, because we've missed some opportunities with coaches due to this type of thinking.  It still kills me that Kirby could be our coach right now.

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DAG Founding Father

DAG 33,964

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3 minutes ago, AUEngineer2016 said:

I disagree completely because:

  • Both Strong and Wilson are at non-P5 programs. Mullen is at an SEC program.
  • Both Strong and Wilson have been at their programs for less than 2 years (Wilson - 2016, Strong - 2017). Mullen has been with State for 8 years (2009)
  • Strong has been a P5 coach and will look to get back. Wilson is an up-and-comer who is looking for his first P5 opportunity. Meanwhile, Mullen is an established P5 coach and has no reason to try and move.

How in the world is Mullen a more realistic hire than Wilson or Strong? If you're thinking in terms of the "best" coach of the three, I agree. However if you're thinking in terms of coaches that would actually come in and find success at Auburn, I disagree. 

Charlie Strong couldn't win at Texas with all the money and influence in the world. In the big 12, which is one of the weaker conferences in the power 5 paradigm. So yes, If AU offered Charlie strong, He would be a fool to turn it down, but my question is, why would we offer him? 

He does have a reason. Do you really think if someone like UF offered Dan Mullen a HC position, he would say you know what I have an established base at Starksville, MS..He only can take them so far.

Wilson? Wilson went 6-7 at UTSA last year and previous to that he was mainly a recruiting coordinator and positional coach. Why would AU offer him a position as an HC? It has to be realistic from both sides man.

Like realistically, if Margot Robbie offered to date any of the males on this thread, they would accept, but why would she find that appealing?
 

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