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IronMan70

A Game Day Suggestion for Gus from a Supporter (but waning).

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McLoofus    3,609
Just now, AU64 said:

Well if you want to look at it that way.....one of them is a missed point blank 30 yard field goal from watching the 2016 playoffs from his lakeside home in South Carolina last year.:)

Hah. Well played.

Point is, all head coaches are not created equal. 

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johnnyAU    460

Gus has lost me completely. His inability, or reluctance, to sub in healthy RB's for an obviously injured Pettway is ridiculous.  That in addition to having a simplistic WR route tree that hasn't grown or gotten any more complex in his entire tenure at Auburn.  We are sending multiple WR's deep, with slow developing routes on the same play with no outlets in the face of blitzes. We aren't using the TE, or the RB effectively in the passing game. Our screen attempts are chaotic and our flea flicker, while I liked the idea, took way too long.  We were in the red zone twice for multiple plays, and we threw ZERO passes across the goal line once again.  

He could have done something in desperation in those final 2 drives to add a spark, like putting in Willis or Martin, Miller, etc....Nothing. 

How many times do the opposing DC's adjust to his tendencies and Gus fails to adapt effectively? It just seems like he just keeps trying the same things over and over, hoping they will eventually work. 

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ValleyTiger    551
31 minutes ago, DyeCampAlum said:

But on the OL, I can vouch for Herb Hand. He developed a running game at Vandy, which says everything.

You shouldn't. Two years in a row and his guys look completely outmatched weeks into a season. The talent is there, the coaching, eh not so much. IMHO every OL coach should be on the sideline drawing it up for his guys, helping them face to face. 

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meh130    131
1 hour ago, IronMan70 said:

The basis for much of the reaction we are seeing is that, given the disappointing offensive production at the end of last season, we expected improvements to the offense so it could compliment this very good defense. When that didn't happen, especially in light of certain off season moves, we were understandably very disappointed, shocked, angered, all the above. But it seems like Gus just refuses to let go and allow the OC to do his job. So here is one suggestion for game day from a long time supporter.

Gus, get rid of the play sheet clipboard, maybe even lose the head set, calm down on the sidelines and act like the head coach. Carrying around the play sheet just looks like you are hovering over the OC, which is what you are doing and it doesn't help the situation. You are not the OC, let the OC do his job like you do with the DC. That would be a start and it may help, but honestly Gus, when you start to lose a guy like me who has been a supporter from the beginning, you really don't have much time. Let go Gus.

I agree with the sentiment, and it is a very good point. Dye, Tubberville, and Saban did not carry call sheets. And it would be a visible message.

I am not sure about losing the headset. You would end up with the Pat Dye situation of him yelling questions to his assistants over the crowd noise.

Other coaches (Dabo, for example) carry a call sheet, but there is not a hovering question with them.

However, do we know if the call sheet is the offensive call sheet? Some defensive assistants use call sheets as well.

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meh130    131
21 minutes ago, johnnyAU said:

Gus has lost me completely. His inability, or reluctance, to sub in healthy RB's for an obviously injured Pettway is ridiculous.  That in addition to having a simplistic WR route tree that hasn't grown or gotten any more complex in his entire tenure at Auburn.  We are sending multiple WR's deep, with slow developing routes on the same play with no outlets in the face of blitzes. We aren't using the TE, or the RB effectively in the passing game. Our screen attempts are chaotic and our flea flicker, while I liked the idea, took way too long.  We were in the red zone twice for multiple plays, and we threw ZERO passes across the goal line once again.  

He could have done something in desperation in those final 2 drives to add a spark, like putting in Willis or Martin, Miller, etc....Nothing. 

How many times do the opposing DC's adjust to his tendencies and Gus fails to adapt effectively? It just seems like he just keeps trying the same things over and over, hoping they will eventually work. 

Agree. We do not adapt because we cannot adapt. We have a game plan problem.

On one play I saw the right Clemson DE lined up wide, in a 9-Tech. There was no way Tega could get to him--I doubt any OT could have, not even Greg Robinson.

But here is the thing. If you line your DE up in a 9T, you leave a huge bubble between your 3-Tech DT and your 9-Tech DE, often covered by a single LB. There are still only 11 defenders on the field.

When faced with that, we should have had the ability to audible into something different. A different blocking scheme,. or a different play. A power running play to the bubble would likely have worked. A draw may have worked well also.

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OnthePlains    418
17 minutes ago, ValleyTiger said:

You shouldn't. Two years in a row and his guys look completely outmatched weeks into a season. The talent is there, the coaching, eh not so much. IMHO every OL coach should be on the sideline drawing it up for his guys, helping them face to face. 

On top of that he has overseen some of the worst pass protection offensive lines in college history.  

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meh130    131
52 minutes ago, DyeCampAlum said:

On the assistant coaching thing, I've long been amazed that Auburn seems incapable of coaching receivers. Some even go on to be successful in the NFL after not having success at Auburn.

But on the OL, I can vouch for Herb Hand. He developed a running game at Vandy, which says everything.

I think Hand is too cerebral. He overthinks things. That is fine in the spring, but by fall it is about getting the positions correct and getting synergy.

That said, I think the shift of Darius James from LT to RT had more to do with James' inconsistent practice/play. He is inconsistent at RT at pass blocking. Who is to say he would be more consistent at LT? Who is to say a talented, experienced, inconsistent James is better than a talented, inexperienced, consistent Tega?

I would have loved to have seen what Braden Smith could have done at LT, but we would have needed to make that change years ago.

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kd4au    502
8 minutes ago, meh130 said:

I think Hand is too cerebral. He overthinks things. That is fine in the spring, but by fall it is about getting the positions correct and getting synergy.

That said, I think the shift of Darius James from LT to RT had more to do with James' inconsistent practice/play. He is inconsistent at RT at pass blocking. Who is to say he would be more consistent at LT? Who is to say a talented, experienced, inconsistent James is better than a talented, inexperienced, consistent Tega?

I would have loved to have seen what Braden Smith could have done at LT, but we would have needed to make that change years ago.

I think your giving Hand to much credit. Braden got beat at guard a couple of times on pass rush. Just in general the O-Line doesn't look like they even know who they should block on some plays and look to me as they get worse each year Hand is there as opposed to getting better. They are way to many unblocked players running in to make plays. Maybe I should say untouched players and not unblocked because most of the time nobody even touches them.

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ToraGirl    285
2 hours ago, AuburnNTexas said:

No HC ever gives up complete control to a DC or OC they always have the right to override on an individual play or make final decision on a gamble type play 4th and one.  That said most HC's are managers they set a direction hire the right people and give them a lot of latitude. Gus has done that over the last 3 years with the DC's but he doesn't seem to be able to hire independent OC's and let them have the latitude they need.

Offense is "his baby", from his past and his perception, but the fruit of his labor just isn't there. For whatever reason. #surrenderthescript

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AUIH1    723
Just now, ToraGirl said:

Offense is "his baby", from his past and his perception, but the fruit of his labor just isn't there. For whatever reason. #surrenderthescript

Actually Tora, the script is the only time Gus' O works and that is for the 1st drive or maybe two.  After that, it goes to crap.

 

wde

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ToraGirl    285

Oh, the script to which I'm referring sounds like, "We didn't execute...we're gonna get better...no doubt about it."

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jAUSon    194

In '15 and '16 my message to CGM is as you stated- hire some competence, back off and be the coach. Right now I'm saying get lost. And y'all are correct about not "hating" the guy. But for the flippant attitude and lying at press conferences, for when he told us he thought "Sean was good to go" even though his arm was broken. The way he sent Pettway into the front four in Q4 limping to the detriment of the scoreboard....I hate the guy. You'll just have to forgive me later. I think he's a douche bag. I hate his glasses. His sweater. His voice. I'm sorry.

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AUIH1    723
57 minutes ago, ToraGirl said:

Oh, the script to which I'm referring sounds like, "We didn't execute...we're gonna get better...no doubt about it."

Got it!  

wde

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around4ever    330
4 hours ago, kd4au said:

No Gus is 100 % the head man and 100 % at fault. He should hire better coaches.

Better coaches would not put up with his stubbornness and micro-managing.  That's why he hires yes men on the offensive side. 

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1913-14    160
3 hours ago, DyeCampAlum said:

On the assistant coaching thing, I've long been amazed that Auburn seems incapable of coaching receivers. Some even go on to be successful in the NFL after not having success at Auburn.

But on the OL, I can vouch for Herb Hand. He developed a running game at Vandy, which says everything.

Herbs weakness is pass blocking...

 

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AU64    1,982
6 minutes ago, 1913-14 said:

Herbs weakness is pass blocking...

 

Auburn is a running team....usually the OL is either good at pass blocking or run blocking....not often both....unfortunately thus far we are not good at either....too much complexity?"   Saw the comment below in a sports blog....

Run-blocking is pro-active. You have a place to be, a guy to hit. Go do it. Pass-blocking is reactive. You retreat into position to block whoever might be coming and have to react to possible blitzes and stunts. Even if you have an assigned guy, you can't just go after him, because moving forward will make it easier for him to get around you. You have to keep him in front of you and do it for a while to give your QB time. They are very different skills

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TigerWar    82
46 minutes ago, IronMan70 said:

The basis for much of the reaction we are seeing is that, given the disappointing offensive production at the end of last season, we expected improvements to the offense so it could compliment this very good defense. When that didn't happen, especially in light of certain off season moves, we were understandably very disappointed, shocked, angered, all the above. But it seems like Gus just refuses to let go and let the OC do his job. So here is one suggestion for game day from a long time supporter.

Gus, get rid of the play sheet clipboard, maybe even lose the head set, calm down on the sidelines and act like the head coach. Carrying around the play sheet just looks like you are hovering over the OC, which is what you are doing and it doesn't help the situation. You are not the OC. Let the OC do his job like you do with the DC. That would be a start and it may help, but honestly Gus, when you start to lose a guy like me who has been a supporter from the beginning, you really don't have much time. Let go Gus.

The team takes on the personality of its coach. The defense has taken on the traits of Steele with tactical savagery. Does Gus not realize the vibes his body language puts off on the sidelines? During the Clemson game, he often looked anguished, timid, anxious and nervous. Come to think of it, that's exactly how 'his' offense played, especially the quarterback.

Your post is 100% dead-on. Gus had me convinced that this was his deepest and most talented team ever.  Well, he may have been right when referring to the opposite side of the ball wherein lies his expertise. The defense is truly a Top 10 defense. However, the offense...the offense is as bad as it's ever been in modern history and as we all know, ironically, yet sadly that's the side of the ball that Gus Malzahn is known for.

I've been a Gus defender and believer from Day 1, but witnessing the horror movie that was the Clemson game put me over the edge and I felt like I was watching Chip Lindsey trying to do his job but every single decision was being micromanaged by his boss on the headset. Now that may or may not be what actually happened but I can certainly understand why that would be the perception. I agree, I would LOVE for Gus get rid of the headset and especially the play-chart and truly be a CEO type coach of the entire team.

The best thing Gus can do is take off the headset, set down the clipboard, do a better job of managing the ebb and flow of the game with clock management/timeouts, hold officials responsible on certain calls, give the 'Yay' or 'Nay' regarding 4th Down calls, encourage players on offense, defense, and special teams as the game is going and most importantly...LET YOUR ASSISTANTS DO THEIR JOB.

As someone has already pointed out, Gus needs to remember back in his career when Houston Nutt was dabbling with everything he was doing on the offensive side of the ball when he was the OC for the Razorbacks. Gus, it wasn't fun for you then and it sure as hell isn't fun for us now.

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1913-14    160
54 minutes ago, AU64 said:

Auburn is a running team....usually the OL is either good at pass blocking or run blocking....not often both....unfortunately thus far we are not good at either....too much complexity?"   Saw the comment below in a sports blog....

Run-blocking is pro-active. You have a place to be, a guy to hit. Go do it. Pass-blocking is reactive. You retreat into position to block whoever might be coming and have to react to possible blitzes and stunts. Even if you have an assigned guy, you can't just go after him, because moving forward will make it easier for him to get around you. You have to keep him in front of you and do it for a while to give your QB time. They are very different skills

They are a running /play action team that had 11 sacks. BTW, you can do both. I've coached O-line for 2 state champions and 2 runners up...

 

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AU64    1,982
42 minutes ago, 1913-14 said:

They are a running /play action team that had 11 sacks. BTW, you can do both. I've coached O-line for 2 state champions and 2 runners up...

 

I don't doubt that but I've read numerous articles over the years on the issue...maybe just as an excuse but it's also seems to be generally accepted that teams that primarily focus on running the ball have problems with pass blocking.   NFL keeps stats on that kind of thing and some teams are just bad and some are good....but quite a few also have quite a disparity in ratings between passing and running. 

AU calls itself a running /play action team but as long as I can remember "Running Back U" has primarily featured the running game and I expect  that has been how the OL has been coached.   Seems that most AU QBs have had a hard time getting adequate pass protection....and I'm thinking back several different offensive line coaches. Maybe it started with Gus...but I'm thinking back before that too. :dunno: 

No doubt this season's group is pretty bad....and hoping some position / player changes might improve things.....pretty sure JS is hoping so. 

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IronMan70    449

Confirmation:

There just happens to be a long article on 24/7 today that confirms the suspicions in the OP about the headset/clipboard/control issues . The article is premium so I will just paraphrase the point. Several sideline sources say on game days Gus is linked directly to the OC and Lindsey is more of a conduit than an individual play caller. I added the link to the OP for those who can also read it. 

Edited by IronMan70
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1913-14    160
15 hours ago, AU64 said:

I don't doubt that but I've read numerous articles over the years on the issue...maybe just as an excuse but it's also seems to be generally accepted that teams that primarily focus on running the ball have problems with pass blocking.   NFL keeps stats on that kind of thing and some teams are just bad and some are good....but quite a few also have quite a disparity in ratings between passing and running. 

AU calls itself a running /play action team but as long as I can remember "Running Back U" has primarily featured the running game and I expect  that has been how the OL has been coached.   Seems that most AU QBs have had a hard time getting adequate pass protection....and I'm thinking back several different offensive line coaches. Maybe it started with Gus...but I'm thinking back before that too. :dunno: 

No doubt this season's group is pretty bad....and hoping some position / player changes might improve things.....pretty sure JS is hoping so. 

JB Grimes did a great job...I guess Alabama and New England haven't read those articles...btw, Auburn ,and most teams, now try to achieve balance...if they read those articles,why try?...in high school you better be proficient in coaching it all...

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AUloggerhead    187

The limited number of plays the offense runs (e.g. KP up the middle or off tackle, Eli Stove on the sweep, WR screen pass, occasional deep throw, etc.) makes the existence of the "playsheet" more like a decoy prop. 

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Beaker    377
On 9/11/2017 at 2:03 PM, kd4au said:

No Gus is 100 % the head man and 100 % at fault. He should hire better coaches.

No need in hiring better coaches on the O side, he is micromanaging them to death.     Better coaches is not the answer I am afraid.

On 9/11/2017 at 1:50 PM, TigerHorn said:

Didn't I see Dabo The Anointed with his play sheet on the sidelines? Maybe I'm not remembering it right. There is definitely a problem with this team, I'm just not so sure its all Gus. 

It is all  Gus.  I like Gus, but he is holding the team back.  THIS IS the most talent we have had on O since 2004, period.  If it is the process on the offense, that's on Gus.  If it is the coaches on the O, that's on Gus.   It is not the players.  He has made about $25 mil from Auburn since 2009; if you take the checks you take the responsibility and thus accountable.

Look at who he learned from:  Houston Nutt and Gene Chizik.    Nutt is a nut and Chiz is fine, but Gus had little to no development before he came to Auburn.  We took a flyer and he hasn't gotten better.  A case can be made he has digressed ( a strong case ).

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