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The "Sh*thole Countries" Remark


AUDub

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1 hour ago, NolaAuTiger said:

In a closed door meeting with no transcript. They are ****hole countries. The people who’d cut off their left leg to leave would agree. Such a term too harsh for you? Could you ever attend a private meeting on the Hill? Trust me, the rhetoric gets worse than that.

And how did that work out in this case?

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2 hours ago, AUDub said:

It really can't be denied anymore. Trump is your racist retiree uncle living in Florida scared shitless by brown people, elected to the highest office in the land. 

Look, there are people coming here from countries that do have serious problems, and that is usually why those people are leaving. Those countries are struggling, as were many countries at one time. People immigrated from those nations. EVERY TIME those people were stereotyped and vilified by those already here. They were framed as criminals and leeches. Every. Time. The Irish, the Germans, the Italians, the Jews etc. We are doing it again and this particular president based his campaign on doing it. He used people's fears and prejudices, as well as his own, to his advantage. He divided us further. He fanned flames and poured gasoline on them. And he's doing it again. He doesn't care about the effect he's having on us beyond how that effect serves his need at the time. That is not the mark of any leader.

Hell, this is a long and storied pattern. We should stop being reticent about calling it what it is. All that rhetoric during the campaign. Questioning the fitness of a U.S. born federal judge because of his heritage. His hemming and hawing over David Duke. The "both sides" remark in Charlottesville. 

No I don't. That was like 30 offensive remarks ago. 

Well every illegal immigrant is a criminal... soo, yeah if we’re talking about that group (the one Trump said contain Rapists and etc)... then that sums it up.

In regards to those seeking asylum and refugee status, Trump didn’t call the people shitholes during a State of the Union Address as reactions would cause one to think. He allegedly said the places are shitholes, in a closed door meeting. It’s really a non-issue. Cmon Ben.

By inferring that the allegation is somehow an attack against the people - who want to get the hell out of those places - is erroneous. I mean hell its more logical to bitch about the enormous amounts of wealth the Clintons amassed at the steak of countries like Haiti and those in the Middle East that throw gays off of buildings and kill women for showing their face. But im probably not allowed to bring that into the picture frame lest I be accused of exercising a fallacy or some scapegoat contention.

America isn’t at war with the Haitians. We aren’t killing natives from far away lands. We allow plenty to seek asylum and have established governance for the enforcement and allowance of US Refugee Status. You seem to purport that our government is now somehow attacking immigrants now but the basis is saturated with assumptions and allegations blown way out of proportion.

I could just as easily contend that, based on black unemployment percentages, that Trump married a foreigner, his comments about Asian immigration, the fact that he meets about immigration, and so on at least cancels out our arguments because they would essentially be the same thing from opposite sides. The needle doesn’t move and it all ends up being a nothing-burger.

Maybe the problem isn’t his rhetoric.. maybe people get offended too easily now’a days. I actually like the blow up... it’s exactly what got Trump elected. Hopefully the MSM keeps up their complaining about nothing-burgers

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1 hour ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Well every illegal immigrant is a criminal... soo, yeah if we’re talking about that group (the one Trump said contain Rapists and etc)... then that sums it up.

In regards to those seeking asylum and refugee status, Trump didn’t call the people shitholes during a State of the Union Address as reactions would cause one to think. He allegedly said the places are shitholes, in a closed door meeting. It’s really a non-issue. Cmon Ben.

By inferring that the allegation is somehow an attack against the people - who want to get the hell out of those places - is erroneous. I mean hell its more logical to bitch about the enormous amounts of wealth the Clintons amassed at the steak of countries like Haiti and those in the Middle East that throw gays off of buildings and kill women for showing their face. But im probably not allowed to bring that into the picture frame lest I be accused of exercising a fallacy or some scapegoat contention.

America isn’t at war with the Haitians. We aren’t killing natives from far away lands. We allow plenty to seek asylum and have established governance for the enforcement and allowance of US Refugee Status. You seem to purport that our government is now somehow attacking immigrants now but the basis is saturated with assumptions and allegations blown way out of proportion.

I could just as easily contend that, based on black unemployment percentages, that Trump married a foreigner, his comments about Asian immigration, the fact that he meets about immigration, and so on at least cancels out our arguments because they would essentially be the same thing from opposite sides. The needle doesn’t move and it all ends up being a nothing-burger.

Maybe the problem isn’t his rhetoric.. maybe people get offended too easily now’a days. I actually like the blow up... it’s exactly what got Trump elected. Hopefully the MSM keeps up their complaining about nothing-burgers

MLK's niece sure doesn't think he is a racist. I loved hearing tow black women on TV today saying Dem. Representatives Elijah Cummings and Maxine Waters were really racists.

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From another Senator who was in the meeting. In essence calling Durbin a liar. Rare among senators.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/01/14/gop-senator-perdue-comes-to-trumps-defense-after-s-hole-outcry-questions-durbins-credibility.html

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4 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

From another Senator who was in the meeting. In essence calling Durbin a liar. Rare among senators.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/01/14/gop-senator-perdue-comes-to-trumps-defense-after-s-hole-outcry-questions-durbins-credibility.html

Graham supposedly confirmed the story to Tim Scott and Jeff Flake. Who to believe, who to believe. 

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21 hours ago, NolaAuTiger said:

It's not an insult to their country. It's the reason people seek asylum and refugee status America - they want to get away from the blankety blank they live in (look at the federal legal requirements). He said it behind closed doors. We don't know what was said around it. It's a complete nothing-burger that anti-trumpets are blowing out of proportion. A losing battle. It doesn't move the needle any.

You have lost your damn mind. Most of these people live their countries but circumstances such as war, famine, natural disaster and so on have forced them to seek a new start elsewhere. Some only come here for education purposes so they can go back to their native land and help their people - as doctors, dentists, engineers, and so on. 

Stop minimizing and making excuses. No one with a half ounce of walking around sense thinks it’s nothing to refer to other people’s lands as “shitholes”. Good grief. 

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4 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

You have lost your damn mind. Most of these people live their countries but circumstances such as war, famine, natural disaster and so on have forced them to seek a new start elsewhere. Some only come here for education purposes so they can go back to their native land and help their people - as doctors, dentists, engineers, and so on. 

Stop minimizing and making excuses. No one with a half ounce of walking around sense thinks it’s nothing to refer to other people’s lands as “shitholes”. Good grief. 

You're lumping all immigration into one generalization, halfwit (not smack talk because I'm using it to mean that you've lost your mind). The ****hole countries he allegedly referred to were African countries and Haiti. The whole point of the temporary status welcoming immigrants from these countries is based on them being real shitholes – places so dangerous and awful that we won’t send refugees from them back to the countries because they’ll probably die, or worse. That’s the whole point of granting this policy in the first place. If you honestly think those people are coming here to get an education, and go back - you've lost your damn mindZoom in on Haiti via Google Earth and tell me what slums you see. Now sure, in some rare circumstances, people from all around the world, including Haiti, might come to America to get an education. But that's not asylum or refugee status. By proposing that alternative in this context is essentially focusing attention on the more rare, uncommon incident while ignoring the more practical, actual reason people want to leave Haiti and countries of those sorts. Let's try to focus on the more popular reason people leave. None of that "oh well what about" BS. You and I both know majority of Haitians and those in African Countries want to come to America because it's much better than the slums they live in. 

 

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The message is clear: it’s just not nice to tell the truth.

You may want to add this to your favorites bar. I did.

(Personally, my first thought on hearing about the remark was: “What squirrely little tattle-tale of a weasel went running to the press with that?” But never mind. That’s just me.)

 

https://www.city-journal.org/html/crudeness-and-truth-15668.html

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48 minutes ago, homersapien said:

So you don't care about the world's opinion?

Define what you mean by "world" and I'll answer. And also qualify "opinion" - those of the opinion that "****hole" was used vs those of the opinion that it was not used.  

Do you mean the Haitian government? Like do I care enough about what they think, that I'd lose sleep? Or just in general do I "care" about the people?

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Power and truth, likely ignored by effeminate men...........

For Nurse Ratched, read Hillary Clinton, CNN, the New York Times, Yale University, Twitter, and Google/YouTube—all the tender ministers of polite silence and enforced dishonesty. If Donald Trump’s boorishness crashes like a bull through the crystal madhouse of their leftism—well, good. It’s about time.

For all the bad language, for all the loose talk, I would rather hear a man speak as a man without fear of the Nurse Ratcheds in the press and the academy than have him neutered and gagged by a system of good manners that has been misused as a form of oppression. Better impoliteness than silence. Better crudeness than lies.

 

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We have seen the effect of uncontrolled immigration on Europe. It is very, very bad. The fact is: some countries are shitholes. I don’t want this to become one of them.   https://www.city-journal.org/html/crudeness-and-truth-15668.html

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Even the other half of the same island....

 

In 2013 the Dominican Republic's constitutional court issued a ruling that stripped citizenship from some 200,000 people of Haitian descent because their parents had come to the country illegally and they are deporting them.

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28 minutes ago, WDG said:

We have seen the effect of uncontrolled immigration on Europe. It is very, very bad. The fact is: some countries are shitholes. I don’t want this to become one of them.   https://www.city-journal.org/html/crudeness-and-truth-15668.html

Truth can be painful right?

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1 hour ago, homersapien said:

So you don't care about the world's opinion?

MAGA

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1 hour ago, WDG said:

We have seen the effect of uncontrolled immigration on Europe. It is very, very bad. The fact is: some countries are shitholes. I don’t want this to become one of them.   https://www.city-journal.org/html/crudeness-and-truth-15668.html

I don't know what's funnier. That this smug trash

"Nothing scandalizes a leftist like the truth. Point out that women and men are different, that black Americans commit a disproportionate amount of violent crime, that most terrorist acts are committed by Muslims, and the Left leaps to its collective feet in openmouthed shock, like Margaret Dumont after a Groucho Marx wisecrack. This is racism! This is sexism! This is some sort of phobia! I’m shocked, shocked to find facts being spoken in polite company!"

was presented here unironically or the arguments therein.

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22 hours ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Well every illegal immigrant is a criminal... soo, yeah if we’re talking about that group (the one Trump said contain Rapists and etc)... then that sums it up.

Are you suggesting that anyone who commits the crime of illegally immigrating, is also a rapist and murderer?  Or are you saying the crimes are equivalent?

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2 hours ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Define what you mean by "world" and I'll answer. And also qualify "opinion" - those of the opinion that "****hole" was used vs those of the opinion that it was not used.  

Do you mean the Haitian government? Like do I care enough about what they think, that I'd lose sleep? Or just in general do I "care" about the people?

I used the the "world" in the exact same sense as the following article used "global":

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jan/12/unkind-divisive-elitist-international-outcry-over-trumps-****hole-countries-remark

'There's no other word but racist': Trump's global rebuke for '****hole' remark

excerpt: 

US diplomats around the world were summoned for formal reproach, amid global shock that such crude remarks could ever be made in a semi-public meeting by the president of America.

In a strongly-worded statement, the UN said it was impossible to describe his remarks as anything other than racist, while the Vatican decried Trump’s words as “particularly harsh and offensive”.

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1 hour ago, WDG said:

We have seen the effect of uncontrolled immigration on Europe. It is very, very bad. The fact is: some countries are shitholes. I don’t want this to become one of them.   https://wUww.city-journal.org/html/crudeness-and-truth-15668.html

Yeah, but the issue here is whether or not it's a good thing for the POTUS call them that.
 

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25 minutes ago, AUDub said:

I don't know what's funnier. That this smug trash

"Nothing scandalizes a leftist like the truth. Point out that women and men are different, that black Americans commit a disproportionate amount of violent crime, that most terrorist acts are committed by Muslims, and the Left leaps to its collective feet in openmouthed shock, like Margaret Dumont after a Groucho Marx wisecrack. This is racism! This is sexism! This is some sort of phobia! I’m shocked, shocked to find facts being spoken in polite company!"

was presented here unironically or the arguments therein.

I like how they are validating Hillary Clinton's slightly intemperate remark.

Maybe if she had called Trump's base a bunch of "shitholes" instead of "diplorables" we wouldn't be having this discussion?    <_<

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