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2019 O Line Recruiting


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22 hours ago, McLoofus said:

That's weird since you've recently and repeatedly been counting  him as one of our OL reserves who can be depended upon. 

I recently and repeatedly counted him as a scholarship  OL player. That's what he is today and will remain unless/until he moves on. Anything beyond that is your own attempt at creating, well, whatever you are attempting to create. "False information" comes to mind.

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5 minutes ago, Mikey said:

I recently and repeatedly counted him as a scholarship  OL player. That's what he is today and will remain unless/until he moves on. Anything beyond that is your own attempt at creating, well, whatever you are attempting to create. "False information" comes to mind.

I'm not attempting to create anything, my man! All I'm doing is reiterating your own comments to you. I'm sorry that you find them problematic. Good news is that the first step is admitting you have a problem. 

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11 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I'm not attempting to create anything, my man! All I'm doing is reiterating your own comments to you. I'm sorry that you find them problematic. Good news is that the first step is admitting you have a problem. 

Well then, I suppose you'll have no difficulty with finding and quoting my posts in which I said Sammons would be "a reserve who can be depended on"? Don't bother looking, I never made such a statement about Sammons or any other player. I have said we're almost four deep on the O-line, which should be plenty of depth.

Anything beyond that is you trying to create something out of nothing because,,,,because,,,, why?

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7 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Well then, I suppose you'll have no difficulty with finding and quoting my posts in which I said Sammons would be "a reserve who can be depended on"? Don't bother looking, I never made such a statement about Sammons or any other player. I have said we're almost four deep on the O-line, which should be plenty of depth.

Anything beyond that is you trying to create something out of nothing because,,,,because,,,, why?

You're not worth that much trouble, silly goose.

As for why? Funny. Was recently discussing that with some others. We couldn't really come up with an answer. Like, what is the point? You're just going to keep spouting nonsense, moving goalposts, going in circles, avoiding, being disingenuous, pretending you didn't say things you did... You're right. There's not much value in it. 

As I'm typing this, though, something occurs to me. I guess we can't have thoughtful, reasoned discourse all the time? So we look for a diversion to blow off some steam? I guess that's you? Something frivolous to waste a little time on before going back to grownup conversations? Thanks?

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2 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

You're not worth that much trouble, silly goose.

As for why? Funny. Was recently discussing that with some others. We couldn't really come up with an answer. Like, what is the point? You're just going to keep spouting nonsense, moving goalposts, going in circles, avoiding, being disingenuous, pretending you didn't say things you did... You're right. There's not much value in it. 

As I'm typing this, though, something occurs to me. I guess we can't have thoughtful, reasoned discourse all the time? So we look for a diversion to blow off some steam? I guess that's you? Something frivolous to waste a little time on before going back to grownup conversations? Thanks?

My point has been solid and clear from the start. Roughly four deep is enough depth at any position. Claiming anything from me beyond that is your creation and your problem.

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3 hours ago, Mikey said:

My point has been solid and clear from the start. Roughly four deep is enough depth at any position. Claiming anything from me beyond that is your creation and your problem.

Is four deep sufficient if the backups are not good enough?  

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19 hours ago, triangletiger said:

Is four deep sufficient if the backups are not good enough?  

If a coach can't make a solid lineup with solid backups out of a position that's four deep in scholarship players, the problem isn't with the players because sufficient numbers are there. That would be on their coach.

To date, we haven't been faced with having a four-deep without good backups. Our O-line improved during the season, as would be expected after losing all five starters to graduation. Will we have adequate backups this coming season? I think we will. One can't say we don't have adequate quality depth when the guys down the chart have yet to be given a chance. If they are placed on the field and fail, then it could be said that they weren't adequate. Until that happens, nobody except their coaches and fellow players know how good they are or aren't. Certainly message board warriors don't know. All message board members can do is count numbers, which are fully adequate in Auburn's case.

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On 2/12/2019 at 9:03 PM, Southwest said:

Let's see who had the better line last year? Also who has recruited better? So sure we can rail Rg the same as Grimes 🤔

Scroll through to 2015 and you’ll see these same haters wanting RG run off too. 

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37 minutes ago, alexava said:

Scroll through to 2015 and you’ll see these same haters wanting RG run off too. 

And I remember when Garner was at GA, the bio on his was that he was a great recruiter and an so-so on field coach. We only wanted him for his recruiting knack. 

Turns out he is not bad at coaching his defensive players. And knocking him bc of one or two top recruits not panning out is ridiculous. His overall coaching ability of the players he brings in is very good IMO. 

A lot of times the position coach gets blamed for a player not producing when in reality its the DC and his schemes that contribute to a player not cutting it in the end.

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1 hour ago, alexava said:

Scroll through to 2015 and you’ll see these same haters wanting RG run off too. 

To be fair, he signed one of our best ever hauls in 2013 and then only signed 2 impact players in the next 2 classes. (Cowart was an impact signing, but not an impact player.) And those CEJ defenses were as bad as Auburn's ever seen, DL included. In 2015, it didn't look like Garner was getting results. It wasn't "haters". It was people who objectively saw a lack of job performance.

People thought Jason Campbell sucked after the 2003 season, too. Because up until that point, he had. It wasn't "hate". 

 

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2 hours ago, alexava said:

Scroll through to 2015 and you’ll see these same haters wanting RG run off too. 

There hasn't been much negativity with Garner.

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39 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

To be fair, he signed one of our best ever hauls in 2013 and then only signed 2 impact players in the next 2 classes. (Cowart was an impact signing, but not an impact player.) And those CEJ defenses were as bad as Auburn's ever seen, DL included. In 2015, it didn't look like Garner was getting results. It wasn't "haters". It was people who objectively saw a lack of job performance.

People thought Jason Campbell sucked after the 2003 season, too. Because up until that point, he had. It wasn't "hate". 

 

You could also call it impatience. You could call it not considering the persons entire body of work. I’m glad we didn’t get rid of Jason or RG. I don’t think our fans understand you have ups and downs. Constantly changing staff members just for the sake of change can set you back. Unless you have a candidate you know is a better fit you might better stick with what has worked. 

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Posters, look i can tell you coach grimes knows how to coach and the kids do like him and listen to him. I cannot tell you why last year was so bad but just like baseball you have to start with being strong up the middle and we were not. That was not totally his fault since he had not been here for two years in between. As to coaching he understands footwork and hand placement and runs an upbeat get after practice, but yet finds ways, unlike Ricky Trickett, to make learning and getting better fun and competitive for the players. He apparently needs some help recruiting and i say apparently but looks like we are providing that help. Otherwise he is a good coach and unless you have seen him run his practice and you KNOW he does not have a clue about coaching the OL i really wish you would back off. It ONLY hurts Auburn.

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23 minutes ago, alexava said:

You could also call it impatience. You could call it not considering the persons entire body of work. I’m glad we didn’t get rid of Jason or RG. I don’t think our fans understand you have ups and downs. Constantly changing staff members just for the sake of change can set you back. Unless you have a candidate you know is a better fit you might better stick with what has worked. 

In Grimes's case, the recruiting has never worked particularly well. And it hasn't entirely been his fault. But, as was the case with CCL, doesn't really matter whose fault it was. When things don't work, you have to change something, and Gus isn't going to fire himself. (As for candidates to replace Grimes, the names of several young, energetic guys who have gotten results at other programs have been mentioned over the last year.)

Fortunately, Gus isn't sticking with what hasn't worked, and he might have found a way to make it work while retaining JB. If they pull this off, I'll be elated. 

Edited by McLoofus
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We signed three pretty good O-Linemen this year even though we needed at least one more OT it was not a bad class in that we had one center, one guard, and one tackle. We have a commitment from a really good guard for next year and have a Juco OT with a lot of potential coming in for 2020 season. I am sure other coaches were more responsible for the three signees but all three had good things to say about Grimes.  It is very hard for any coach to come in in year one from another region of the country and have an initial recruiting impact because he has not had time to build relationships.

As for his coaching ability you really have to look at his body of work not just last year.  These were players who had been coached by a different coach, most of the O-line starters were gone from the year before and we really didn't have a true SEC center.  At the beginning of the year Kim was getting man handled at Center which messed up the whole line than Brahm came in and didn't do any better. So you could say poor coaching but in last three games with Kim at Center he was holding his own including games against bama and Georgia.  You don't get stronger during the season that is taken care of in Off-Season. The reason he was able to hold his own is he read the D better and he improved his technique. That has to be due to coaching.  Something strange happened once Center was holding his own the whole O-line seemed to play better.  Was it a great O-Line at end of season? No, but it held its own against two strong defenses and routed a weak defense.

I still think O-Line is a question mark for next year and I still think Grimes with help from other coaches has to show he can recruit O-Line better then past O-Line recruiting but with Jernigan and Buskey he has a good beginning. The other thing to watch is how the non-starters who were here when Grimes got here have improved to the point of competing for a starting job in the fall or at least being viable subs.  The current backups and the ones coming in this year will be tested in 2020. 

We had some pretty good O-Lines when he was here before. I am not against looking for a new O-Line coach but I am not for it either unless there is a really good candidate to replace Grimes who wants to come to Auburn.  If Auburn finds a way to pull off a 9 or 10 win season with our schedule then Grimes will have done a heck of a coaching job, if O-Line looks like last year he should go.

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23 hours ago, Mikey said:

If a coach can't make a solid lineup with solid backups out of a position that's four deep in scholarship players, the problem isn't with the players because sufficient numbers are there. That would be on their coach.

To date, we haven't been faced with having a four-deep without good backups. Our O-line improved during the season, as would be expected after losing all five starters to graduation. Will we have adequate backups this coming season? I think we will. One can't say we don't have adequate quality depth when the guys down the chart have yet to be given a chance. If they are placed on the field and fail, then it could be said that they weren't adequate. Until that happens, nobody except their coaches and fellow players know how good they are or aren't. Certainly message board warriors don't know. All message board members can do is count numbers, which are fully adequate in Auburn's case.

Lost hard @ “all message board members can do is count numbers”.

No, that’s actually not all we can do.  Some of us have common sense, can make inferences based on obvious indicators and study our recruiting history so we can know a little bit about those players within our 4-deep.

Your misunderstanding of the difference between “depth” and “numbers” is mystifying for a grown man.

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On 2/12/2019 at 1:09 PM, McLoofus said:

Hah! Just found it using Google.

20 guys with 10 games worth of experience and 10 guys with 30. That's for the whole team, but OL counts for nearly 25% of the offensive and defensive positions. And we're losing 3 3-4 year starters on the DL after 2019. 

Yeah, we will be losing 8 out of 9 starters in the trenches after 2019!!!  I have more confidence in the way we have recruited and developed depth along the DL (major understatement there)

2020 doesn’t look too good for AU football atm.  (which means we’ll probably make the playoffs, it’s just the Auburn thing to do)

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1 hour ago, L I G E R said:

study our recruiting history so we can know a little bit about those players within our 4-deep.

If you think there's a problem you haven't studied our recruiting history much. The depth on the O-line has is composed highly recruited former 3* and 4* guys that are waiting their chance.

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1 hour ago, Mikey said:

If you think there's a problem you haven't studied our recruiting history much. The depth on the O-line has is composed highly recruited former 3* and 4* guys that are waiting their chance.

I can promise you I’ve studied our recruiting history far more than you have, and the caliber of those players we’ve signed.

You seem to not understand the difference between “depth” and “numbers”, which means any attempted conversation further with you about this is futile in the first place.

Your only two options are as follows:

1.  Continue believing everyone else is wrong and you’re right, and then be shocked/annoyed/victimized/etc. when everyone throws it in your face as we all watch our 2020 OL be a disaster.

2.  Consider the strong possibility you’re very, very wrong here.

Edited by L I G E R
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10 minutes ago, L I G E R said:

I can promise you I’ve studied our recruiting history far more than you have

You’re taking to a guy that has recorded scholarship numbers and such since tbe 80’s. You’re in over your head, again. 

 

13 minutes ago, L I G E R said:

2.  Consider the strong possibility you’re very, very wrong here.

This is a possibility that all sides have to consider. 

 

15 minutes ago, L I G E R said:

You seem to not understand the difference between “depth” and “numbers”,

There really isn’t much of a difference. If you said “quality depth” then you have a point. 

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1 hour ago, aujeff11 said:

There really isn’t much of a difference. If you said “quality depth” then you have a point. 

Maybe...… If you note that much of that depth is in the form of freshmen and sophs….how can you declare them as "low quality" before they have even been on the field?   All were deemed to be good recruit when we signed them.....and for the young guys, I'd like to see how they pan out for a couple years before declaring them as having no useful role at AU. :dunno:

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I think next season will show whether or not JB is getting it done with our OL. If they keep going in the direction they did with the Purdue game, then we will be in good shape. However, you cannot base everything on one game, but after watching that game multiple times looking at different positions such as the OL and DL, you can see very solid progress.

I think out defense is going to be something really special in 2019 and likely beyond. Our defense will put us in a position to win a good deal of games in 2019. If our offense can be pretty good with our D playing lights out, then winning 9 plus games is a reality and not a pipe dream. 2020 is the season I am most concerned about with the loss of the most of the OL starters.  Our young DLs that have a wealth of talent will get their chance to show what they can do in 2020. We will need a great defense to carry us through the growing pains on the OL that is certain to happen. We could be looking at a 7-8 win season at best for 2020. Who knows folks.

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  • 2 years later...
On 2/4/2019 at 12:23 AM, Mikey said:

Gus has taken AU to two SEC championship games and won one of them in the last six years.  There's no reason to think he won't accomplish that again, and therefore he'll get the most out of his players in the process.

This post aged pretty well....:laugh:

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