Trump Ignored Explicit, All-Caps Instructions to ‘NOT CONGRATULATE’ Putin: Report

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

1 minute ago, homersapien said:

Had the Russians attacked our electoral process prior to Obama congratulating Putin?

They certainly did before Trump did. (And as I recall Trump actually encouraged them to go after his opponent.)  And of course, there are Trumps extensive business dealings with the Russians. I'm sure we'll know more about those with time.  

Trump acts afraid of Putin - as if Putin has something on him.  

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/21/opinion/donald-trump-russia-putin.html

Why Is Trump So Afraid of Russia?

Undoubtedly, these circumstances are what prompted someone high on Trumps staff to tell him in all caps DO NOT CONGRATULATE.

To throw Obama's mistake up as the reason to excuse Trump for his behavior is weak.  Very weak. 

I didn’t say excuse anyone! I said if you’re going to criticize one, then don’t let the other off the hook. Freakin Schumer even said Obama should’ve acted sooner against the Russian threat. We knew of the threat in 2012. If you don’t have any problem with obama’s congrats, yet you bash Trump for it, then you’re truly delusional.

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

4 minutes ago, homersapien said:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/21/opinion/donald-trump-russia-putin.html

"....The possibility that Mr. Putin could have some hold on the American president has lurked in the background over the past year as Mr. Trump displayed a mystifying affection for the Russian leader and ignored or excused his aggressive behavior and nefarious activities, most important, his interference in the 2016 campaign, a subject of the special counsel Robert Mueller’s investigation.

Some Trump defenders noted that President Barack Obama also called Mr. Putin when he was elected president in 2012.

But the circumstances are very different. In the intervening years, Mr. Putin has become an increasingly authoritarian leader who has crushed most of his political opposition and engineered a deeply lopsided re-election this week. American intelligence officials say they are certain that he meddled in the 2016 American election on behalf of Mr. Trump and is trying to meddle again in the 2018 election, as well as in many European elections.

Russia annexed Crimea in 2014, is waging war in other parts of Ukraine and is enabling President Bashar al-Assad in Syria.

While the administration recently imposed its first significant sanctions on Russia for election interference and other malicious cyberattacks and has faulted Russia for the poisoning of a former Russian spy and his daughter in Britain, Mr. Trump has refrained from criticizing Mr. Putin or calling him to account. The phone call reinforced that approach.

What Mr. Trump didn’t say to Mr. Putin was as significant as what he did say. He did not demand that Mr. Putin stop meddling in American elections or others, he did not even raise Moscow’s role in the poisoning.

He made no mention of the unfair political system that deprives Russians of a real say in their government. The White House press secretary, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, later reinforced Mr. Trump’s lack of interest, telling reporters it was not America’s place to question how other countries conduct their elections.

The disparity between Mr. Trump and his advisers, who seem to take threats from Russia more seriously, is becoming more pronounced.

A senior administration official told The Times that Mr. Trump didn’t want to antagonize Mr. Putin because fostering rapport is the only way to improve relations between the two countries. On Tuesday, the president said he hoped to meet Mr. Putin soon and discuss preventing an arms race — an arms race both leaders have encouraged with loose talk and investment in new weapons.

Engaging Russia and preventing an arms race are undeniably important. But it’s hard to see how praising and appeasing a bully will advance American interests. That’s not the approach Mr. Trump has taken with adversaries like North Korea or Iran, or, for that matter, even with some allies.

While Mr. Trump panders to Mr. Putin, his criticism of Mr. Mueller is becoming harsher, as the investigation raises increasingly serious concerns about a web of ties connecting Mr. Trump’s associates to Russia.

Mr. Trump’s former national security adviser, Michael Flynn, has pleaded guilty to lying about his involvement with Russia. A former foreign policy adviser, George Papadopoulos, has pleaded guilty to lying about his involvement with Russians. A former deputy campaign chairman, Rick Gates, who had his own Russian connections along with a now-indicted former campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, has pleaded guilty to lying about Russian-related matters.

Mr. Mueller has subpoenaed Mr. Trump’s company for any documents involving Russia. Democrats on the House Intelligence Committee sayMr. Trump was “actively negotiating a business deal in Moscow with a sanctioned Russian bank” during the 2016 campaign season.

And Mr. Mueller has charged 13 Russians with conspiring to subvert the 2016 election and put Mr. Trump in the White House.

Mr. Brennan’s fears clearly arise from some of these elements.

If you’re just going to be a puppet for The NY Times, don’t waste your time trying to make me see their links.

[homersapien 11,352]

Just now, NolaAuTiger said:

I didn’t say excuse anyone! I said if you’re going to criticize one, then don’t let the other off the hook. Freakin Schumer even said Obama should’ve acted sooner against the Russian threat. We knew of the threat in 2012. If you don’t have any problem with obama’s congrats, yet you bash Trump for it, then you’re truly delusional.

I didn't say I didn't have a problem with Obama congratulating Putin.  In fact, I said it was a mistake.

My point is obvious.  The two actions are not comparable.  There were a lot of differences in circumstances and recent history.

Given the circumstances, Trump's congratulations were WAY more outrageous.  

[homersapien 11,352]

1 minute ago, NolaAuTiger said:

If you’re just going to be a puppet for The NY Times, don’t waste your time trying to make me see their links.

Trying to make you see anything is a waste of time.  But it's nice to see you acknowledge it.

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

10 minutes ago, homersapien said:

I didn't say I didn't have a problem with Obama congratulating Putin.  In fact, I said it was a mistake.

My point is obvious.  The two actions are not comparable.  There were a lot of differences in circumstances and recent history.

Given the circumstances, Trump's congratulations were WAY more outrageous.  

Different circumstances but the same principle 

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

9 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Trying to make you see anything is a waste of time.  But it's nice to see you acknowledge it.

Are you ever going to acknowledge my compliments ???

[homersapien 11,352]

1 minute ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Are you ever going to acknowledge my compliments ???

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

1 minute ago, homersapien said:

Guess not. Back to work. Argue with ya later Homes

[homersapien 11,352]

2 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Different circumstances but the same principle 

Yeah, both offered congratulations.

But the circumstances obviously define the degree of the mistake.  They aren't in the same ball park.  Putin hadn't even invaded Crimea yet when Obama offered his congratulations, much less attacked our electoral system.  That makes a difference.  A huge difference.

[homersapien 11,352]

2 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Guess not. Back to work. Argue with ya later Homes

I am curious, do you have a job or are you independently wealthy?  

No way I could waste as much time as you do on this forum when I was your age.

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

32 minutes ago, homersapien said:

I am curious, do you have a job or are you independently wealthy?  

No way I could waste as much time as you do on this forum when I was your age.

Yeah because they didn’t have computers when you were my age. You old fart. Also, I have no clue how you’d figure how old I am.

Anyways. I’m well off and I work hard. Believe me. Parents worked hard, I’m following suit.

The forum is a stress reliever and I enjoy it. Is that ok?

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

31 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Yeah, both offered congratulations.

But the circumstances obviously define the degree of the mistake.  They aren't in the same ball park.  Putin hadn't even invaded Crimea yet when Obama offered his congratulations, much less attacked our electoral system.  That makes a difference.  A huge difference.

What happened then led to now. Again, even Schumer saw it. I criticize neither though. They congratulated him. Big deal

[homersapien 11,352]

1 hour ago, NolaAuTiger said:

What happened then led to now. Again, even Schumer saw it. I criticize neither though. They congratulated him. Big deal

Are you saying that Obama congratulating Putin in 2012 directly led to Putin's invasion of Crimea and his interference in our election?   If so, that's absurd.

And yes, having the POTUS congratulate Putin after him attacking our country by interferring in our election is a "big deal". 

That's exactly the attitude I was referring to when I said many Trump supporters seem to love Trump more than our country.

[homersapien 11,352]

1 hour ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Yeah because they didn’t have computers when you were my age. You old fart. Also, I have no clue how you’d figure how old I am.

Anyways. I’m well off and I work hard. Believe me. Parents worked hard, I’m following suit.

The forum is a stress reliever and I enjoy it. Is that ok?

Correct.  No computers when I was 28.  (Hell, I only got my first electronic calculator when I was 24. I didn't trust it at first and double checked it with my slide rule.)

I am also an old fart, but you have no standing to call me that.  It shows a serious lack of respect and hubris for you to do so.

You told us your age in the bio thread, I got a good laugh from it.  

[SaltyTiger 7,761]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

Yeah, both offered congratulations.

But the circumstances obviously define the degree of the mistake.  They aren't in the same ball park.  Putin hadn't even invaded Crimea yet when Obama offered his congratulations, much less attacked our electoral system.  That makes a difference.  A huge difference.

Are you sure he never meddeled with our elections in the past Brother Homer?

[homersapien 11,352]

1 minute ago, SaltyTiger said:

Are you sure he never meddeled with our elections in the past Brother Homer?

Nope.  But I am sure he did it before Trump called to congratulate him.

[SaltyTiger 7,761]

7 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Nope.  But I am sure he did it before Trump called to congratulate him.

Good answer Brother Homer....liked that and liked not having to read a big long linked article as your back up.

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

Correct.  No computers when I was 28.  (Hell, I only got my first electronic calculator when I was 24. I didn't trust it at first and double checked it with my slide rule.)

I am also an old fart, but you have no standing to call me that.  It shows a serious lack of respect and hubris for you to do so.

You told us your age in the bio thread, I got a good laugh from it.  

Seriously Homer?? I was not, by any means, using that term to offend you. Lighten up a little. Don't be a snowflake about it. I was not using it to insult you. Golf called @Proud Tiger the same thing once. PT obviously knew it was in jest. Even laughed about it. 

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

Are you saying that Obama congratulating Putin in 2012 directly led to Putin's invasion of Crimea and his interference in our election?   If so, that's absurd.

And yes, having the POTUS congratulate Putin after him attacking our country by interferring in our election is a "big deal". 

That's exactly the attitude I was referring to when I said many Trump supporters seem to love Trump more than our country.

In the overall context of Russian aggression that was present during Obama years, yes it's evolvement includes current election interference. 

[homersapien 11,352]

19 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

In the overall context of Russian aggression that was present during Obama years, yes it's evolvement includes current election interference. 

Fine, blame Obama for Putin if you insist.  But that doesn't explain Trumps reluctance to acknowledge their behavior.  And the very reason Putin hated Clinton was due to her calling him out.  And as you may recall, Clinton was part of the Obama administration.

The Russians have financial ties to Trump - and possibly a lot more.   

Trying to equate Obama's behavior towards Putin with Trump's is absurd.

[homersapien 11,352]

35 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Seriously Homer?? I was not, by any means, using that term to offend you. Lighten up a little. Don't be a snowflake about it. I was not using it to insult you. Golf called @Proud Tiger the same thing once. PT obviously knew it was in jest. Even laughed about it. 

Did I sound offended?   Hell, I admitted I was an old fart.  

I just don't think someone still wet behind the ears has the standing to joke about it.  Now if that offends you, then you're the "snowflake".

[homersapien 11,352]

1 hour ago, SaltyTiger said:

Good answer Brother Homer....liked that and liked not having to read a big long linked article as your back up.

You have my permission to remain ignorant if you so choose. 

[japantiger 4,051]

Interesting choice of title for the thread...Trump ignored "instructions".....Trump might have ignored a recommendation (apparently not according to most reports; but...) or he might have ignored advice or he might have ignored very wise council...but he didn't ignore "instructions"....he's the president...department heads don't give him instructions.  As to whether it is a good idea or not...it means little.  Been done for decades....what matters is what you do when they take an action....I've only seen on place where we've had to directly confront them and we embarrassed them.  As for election response; I don't think we know what this admin has done.  They have a tendency to play that close to the vest.  We only found out about the Syria shellaquing we gave the Russians from the Russians....If I was conducting cyber ops against the Russians, I wouldn't be talking about it...

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

Did I sound offended?   Hell, I admitted I was an old fart.  

I just don't think someone still wet behind the ears has the standing to joke about it.  Now if that offends you, then you're the "snowflake".

Who decides the threshold for standing in this instance, your honor? ??

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

Fine, blame Obama for Putin if you insist.  But that doesn't explain Trumps reluctance to acknowledge their behavior.  And the very reason Putin hated Clinton was due to her calling him out.  And as you may recall, Clinton was part of the Obama administration.

The Russians have financial ties to Trump - and possibly a lot more.   

Trying to equate Obama's behavior towards Putin with Trump's is absurd.

Again, they both, with knowledge of Russian aggression, congratulated the man. Big deal.

Be consistent in your disdain, ya old fart