Baptisms at the Athletics Complex

[RunInRed 16,360]

Church / State?  Thoughts?

 

[ArgoEagle 1,767]

My thought is Praise God!!!! Salvation through Jesus Christ is acceptable anywhere, as long as it is your decision and is not forced on you.

The only way it would be wrong is if the coaches said: If you are not a Christian, then you can't play on our team.

[PUB78 1,354]

I think it is great! You don’t check your religion at the door just because Auburn is a state school.

Glad we have Gus and Chet as mentors to these young men.

[abw0004 10,104]

Absolutely no issues with this and very happy to see this.

I see Iggy, but who are the other two?

[lionheartkc 6,150]

The separation of church and state is all about not establishing a state religion, not banning any religious activity from buildings that happen to be partially funded by state money. If you went down that road, then you'd have to go as far a saying students of all religions couldn't pray in their own dorm rooms and religious organizations could only meet off campus.

I have a very deep respect for Auburn's willingness to embrace the good that comes from religious practices. In fact, that was part of why I decided to go there. When I went on my campus visit, there was a copy of the Glom in the first office we went to, and looking through it, I was blown away by the open display of religious activities side-by-side with secular activities. Coming from close proximity to KU, where religion is treated like an infectious disease, that was refreshing.

[RunInRed 16,360]

Maybe (probably) it's just me, or my tilt to religion being a personal and private thing, but I've always been disturbed how Auburn Athletics injects it into the fabric of everything they do.  I get that it plays well in this part of the country but at the end of the day, we're a public university, not Liberty, BYU or Brandeis.

[AUatHeart 624]

I'm all for it!  Now I can truly call these young men my Brothers!

[kd4au 1,145]

Love it, we need more of these type of young men not less.

[DAG 33,955]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with it. 

[DAG 33,955]

10 minutes ago, RunInRed said:

Maybe (probably) it's just me, or my tilt to religion being a personal and private thing, but I've always been disturbed how Auburn Athletics injects it into the fabric of everything they do.  I get that it plays well in this part of the country but at the end of the day, we're a public university, not Liberty, BYU or Brandeis.

Not trying to make this into a spiritual warfare but Christianity is anything but private, especially when you think of the early church in the Bible. I like that AU is willing to not be afraid to showcase this. I hope they have the same mindframe for others personal believes as well. Notice I said Christianity , not religion.

[toddc 13,194]

This is awesome—so get ready for the Jesus police!

[JDUBB4AU 5,102]

Praise God ... that’s all 

[AU64 10,122]

37 minutes ago, RunInRed said:

Maybe (probably) it's just me, or my tilt to religion being a personal and private thing, but I've always been disturbed how Auburn Athletics injects it into the fabric of everything they do.  I get that it plays well in this part of the country but at the end of the day, we're a public university, not Liberty, BYU or Brandeis.

I can accept your view but I would hate to see you or a few other people impose that on other people.      Lion offers a more than adequate explanation of what church and state issues involve.  This does not directly affect you in any way and despite attempts by some in the media to imply that players are pressured,  there has been nothing to support those claims.

And interesting too that AU opened under the name of East Alabama Male College under guidance of the Methodist Church. 

War Eagle to those young men who are committing themselves to a life in Christ. 

[Zeek 16,615]

When I went to college in Orlando it made me appreciate the lack of PC attitudes in the South

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

7 minutes ago, AU64 said:

I can accept your view but I would hate to see you or a few other people impose that on other people.      Lion offers a more than adequate explanation of what church and state issues involve.  This does not directly affect you in any way and despite attempts by some in the media to imply that players are pressured,  there has been nothing to support those claims.

And interesting too that AU opened under the name of East Alabama Male College under guidance of the Methodist Church. 

War Eagle to those young men who are committing themselves to a life in Christ. 

I don't think he (or myself or others) are imposing a view on anyone.  His point is that AU is a public school and therefore university employees shouldn't openly push one religion or another.  There are open spaces all over campus where the freedom to gather and worship are welcome, per the law, and I have no complaints about that.

Now, if the baptism was done off-campus at a local church or something like that, then cool, no issues from me and more power to them.  But since it was done in the athletic complex, where ostensibly you could have other students walking by who happen to be of another religion, well that's a bit out of bounds.   I don't claim to know the religion of every athlete on campus, but we do have student-athletes from all over the world there, so the odds of someone being Muslim, Hindu, Jewish, etc are pretty high.

[AU64 10,122]

2 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

I don't think he (or myself or others) are imposing a view on anyone.  His point is that AU is a public school and therefore university employees shouldn't openly push one religion or another.  There are open spaces all over campus where the freedom to gather and worship are welcome, per the law, and I have no complaints about that.

Now, if the baptism was done off-campus at a local church or something like that, then cool, no issues from me and more power to them.  But since it was done in the athletic complex, where ostensibly you could have other students walking by who happen to be of another religion, well that's a bit out of bounds.   I don't claim to know the religion of every athlete on campus, but we do have student-athletes from all over the world there, so the odds of someone being Muslim, Hindu, Jewish, etc are pretty high.

No evidence that is being done so what is your gripe?    "University employees shouldn't push religions...."    That almost made me laugh  ....I bet there are dozens of professors at AU who vigorously teach against Christianity or religion in general and doing so as part of their First Amendment rights I'm guessing.   We had those back in the 1960s and I expect there are more today....   If the school tried to prevent atheist or agnostic professors from expressing "religious views" the ACLU would be all over the school don't you know.  So what's the deal about students and volunteer staff doing something? 

I'm sure there are students with every type of religious background at AU.  But, those students of other religious persuasions don't have to attend or participate....freedom to practice their religion how they wish...or not.   But they should not have the right to prevent others from doing the same. .   

I'm happy for those young men who made what can be a life changing decision and for their friends there to support them. 

[RunInRed 16,360]

43 minutes ago, AU64 said:

I can accept your view but I would hate to see you or a few other people impose that on other people.     

Do you see any irony here?

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

11 minutes ago, AU64 said:

No evidence that is being done so what is your gripe?    "University employees shouldn't push religions...."    That almost made me laugh  ....I bet there are dozens of professors at AU who vigorously teach against Christianity or religion in general and doing so as part of their First Amendment rights I'm guessing.   We had those back in the 1960s and I expect there are more today....   If the school tried to prevent atheist or agnostic professors from expressing "religious views" the ACLU would be all over the school don't you know.  So what's the deal about students and volunteer staff doing something? 

I'm sure there are students with every type of religious background at AU.  But, those students of other religious persuasions don't have to attend or participate....freedom to practice their religion how they wish...or not.   But they should not have the right to prevent others from doing the same. .   

I'm happy for those young men who made what can be a life changing decision and for their friends there to support them. 

And as usual, you completely ignored most of the post and missed the point.  No one is stopping the kids from worshipping.  The baptism was done in a part of campus that is not open to every student and is being conducted by a university employee (pretty sure that's Chette performing the ceremony).  If it's done in an open forum area on campus protected by law, then cool, go for it.  If it's done off-campus anywhere, then cool, go for it.

But what if an athlete from another sport, who happens to be of a different religion, needed that pool for therapy at that time?  Why should he/she have to wait for a religious ceremony to conclude?  Why couldn't this have been done in the swimming pool at the Student Act?  It would have accomplished the same thing and the optics would be much better since that area is open to ALL students.

Look, religion is a personal choice.  I'm happy that these guys made a choice that makes them happy.  I don't even care in the slightest that they put it on social media or anything.  My only concern is WHERE it took place.

[AU64 10,122]

2 minutes ago, RunInRed said:

Do you see any irony here?

nope,,,,

[AU64 10,122]

2 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

  My only concern is WHERE it took place

And I'm not concerned.....so guess we just disagree on this...

[lionheartkc 6,150]

29 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

I don't think he (or myself or others) are imposing a view on anyone.  His point is that AU is a public school and therefore university employees shouldn't openly push one religion or another.  There are open spaces all over campus where the freedom to gather and worship are welcome, per the law, and I have no complaints about that.

Now, if the baptism was done off-campus at a local church or something like that, then cool, no issues from me and more power to them.  But since it was done in the athletic complex, where ostensibly you could have other students walking by who happen to be of another religion, well that's a bit out of bounds.   I don't claim to know the religion of every athlete on campus, but we do have student-athletes from all over the world there, so the odds of someone being Muslim, Hindu, Jewish, etc are pretty high.

All I see is the back of his head, but my guess would be that the person performing the baptism is Brother Chette, whose paycheck comes from the Fellowship of Christian Athletes, not Auburn.

As for the risk of people walking by and seeing it, nothing in any document of American rights protects people from not seeing something that they don't believe in. If someone can't handle seeing something that has no effect on them other than it isn't part of their belief system, then they have far bigger issues to deal with. The fact that some people consider the very practice of religion to be hostile speaks volumes about how far our society has fallen.

[Barnacle 9,064]

So long as athletes of other religions are free to do the same, I don't see an issue with this. 

[lionheartkc 6,150]

5 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

But what if an athlete from another sport, who happens to be of a different religion, needed that pool for therapy at that time?  Why should he/she have to wait for a religious ceremony to conclude?  Why couldn't this have been done in the swimming pool at the Student Act?  It would have accomplished the same thing and the optics would be much better since that area is open to ALL students.

Now your stretching. I guarantee you that time in the training pool is scheduled and the pool was reserved for this purpose. I also guarantee you that they would prioritize medical needs over any kind of extracurricular activities. 

I know, in the past, they've done things like this at Chewacla, but based on what I've read, things have been rather unseasonable in Auburn, so that wasn't an option. Doing it someplace like the Student Act would likely be more of an imposition on others because it isn't something you can reserve and would interfere with student's ability to utilize one of their resources. 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

1 minute ago, lionheartkc said:

Now your stretching. I guarantee you that time in the training pool is scheduled and the pool was reserved for this purpose. I also guarantee you that they would prioritize medical needs over any kind of extracurricular activities. 

I know, in the past, they've done things like this at Chewacla, but based on what I've read, things have been rather unseasonable in Auburn, so that wasn't an option. Doing it someplace like the Student Act would likely be more of an imposition on others because it isn't something you can reserve and would interfere with student's ability to utilize one of their resources. 

OK, so aren't there dozens of churches in the Auburn area that you could have done this at?  Or maybe someone's swimming pool?  I'm sure someone in the AD has a place with a pool.  And for the record, Chewacla is a completely proper place to hold these ceremonies.

Location thoughts aside, I think the school is opening itself up to a potential issue that could have been easily avoidable.  Now I highly doubt anything comes of this and my hope is nothing does, because we've got enough things to worry about AU.  But considering all of the rulings and lawsuits that have been brought forth over the years regarding similar issues, this just reeks of stupidity to me.

[Jgarrett7 957]

23 minutes ago, RunInRed said:

Do you see any irony here?

Doubt anyone is being forced to participate! Praise God for the people in this world willing to stand up for Christ, we need Him more than ever.