Gus is ranked 16th on the hot seat

[Zeek 16,613]

6 minutes ago, AU64 said:

An AU coach is usually on the list of "hot seat" coaches...no matter who he is.  Tubs was there about half his career too.....same reason as Gus....losing games he was not supposed to lose. ...and Chiz and Bowden .....what can you say ?  flamed out in a season. 

Some folks say AU is like every other school in that regard.....I think not. 

Well our last three coaches have never been able to establish any real consistency. Here are our win percentages by year.

2017 71% / 2016 62% / 2015 54% / 2014 62% / 2013 86% / 2012 25% / 2011 62% / 2010 100% / 2009 62% / 2008 42% / 2007 69% / 2006 85% / 2005 75% / 2004 100% / 2003 62% / 2002 69% / 2001 58% / 2000 69% / 1999 46% / 1998 27% / 1997 77% / 1996 67% / 1995 67% / 1994 86% / 1993 100% / 1992 50% / 1991 46% / 1990 70% / 1989 83% / 1988 83% / 1987 83% / 1986 83% / 1985 67% / 1984 69% / 1983 91% / 1982 75% / 1981 45% / 1980 45%

1982-83, 1986-90, 1993-94, 2004-06

Those are the only times where we have had back-to-back seasons with a grade higher than "D"

Now the trade off is that a lot of coaches stay above that "D" mark but they don't necessarily win many championships.

Alabama hasn't fallen below a "C" in eleven seasons. Georgia has only had 4 seasons under a "C" in the last eleven seasons. LSU has been under a "C" 5 times in the last eleven seasons. Auburn unfortunately has been under the mark 8 times in the last eleven seasons. We have had our fun years but we're not where I think many would like to be and there is nothing wrong with that.

 

[DAG 33,955]

And no Gus is not on the hot seat and based on that contract he probably has a mulligan for at least the next two years.

[DAG 33,955]

24 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

5 coaches since 1980. Decided to look around. 

Ohio State- 5
Oklahoma- 6
Michigan- 6
Notre Dame- 6 (not counting O'Leary)
Miami- 8
USC- 9 (I think? Hard to read the wiki)
Nebraska- 7
Georgia- 5
LSU- 8
bama- LOL. Man, that Forehead/Franchione/Price/Shula run was fun. 

We are fine now that we don't let non-football staff run defensive meetings. 

 

So Auburn is in fact not uniquely suited in their expectations for winning. I don’t know why folks think the grass is greener at other football institutions and with other fan bases. Based on this, it looks to me like we might actually be a lot more patient.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

5 minutes ago, Zeek said:

I'd argue that we were superior than FSU and we let off the gas. We could have racked up the score but instead we went too conservative.

I recommend going back and looking at the 2013 season. We BARELY won several of our games that year. While we had the ability to nearly score at will against lesser opponents, we weren't running up the score against good defenses and we had no ability to stop the other team from scoring.  Florida State, on the other hand, soundly beat all comers and ran up the score pretty readily. We actually gave them their biggest challenge and, incidentally, held them to their lowest score of the entire season and scored more on them than all but 1 opponent who only scored 3 more than we did.

10 minutes ago, Zeek said:

I don't give Gus an out with injuries against the pups in round 2. The entire offense shouldn't become inept because of a dinged up running back. His stubborn attitude and weird decision to keep shoving Pettway onto the field while hobbling made no sense. We had plenty other backs that could have been developed throughout the season better.

Not to be nit picky, but Pettway didn't play against Georgia. While I don't disagree that we could have had a more unique game plan going into that game and we certainly could have put more effort into developing our back-ups to be ready for that game. We also could have won that game if it weren't for a few miscues. I firmly believe that fumbling when we were about to go up by 2 scores totally changed the complexion of that game.  It's also worth noting, since people continue to harp on it, that Kerryon only had 42% of the carries in that game and a good 1/2 of those carries came before they reinjured him.

23 minutes ago, Zeek said:

There is nothing wrong with having high expectations. (1-4) in bowl games is not pretty and Gus' offense has become oddly plain and predictable.

While i don't disagree that our offense has become predictable at times (several teams would certainly argue that they didn't find it predictable most of last year when we were racking up 40+ points on them), the 1-4 in bowl games doesn't seem so bad when you realize that we didn't have a QB in 1 of those losses and were playing the Heisman trophy winner who carried that team for 2 years (yes, not having one is on Gus, but he's fixed that), one of those was against the best running back in the nation and we didn't have a defense (again, something Gus fixed going forward), and one of them was the National Championship that we barely lost in the last few seconds. This year's loss was disappointing, to say the least, but no one else beat them either.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

29 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

5 coaches since 1980. Decided to look around. 

Ohio State- 5
Oklahoma- 6
Michigan- 6
Notre Dame- 6 (not counting O'Leary)
Miami- 8
USC- 9 (I think? Hard to read the wiki)
Nebraska- 7
Georgia- 5
LSU- 8
bama- LOL. Man, that Forehead/Franchione/Price/Shula run was fun. 

Interesting list, especially when you consider how many of those teams are still desperately looking for their next big thing and how many others are just trying to compete with the bama machine. 

32 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

We are fine now that we don't let non-football staff run defensive meetings. 

Preach it brother.

[Win4AU 4,052]

I don’t know the details but I have to imagine the buyout for Gus is going to keep him the Auburn coach for at least 3 years.  It would take a 2012 or some sort of scandal where he’d be fired with cause.  

I thought Kevin Steele came to Auburn to lock in his state retirement pension?  I’m sure he’s made enough over his career that he’d be fine either way but I thought that was the sticking point?  Also how would his age play as far as a HC?

I personally hope Gus and Kevin put out another top 5 team and we keep this Bus rolling for the next 10 years!

[gravejd 3,267]

Gus is not on the hot seat this year. Gus will be the coach of AU next year. About as sure a thing as there is in sports. 

[AU64 10,122]

2 hours ago, DAG said:

So Auburn is in fact not uniquely suited in their expectations for winning. I don’t know why folks think the grass is greener at other football institutions and with other fan bases. Based on this, it looks to me like we might actually be a lot more patient.

Based on this, it looks to me like we might actually be a lot more patient

 

I guess that could be....an undefeated season or serious run at the championship usually buys the coach a little time....not that fans are necessarily patient but perhaps the rewards and buyouts help defer the action.   

[lionheartkc 6,150]

2 hours ago, DAG said:

So Auburn is in fact not uniquely suited in their expectations for winning. I don’t know why folks think the grass is greener at other football institutions and with other fan bases. Based on this, it looks to me like we might actually be a lot more patient.

Kind of... look back at that list. LSU, Georgia, Ohio State, Michigan, Oklahoma, Nebraska, USC, and bama have all had long term coaches through that time frame, most of whom have lasted longer than any of Auburn's coaches and several of whom left because of reasons that weren't related to on the field performance.

Notre Dame juggles coaches looking for the next Parseghian, with Holtz being the closest they came and he lasted just as long (11 years)

Nebraska is looking for the next Tom Osborne who coached there for 24 years

Michigan is always looking for the next Schembechler (30 years) (Carr came a close second with 12 years and almost as good of a record), and Harbaugh has most definitely not taken up that mantle.  

USC is looking for the next Pete Carol (who doesn't play fast and loose with the rules, or at least doesn't get caught), but they are probably the most similar to Auburn in how long their coaches last.

Of all of them, Miami is by far the worst for short term coaches.

[McLoofus 35,182]

1 minute ago, lionheartkc said:

Kind of... look back at that list. LSU, Georgia, Ohio State, Michigan, Oklahoma, Nebraska, USC, and bama have all had long term coaches through that time frame, most of whom have lasted longer than any of Auburn's coaches and several of whom left because of reasons that weren't related to on the field performance.

Dye lasted 12 years and left for reasons not related to on-field performance.

I'm still not sure what happened with Bowden.

Tubs lasted 10 years.

The school was left no choice but the fire Chizik. He won a national championship with Tubs's players + Football Jesus and then lit a match to the whole damn program.

Gus is entering his 6th year with a shiney, new, very very very lucrative contract after losing at least 4 games in each of his prior 4 seasons.

We don't have a problem with patience at Auburn. 

[SumterAubie 3,031]

I'm a glass half full kind of guy. So I don't see how a coach who beat two  number 1 teams in a 3 week time frame can be on the hot seat. Some programs go for years without whoopin' a number 1 team. Auburn does it twice in 3 weeks.

[RunInRed 16,360]

We couldn't fire him even if we wanted to $$$

[lionheartkc 6,150]

38 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I'm still not sure what happened with Bowden.

Bowden crossed the wrong people, several of whom had their sights on replacing him with Bill Oliver, who failed his interview, thwarting that plan.

39 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

We don't have a problem with patience at Auburn. 

We have no problem with patience when the coach is meeting expectations. Falter once and you have Jetgate. Cross the wrong people (the same ones who were running defensive meeting under Chizik) and, even though you are the winningest football coach in modern history at Auburn, you're gone. And of course, no matter how long you actually last, if you aren't keeping up with expectations, a vocal minority is ALWAYS loudly calling for your head.

[DAG 33,955]

1 minute ago, lionheartkc said:

Bowden crossed the wrong people, several of whom had their sights on replacing him with Bill Oliver, who failed his interview, thwarting that plan.

We have no problem with patience when the coach is meeting expectations. Falter once and you have Jetgate. Cross the wrong people (the same ones who were running defensive meeting under Chizik) and, even though you are the winningest football coach in modern history at Auburn, you're gone. And of course, no matter how long you actually last, if you aren't keeping up with expectations, a vocal minority is ALWAYS loudly calling for your head.

I admire your ability to try to bring balance but even you have to admit that based on what McLoofus hasn’t put out, the narrative that we are willing to just have coaching turnovers on the whim is a bit short sighted. Furthermore, I can’t really think of a job in America where if you aren’t meeting someone’s expectation, you won’t get critiques, feel the heat, etc, etc. I say someone because clearly fans expectations and the money brokers expectation can be completely different.

[aucom96 1,614]

The fact of that ludicrous contract removes any chance of Malzahn being on any hot seat. 

The press will continue to sell it because no one really knows what to expect with a Malzahn team. His teams are very inconsistent and often look very clumsy and unprepared...even sometimes in victory. He's got the personality of drywall, runs his program as tightly a government intelligence wing and his offenses are pretty unpleasant to look at most of the time. He wins against the two national championship contenders in a matter of weeks, then drops two duds. It's pretty much the story of his tenure and until he can change that, some rag will keep claiming he's on the hot seat. 

[lionheartkc 6,150]

4 minutes ago, DAG said:

I say someone because clearly fans expectations and the money brokers expectation can be completely different.

That is so true and was a BIG problem at Auburn that I hope Greene being an outsider is fixing.

5 minutes ago, DAG said:

the narrative that we are willing to just have coaching turnovers on the whim is a bit short sighted.

I think if the narrative was that we DID have coaching turnovers on a whim, then yea, it would be short sighted, but I think if either the money brokers or the fans (at least the vocal ones) had full control, we'd be at the top of the coaching turnover list. Most of the vocal fans are in "win a championship in 3-4 years or your gone" mode and the money brokers have always been in "cross me once and I'll replace you" mode. Fortunately the fans have had the ability, at least once, to counteract the money people and for the most part, the AD doesn't make personnel decisions based on fan input.

[lionheartkc 6,150]

50 minutes ago, aucom96 said:

He's got the personality of drywall in interviews, runs his program as tightly tighter than a government intelligence wing and his offenses are pretty unpleasant to look at most of the time a couple of times a year.

Fixed it for you.

[AU64 10,122]

1 hour ago, DAG said:

I admire your ability to try to bring balance but even you have to admit that based on what McLoofus hasn’t put out, the narrative that we are willing to just have coaching turnovers on the whim is a bit short sighted. Furthermore, I can’t really think of a job in America where if you aren’t meeting someone’s expectation, you won’t get critiques, feel the heat, etc, etc. I say someone because clearly fans expectations and the money brokers expectation can be completely different.

 

1 hour ago, lionheartkc said:

Bowden crossed the wrong people, several of whom had their sights on replacing him with Bill Oliver, who failed his interview, thwarting that plan.

We have no problem with patience when the coach is meeting expectations. Falter once and you have Jetgate. Cross the wrong people (the same ones who were running defensive meeting under Chizik) and, even though you are the winningest football coach in modern history at Auburn, you're gone. And of course, no matter how long you actually last, if you aren't keeping up with expectations, a vocal minority is ALWAYS loudly calling for your head.

if you aren't keeping up with expectations, a vocal minority is ALWAYS loudly calling for your head.

Recall a coach explaining that....think maybe about Richt......if a coach hangs around a school long enough almost no matter how well he does, each year a few more people become disenchanted with him over something...a game he lost, a player he did not sign or whatever.....but anyway.....it adds up and pretty soon it's a pretty big number. ...and out he goes. 

 

[lionheartkc 6,150]

Just now, AU64 said:

if you aren't keeping up with expectations, a vocal minority is ALWAYS loudly calling for your head.

Yea, I guess I should clarify it to say if you aren't keeping up with said minority's often inflated expectations.

1 minute ago, AU64 said:

Recall a coach explaining that....think maybe about Richt......if a coach hangs around a school long enough almost no matter how well he does, each year a few more people become disenchanted with him over something...a game he lost, a player he did not sign or whatever.....but anyway.....it adds up and pretty soon it's a pretty big number. ...and out he goes. 

Yup... that's how I define fandom in the SEC. 

[DAG 33,955]

2 minutes ago, AU64 said:

 

if you aren't keeping up with expectations, a vocal minority is ALWAYS loudly calling for your head.

Recall a coach explaining that....think maybe about Richt......if a coach hangs around a school long enough almost no matter how well he does, each year a few more people become disenchanted with him over something...a game he lost, a player he did not sign or whatever.....but anyway.....it adds up and pretty soon it's a pretty big number. ...and out he goes. 

 

True. I think teams like UTENN, UGA, Possibly UF have pushed the reset button too early. However, This has not been the case at AU. The coaches who have gotten fired honestly had it coming, at least in my lifetime. There was just too much bad blood with Tommy for there to be continued relationship and Gene Chizik lost control of the program. I think the power brokers have been completely fair with Gus during his tenure. The fans is another question.

[AU64 10,122]

15 minutes ago, DAG said:

True. I think teams like UTENN, UGA, Possibly UF have pushed the reset button too early. However, This has not been the case at AU. The coaches who have gotten fired honestly had it coming, at least in my lifetime. There was just too much bad blood with Tommy for there to be continued relationship and Gene Chizik lost control of the program. I think the power brokers have been completely fair with Gus during his tenure. The fans is another question.

There are almost no lifetime contracts like back in the day of Shug, Bear, Bo, JoPa, Bobby Dodd... and a dozen or so others.   The money got too big and with the big money came big expectations little tolerance for a couple off years or a series of losses to a major rival.  

Only before the big money started,  would a guy like Paul Dietzel think to leave LSU to take the job at Army?  ..his last few years at LSU were the highlight of his career and his leaving was not about the money..  

Now....There is the unholy deal made between football factories and their coaches......"we will pay you a fortune but you must win...and win the right games ...or you are gone"

[DAG 33,955]

6 minutes ago, AU64 said:

There are almost no lifetime contracts like back in the day of Shug, Bear, Bo, JoPa, Bobby Dodd... and a dozen or so others.   The money got too big and with the big money came big expectations little tolerance for a couple off years or a series of losses to a major rival.  

Only before the big money started,  would a guy like Paul Dietzel think to leave LSU to take the job at Army?  ..his last few years at LSU were the highlight of his career and his leaving was not about the money..  

Now....There is the unholy deal made between football factories and their coaches......"we will pay you a fortune but you must win...and win the right games ...or you are gone"

Yeah I unfortunately can’t think of any. I guess the Iowa coach is the closest right now. Kansas state coach as well. I feel like you almost have to be at a lower lever tier school for that to happen or a school who produces average to decent results for that loyalty to be there. Dan Mullen could’ve been a lifer at MSU in my eyes. I also believe Gus could’ve been a lifer at Arkansas if he would’ve taken their deal. You just don’t see that loyalty anymore. Everyone is always looking for the next big thing this day and age.

[SumterAubie 3,031]

9 minutes ago, AU64 said:

.  

Now....There is the unholy deal made between football factories and their coaches......"we will pay you a fortune but you must win...and win the right games ...or you are gone"

And we will continue to pay you, even after you  are gone.

[DAG 33,955]

2 minutes ago, SumterAubie said:

And we will continue to pay you, even after you  are gone.

Good point. Gene Chizik gets paid pretty good for being fired. Hard for me to feel too bad.

[AU64 10,122]

21 minutes ago, DAG said:

Good point. Gene Chizik gets paid pretty good for being fired. Hard for me to feel too bad.

True but as I've said before, Charlie Weiss is my all time hero.....three big "buy outs" all paying him at the same time not to coach. 

Nobody even comes close to that.    Notre Dame, Kansas and Florida....you would think that at least one of them would have known better....