NolaAuTiger

NFL - players will be fined for kneeling

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I agree. Money always ends up talking. The owners finally got the message from fans not showing up.

Edited by Proud Tiger

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I would prefer people just quit getting bent over this stuff.  Everyone loves them some free speech/expression until they see some they don't agree with, then all hell breaks loose.  My attitude is "Why are you kneeling?  Because you feel like America isn't living up to its ideals in how it treats black people?  Well ok, I'm not sure this is the best way to handle it but whatever floats your boat."  And I move on.

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27 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

I would prefer people just quit getting bent over this stuff.  Everyone loves them some free speech/expression until they see some they don't agree with, then all hell breaks loose.  My attitude is "Why are you kneeling?  Because you feel like America isn't living up to its ideals in how it treats black people?  Well ok, I'm not sure this is the best way to handle it but whatever floats your boat."  And I move on.

Great. Then let your employees kneel. If it’s detrimental to your business financially, maybe you’d change your mind. Business owner’s freedom is great, isn’t it folks? 

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2 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Great. Then let your employees kneel. If it’s detrimental to your business financially, maybe you’d change your mind. Business owner’s freedom is great, isn’t it folks? 

My point was, it shouldn't have even come to that.  Instead of most people bothering to sit down and have a real conversation with a player who kneeled (or a black person who supported that kneeling), they just got mad and fomented more anger on Facebook and amongst their buddies.  But if you engage a person with an open heart and mind, you can really try and understand why they felt this was the right form and forum for their protest.  And if you're a good listener to their side, then they are usually going to be willing to listen to your side of it - maybe that you feel like the powerful symbolism of our flag and the anthem for our military and their families makes choosing this venue hurtful for them.  Maybe you'll change your mind, maybe they'll change theirs, or maybe you'll both give a little while maintaining your same basic feeling on the matter.

That is how you handle something like this.  Or at least that's who emotionally mature people handle it.  But I suppose it's easier to burn jerseys, boycott advertisers and games, and rant about it on Facebook.

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19 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

My point was, it shouldn't have even come to that.  Instead of most people bothering to sit down and have a real conversation with a player who kneeled (or a black person who supported that kneeling), they just got mad and fomented more anger on Facebook and amongst their buddies.  But if you engage a person with an open heart and mind, you can really try and understand why they felt this was the right form and forum for their protest.  And if you're a good listener to their side, then they are usually going to be willing to listen to your side of it - maybe that you feel like the powerful symbolism of our flag and the anthem for our military and their families makes choosing this venue hurtful for them.  Maybe you'll change your mind, maybe they'll change theirs, or maybe you'll both give a little while maintaining your same basic feeling on the matter.

That is how you handle something like this.  Or at least that's who emotionally mature people handle it.  But I suppose it's easier to burn jerseys, boycott advertisers and games, and rant about it on Facebook.

Wrong. An employer handles it however they damn well please. Keep the customer happy - a fundamental tenant of business. You’re just mad becuase the customer actually produced a change. Deal with it. I find it absurd that you take issue with customers exercising their freedom to boycott a business, subsequently causing a business to change its policy. 

Edited by NolaAuTiger
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22 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

 But if you engage a person with an open heart and mind, you can really try and understand why they felt this was the right form and forum for their protest.

No one is stopping them from protesting. If they think that law enforcement systematically opposes black people, then they can protest whenever they please. It doesn't mean I should be compelled to accept their premise as valid and support subsequent protest. If they do it while in the course and scope of their employment, it'll cost a fee. 

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  Im just hopeful I can watch sports not mixed with politics this year. I dont have a lot of faith in that thanks to the Media. Goodall says that if the player doesn't want to participate in standing for the flag, they can remain in the locker room....well, anyone can guess what the media is going to do, they will focus on the players that do not participate, dragging us right back in a political sports venue. More doubt than hope for me, but we will see!!

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51 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Wrong. An employer handles it however they damn well please. Keep the customer happy - a fundamental tenant of business. You’re just mad becuase the customer actually produced a change. Deal with it. I find it absurd that you take issue with customers exercising their freedom to boycott a business, subsequently causing a business to change its policy. 

You know, it's possible to discuss this without being a jerk. 

You should try it sometime.

Edited by homersapien
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47 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Wrong. An employer handles it however they damn well please. Keep the customer happy - a fundamental tenant of business. You’re just mad becuase the customer actually produced a change. Deal with it. I find it absurd that you take issue with customers exercising their freedom to boycott a business, subsequently causing a business to change its policy. 

You keep focusing on employers and legalities. I’m talking about how the people protesting and those who took issue with their manner of protesting should handle it, if they are emotionally mature people. It never needed to get to a stage where we are having to discuss what the employer does in response. 

And I'm not mad.  I’m just trying to explain how this would have been better handled. 

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Nola, is there a reason you’re acting so cranky?  Can you have an adult conversation about this?

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8 minutes ago, GiveEmElle said:

All the coach’s have to do is keep their teams in the locker room until after the anthem. 

 If I were an NFL coach, this is probably how I would handle it   

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4 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

 If I were an NFL coach, this is probably how I would handle it   

Me too. It would be a win win for the NFL. Fines appease the Trump supporters and coaches keeping players in appeases protestors. 

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14 minutes ago, GiveEmElle said:

Me too. It would be a win win for the NFL. Fines appease the Trump supporters and coaches keeping players in appeases protestors. 

You were doing good until you you resorted to your dislike of Trump supporters.  Why do fines appease Trump supporters more than anyone else? I think this whole way of protesting makes vets angrier than anyone. What would be your reaction if you saw two Auburn basketball players doing it on court before a game?

 

Edited by Proud Tiger

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12 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

You were doing good until you you resorted to your dislike of Trump supporters.  Why do fines appease Trump supporters more than anyone else? I think this whole way of protesting makes vets angrier than anyone. What would be your reaction if you saw two Auburn basketball players doing it on court before a game?

 

I referred to Trump supporters because it was Trump supporters who cheered when Trump called NFL players sons of bitches. Let me know if I need to link Trump saying that. I’ve talked to several vets and it doesn’t anger them, my dad included. It wouldn’t bother me in the least if AU players did this to protest injustice to African Americans in our country. 

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9 minutes ago, GiveEmElle said:

I referred to Trump supporters because it was Trump supporters who cheered when Trump called NFL players sons of bitches. Let me know if I need to link Trump saying that. I’ve talked to several vets and it doesn’t anger them, my dad included. It wouldn’t bother me in the least if AU players did this to protest injustice to African Americans in our country. 

I will just agree to disagree since we are about 180 degrees apart.

Edited by Proud Tiger

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38 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

I will just agree to disagree since we are about 180 degrees apart.

It’s really a non issue since no AU players have done this. 

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4 hours ago, SaturdayGT said:

  Im just hopeful I can watch sports not mixed with politics this year.

I feel that this is a general consensus for many many people regardless of left/right/middle. I didn't watch the NFL the past year because I was tired of the politics in the game. I don't watch any of ESPN's shows anymore because it is all about politics. Though ESPN is really trying to make a push away from politics and back to sports given their loss of viewers over the past years.

I watch sports for entertainment and escape.

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4 hours ago, NolaAuTiger said:

Wrong. An employer handles it however they damn well please. Keep the customer happy - a fundamental tenant of business. You’re just mad becuase the customer actually produced a change. Deal with it. I find it absurd that you take issue with customers exercising their freedom to boycott a business, subsequently causing a business to change its policy. 

I don't think that Titan is wrong in his thinking. In an ideal world that is the way that it should work when people work out issues with others. Doesn't happen in modern America very often anymore.

You are also not wrong in your thinking. It is the employers choice. The business owner can do what he wants legally to ensure profitability. Consumers have the right to take a stand. This means that if others have voiced their opinions through modern social media (which is a primary tool for marketing) the business owner needs to decide whether conform or risk loss.

Good example would be when I worked sales. Consumers love sales and holiday sales are huge. Say I take offense to one of the sales I am suppose to be running, thus I protest and don't do the marketing for it. I would be told I have the right to protest, which I would later be doing under a bridge near I35 cause I would be unemployed for not carrying out the organizational purpose of the business.

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4 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

You keep focusing on employers and legalities. I’m talking about how the people protesting and those who took issue with their manner of protesting should handle it, if they are emotionally mature people. It never needed to get to a stage where we are having to discuss what the employer does in response. 

And I'm not mad.  I’m just trying to explain how this would have been better handled. 

Understood. And it can still be handled that way. Perhaps we’re focusig on two separate issues. My bad

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4 hours ago, homersapien said:

You know, it's possible to discuss this without being a jerk. 

You should try it sometime.

Did I call him absurd?

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4 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

Nola, is there a reason you’re acting so cranky?  Can you have an adult conversation about this?

I’m not acting immature. I wish you would pose the same question to yourself at times.

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3 minutes ago, NolaAuTiger said:

I’m not acting immature. I wish you would pose the same question to yourself at times.

I will.  Sometimes I act immature.  It usually doesn't come out of the clear blue sky though.  Someone isn't calmly stating a position and I just go off.

You just sort of went straight for ornery with basically no reason to do so in this thread.  

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2 hours ago, GiveEmElle said:

Me too. It would be a win win for the NFL. Fines appease the Trump supporters and coaches keeping players in appeases protestors. 

This isn’t a “trump supporter v protestors” issue at all. Try not being so tenuous in your assertions. A raging democrat who cried on election night could support the new rule. It wouldn’t make them a deplorable.

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