bigbird

When and when not to look for the ball.

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2 minutes ago, bigbird said:

Bama runs a complex match zone cv3 scheme. I'm not going to explain it, but if you'd like to read about it.

This is a good article

 

To me, I love the pattern matching aspect and always have taught my guys to understand and use it.

They also get incredible help on the intermediate stuff from their LBs.  Very difficult to teach but their experienced players play it about as well as can be played.  

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9 minutes ago, bigbird said:

Bama runs a complex match zone cv3 scheme. I'm not going to explain it, but if you'd like to read about it.

This is a good article

 

To me, I love the pattern matching aspect and always have taught my guys to understand and use it.

Thankyou.   This will take me a while to digest.   

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20 minutes ago, auskip07 said:

Thankyou.   This will take me a while to digest.   

It took me a couple years and that was after having Kirby explain it at a clinic

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Wait, you mean you can't run as fast if you are looking back for the ball?

 For E: :drippingsarcasm7pa:

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19 hours ago, bigbird said:

Alright so here it goes. There is always confusion and complaining about DBs and why they are not looking back for the ball. Hopefully this will help clear some of it up.

The answer is different for each player, but concept remains the same. Basically, the rule is, when a DB is in phase, and in a position of control they can turn and find the ball.

Well, what does that mean?

In phase vs out of phase.

In phase means the DB is running hip to hip with the receiver. Out of phase means the DB is trailing and trying to catch up to the WR.

Position of control

Typically, the position of control is when the DBs shoulder is ahead of the receiver or when you can read his opposite number.  The DB can affect the receivers speed and route and therefore can control the receiver. From this position, a DB can "lean and locate".  By feeling the receiver with your off arm and body you are assured not to lose him.

 

If the DB is not in phase and in a position of control and he looks back, he slows down and the separation increases.  The DB should keep eyes on the receiver, track him down, and play the ball through the basket by raking or clubbing when the ball arrives.

Any questions, ask away.

In Atlanta, a small theatre does 'The Santaland Diaries' by David Sedaris every Christmas. Same cast, same show, every year. And totally entertaining and awesome every year. 

Thanks, Coach. 

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@bigbird thank you for this.  Very insightful.  Honestly, it would probably be best to display this on the jumbotron in Jordan-Hare stadium so the people who have their seats behind me can stop inaccurately criticizing how our players should play.  I already know they will bring this up, so just getting ahead of the cruve here.  Maybe @RunInRed can make this happen?  :laugh:

Edited by abw0004
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But, even when out of phase, a natural DB will learn to "read the receiver" and turn and find the ball a majority of the time (or at least attempt to).  It's never 100% success due to the type of coverage, granted, but to never turn on the ball is begging to get beat the majority of the time.  In fact, never turning usually results in a catch and/or PI.

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58 minutes ago, Swamp Eagle said:

But, even when out of phase, a natural DB will learn to "read the receiver" and turn and find the ball a majority of the time (or at least attempt to).  It's never 100% success due to the type of coverage, granted, but to never turn on the ball is begging to get beat the majority of the time.  In fact, never turning usually results in a catch and/or PI.

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Bird, thanks for your input.

 

Some folks just don’t and refuse to understand the techniques of this position. 

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19 hours ago, auskip07 said:

just doesnt seem like we disrupt the routes  as well as some others ive seen.  maybe im not looking hard enough

 

I wish Chris Davis head Jammed Kelvin Benjamin at the line in 2013 and we would have a Natty under GM

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1 hour ago, Tigerpro2a said:

I wish Chris Davis head Jammed Kelvin Benjamin at the line in 2013 and we would have a Natty under GM

The end zone play would have never happened if our two guys had made the tackle on the receiver one or two plays prior. I believe two of our dbs bounced off the receiver and he turned a 10yard play Into a 35/40 yard play. 

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Good Stuff @bigbird  Nice to have someone here with this knowledge and insight that very few have.   It's easy to be a coach from a recliner, on the field not so much. 

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Very well explained bigbird! Had this explained a few years ago by a coworker who is also a co-defensive coordinator at a high school in Columbus, GA. Had several of the other T.V coaching coworkers dispute his explanations and defensive philosophy. He does a lot of the clinics with college coaches had one with Travis Williams a couple years ago.  

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3 minutes ago, augolf1716 said:

Sorta complicated for the 7th graders you coach isn't it???

7 the grade mentally

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Coach you hit this one out of the park...clear ,concise, accurate and easily understood.

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cleared up some muddy water for the Doc!

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Agree w Bird and Swamp...it seemed like we were out of phase a bunch, but a few times we recovered w time to spare. It would be great to see the natural ability of a DB in this situation turn and make an agressive play on the ball. Tip drills are practiced for a reason lol.

Again, Great Post by Bird, but i do love a Playmaker. ? 

Question for Bird? In your cov3 do you shuffle or backpedal your CBs?

Edited by AUallday

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57 minutes ago, AUallday said:

? Question for Bird? In your cov3 do you shuffle or backpedal your CBs?

We rarely run CV 3.  Our base is out of 4, but we press our corners to give a cv2 look.  Sometime we will have our corners bail and others stay in press.  Being in 4, we can roll to trips and man up the backside corner. 

Typically if we run man, we play catch man, which is pretty much bump-n-run. When doing that, I teach them to buzz their feet and slide into the receivers path to jam him.  

With my corners, I have them shuffle with their eyes on the QB, after 3 steps their eyes go back to the receiver. Because after 3 the ball is either in the air for a quick pass where the DB can react or the receiver is running a longer pattern and can either match up or pass on.

My safeties take a flat footed read. 

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Having read most of the replies and seen a couple clips from mistakes being made, it would appear that the corners in question relied on talent over technique. Mental lapse or not, the two players I saw that put themselves in poor positions have played too much football to be making those types of errors: J Davis and J Dean. But I can’t say I blame them, they both run like scalded dogs. 

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15 hours ago, creed said:

The end zone play would have never happened if our two guys had made the tackle on the receiver one or two plays prior. I believe two of our dbs bounced off the receiver and he turned a 10yard play Into a 35/40 yard play. 

Neither of them touched him. One of them was responsible for a different receiver. Davis was playing close to the sideline to keep everything in bounds since there wasn't much time left. They didn't play it perfectly but it wasn't nearly as bad as folks tend to remember. Also, he went out at the 23 yard line. It's not like he ran it down to the 5. There were several plays between that one and the touchdown. 

But you make a good point. That wasn't a one play game. I don't understand how people keep trying to make it one. There's the camp that thinks it was that play. Then there's the Benjamin touchdown camp. There's the kick return camp. There's the guy who missed the block on the kick return at the end. There's even a camp that thinks it's Tre's fault for scoring the go-ahead touchdown too fast. (!!!!!!!) 

A lot of things went right and a lot of things went wrong. We lost to a good team. Their guy won the Heisman and is now QB1 in the NFL. Our guy is a cornerback in Canada. You could go on down the line. 

Sorry. /rant

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10 hours ago, bigbird said:

We rarely run CV 3.  Our base is out of 4, but we press our corners to give a cv2 look.  Sometime we will have our corners bail and others stay in press.  Being in 4, we can roll to trips and man up the backside corner. 

Typically if we run man, we play catch man, which is pretty much bump-n-run. When doing that, I teach them to buzz their feet and slide into the receivers path to jam him.  

With my corners, I have them shuffle with their eyes on the QB, after 3 steps their eyes go back to the receiver. Because after 3 the ball is either in the air for a quick pass where the DB can react or the receiver is running a longer pattern and can either match up or pass on.

My safeties take a flat footed read. 

Wow.  I read this and my eyes glaze over.... It reminds me of how impressive coaching & playing defensive back (either corner or safety) is.  Especially in the modern day....how much the game has grown technically, especially in HS.

When I played HS offensive guard in the '80's I had two instructions.  The main one was "see guy; bury guy".

But I was "reely smurt two" so they made me the pulling guard so I actually had a second responsibility.  "See guy standing outside the offensive tackle; slam guy into the bleachers".

Not sure I'm smart enough to play today's game.

Impressive stuff Bird!

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22 hours ago, Swamp Eagle said:

But, even when out of phase, a natural DB will learn to "read the receiver" and turn and find the ball a majority of the time (or at least attempt to).  It's never 100% success due to the type of coverage, granted, but to never turn on the ball is begging to get beat the majority of the time.  In fact, never turning usually results in a catch and/or PI.

Big Bird explained this previously. Receivers fake the things to make DB's react. Reach a hand up when ball isn't there  open eyes wider etc. Everything you can key on a receiver can fake to make you react. In the movies they always do the white knuckle of an O-Lineman as a key. O-linemen watch the same movies. I can squeeze my fingers really tight without having downward pressure on the ground and get the same effect. For every read their is a trick to offset it.  It is a true cat and mouse game inside the game.

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