So, the OL..?

[AUinfusion 390]

I am neither a coach nor an expert on offensive line grading, but re-watching the game it seemed to me that we did a fairly low quality job on the OL. I know that Gus said he was... was it "pretty happy" with their job? I can't remember exactly. But it looked to me like we either missed one or more blocks on almost every play, or we got to the block and just got whipped. Is there someone here with better knowledge of the art and craft of the offensive line that can correct my interpretation, because it's a little concerning. Even more so, I thought Horton was supposed to be one of our best, and he did not look like one of our best. It looked, to my untrained eye, like his defensive responsibility made a lot of tackles las week. I know that ASU should be an easy team to run on, but unless I'm reading everything about the Washington game wrong, I'm less interested in seeing us physically overpower them, and more interested in seeing us just consistently engage the right defender with the right angle and hold that engagement for the entirety of the play.

 

Am I completely off base here?

[Gowebb11 9,307]

14 minutes ago, AUinfusion said:

I am neither a coach nor an expert on offensive line grading, but re-watching the game it seemed to me that we did a fairly low quality job on the OL. I know that Gus said he was... was it "pretty happy" with their job? I can't remember exactly. But it looked to me like we either missed one or more blocks on almost every play, or we got to the block and just got whipped. Is there someone here with better knowledge of the art and craft of the offensive line that can correct my interpretation, because it's a little concerning. Even more so, I thought Horton was supposed to be one of our best, and he did not look like one of our best. It looked, to my untrained eye, like his defensive responsibility made a lot of tackles las week. I know that ASU should be an easy team to run on, but unless I'm reading everything about the Washington game wrong, I'm less interested in seeing us physically overpower them, and more interested in seeing us just consistently engage the right defender with the right angle and hold that engagement for the entirety of the play.

 

Am I completely off base here?

We had some hiccups for sure, but there were a lot of positives. By my count we only had one run for negative yards. Also, Stidham scrambled some, but we gave up few sacks. It’s been said before, but UW had an outstanding defense last year and returned 9 starters. In short, a lot of improvement is needed, but it looked better than the Clemson and Mercer games early last year. I’m confident we will improve as the year goes on. WDE!!!

[AUsince72 11,084]

I don't think anybody would disagree with you that the O-Line didn't have the best game.  Plenty of teaching moments for sure...

However, I think we also mostly agree that when you take the following factors into consideration, it really wasn't SO bad.

1: Only Tega & Harrell had any real experience (1 season worth) before that game.  Even Driscoll, who has a lot of experience, was playing his first game as a Tiger.
They will need some time to gel and simply get better.  If they're coachable, Grimes will take care of that.

2: It seems fairly widely agreed that Washington's front is very, very good.  Especially against the run.  Auburn was playing a team almost on level with a good SEC team (better than many) so you have to give their defense credit.

3: The running backs did not use their vision to the fullest.  Not throwing anyone under the bus, but there were multiple plays where the correct cut or maybe a move to the outside, would have unlocked a bigger run.  THAT also will be corrected by the RB coaches as well.

4: Some of the pressure on Stidham in the passing game could have been alleviated with a little better presence by the QB as well.  Especially stepping up into the pocket instead of immediately running sideways and looking to toss the ball to the sidelines.  BUT, consider, I don't think they gave up a sack ultimately....

Now, I will say that I'm disappointed in Kim.  I think he should be more aggressive in his blocking.  He seems to do everything else well (I think) but Auburn has a nice history of some pretty mean Centers.  I'd like for him, or Nick Brahms, to step up to that task.

Bottom line, starting the season against a defense as good as Washington was a tough task, even for a seasoned offensive line.  At least this way, Coach Grimes is crystal clear on what deficiencies need to be addressed and I believe he's the type of coach that can correct it.  Fortunately, game 2 is a nice tune-up to practice what they've learned from week 1 and then next week will REALLY tell the tale.

War Eagle!

[ValleyTiger 2,894]

You're correct on Horton, he had a bad day. I can assume they've worked a good bit this week on the combo blocks and climbing to that 2nd level of the defense quicker. We're about to see a ton of run blocking on Saturday.

[shabby 1,956]

I thought pass-blocking was actually really good. However when it came to creating holes for the running backs that didn't happen so well

[toddc 13,194]

26 minutes ago, ValleyTiger said:

You're correct on Horton, he had a bad day. I can assume they've worked a good bit this week on the combo blocks and climbing to that 2nd level of the defense quicker. We're about to see a ton of run blocking on Saturday.

This! Coming off blocks and getting to the lbs/2nd level. Their lbs made too many plays on our run game.

[PoetTiger 1,896]

All I know is they hit the mark on Boobie’s touchdown run....not the best overall performance but when the game was on the line they delivered.

[au302 2,669]

I’m surprised Nick Brahms isn’t starting this week. Not saying he’s the answer over Kim but I thought he’d take the job once he got healthy

[McLoofus 35,182]

12 minutes ago, au302 said:

I’m surprised Nick Brahms isn’t starting this week. Not saying he’s the answer over Kim but I thought he’d take the job once he got healthy

He'll ultimately be more talented but there's no discounting that Kim's been on campus for a few years now and that counts for a whole lot at the center position. 

Maybe only a matter of time but Kim is still the better option for now and he needs the reps with the other 1s. 

[Win4AU 4,052]

17 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

He'll ultimately be more talented but there's no discounting that Kim's been on campus for a few years now and that counts for a whole lot at the center position. 

Maybe only a matter of time but Kim is still the better option for now and he needs the reps with the other 1s. 

Wasn’t Brahms ahead of Kim in the spring before the leg break?  Maybe it was too close to call.

[selias 2,398]

I'll defer to folks like @bigbird, @JMR, and @corchjay but, I think he was pretty happy considering it's an inexperienced line going up a talented, veteran defensive front.

[IronMan70 3,277]

They all had some good plays and bad plays. Without mentioning any names, one thing that stood out to me was a couple of them not maintaining their blocks on pass pro long enough after the initial contact. On run blocking they seemed a tad unsure of themselves which does affect aggressiveness, however, that is understandable considering their actual experience together. Both of those areas are easily corrected.

Kim seems to be getting some criticism but let us remember, he had a pancake using leverage on Whitlow's rushing touchdown. He ALSO had a key block on the 4th down play when Martin broke it for a big gain off Kim's block on the LB. Grimes now has actual game film on his OL against a top DL and we will likely see significant improvement this week. 

[kd4au 1,145]

I guess it all depends on how good Washington turns out being. If they are as good as some seem to think, the o-line did a good job, if not then we have a long way to go. The line has plenty to work on though even if Washington is a good team, but I think JB will get the job done. The O-line already looks better than when Hand was the coach at least they didn't give up 11 sacks. 

[AUinfusion 390]

Some good responses, so far. For those that don't know, WarRoom Eagle has a channel on YouTube where he takes each game, breaks it into two videos (all offense, all defense), and removes everything that's not an actual play being run, so you can run through every offensive or defensive snap in about 15 minutes. It's a fun way to review and see if you saw what you thought you saw.

 

I do think that our skill players could have helped us more. JS got happy feet a little early a few times, and we do seem to miss open holes, but the OL still worries me. I saw too many instances of either guys blocking no one on the play, or guys getting tossed away by the defender. I'm less worried about OC than I am about OG after watching the replay. Our transfer OT missed a few, too (got there lot if I remember correctly), but I feel like he'll adjust.

 

BTW, this isn't meant to be doom and gloom. We have a new OL coach who specifically called out the "loafing" problem after our first scrimmage, so I expect that we will get this fixed. I'm just making pre-game conversation about where I think our biggest area for improvement is. 

[gctiger 924]

I never played the game so I wouldn’t know good blocking techniques if I saw them, but as a neutral observer I would say that all things considered we have a serviceable OL.  They’ll win some battles and lose some, but if they can continue to improve and avoid injuries I think they coukf win a lot of games.  

Even when I attempt to concentrate on watching the OL, I find it extremely challenging to focus on the line and not watch the ball.  

[McLoofus 35,182]

1 hour ago, Win4AU said:

Wasn’t Brahms ahead of Kim in the spring before the leg break?  Maybe it was too close to call.

I don't remember it that way but I am growing less confident in my memory daily. 

[Brad_ATX 13,654]

Went back and watched nothing but the line.  Looked like they were very tentative as a group on run plays.  Weren't really firing off the ball and it lead to a lot of stalemates on the line, which then allows LBs to make plays for minimal gains.

Pass blocking was actually pretty solid.  We had some quicker throws, especially in the first half, that helped.  But overall my concern us definitely with the run game.  Gotta be more aggressive on the snap.

[boomstick 1,315]

6 minutes ago, Brad_ATX said:

Went back and watched nothing but the line.  Looked like they were very tentative as a group on run plays.  Weren't really firing off the ball and it lead to a lot of stalemates on the line, which then allows LBs to make plays for minimal gains.

Pass blocking was actually pretty solid.  We had some quicker throws, especially in the first half, that helped.  But overall my concern us definitely with the run game.  Gotta be more aggressive on the snap.

Probably has a little to do with the play calling. We ran inside zone or zone schemes almost exclusively all game. So rather than firing off and finding their man to block, they're diagnosing designated zones to fit. Could cause some hesitation. I've also heard some say it may have been a conscious decision by the coaching staff to help reduce negative plays. I believe we only had 3 negative run plays or sacks in the game.

[corchjay 5,311]

4 hours ago, selias said:

I'll defer to folks like @bigbird, @JMR, and @corchjay but, I think he was pretty happy considering it's an inexperienced line going up a talented, veteran defensive front.

I'm no expert on the OL but it appeared to me I'd rank them in this order.

Harrell the best

Tega

Kim

Driscoll

Horton the worst

But all had some missed assignments and blocks.  We need better line play but I think everyone understood it would take a few games for the new line to get their feet wet.  If we look poor 6 games into the season then I will be really worried.  

[AUGoo 2,659]

4 hours ago, AUinfusion said:

Some good responses, so far. For those that don't know, WarRoom Eagle has a channel on YouTube where he takes each game, breaks it into two videos (all offense, all defense), and removes everything that's not an actual play being run, so you can run through every offensive or defensive snap in about 15 minutes. It's a fun way to review and see if you saw what you thought you saw.

 

I do think that our skill players could have helped us more. JS got happy feet a little early a few times, and we do seem to miss open holes, but the OL still worries me. I saw too many instances of either guys blocking no one on the play, or guys getting tossed away by the defender. I'm less worried about OC than I am about OG after watching the replay. Our transfer OT missed a few, too (got there lot if I remember correctly), but I feel like he'll adjust.

 

BTW, this isn't meant to be doom and gloom. We have a new OL coach who specifically called out the "loafing" problem after our first scrimmage, so I expect that we will get this fixed. I'm just making pre-game conversation about where I think our biggest area for improvement is. 

Warroom Eagle channel is AUsome!

Thanks!

 

Our pass pro looked pretty good.

Run blocking got zero push. RB's missed holes at times.

But, Still got 150 yds of rushing.

[AUGoo 2,659]

After rewatching, 

Need more Worm!

[The Plainsman 948]

2 hours ago, corchjay said:

I'm no expert on the OL but it appeared to me I'd rank them in this order.

Harrell the best

Tega

Kim

Driscoll

Horton the worst

But all had some missed assignments and blocks.  We need better line play but I think everyone understood it would take a few games for the new line to get their feet wet.  If we look poor 6 games into the season then I will be really worried.  

Tega graded the best of the linemen last week I believe.  

[doc4aday 1,887]

If we compared the OL right now to our OL at this time last season, we imho, are ahead of the game. We played what is likely one of, if not the best defenses we will see all season. We will face some good defenses no doubt this season, but with game experience our OL should gel nicely and get the job done. The OL is a work in progress, but a work in progress that will get the job done with JB's guidance.

I think they will do fine against LSU next week  being battle tested by Washington. I think UW is a superior tean to LSU and it will show next week. I know some think LSU is for real, and they likely are to a degree. But not to where they will contend for the west title. Auburn on the other hand, will contend and will do so with our OL improving under JB's guidance.

[sevenlee36 1,654]

Last Saturday I believe we did a very good job at pass protection. I think JS got out of the pocket to soon at times to scramble when it wasn’t necessary. The run game is our staple and we aren’t comfortable with where we are do to inexperience. This week I hope we run the ball 80% of the time and heck leave the starting line in the whole game to get reps. Let’s try all the running backs out.

[alexava 6,973]

11 hours ago, AUsince72 said:

I don't think anybody would disagree with you that the O-Line didn't have the best game.  Plenty of teaching moments for sure...

However, I think we also mostly agree that when you take the following factors into consideration, it really wasn't SO bad.

1: Only Tega & Harrell had any real experience (1 season worth) before that game.  Even Driscoll, who has a lot of experience, was playing his first game as a Tiger.
They will need some time to gel and simply get better.  If they're coachable, Grimes will take care of that.

2: It seems fairly widely agreed that Washington's front is very, very good.  Especially against the run.  Auburn was playing a team almost on level with a good SEC team (better than many) so you have to give their defense credit.

3: The running backs did not use their vision to the fullest.  Not throwing anyone under the bus, but there were multiple plays where the correct cut or maybe a move to the outside, would have unlocked a bigger run.  THAT also will be corrected by the RB coaches as well.

4: Some of the pressure on Stidham in the passing game could have been alleviated with a little better presence by the QB as well.  Especially stepping up into the pocket instead of immediately running sideways and looking to toss the ball to the sidelines.  BUT, consider, I don't think they gave up a sack ultimately....

Now, I will say that I'm disappointed in Kim.  I think he should be more aggressive in his blocking.  He seems to do everything else well (I think) but Auburn has a nice history of some pretty mean Centers.  I'd like for him, or Nick Brahms, to step up to that task.

Bottom line, starting the season against a defense as good as Washington was a tough task, even for a seasoned offensive line.  At least this way, Coach Grimes is crystal clear on what deficiencies need to be addressed and I believe he's the type of coach that can correct it.  Fortunately, game 2 is a nice tune-up to practice what they've learned from week 1 and then next week will REALLY tell the tale.

War Eagle!

3.  I am not sure you can coach vision. Our rbs worry me a little.