Will Stidham Return for 2019 Season?

[selias 2,398]

Just now, Zeek said:

Agreed but they ran it with different looks. I think the RPO could work for us but everything would have to look different and the run blocking has to be tremendously better or they’ll just blow up both options.

The RPO is the hot new girl at the club

[Zeek 16,615]

Just now, selias said:

The RPO is the hot new girl at the club

Yup, defenses will adjust to it eventually but offenses must keep adjusting to live 

[twilli13 600]

1 hour ago, selias said:

The zone read offense of Cam & Nick is not coming back. The genie is out of the bottle on stopping that 

1 hour ago, Zeek said:

Agreed but they ran it with different looks. I think the RPO could work for us but everything would have to look different and the run blocking has to be tremendously better or they’ll just blow up both options.

Yeah I wasnt suggesting the old zone read as primary basis for offense. But not using some zone read concepts with Bryant's wheels would unwise. As pointed above, many teams are using some zone read concepts. As Bryant is also a decently accurate passer, we could run some zone read and some Chip Lindsey passing concepts. Now, whether Arthur Gustav and Ole Chip could get on the same page and make that work, that's a different story. But I personally dont think mixing in a little zone read should be that difficult. 

 

[AU-24 3,063]

3 hours ago, AUFriction said:

I think this is the most accurate pose I’ve ever seen on the forum. We don’t really know much about any of these options aside from the fact that, at the beginning of the season, our second best option was Willis. People are making a lot out of the underwhelming spring game performances, which we know how much those mean (see Cam Newton’s terrible performance in the spring of 2010). People are making a lot out of the few garbage reps our quarterbacks have gotten this year. 

The truth is that we won’t “really” know who is good and who isn’t until we announce a starter after stidham leaves and let them start unless they are somehow forced into real game action sooner.

So what exactly are you both saying? Gus’s and the fan base don’t want Malik Willis because we’re all racist?

Malik Willis is really better than Jarrett Stidham but because of his skin color he’s not playing? Gus started and continued to play Jeremy Johnson when he couldn’t get his head “screwed on straight from his neck” was he then a racist against whites?

When Cam Newton was the starting quarterback, when Chiz didn’t even want to bring him in from Blinn College and Gus talked Chiz into offering Cam, was Gus a racist then?

When Gus recruits black quarterbacks, to include those that did not except the scholarship from Auburn, was he and the fan base a racist then?

When Auburn hired a black athletic director were they racist?

JS playing behind a subpar SEC O- line, with a sub par running game, still managed to play well enough to beat both Washington and LSU. Obviously the SEC officials were not gonna let us beat LSU.

Please get the racist chip off your shoulders and try to be a normal Auburn fan.

[oracle79 3,569]

6 hours ago, selias said:

The zone read offense of Cam & Nick is not coming back. The genie is out of the bottle on stopping that offense.

Refresh my memory on which game either of those offenses were stopped if you wouldn't mind.  Has Saban ever given up more yards than Nick Marshal's last game against him?

[AUFriction 1,179]

3 hours ago, AU-24 said:

So what exactly are you both saying? Gus’s and the fan base don’t want Malik Willis because we’re all racist?

Malik Willis is really better than Jarrett Stidham but because of his skin color he’s not playing? Gus started and continued to play Jeremy Johnson when he couldn’t get his head “screwed on straight from his neck” was he then a racist against whites?

When Cam Newton was the starting quarterback, when Chiz didn’t even want to bring him in from Blinn College and Gus talked Chiz into offering Cam, was Gus a racist then?

When Gus recruits black quarterbacks, to include those that did not except the scholarship from Auburn, was he and the fan base a racist then?

When Auburn hired a black athletic director were they racist?

JS playing behind a subpar SEC O- line, with a sub par running game, still managed to play well enough to beat both Washington and LSU. Obviously the SEC officials were not gonna let us beat LSU.

Please get the racist chip off your shoulders and try to be a normal Auburn fan.

My post had nothing to do with racism. I’m just saying that people are jumping to conclusions on which quarterbacks are/aren’t good having seen very little of them.

[selias 2,398]

12 hours ago, oracle79 said:

Refresh my memory on which game either of those offenses were stopped if you wouldn't mind.  Has Saban ever given up more yards than Nick Marshal's last game against him?

@bigbird explained it another thread. Defenses aren't letting the read happen now and are attacking the mesh point, effectively nullifying running the RO as a base offense.

[Zeek 16,615]

14 hours ago, AU-24 said:

So what exactly are you both saying? Gus’s and the fan base don’t want Malik Willis because we’re all racist?

Malik Willis is really better than Jarrett Stidham but because of his skin color he’s not playing? Gus started and continued to play Jeremy Johnson when he couldn’t get his head “screwed on straight from his neck” was he then a racist against whites?

When Cam Newton was the starting quarterback, when Chiz didn’t even want to bring him in from Blinn College and Gus talked Chiz into offering Cam, was Gus a racist then?

When Gus recruits black quarterbacks, to include those that did not except the scholarship from Auburn, was he and the fan base a racist then?

When Auburn hired a black athletic director were they racist?

JS playing behind a subpar SEC O- line, with a sub par running game, still managed to play well enough to beat both Washington and LSU. Obviously the SEC officials were not gonna let us beat LSU.

Please get the racist chip off your shoulders and try to be a normal Auburn fan.

Not it at all, but a lot of people are making assumptions about Malik's accuracy when he's had 9 attempts in live games. I'm not using the "racist card" but it is a common assumption that black quarterbacks aren't accurate. A-day game tells us very little; it would be like saying Stidham isn't an accurate quarterback because of some bad game he has. We judge players on a body of work and we simply don't have enough to judge Malik off of; hell we don't have enough to judge Cord, Joey, Malik, or Bo.

No...I never implied for even a millisecond that he was better than Stidham. If he were he'd be starting. We're all well aware that Cam, Jeremy, Kodi, and Nick have all been given a fair shake here at Auburn.

You seem to battling a strawman my friend.

Legitimately you're having an argument that neither I nor AUFriction started or implied.

All I said, was that we as a fanbase need to quit making assumptions about all of our backups that we haven't seen enough of. I'm well aware of the OL problems and Stidham's ability. If you have seen the majority of my posts on here I've made it very clear that I think a change should be made at the Guard positions and that I would personally advise Stidham against leaving after this year.

We were much more focused on the quarterback battle heading into next season. No one here thinks we have a better qb option than Stidham.

I respect you a lot as a poster AU-24 but I think you're misunderstanding my post and me as a poster.

War Eagle.

[oracle79 3,569]

2 hours ago, selias said:

@bigbird explained it another thread. Defenses aren't letting the read happen now and are attacking the mesh point, effectively nullifying running the RO as a base offense.

Yep, saw that. Now which game was/were the Cam/Nick offenses stopped?  I know you can blow up the mesh with average QB's.  

[TigerFanAU 586]

19 hours ago, AU-24 said:

So what exactly are you both saying? Gus’s and the fan base don’t want Malik Willis because we’re all racist?

Malik Willis is really better than Jarrett Stidham but because of his skin color he’s not playing? Gus started and continued to play Jeremy Johnson when he couldn’t get his head “screwed on straight from his neck” was he then a racist against whites?

When Cam Newton was the starting quarterback, when Chiz didn’t even want to bring him in from Blinn College and Gus talked Chiz into offering Cam, was Gus a racist then?

When Gus recruits black quarterbacks, to include those that did not except the scholarship from Auburn, was he and the fan base a racist then?

When Auburn hired a black athletic director were they racist?

JS playing behind a subpar SEC O- line, with a sub par running game, still managed to play well enough to beat both Washington and LSU. Obviously the SEC officials were not gonna let us beat LSU.

Please get the racist chip off your shoulders and try to be a normal Auburn fan.

WTF? His post had nothing to do with race in any way. You're the only one that brought race into this thread. 

[atl-tiger 655]

This thread is funny.  Can we just end it with NO he won't be back?  He will get drafted on measurables alone regardless of Auburn's offense this year.  I don't see him as the type that "comes back for unfinished business". 

[AUsince72 11,084]

2 hours ago, oracle79 said:

5 hours ago, selias said:

@bigbird explained it another thread. Defenses aren't letting the read happen now and are attacking the mesh point, effectively nullifying running the RO as a base offense.

Yep, saw that. Now which game was/were the Cam/Nick offenses stopped?  I know you can blow up the mesh with average QB's.  

That was a convo tween bird and me.  I understand where he's coming from but don't 100% concede either because the sample play used was the 2016 game with JJ at QB, I believe.  JJ was decidedly not Cam nor Nick... even though Gus kinda sold us he was a Cam type, IIRC.

I still would love to see what would happen if this offense had a Nick Marshall type actually running it again.  Hey, I could be wrong but at least that would answer it once and for all.  I'm just not sure DE's can wrecklessly crash mesh points when you have a slippery and fast QB (not mobile.... FAST AND AGILE).

[bigbird 60,368]

1 hour ago, AUsince72 said:

I'm just not sure DE's can wrecklessly crash mesh points when you have a slippery and fast QB (not mobile.... FAST AND AGILE).

The end and LB would have a gap exchange and he would take any out side pull/keep..if the qb could escape the mesh.

[AUsince72 11,084]

20 minutes ago, bigbird said:

The end and LB would have a gap exchange and he would take any out side pull/keep..if the qb could escape the mesh.

I understand the X's & O's portion of your point and agree.

My main reason for still believing it can work with the right QB is the "Jimmy's & Joe's" point of view.  True, it might be much more difficult against the semi-pro bammer players but more often than not college players are still college players and the idea of having to pick your poison still could open it up for the option, especially if you have the high quality backs.

It may not be able to be an 85% of your plays staple and I feel a sound passing game would be necessary to help keep the D honest, but I think it's better than having a Stidham handing off on basically the same play except, he's no threat to run himself.  Thus AU's backs are just running into walls because there's no outside threat.  

Guess I'm just stubborn. ?

[oracle79 3,569]

5 hours ago, bigbird said:

The end and LB would have a gap exchange and he would take any out side pull/keep..if the qb could escape the mesh.

I respect your analysis, but the read option is predicated on leaving one person unblocked, and the QB reading him right?  If the end is unblocked and crashes the mesh, then the QB has to read that and pull the ball and theoretically, because he's unblocked, then the LB would be blocked.  Nick Marshal could make it work, a less gifted, slower QB couldn't make it work.  Now if that end is the first round NFL draft pick, he's probably good enough to come off the back and take the QB so you'd be right.  Comes down to athletic ability then.  I'll agree crashing the mesh point makes it more difficult.  I dunno, maybe I'm dense and it will never work again, but I never saw it truly stopped when a Cam or Nick ran it.  More Nick because Cam was inside veer more, but regardless we don't have either although some think Malik could emulate Nick and Joey could emulate Cam.  Doubt if either could do it as well though.  No idea if Bryant could or not.

[EagleReedle 14]

On 9/25/2018 at 8:16 AM, selias said:

You mistake me for a Gus fan. Double Bubble is in WAY over his head and that gimmicky HS offense clearly doesn't cut it anymore.

 

Wait, this is Chip Lindsey's offense. It doesn't look like a Gus offense because it isn't. What plays do we know for certain Gus has called this year? 

 

We know for certain the 3rd down hand off to Whitlow for the TD vs Washington was called by Lindsey and if that hadn't of gone for a TD it would have been a colossally bad call. I keep seeing this "gus' system, gus's offense" it isn't and doesn't look like anything i recall a Malzahn offense looking like, it does look like Lindsey's past offense's 

[selias 2,398]

2 minutes ago, EagleReedle said:

 

Wait, this is Chip Lindsey's offense. It doesn't look like a Gus offense because it isn't. What plays do we know for certain Gus has called this year? 

IMO, what we've seen this year (outside of the UW game) is some weird frankenstein-like attempt to combine Chip & Gus. It doesn't appear to be working, like OJ flavored toothpase

[McLoofus 35,182]

20 minutes ago, EagleReedle said:

it isn't and doesn't look like anything i recall a Malzahn offense looking like, it does look like Lindsey's past offense's 

Lol, I see the exact opposite on about 90% of our snaps so far this season. There have been moments, but most of them happened against Washington and not many have happened since. 

[DAG 33,955]

50 minutes ago, EagleReedle said:

 

Wait, this is Chip Lindsey's offense. It doesn't look like a Gus offense because it isn't. What plays do we know for certain Gus has called this year? 

 

We know for certain the 3rd down hand off to Whitlow for the TD vs Washington was called by Lindsey and if that hadn't of gone for a TD it would have been a colossally bad call. I keep seeing this "gus' system, gus's offense" it isn't and doesn't look like anything i recall a Malzahn offense looking like, it does look like Lindsey's past offense's 

This absolutely does not completely look like a Chip Lindsey offense if you watched ASU games of the past. It’s an hybrid of what both of them want to do.

[EagleReedle 14]

21 minutes ago, DAG said:

This absolutely does not completely look like a Chip Lindsey offense if you watched ASU games of the past. It’s an hybrid of what both of them want to do.

from all the youtube arizona st games i've been able to peruse, it looks identical to what we are running now. I'm just trying to be totally honest, i see very similar offensive scheming to what we are running now. The Sugar huddle is the only thing i've seen get carried over. I fear everyone is trying to flee Malzahn when in fact we should be going back to his wing-T ways provided we get a player like Bryant to transfer. 

 

I just think until we know for certain Gus is saying "no chip we are going to run this play" or "no Chip this is the package i've always run lets add this too" then all this blame on the offense pointed at Gus is misguided ... i can totally see Gus saying "G*dd**** Chip we are going to get a 100 yard rusher every game, you had better call it so it happens!" i could see that. 

[I_M4_AU 7,768]

15 minutes ago, EagleReedle said:

from all the youtube arizona st games i've been able to peruse, it looks identical to what we are running now. I'm just trying to be totally honest, i see very similar offensive scheming to what we are running now. 

 

I just think until we know for certain Gus is saying "no chip we are going to run this play" or "no Chip this is the package i've always run lets add this too" then all this blame on the offense pointed at Gus is misguided ... i can totally see Gus saying "G*dd**** Chip we are going to get a 100 yard rusher every game, you had better call it so it happens!" i could see that. 

How do you explain the delay of game penalties and time outs we used during the Arky game if Gus doesn’t have oversight of the offensive product we have used recently.

[EagleReedle 14]

1 minute ago, I_M4_AU said:

How do you explain the delay of game penalties and time outs we used during the Arky game if Gus doesn’t have oversight of the offensive product we have used recently.

I don't have an explanation. I'll have to look in to that and while I'm certain he has some oversight I just don't know that he's calling the shots like folks want to believe however that said, i will explore those instances. thanks. 

[I_M4_AU 7,768]

1 minute ago, EagleReedle said:

I don't have an explanation. I'll have to look in to that and while I'm certain he has some oversight I just don't know that he's calling the shots like folks want to believe however that said, i will explore those instances. thanks. 

I don’t know what happened during the Arky game, but there was a lot of frustration shown on the offensive side of the ball.  It was not a well oiled machine.  It just needs to be fixed.  I hope Gus, as the HC, can fix it soon.

[DAG 33,955]

38 minutes ago, EagleReedle said:

from all the youtube arizona st games i've been able to peruse, it looks identical to what we are running now. I'm just trying to be totally honest, i see very similar offensive scheming to what we are running now. The Sugar huddle is the only thing i've seen get carried over. I fear everyone is trying to flee Malzahn when in fact we should be going back to his wing-T ways provided we get a player like Bryant to transfer. 

 

I just think until we know for certain Gus is saying "no chip we are going to run this play" or "no Chip this is the package i've always run lets add this too" then all this blame on the offense pointed at Gus is misguided ... i can totally see Gus saying "G*dd**** Chip we are going to get a 100 yard rusher every game, you had better call it so it happens!" i could see that. 

You might be being honest but you have several other posters who have also watched those games, who can put 2+2 together and come up with a conclusion opposite of yours. 

You will never hear Gus say anything like that, but Gus is the head coach right? So he absolutely is not absolved of blame for what’s going on under his watch.

[EagleReedle 14]

8 minutes ago, DAG said:

You might be being honest but you have several other posters who have also watched those games, who can put 2+2 together and come up with a conclusion opposite of yours. 

You will never hear Gus say anything like that, but Gus is the head coach right? So he absolutely is not absolved of blame for what’s going on under his watch.

 It's hardly as simple as a few differing opinions as being "folks who can put 2+2 together".  No need to be condescending to try and make a point. You have now shifted the topic to something different. I am not saying Malzahn is absolutely absolved of blame. I'm saying to the person who said Gus is running a "double bubble gimmicky high school offense" that he's not, it is lindsey's offense and we don't know the extent to which Malzahn is interpolating his own schemes.