Congressman Ellison Accused

[TitanTiger 20,471]

15 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Of course I don't know. Neither do you.

I’m not the one making grandiose claims about what I’m sure he’ll do. 

 

15 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

 

When did  knowing something here become a criteria? Threads are rampant with speculation. Let me say I THINK Kavanaugh would feel bad and contrite. He seems to be a good man and I base my opinion on that. Is that better for you?

 

Much. 

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

11 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

I’m not the one making grandiose claims about what I’m sure he’ll do. 

 

Much. 

Good. Now will you make the same comments on Dub's speculation that the house where a teammate lived could be the house where the event happened. He don't know that.

[HVAU 673]

3 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

I certainly try to admit when I'm wrong. Please tell me what I was wrong about in this thread. I may have confused the discussion since Ellison and Booker were in the thread. As far as Booker, I  made a post and asked a question. One can disagree with my opinion without me being wrong. Please read thru the thread again. I caused confusion but what am I supposed to admit being wrong about? Do you agree with Titan's tirade?

The fact that once you were called out on your error you slip recurring criticisms of Titan as being unfair to you or nasty.  

I do disagree with your take on Booker.  The Kavanaugh allegations are not similar in the least to Booker's scenario.  The act of trying to draw the parallel indicates that you're either not researching matters before you use them in your arguments, or your just Gish galloping.  Maybe I'm wrong on that, but I think we all, me in particular, can do better to engage in honest dialogue.  If that's not possible for some, their political discourse should be limited to the Smack side.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

11 minutes ago, HVAU said:

The fact that once you were called out on your error you slip recurring criticisms of Titan as being unfair to you or nasty. 

I said I caused confusion but you clearly implied I had something wrong. I still ask----what did I say that was wrong? Can you point out the post?

I do disagree with your take on Booker.  The Kavanaugh allegations are not similar in the least to Booker's scenario.  The act of trying to draw the parallel indicates that you're either not researching matters before you use them in your arguments, or your just Gish galloping.  Maybe I'm wrong on that, but I think we all, me in particular, can do better to engage in honest dialogue. --And I disagree with you re. I respect your opinion but mine happens to br different since he will be voting in a case he should recuse himself for. 

If that's not possible for some, their political discourse should be limited to the Smack side.--I started the thread in the Smack Forum but it got moved here. I certainly agree it belong back there now.

 

[homersapien 11,353]

4 hours ago, HVAU said:

It's ok to admit that you are wrong from time to time.  It is much more respectable than becoming defensive whenever a poorly chosen position is shown to be such.

I think you should check out some Sam Harris.  One of the early lines he uses in his "Waking Up" podcast is something to the effect of "I don't want to be incorrect in my positions any longer than I must, so please if you have a better, more rational position educate me."

 

 

This is more about recognizing simple facts as it is about rationalizing an argument.

[HVAU 673]

2 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

I said I caused confusion but you clearly implied I had something wrong. I still ask----what did I say that was wrong? Can you point out the post?

The way in which you caused the confusion is a wrong.  You inaccurately read a posters comment when that poster used your original post in quotations to respond to the thread.  Then you responded in a way that appeared to recommend that the poster had made an error.

You ignored your own error, and criticized Titan of being "lost".  

So on and so on.

Also, I understand it is just an opinion, but let's remove Booker v. Kavanaugh from the political realm for a moment:

Scenario A. A young man and young woman are making out.  The young man gropes the breasts of the young woman.  The young woman asks the young man to stop.  The young man stops.

Scenario B. A young man and his friend get drunk at a party.  The young men take a young woman to a bedroom.  One of the young men forces the young woman onto a bed despite her protestations.  He covers her mouth and uses his body to hold her down on the bed.  He unsuccessfully attempts to have sex with the young woman. 

So, in my opinion, these two scenarios are, other than the most obvious similarities of youth and sexual relationships, nothing alike.  I hold that as one of your wrongs as well.  However, if you can present a rationale that makes sense I'll entertain the argument.

 

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

12 hours ago, HVAU said:

The way in which you caused the confusion is a wrong.  You inaccurately read a posters comment when that poster used your original post in quotations to respond to the thread.  Then you responded in a way that appeared to recommend that the poster had made an error.

You ignored your own error, and criticized Titan of being "lost".  

So on and so on.

Also, I understand it is just an opinion, but let's remove Booker v. Kavanaugh from the political realm for a moment:

Scenario A. A young man and young woman are making out.  The young man gropes the breasts of the young woman.  The young woman asks the young man to stop.  The young man stops.

Scenario B. A young man and his friend get drunk at a party.  The young men take a young woman to a bedroom.  One of the young men forces the young woman onto a bed despite her protestations.  He covers her mouth and uses his body to hold her down on the bed.  He unsuccessfully attempts to have sex with the young woman. 

So, in my opinion, these two scenarios are, other than the most obvious similarities of youth and sexual relationships, nothing alike.  I hold that as one of your wrongs as well.  However, if you can present a rationale that makes sense I'll entertain the argument.

 

You keep throwing back that I caused confusion which I admitted. But you still can't point out a post where I said something wrong or in error otherwise.

[TitanTiger 20,471]

15 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

You keep throwing back that I caused confusion which I admitted. But you still can't point out a post where I said something wrong or in error otherwise.

I will.  You're in wrong/in error to suggest that Booker's situation and what Kavanaugh is alleged to have done are on the same level.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

5 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

I will.  You're in wrong/in error to suggest that Booker's situation and what Kavanaugh is alleged to have done are on the same level.

That's only wrong in YOUR opinion, not mine. And I don't think I even suggested it even though I think it is. I guess anyone else's opinion you don't agree withh you don't agree with is wrong and erroneous.

[TitanTiger 20,471]

4 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

That's only wrong in YOUR opinion, not mine.

It's wrong in everyone's opinion that thinks about it for more than 0.5 seconds.  There's a reason the two situations would be treated differently in a court for that same reason.  Don't be ridiculous.

 

Quote

And I don't think I even suggested it even though I think it is. I guess anyone else's opinion you don't agree withh you don't agree with is wrong and erroneous.

Yeah, you kinda did by suggesting that Booker's situation makes him unfit to vote on Kavanaugh's confirmation.  The two situations aren't even in the same league.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

3 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

It's wrong in everyone's opinion that thinks about it for more than 0.5 seconds.  There's a reason the two situations would be treated differently in a court for that same reason.  Don't be ridiculous.

 

Yeah, you kind did by suggesting that Booker's situation makes him unfit to vote on Kavanaugh's confirmation.  The two situations aren't even in the same league.

Not going to waste my time today with hopeless "discussion" with you. You will post forever and your opinion always has. to be right.

[TitanTiger 20,471]

1 minute ago, Proud Tiger said:

Not going to waste my time today with hopeless "discussion" with you. You will post forever and your opinion always has. to be right.

Once again, someone blows holes in your arguments that you could drive a truck through and you retreat to your favorite excuse.  

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

Once again, someone blows holes in your arguments that you could drive a truck through and you retreat to your favorite excuse.  

As I said you are always right. Hugs

[TitanTiger 20,471]

1 minute ago, Proud Tiger said:

As I said you are always right. Hugs

Another one of your preferred fallback tactics when you get owned.

The sooner your realize that saying "it's my opinion" isn't some magic fairy dust that makes your assertions immune to critique, the better off you'll be.  Until then, you're out of your depth here.

[HVAU 673]

2 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

But you still can't point out a post where I said something wrong or in error otherwise.

In political discourse if you can not provide a rationale for your position, even those related to opinion, you are considered wrong by those that support opposing opinions with logical arguments.  It isn't enough to merely say "that's my opinion" and carry on as if you are vindicated.

Also, you admitted to causing the confusion, so, though I think you could have handled your error in a more magnanimous way, I'll drop that issue.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

9 minutes ago, HVAU said:

 

Also, you admitted to causing the confusion, so, though I think you could have handled your error in a more magnanimous way, I'll drop that issue.

Oh wow that's mighty white of you

[homersapien 11,353]

6 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

Oh wow that's mighty white of you

That's inherently racist, not withstanding.

It might have worked had you been arguing about what constitutes racial language (for example), but not just out of the blue like that.

[HVAU 673]

31 minutes ago, Proud Tiger said:

Oh wow that's mighty white of you

Do you want to discuss the Booker opinion, and support your position?

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

1 hour ago, HVAU said:

Do you want to discuss the Booker opinion, and support your position?

Not really because:

1.. I haven't stated a position. I posted a link about Booker and asked if you thought he should be allowed to vote on Kavanaugh.. You never answered but later in the thread you said I was wrong and I should admit it. I asked you what I was wrong about and that lead to another "discussion" and an interruption and tirade by Titan. So I'm not even sure what you think my "position" is.

2. I'm tired of the acrimony on display among Auburn "family."  It's just lots of yada yada and no one ever changes their mind about anything. Some just want to post until they get the last post to satisfy their overinflated ego and declare victory. Guess I just need to take a break and get ready for some football Saturday. WDE.

[AU64 10,122]

5 hours ago, Proud Tiger said:

That's only wrong in YOUR opinion, not mine. And I don't think I even suggested it even though I think it is. I guess anyone else's opinion you don't agree withh you don't agree with is wrong and erroneous.

Now you understand ( I hope ) why it is fruitless to get into long exchanges with some of these guys...

They are never wrong, …..their opinions carry the same weight as fact,  they have all the answers and insights,  even when the rest of the world does not know...., and they will never quit trying to twist words or tell you what you are thinking....or what you believe.    BIG waste of time going beyond two posts in response. . 

[AUDub 11,131]

9 minutes ago, AU64 said:

Now you understand ( I hope ) why it is fruitless to get into long exchanges with some of these guys...

They are never wrong, …..their opinions carry the same weight as fact,  they have all the answers and insights,  even when the rest of the world does not know...., and they will never quit trying to twist words or tell you what you are thinking....or what you believe.    BIG waste of time going beyond two posts in response. . 

I have been very careful to qualify my responses, as have others.

[TitanTiger 20,471]

10 minutes ago, AU64 said:

Now you understand ( I hope ) why it is fruitless to get into long exchanges with some of these guys...

They are never wrong, …..their opinions carry the same weight as fact,  they have all the answers and insights,  even when the rest of the world does not know...., and they will never quit trying to twist words or tell you what you are thinking....or what you believe.    BIG waste of time going beyond two posts in response. . 

This has mostly been a fruitful discussion.  But it's entirely reasonable to question what was being suggested and, in some parts, call BS on it.

But you know, if you think it's fruitless to get into longer discussions with some of us, nobody's holding a gun to your head keeping you here suffering through it all.  I can even make it so you don't even see the politics forums anymore so you won't be tempted to get sucked into all the fruitless banner.  Your call.

[HVAU 673]

1 hour ago, Proud Tiger said:

Not really because:

1.. I haven't stated a position. I posted a link about Booker and asked if you thought he should be allowed to vote on Kavanaugh.. You never answered but later in the thread you said I was wrong and I should admit it. I asked you what I was wrong about and that lead to another "discussion" and an interruption and tirade by Titan. So I'm not even sure what you think my "position" is.

No.  I responded to your question about Ellison before you asked anything about Booker.  I didn't enter the thread again until you had discussed the confusion issue with Titan.  Your position on Booker was implied by both the posing of an unnecessary query and made clearer in the comments that followed.

I again invite you to support your position.  Then we can maybe have a real discussion.

2. I'm tired of the acrimony on display among Auburn "family."  It's just lots of yada yada and no one ever changes their mind about anything. Some just want to post until they get the last post to satisfy their overinflated ego and declare victory. Guess I just need to take a break and get ready for some football Saturday. WDE.

I can sympathize with that frustration.  I fall into that mode of operation for time to time.  Do you recognize that you often do as well?

War Eagle!

 

[homersapien 11,353]

2 hours ago, AU64 said:

Now you understand ( I hope ) why it is fruitless to get into long exchanges with some of these guys...

They are never wrong, …..their opinions carry the same weight as fact,  they have all the answers and insights,  even when the rest of the world does not know...., and they will never quit trying to twist words or tell you what you are thinking....or what you believe.    BIG waste of time going beyond two posts in response. . 

That sounds a little pathetic.  I you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

[Proud Tiger 4,261]

4 hours ago, AU64 said:

Now you understand ( I hope ) why it is fruitless to get into long exchanges with some of these guys...

They are never wrong, …..their opinions carry the same weight as fact,  they have all the answers and insights,  even when the rest of the world does not know...., and they will never quit trying to twist words or tell you what you are thinking....or what you believe.    BIG waste of time going beyond two posts in response. . 

It is refreshing to see that others see that. But they don't care. Their egos and presumed self superiority are incurable. It is what it is.