A way forward

[ToomersStreet 795]

Gus is our coach love it or hate it.  I do not see Gus being terminated before 2021.  Gus's offense has been an issue since Nick Marshal left after  2014 for  one reason or  another and is primarily responsibly  for Auburn losing an average of five games a year since 2014.  Despite  the offense Gus has done well  representing Auburn. He doesn't  make stupid public statements(not talking about statements he makes about his team).  He has run a clean program.  We do not have serious off the field issues. He recruits well.  Lastly  he has put together a solid defensive staff.  The one glaring issue is  his constant involvement and micromanaging of  the offense.  The powers at Auburn, starting with the AD need to find a way to to gain leverage against Gus and pry the offense away from him.  Find an OC that Gus does not have ties to, and assistants that Gus has not worked  with.  I get this sounds crazy but what we are watching on Saturdays is also crazy.  UGA went through this with Mark Richt but were able to get him to give up  offensive play calling after six years.   Greene or someone needs to find a way to  do this with Gus.  Bring in Al  Borges or another proven OC who is proven and will  stand there ground with Gus.  If  not then this will continue until Auburn can afford the buyout.

[Win4AU 4,052]

I disagree about Gus’s offense needing to be taken away.  I’m as disgusted as anyone with the product on the field right now.  I had to sit for 3 hrs Saturday night surrounded by cowbells so I suffered X2 last game.  I think the Auburn offense is where it’s at due to Gus bending under the pressure of everyone telling him to change his ways.  Gus’s offense may be simple but when it works it’s hard to stop.  This offense needs a power running game, with or without a running Qb, and a Qb who doesn’t turn the ball over.  Gus would be well served bringing in a Qb guru that would work on mechanics just like any other position coach and leave the offensive design purely on Gus.  Next year with a returning line, returning RBs and his choice of 4 true dual threat Qbs should fall right in his wheel house.  I’m sure I’ll get torched for this opinion but if you look at the last 6 years the wins have come when the offense operates his way.

[doc4aday 1,887]

12 minutes ago, Win4AU said:

I disagree about Gus’s offense needing to be taken away.  I’m as disgusted as anyone with the product on the field right now.  I had to sit for 3 hrs Saturday night surrounded by cowbells so I suffered X2 last game.  I think the Auburn offense is where it’s at due to Gus bending under the pressure of everyone telling him to change his ways.  Gus’s offense may be simple but when it works it’s hard to stop.  This offense needs a power running game, with or without a running Qb, and a Qb who doesn’t turn the ball over.  Gus would be well served bringing in a Qb guru that would work on mechanics just like any other position coach and leave the offensive design purely on Gus.  Next year with a returning line, returning RBs and his choice of 4 true dual threat Qbs should fall right in his wheel house.  I’m sure I’ll get torched for this opinion but if you look at the last 6 years the wins have come when the offense operates his way.

You are right in many ways. Gus has a QB named Gatewood that should be given a shot to run the show. I feel fairly confident that Joey could run the offense like what Cam and Nick did. JS is a pocket passer QB that has shown signs of brilliance but cannot run the football much if any this season unless he is running for his life away from defenders. I think he gets happy feet far more this season that last. I hope come saturday, he has a great day and gets it all working. We will see.

[KolchakAU85 430]

15 minutes ago, Win4AU said:

I disagree about Gus’s offense needing to be taken away.  I’m as disgusted as anyone with the product on the field right now.  I had to sit for 3 hrs Saturday night surrounded by cowbells so I suffered X2 last game.  I think the Auburn offense is where it’s at due to Gus bending under the pressure of everyone telling him to change his ways.  Gus’s offense may be simple but when it works it’s hard to stop.  This offense needs a power running game, with or without a running Qb, and a Qb who doesn’t turn the ball over.  Gus would be well served bringing in a Qb guru that would work on mechanics just like any other position coach and leave the offensive design purely on Gus.  Next year with a returning line, returning RBs and his choice of 4 true dual threat Qbs should fall right in his wheel house.  I’m sure I’ll get torched for this opinion but if you look at the last 6 years the wins have come when the offense operates his way.

You make some good points, and I appreciate your optimism about next year.

[BJCrawford 1,568]

Was miss state running some form of his offense Saturday? I keep hearing they had a game plan we had not seen before. I just think it looked like it could not be stopped. Reminded me of the 2013 sec championship game where mason had 300 yards (only that was worse)

[KolchakAU85 430]

3 minutes ago, BJCrawford said:

Was miss state running some form of his offense Saturday? I keep hearing they had a game plan we had not seen before. I just think it looked like it could not be stopped. Reminded me of the 2013 sec championship game where mason had 300 yards (only that was worse)

They ran 3 plays: Jet sweep left, Jet sweep right, QB up the middle.  Mostly the latter.  And they racked up almost 350 yards, with two 100-yard rushers.

All we had to defend were 3 plays - all running plays.  And with our supposedly stout and deep DL, we failed miserably.

[corchjay 5,311]

3 minutes ago, BJCrawford said:

Was miss state running some form of his offense Saturday? I keep hearing they had a game plan we had not seen before. I just think it looked like it could not be stopped. Reminded me of the 2013 sec championship game where mason had 300 yards (only that was worse)

Just a simple read play.  They were reading the play side linebacker.  If he stayed inside they gave to the back,  he following the back they ran the QB.  In the hole the opposite backer would either get chipped by a OL or would just get beat by the QB in the hole.  We missed tackles but their backs and QB normally made the first person miss a lot. 

[War to the Eagle 362]

33 minutes ago, Win4AU said:

I disagree about Gus’s offense needing to be taken away.  I’m as disgusted as anyone with the product on the field right now.  I had to sit for 3 hrs Saturday night surrounded by cowbells so I suffered X2 last game.  I think the Auburn offense is where it’s at due to Gus bending under the pressure of everyone telling him to change his ways.  Gus’s offense may be simple but when it works it’s hard to stop.  This offense needs a power running game, with or without a running Qb, and a Qb who doesn’t turn the ball over.  Gus would be well served bringing in a Qb guru that would work on mechanics just like any other position coach and leave the offensive design purely on Gus.  Next year with a returning line, returning RBs and his choice of 4 true dual threat Qbs should fall right in his wheel house.  I’m sure I’ll get torched for this opinion but if you look at the last 6 years the wins have come when the offense operates his way.

This × 1000. Thank you. We completely, and I mean completely, forget about his offenses in years past. They didn't work every year, but often that was the case because of personnel that were not conducive to the system (and that he did not recruit). 

I have spoken similarly in other threads. I'm not trying to be a Gus apologist. I am, however, trying to speak with pause during a storm. Think about this: last year was the tail-end of his first real recruiting class. Look how the offense produced last year. It stuns me how quickly we forget.

[AU64 10,122]

36 minutes ago, Win4AU said:

I disagree about Gus’s offense needing to be taken away.  I’m as disgusted as anyone with the product on the field right now.  I had to sit for 3 hrs Saturday night surrounded by cowbells so I suffered X2 last game.  I think the Auburn offense is where it’s at due to Gus bending under the pressure of everyone telling him to change his ways.  Gus’s offense may be simple but when it works it’s hard to stop.  This offense needs a power running game, with or without a running Qb, and a Qb who doesn’t turn the ball over.  Gus would be well served bringing in a Qb guru that would work on mechanics just like any other position coach and leave the offensive design purely on Gus.  Next year with a returning line, returning RBs and his choice of 4 true dual threat Qbs should fall right in his wheel house.  I’m sure I’ll get torched for this opinion but if you look at the last 6 years the wins have come when the offense operates his way.

agree...I'd prefer to see Gus run the offense ...totally and period..... and not be trying to split the duties...game planning vs actual play calling. JMO but the more Gus has surrendered the actual play calling the worse things looks.  

[ToomersStreet 795]

5 minutes ago, War to the Eagle said:

This × 1000. Thank you. We completely, and I mean completely, forget about his offenses in years past. They didn't work every year, but often that was the case because of personnel that were not conducive to the system (and that he did not recruit). 

I have spoken similarly in other threads. I'm not trying to be a Gus apologist. I am, however, trying to speak with pause during a storm. Think about this: last year was the tail-end of his first real recruiting class. Look how the offense produced last year. It stuns me how quickly we forget.

He recruited Jeremy Johnson, John Frankln,  Tyler  Queen,  Woody Barrett, White and Jarrett.  All guys that didn't work out  or dont fit the system.  Reason why he shouldn't run his offense. He doesn'trecruitthe right players for  his own system.

And this years is 100% his players.  So why are we struggling? A year ago Gus said the next 3-4 for years  are going to be Auburns best. End of last  season he said "the foundtion has been laid."

[IronMan70 3,277]

We went thru this play calling stuff last year after the Clemson game. Quite frankly, you don't pay this kind of money and then have to micro-manage a HC. He makes the decisions. My personal opinion is they have been caught off guard with this subpar OL. That is something that should never happen especially if you expect to be a top tier program. No offense will perform at a high level with a below average OL, it won't matter who calls the plays. We've already had to take out most of our inside run calls from the playbook.

As far as who the OC might be it is also something that, within reason, won't matter in a top tier program. That 'not to be named' program in the state is a perfect example. It doesn't matter if they change their OC, heck half the time we don't even know the guy's name. But one thing they don't do is put a very below average OL on the field and expect success. They make sure ahead of time that their offensive coordinator and skill players aren't put in that position. The same goes for their DL. Fortunately in our case, CRG has our DL playing at a high level year over year so it's not an issue. 

[tigerchris 243]

I say delete the offensive coordinator position and let Gus run it 100%.  Take the money and spend on hiring better position coaches, training programs and facilities. 

If the offense fails, he can’t hide from it. 

[johnnyAU 3,630]

I'd like to see Gus completely abandon his play calling duties and give up the responsibility to someone who knows how to design a passing game, AND who can properly train/mentor a QB.  Someone who is experienced in attacking various defensive schemes, and isn't so arrogant he continues to do the same thing over and over when it's obvious to every DC and fan in the country it just isn't working. 

I'd love Big Al Borges to return as OC.  We are built more for his West Coast offense right now than whatever Gus is trying to run. 

[aucanucktiger 1,791]

58 minutes ago, Win4AU said:

I disagree about Gus’s offense needing to be taken away.  I’m as disgusted as anyone with the product on the field right now.  I had to sit for 3 hrs Saturday night surrounded by cowbells so I suffered X2 last game.  I think the Auburn offense is where it’s at due to Gus bending under the pressure of everyone telling him to change his ways.  Gus’s offense may be simple but when it works it’s hard to stop.  This offense needs a power running game, with or without a running Qb, and a Qb who doesn’t turn the ball over.  Gus would be well served bringing in a Qb guru that would work on mechanics just like any other position coach and leave the offensive design purely on Gus.  Next year with a returning line, returning RBs and his choice of 4 true dual threat Qbs should fall right in his wheel house.  I’m sure I’ll get torched for this opinion but if you look at the last 6 years the wins have come when the offense operates his way.

Bingo, IMO. Spurrier was a brilliant O mind & managed both HC & primary play calling wonderfully most of his career - it can be done. We hired Malzahn for his proven talent of successfully blending his own O tempo timing & frankly not unusual plays. One of the reasons Chizik didn't work out (one of the defensive minds of his generation) was his delegating his strength - defense coordinating - to lesser mortals.

[autigeremt 6,597]

31 minutes ago, KolchakAU85 said:

They ran 3 plays: Jet sweep left, Jet sweep right, QB up the middle.  Mostly the latter.  And they racked up almost 350 yards, with two 100-yard rushers.

All we had to defend were 3 plays - all running plays.  And with our supposedly stout and deep DL, we failed miserably.

This game reminded me of the LSU defense against Cam in 2010. 

[Win4AU 4,052]

I’d say the reason this year’s teams with his recruits is struggling is lack of tempo, lack of misdirection, and continually getting in 3rd and longs.  3rd and long becomes an obvious passing down.  

As much as I loved Gorgeous Borges in 2004 & 2005 the Auburn offense got progressively worse until Tubs decided to make a change.

I also don’t believe Gus needs a running Qb but a Nick or Cam does make this offense dangerous.  Sean was serviceable in 2015 till he was injured late in the season just as he was in 2016.  Stidham was an upgrade in 2017 but still wasn’t a running QB.  

I do agree that evaluation of some the Qb recruits leaves some to be desired.