Asa Martin (update transferring)

[nutspanther 73]

46 minutes ago, jAUSon said:

Any chance the staff is having a tough time with Martin and family, decide to intentionally take off the redshirt, then ice it as a sort of nudge toward transferring? 

If that is the case, it is the most unethical thing I have heard come from our program and I would highly advocate against anybody committing to play football at Auburn University until the regime is changed.

[abw0004 10,110]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

 

Here ya go, and he isn’t the only one.  I’m not talking just about this thread.

I think that was taken out of context.  I asked if what I read was correct, and if so what I said had merit.  I wasn’t immediately going after Chip.  That’s why I asked the forum if what I read was correct.  

[McLoofus 35,182]

4 hours ago, AU64 said:

She also said her discussions were with Chip...so who knows...   hope he lands where he can play regularly but was not going to happen here it seems 

No, she said she had discussions with Chip and another staffer who she declined to name. Chip said Martin was going to play and then the other staffer told her that they were redshirting Martin after he'd already played 5 games.

I know it's disappointing and inconvenient to some but the article is very clear and you can't pin this on the guy who isn't here anymore. Our problems aren't leaving with Chip. They're still here and getting worse as talented staff and players start filing out of that locker room.

[cole256 17,043]

19 hours ago, Eagle Eye 7 said:

Yes I live in the area, but they don’t have the program like Hoover, Thompson and the likes have . Big school no funds.

That may be so but it isn't in anyway a small school. Now down the street Courtland, tanner etc those are small schools

[I_M4_AU 7,801]

2 hours ago, abw0004 said:

I think that was taken out of context.  I asked if what I read was correct, and if so what I said had merit.  I wasn’t immediately going after Chip.  That’s why I asked the forum if what I read was correct.  

Not going after you personally, just used your post as an example of someone “blaming” CCL now that he is gone.  He mentioned he didn’t see anyone complaining about CCL.  Even though you asked the question, you didn’t wait for an answer before you jumped on CCL.  Shows intent.  There have been other posters blaming CCL and you’re not the only or first one.

[abw0004 10,110]

16 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Not going after you personally, just used your post as an example of someone “blaming” CCL now that he is gone.  He mentioned he didn’t see anyone complaining about CCL.  Even though you asked the question, you didn’t wait for an answer before you jumped on CCL.  Shows intent.  There have been other posters blaming CCL and you’re not the only or first one.

I think that is true, although I left it open ended that if I were in correct I would not support that statement.  Or if I were correct I would.  Not really trying to go after Chip, although I could see how you would see that.  

[auburnphan 6,050]

10 hours ago, Mikey said:

We are right at average attrition (6) for this time of year. Average over a long time has been from 7 to 11 per year. Lately, with the new, relaxed transfer rules, average for ALL P5 teams has run closer to from 10 to 14. These days, below 10 would be low attrition, over 14 would be high. That's for a full calendar year.

Does Stidham count on this list as well?

[oracle79 3,569]

1 hour ago, auburnphan said:

Does Stidham count on this list as well?

Yep, but technically he hasn't left yet.  Nor have Brown, Davidson, Coe, Dean, etc.

[Mikey 16,577]

3 hours ago, auburnphan said:

Does Stidham count on this list as well?

I will add Stidham when the time comes. He'll count if he leaves before next July 31st.

[aubearcat 2,137]

11 hours ago, Mikey said:

I will add Stidham when the time comes. He'll count if he leaves before next July 31st.

Hasn’t he already announced his decision that he’s leaving AUburn after this season?

[McLoofus 35,182]

6 minutes ago, aubearcat said:

Hasn’t he already announced his decision that he’s leaving AUburn after this season?

Yep.

[WDEDothan1976 2]

Good luck Asa, I wish he would stay for at least 1 more year.

[Linayus 676]

Okay.. let me just throw this out there and be devil's advocate (if someone hasn't already - I'm not reading through 20 pages):

I get it. Coaches/Staff screwed up and you "wasted" a season. But did you really? He was what, 4th or even 5th on our depth chart? Was he really going to factor into our offense when you had other freshmen contributing more and who would likely continue that for the next 3 years? Maybe he decided he could use this as an excuse to leave the program without sounding like he was just outplayed at the position and wanted to go somewhere he could play ASAP, which I totally do not fault him for.

Parents are protective of their kids, so I get their frustration, especially the way it sounds like the staff didn't own up to their mistake. But I won't criticize the coaches if they felt like Asa didn't add enough to the offense to actually see the field more once they realized the red shirt was gone.

All that aside, I wish nothing but the best for Asa. There are a lot of offenses out there that will be able to utilize him more than ours. He'll be fine.

[homersapien 11,366]

2 hours ago, Linayus said:

......I get it. Coaches/Staff screwed up and you "wasted" a season. But did you really? He was what, 4th or even 5th on our depth chart? Was he really going to factor into our offense when you had other freshmen contributing more and who would likely continue that for the next 3 years? Maybe he decided he could use this as an excuse to leave the program without sounding like he was just outplayed at the position and wanted to go somewhere he could play ASAP, which I totally do not fault him for.....

He didn't "waste" a season, he wasted (no quotes) a year of eligibility for the sake of lining up for one play.

First, that's the whole point of red shirting. 

And who's to say how he wouldn't compete in the next 4 years of his eligibility after red shirting his freshman year?  It's not like our coaches have exhibited a keen eye for potential.

[Linayus 676]

1 minute ago, homersapien said:

Quote

He didn't "waste" a season, he wasted (no quotes) a year of eligibility for the sake of lining up for one play.

I'm not going to bandy words with you on that. However you phrase it, he lost a season. I get it. It sucks for him and if it were me, I'd be upset too.

First, that's the whole point of red shirting. 

And who's to say how he would compete in the next 4 years of his eligibility after red shirting his freshman year?  It's not like our coaches have exhibited a keen eye for potential.

Or next year's RB class could surpass him too. You and I don't know that. The coaches don't know that. He doesn't know that. If HE thinks the current RB grouping for next year will continue to play ahead of him, he's making the right choice to move on now. He can still find somewhere to play for 3 years. How many RBs these days actually play more than 2-3 years at the college level anyway?

 

[Malcolm_FleX48 1,869]

27 minutes ago, Linayus said:

Okay.. let me just throw this out there and be devil's advocate (if someone hasn't already - I'm not reading through 20 pages):

I get it. Coaches/Staff screwed up and you "wasted" a season. But did you really? He was what, 4th or even 5th on our depth chart? Was he really going to factor into our offense when you had other freshmen contributing more and who would likely continue that for the next 3 years? Maybe he decided he could use this as an excuse to leave the program without sounding like he was just outplayed at the position and wanted to go somewhere he could play ASAP, which I totally do not fault him for.

Parents are protective of their kids, so I get their frustration, especially the way it sounds like the staff didn't own up to their mistake. But I won't criticize the coaches if they felt like Asa didn't add enough to the offense to actually see the field more once they realized the red shirt was gone.

All that aside, I wish nothing but the best for Asa. There are a lot of offenses out there that will be able to utilize him more than ours. He'll be fine.

Here is the thing, 

Coaches typically need to be able to manage and make sure that they're doing what's best with a player's future. That's the whole reason for the player with aspirations of playing at a higher level coming to the school in the first place. If you listen to all the TOP recruits who know they want to play in the NFL and have a marginally better shot, it's always a point to say, "I think that this will give me the best chance to make it to the league" in some capacity. 

That being said, when a coaching staff shows THAT much incompetence with the task of helping you reach your goal or aren't putting you in a position to succeed, then you begin the question that. This can be exhibited by some or all of the following:

A. Not letting you get enough snaps or meaningful development
B. Putting you in the game and not calling plays to your strength (if you're in a feature position)
C. Not putting you in a redshirt-type program (At Auburn, they have the War Dogs program which is a more rigorous in-season training path for redshirt level players.)
D. Having "Shiny Ball Syndrome" where they initially promise or factor you into the plan, only to see another player make a couple of plays and then completely shunt resources from you to that player without giving you so much as a chance to complete. (This can happen A LOT. Most of the times a player will make a "Wow" play in practice and coaches will become enamored with seeing if that was a fluke and begin to leave that player in despite the fact you were slated to get reps the next go-round. This is why coaches often overlook talent on their roster, because they're trying to get their "flash" players to show that flash more often and don't give enough time to those who could get in a rhythm and become consistent producers.)

My only guess is that not only was Asa not in War dogs or being placed in a "Developmental" designation, he was also getting thrown out there in minimal situations with some probable promise of "Your time is coming." That being said, when his redshirt was burned and he didn't see an uptick in usage and wasn't even considered for being a spell back during the injury plague, he realized that they didn't have a long-term plan for him. That, and also coaches do "Exit Evaluations" at the end of the season for returning players.

There could of been any number of these offenses which damaged Asa's trust in this coaching staff. Also... Players talk. They hear perception, watch Espn and other sports networks and even see the memes on social media. Hell, Prince posted a meme about him on his Snapchat and when I asked him about it, he said someone else made it of them. It's clear to see that this program's stability is slipping and if a new coach were to come in, it'd be possible for all the former recruits of the old regime to get forgotten if they're not the star player. 

Let's not attribute this to a whole "He wasn't going to make it anyways so he transferred." Because that's rarely the case. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

20 minutes ago, Linayus said:

Maybe he decided he could use this as an excuse to leave the program without sounding like he was just outplayed at the position and wanted to go somewhere he could play ASAP, which I totally do not fault him for.

Except nothing about this story suggests that he wasn't outplayed at the position. It's clear that the coaches preferred other players regardless of Martin's eligibility status. Nothing about the Martin family's version of the story disputes that. 

It's a monumental eff up by our staff and it was kind of the Martin family to not name the coach still on our staff who was responsible for it. And I'm not sure there's any reason to think that they approached the media about this. It's much more likely in my mind that the media approached them and they only answered questions honestly.

I know you're not one of the blind Gus apologists around here, so hopefully I'm not coming across as belligerent at all. But I don't think you can come up with a version of this story that exculpates our current staff without projecting dishonesty or some other negative agenda on Martin and his family. And I'm not comfortable with that, at least until the staff offers their own, contradictory version. 

[keesler 5,924]

On 12/9/2018 at 12:54 AM, Malcolm_FleX48 said:

 

I don't know what's currently going on in your life Malcolm, but damnit you need to post on this board more!

 

[gulftiger66 166]

30 minutes ago, Linayus said:

Okay.. let me just throw this out there and be devil's advocate (if someone hasn't already - I'm not reading through 20 pages):

I get it. Coaches/Staff screwed up and you "wasted" a season. But did you really? He was what, 4th or even 5th on our depth chart? Was he really going to factor into our offense when you had other freshmen contributing more and who would likely continue that for the next 3 years? Maybe he decided he could use this as an excuse to leave the program without sounding like he was just outplayed at the position and wanted to go somewhere he could play ASAP, which I totally do not fault him for.

Parents are protective of their kids, so I get their frustration, especially the way it sounds like the staff didn't own up to their mistake. But I won't criticize the coaches if they felt like Asa didn't add enough to the offense to actually see the field more once they realized the red shirt was gone.

All that aside, I wish nothing but the best for Asa. There are a lot of offenses out there that will be able to utilize him more than ours. He'll be fine.

It seems that the "Mr Football" title may be a heavy burden for someone who doesn't immediately break into the rotation.  Yes, a year was apparently squandered but Asa still had 3 more years to play, be in meetings, participate in the S&C program and develop into an SEC level running back.  This is disappointing but perhaps Asa has his eye on a smaller program with immediate playing time, a la Roc Thomas at Jax St.  I also wish him the best in the future.  

[NorthGATiger 1,801]

17 minutes ago, Malcolm_FleX48 said:

Here is the thing, 

Coaches typically need to be able to manage and make sure that they're doing what's best with a player's future. That's the whole reason for the player with aspirations of playing at a higher level coming to the school in the first place. If you listen to all the TOP recruits who know they want to play in the NFL and have a marginally better shot, it's always a point to say, "I think that this will give me the best chance to make it to the league" in some capacity. 

That being said, when a coaching staff shows THAT much incompetence with the task of helping you reach your goal or aren't putting you in a position to succeed, then you begin the question that. This can be exhibited by some or all of the following:

A. Not letting you get enough snaps or meaningful development
B. Putting you in the game and not calling plays to your strength (if you're in a feature position)
C. Not putting you in a redshirt-type program (At Auburn, they have the War Dogs program which is a more rigorous in-season training path for redshirt level players.)
D. Having "Shiny Ball Syndrome" where they initially promise or factor you into the plan, only to see another player make a couple of plays and then completely shunt resources from you to that player without giving you so much as a chance to complete. (This can happen A LOT. Most of the times a player will make a "Wow" play in practice and coaches will become enamored with seeing if that was a fluke and begin to leave that player in despite the fact you were slated to get reps the next go-round. This is why coaches often overlook talent on their roster, because they're trying to get their "flash" players to show that flash more often and don't give enough time to those who could get in a rhythm and become consistent producers.)

My only guess is that not only was Asa not in War dogs or being placed in a "Developmental" designation, he was also getting thrown out there in minimal situations with some probable promise of "Your time is coming." That being said, when his redshirt was burned and he didn't see an uptick in usage and wasn't even considered for being a spell back during the injury plague, he realized that they didn't have a long-term plan for him. That, and also coaches do "Exit Evaluations" at the end of the season for returning players.

There could of been any number of these offenses which damaged Asa's trust in this coaching staff. Also... Players talk. They hear perception, watch Espn and other sports networks and even see the memes on social media. Hell, Prince posted a meme about him on his Snapchat and when I asked him about it, he said someone else made it of them. It's clear to see that this program's stability is slipping and if a new coach were to come in, it'd be possible for all the former recruits of the old regime to get forgotten if they're not the star player. 

Let's not attribute this to a whole "He wasn't going to make it anyways so he transferred." Because that's rarely the case. 

I will take "D" Reasons that players are unhappy for $500 Alex.

Asa Martin is not leaving Auburn because he can't or could not compete.  He is not leaving because he was way down on the depth chart of  of 5 RBs.  He is leaving because we did not use him in a time of need and we did not redshirt him and do anything to make him better.  It was a completely wasted year for the kid.  If your son is a stud in baseball and the head coach says look we need you to play Varsity and not JV then you are thinking great right.  If the coach never plays you on the Varsity squad but also does not let you play JV what good did that do for you?

[Linayus 676]

18 minutes ago, Malcolm_FleX48 said:

Here is the thing, 

Coaches typically need to be able to manage and make sure that they're doing what's best with a player's future. That's the whole reason for the player with aspirations of playing at a higher level coming to the school in the first place. If you listen to all the TOP recruits who know they want to play in the NFL and have a marginally better shot, it's always a point to say, "I think that this will give me the best chance to make it to the league" in some capacity. 

That being said, when a coaching staff shows THAT much incompetence with the task of helping you reach your goal or aren't putting you in a position to succeed, then you begin the question that. This can be exhibited by some or all of the following:

A. Not letting you get enough snaps or meaningful development
B. Putting you in the game and not calling plays to your strength (if you're in a feature position)
C. Not putting you in a redshirt-type program (At Auburn, they have the War Dogs program which is a more rigorous in-season training path for redshirt level players.)
D. Having "Shiny Ball Syndrome" where they initially promise or factor you into the plan, only to see another player make a couple of plays and then completely shunt resources from you to that player without giving you so much as a chance to complete. (This can happen A LOT. Most of the times a player will make a "Wow" play in practice and coaches will become enamored with seeing if that was a fluke and begin to leave that player in despite the fact you were slated to get reps the next go-round. This is why coaches often overlook talent on their roster, because they're trying to get their "flash" players to show that flash more often and don't give enough time to those who could get in a rhythm and become consistent producers.)

My only guess is that not only was Asa not in War dogs or being placed in a "Developmental" designation, he was also getting thrown out there in minimal situations with some probable promise of "Your time is coming." That being said, when his redshirt was burned and he didn't see an uptick in usage and wasn't even considered for being a spell back during the injury plague, he realized that they didn't have a long-term plan for him. That, and also coaches do "Exit Evaluations" at the end of the season for returning players.

There could of been any number of these offenses which damaged Asa's trust in this coaching staff. Also... Players talk. They hear perception, watch Espn and other sports networks and even see the memes on social media. Hell, Prince posted a meme about him on his Snapchat and when I asked him about it, he said someone else made it of them. It's clear to see that this program's stability is slipping and if a new coach were to come in, it'd be possible for all the former recruits of the old regime to get forgotten if they're not the star player. 

Let's not attribute this to a whole "He wasn't going to make it anyways so he transferred." Because that's rarely the case. 

My only assumption about him not getting red shirted earlier was that players like Shwartz/Shivers ended up moving into the roles they originally had Asa projected in. But once again, I admit the coaches screwed up big time. It's 100% on them and it's a crappy position for Asa to be mismanaged in that way. But after the red shirt debacle, I won't fault the coaches for not playing him more if they felt others were performing better in the role he would've been in.

18 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Except nothing about this story suggests that he wasn't outplayed at the position. It's clear that the coaches preferred other players regardless of Martin's eligibility status. Nothing about the Martin family's version of the story disputes that. 

It's a monumental eff up by our staff and it was kind of the Martin family to not name the coach still on our staff who was responsible for it. And I'm not sure there's any reason to think that they approached the media about this. It's much more likely in my mind that the media approached them and they only answered questions honestly.

I know you're not one of the blind Gus apologists around here, so hopefully I'm not coming across as belligerent at all. But I don't think you can come up with a version of this story that exculpates our current staff without projecting dishonesty or some other negative agenda on Martin and his family. And I'm not comfortable with that, at least until the staff offers their own, contradictory version. 

No no, I definitely don't want to come across as defending the staff's screw up. That's 100% on them and they honestly need to just say "Yes, we screwed that up and we apologize to the Martin's for letting them down." I'm only defending the coaches for their decision to not play Asa after that if others were doing better. Don't play a guy just because he burned a red shirt if he's not the best person to put on the field. Maybe there could've been a role for him (I totally typed me here originally! LOL) on the offense, but we'll never know now.

But I do think, if he found himself sitting that far down the depth chart, that this was an easy way to announce his decision to transfer. If I recall his announcement, he didn't sound salty about it (like say Kelly Bryant - LOL) so he might have been considering it anyway.

Regardless - we do all agree the coaches screwed him out of a season.

[Malcolm_FleX48 1,869]

1 minute ago, Linayus said:

I won't fault the coaches for not playing him more if they felt others were performing better in the role he would've been in.

The only issue is that this can be completely subjective. It's not uncommon for coaches to chase an idea and make decisions off of that idea rather than what they've got.

They've got a puzzle box that shows a picture of a train on it, but they want to make it look like a plane instead. Unfortunately, those aren't the pieces they have but they try to force those pieces into the wrong spots ending up with something that doesn't resemble a train or a plane and is barely aesthetic when they could've just put the pieces they had into the right spot. 

I've no doubt their original idea was a 2-back committee system with Whitlow being the Kerryon/Peyton Hybrid that could do most of the heavier runs with a bit of extra burst and bring in Martin for a Speedy slasher switch-up and then have Shivers be their gadget guy. 

Now, what's to say Asa couldn't have been that slasher role while also running the inside zone plays and catching out the backfield and lining up out wide... But because the coaches had an idea set and wanted to commit to that idea, they decided to keep forcing pieces that don't fit. Their only argument against this would be "They'd want to keep more legs fresh without taxing one back."

College is going the way of the 2-back system and the single-workhorse back is becoming rarer and it's largely because it's hard to find and chasing that idea can lead a team to ruin with the rest of the backfield under-utilized and fraught with undeveloped backs.  

[NorthGATiger 1,801]

18 minutes ago, Linayus said:

My only assumption about him not getting red shirted earlier was that players like Shwartz/Shivers ended up moving into the roles they originally had Asa projected in. But once again, I admit the coaches screwed up big time. It's 100% on them and it's a crappy position for Asa to be mismanaged in that way. But after the red shirt debacle, I won't fault the coaches for not playing him more if they felt others were performing better in the role he would've been in.

No no, I definitely don't want to come across as defending the staff's screw up. That's 100% on them and they honestly need to just say "Yes, we screwed that up and we apologize to the Martin's for letting them down." I'm only defending the coaches for their decision to not play Asa after that if others were doing better. Don't play a guy just because he burned a red shirt if he's not the best person to put on the field. Maybe there could've been a role for him (I totally typed me here originally! LOL) on the offense, but we'll never know now.

But I do think, if he found himself sitting that far down the depth chart, that this was an easy way to announce his decision to transfer. If I recall his announcement, he didn't sound salty about it (like say Kelly Bryant - LOL) so he might have been considering it anyway.

Regardless - we do all agree the coaches screwed him out of a season.

Schwartz does not play the same position.  What depth chart is Asa looking at that he does not think he can overcome?  You have Shivers and Whitlow as starters who earned it and Miller who has not seen any playing time hardly since he arrived.  I highly doubt Asa saw himself too far down the depth chart.  I think the biggest issue is when Boobee had an injury and there were situations where a bigger RB was needed they never attempted to use Asa.  Fans on here were wondering why he wasn't being used and the answer was that they were redshirting him.  At the time it made sense.  Then they screwed up the redshirt and still didn't use him.  You gotta let big dogs eat.  

[JMassie11 1,610]

1 hour ago, Linayus said:

Okay.. let me just throw this out there and be devil's advocate (if someone hasn't already - I'm not reading through 20 pages):

I get it. Coaches/Staff screwed up and you "wasted" a season. But did you really? He was what, 4th or even 5th on our depth chart? Was he really going to factor into our offense when you had other freshmen contributing more and who would likely continue that for the next 3 years? Maybe he decided he could use this as an excuse to leave the program without sounding like he was just outplayed at the position and wanted to go somewhere he could play ASAP, which I totally do not fault him for.

Parents are protective of their kids, so I get their frustration, especially the way it sounds like the staff didn't own up to their mistake. But I won't criticize the coaches if they felt like Asa didn't add enough to the offense to actually see the field more once they realized the red shirt was gone.

All that aside, I wish nothing but the best for Asa. There are a lot of offenses out there that will be able to utilize him more than ours. He'll be fine.

Exactly....I was just very blunt in my statement but was told I was “crying” tired of participation trophy generation 

[Linayus 676]

6 minutes ago, NorthGATiger said:

Schwartz does not play the same position.  What depth chart is Asa looking at that he does not think he can overcome?  You have Shivers and Whitlow as starters who earned it and Miller who has not seen any playing time hardly since he arrived.  I highly doubt Asa saw himself too far down the depth chart.  I think the biggest issue is when Boobee had an injury and there were situations where a bigger RB was needed they never attempted to use Asa.  Fans on here were wondering why he wasn't being used and the answer was that they were redshirting him.  At the time it made sense.  Then they screwed up the redshirt and still didn't use him.  You gotta let big dogs eat.  

Whitlow, Shivers, KMart, Miller, Joiner.. they could all be ahead of Asa and all are returning next year. We can only speculate on talent since we don't get to see them much or at all sometimes. lol But he knows who is getting the reps in practice so that might be an indicator of where he sees himself in the rotation.