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NorthGATiger

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13 minutes ago, NorthGATiger said:

My main point of even posting this is that we sure are generous with our money allowing Gus to pay an OC salary to someone he does not allow to be an OC.  Furthermore if he has also removed all decisions on personnel playing in games from all Offensive coaches then we have an extremely high paid head coach with a pretty highly paid staff who is not allowed to carry out many functions of their jobs that they are being paid for.

What makes you think that? I can see the HC/OC making the call on QB. The rest should kind of follow a script, "if we're going to run such and such a play or series, then these players need to be in there. That would be handled in practice.

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4 minutes ago, Mikey said:

"if we're going to run such and such a play or series, then these players need to be in there.

That would make our O really easy to defend...oh wait

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9 minutes ago, Mikey said:

What makes you think that? I can see the HC/OC making the call on QB. The rest should kind of follow a script, "if we're going to run such and such a play or series, then these players need to be in there. That would be handled in practice.

That's already one of the main problems with this freaking offense, and why everyone including my 80 yr old Aunt Gladis knows exactly what the hell we're running in every offensive series.  :banghead:

 

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1 minute ago, bigbird said:

That would make our O really easy to defend...oh wait

The offense has been very good by historical standards. I'm more concerned by a defense that couldn't hold a ten point second half lead against LSU and allowed a limp Tennessee offense to score 30 points.

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2 minutes ago, Mikey said:

The offense has been very good by historical standards. I'm more concerned by a defense that couldn't hold a ten point second half lead against LSU and allowed a limp Tennessee offense to score 30 points.

You would.

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1 minute ago, keesler said:

That's already one of the main problems with this freaking offense, and why everyone including my 80 yr ole Aunt Gladis knows exactly what the hell we're running in every offensive series.  :banghead:

 

I agree that we are very predictable, but really most teams are. UGA and LSU aren’t running complicated plays or schemes, but if you run what you run with better talent than you’re lined up across, it usually works. Gus’s plays worked against UAT and UGA last year because of Kerryon and a competent line. 

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3 minutes ago, Gowebb11 said:

I agree that we are very predictable, but really most teams are. UGA and LSU aren’t running complicated plays or schemes, but if you run what you run with better talent than you’re lined up across, it usually works. Gus’s plays worked against UAT and UGA last year because of Kerryon and a competent line. 

There's a difference though.  If you run 30 plays with the same personnel, then you don't know which of those 30 will be run.  If you substitute and have personnel packages for specific plays, then you can easily determine what play is coming.

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23 minutes ago, Mikey said:

What makes you think that? I can see the HC/OC making the call on QB. The rest should kind of follow a script, "if we're going to run such and such a play or series, then these players need to be in there. That would be handled in practice.

 

14 minutes ago, Mikey said:

The offense has been very good by historical standards. I'm more concerned by a defense that couldn't hold a ten point second half lead against LSU and allowed a limp Tennessee offense to score 30 points.

O

M

G

We are in the presence of Gus himself.  He goes by "Mikey"!!!!

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32 minutes ago, AUsince72 said:

O

M

G

We are in the presence of Gus himself.  He goes by "Mikey"!!!!

He's just become a straight up contrarian troll. He says all this weird stuff defending Gus to provoke a response, and then when he gets the desired response he complains that every thread is full of whiners and crybabies. 

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1 hour ago, Mikey said:

What makes you think that? I can see the HC/OC making the call on QB. The rest should kind of follow a script, "if we're going to run such and such a play or series, then these players need to be in there. That would be handled in practice.

This has been reported numerous times behind pay walls that this year the offensive staff had absolutely no input on who played and Gus micromanaged it like a beast.  Understanding this makes the Asa Martin debacle crystal clear to understand now.

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16 minutes ago, NorthGATiger said:

This has been reported numerous times behind pay walls that this year the offensive staff had absolutely no input on who played and Gus micromanaged it like a beast.  Understanding this makes the Asa Martin debacle crystal clear to understand now.

What’s a paywall???

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11 minutes ago, PoetTiger said:

What’s a paywall???

An Auburn site that requires a paid subscription.

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1 hour ago, Mikey said:

The offense has been very good by historical standards. I'm more concerned by a defense that couldn't hold a ten point second half lead against LSU and allowed a limp Tennessee offense to score 30 points.

Can you just agree that both the defense AND the offense have came up short of expectations last year?

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29 minutes ago, DAG said:

Can you just agree that both the defense AND the offense have came up short of expectations last year?

Sure. Both should have been better. But putting a knock on the offensive philosophy that has produced the best offenses in Auburn football history is what people are trying to do, and they are wrong. Check StatTiger's thread after the '17 season in which he discusses our offense with Coach Malzahn involved. As always, StatTiger uses facts, not opinion in his findings.

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4 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Sure. Both should have been better. But putting a knock on the offensive philosophy that has produced the best offenses in Auburn football history is what people are trying to do, and they are wrong. Check StatTiger's thread after the '17 season in which he discusses our offense with Coach Malzahn involved. As always, StatTiger uses facts, not opinion in his findings.

I do enjoy Stat’s info . Maybe Gus finally taking back over is what this offense needs. My only concern is can he handle being a full time OC and HC. It seems once that occurred Gus started getting tunnel vision. If he just had to worry about being OC I wouldn’t be near as worried.

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Just now, DAG said:

I do enjoy Stat’s info . Maybe Gus finally taking back over is what this offense needs. My only concern is can he handle being a full time OC and HC. It seems once that occurred Gus started getting tunnel vision. If he just had to worry about being OC I wouldn’t be near as worried.

We'll see. I don't think he ever should have got himself talked into hiring a "real" OC. Lots of other head coaches call their own plays and basically run the offense. Let's have Coach Malzahn do that too. Then if he succeeds, great and if he fails, time to go in another direction.

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1 hour ago, Mikey said:

Sure. Both should have been better. But putting a knock on the offensive philosophy that has produced the best offenses in Auburn football history is what people are trying to do, and they are wrong. Check StatTiger's thread after the '17 season in which he discusses our offense with Coach Malzahn involved. As always, StatTiger uses facts, not opinion in his findings.

Auburn football history has AU winning +/- 8 games/yr, and Gus has successfully kept the program on the same historical pattern while, producing the best offenses in Auburn football history. 

This is 2018-2019, is our historical pattern good enough in the current SEC environment?  Are people (AU Admin/PTB/BOT/fans) satisfied with Auburn football remaining the same as it's always been?  

I say AU pays salaries that should result in a substantial up tick in the trajectory and evolve out of our historical pattern, but that's JMHO.  

 

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4 hours ago, bigbird said:

There's a difference though.  If you run 30 plays with the same personnel, then you don't know which of those 30 will be run.  If you substitute and have personnel packages for specific plays, then you can easily determine what play is coming.

That's probably true but from watching NFL on occasion, there are hardly two consecutive offensive plays that have the same personnel on the field......so seems that if the offense can execute properly, this is not a big issue.    Now if you have only one play for each "package" or player grouping that's a problem . 

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2 hours ago, Mikey said:

We'll see. I don't think he ever should have got himself talked into hiring a "real" OC. Lots of other head coaches call their own plays and basically run the offense. Let's have Coach Malzahn do that too. Then if he succeeds, great and if he fails, time to go in another direction.

Talked into?  WTH?  He wasn't talked into anything, he was forced to push Lashlee out. 

Just like he was forced take himself completely out of all operations and management of the defense.  Gus didn't want Mushchamp (a former SEC HC with a strong personality) coming in but WM was pursued and hired by the PTB >>>> Thank God!   Left to his own devices can you imagine what our D would look like?  Well....probably just like the offense is right now with a weak and ineffective line, and sub-par SEC caliber skill players behind that line.

I do agree that FINALLY Gus will sink or swim on his own merits, the excuse bag mercifully emptied out after the UCF bowl loss.  This season was reflective of exactly where his program is situated and now we find Gus is once again in a position to "turn this thing around" after HE twisted it all out of shape and put it where it is now.

 

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3 minutes ago, keesler said:

Talked into?  WTH?  He wasn't talked into anything, he was forced to push Lashlee out. 

Just like he was forced take himself completely out of all operations and management of the defense.  Gus didn't want Mushchamp (a former SEC HC with a strong personality) coming in but WM was pursued and hired by the PTB >>>> Thank God!   Left to his own devices can you imagine what our D would look like?  Well....probably just like the offense is right now with a weak and ineffective line, and sub-par SEC caliber skill players behind that line.

I do agree that FINALLY Gus will sink or swim on his own merits, the excuse bag mercifully emptied out after the UCF bowl loss.  This season was reflective of exactly where his program is situated and now we find Gus is once again in a position to "turn this thing around" after HE twisted it all out of shape and put it where it is now.

 

I think that is one of the major problems at Auburn. Too many hands in the cookie jar. I get boosters have influence every where, but this idea that people are forcing someone’s hand is problematic.

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5 minutes ago, DAG said:

I think that is one of the major problems at Auburn. Too many hands in the cookie jar. I get boosters have influence every where, but this idea that people are forcing someone’s hand is problematic.

It's good and evil - a two edged sword.  Thank goodness Jay Jacobs & others forced their hand and made steps (hired Muschamp) to improve this AU defense, because Gus had no clue what the hell he was doing all the way from talent evaluation to placing a priority on defensive recruiting - NO CLUE.

Gus had few coaching connections when he was hired and a huge question mark in AU bringing him in was whether or not he'd be able to assemble an SEC level staff because he wanted to bring the majority of his Arky State staff with him. He wanted Casey Woods over DCraig, Woods still came with him in an off-field position.  It was suggested to Gus to bring in Craig, hence the tension between him and Gus.  Travis Williams was an unknown to Gus, it was suggested to bring him on staff as well.  Gus wanted Arky States DC on staff, and that obviously wasn't permitted. 

Muschamp was a power move by Jacobs, Gus' ego did NOT want him on staff because he could easily overshadow him and because WM called out Gus' operational and talent evaluation deficiencies relative to recruiting almost the instant he got in town.  Muschamp was shocked at the way Gus conducted and planned practices for his players - shocked.

Gus brought in his totally under-qualified "son" with him as OC and it took the AD & others putting Gus cahones in a garlic press for what seemed eternity to get him to make a switch that was basically forced on him as well.

Gus has indeed been "meddled with", but Lawd has it been necessary.

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16 minutes ago, keesler said:

Gus had few coaching connections when he was hired

This is really important to keep in mind. It's not like they're meddling with a guy who has 20 years in the business.

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20 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

This is really important to keep in mind. It's not like they're meddling with a guy who has 20 years in the business.

Yep!

This is also a reason why Ellis Johnson & Cheese Harbison were brought on board and of course let's not forget Lance Thompson - Gus needed experienced coaches on defense and the recruiting front as well.  Extrapolate that on out to Kevin Steele.......'Cause high school ain't college and Arkansas State dang sure ain't Auburn.

 

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1 hour ago, AU64 said:

That's probably true but from watching NFL on occasion, there are hardly two consecutive offensive plays that have the same personnel on the field......so seems that if the offense can execute properly, this is not a big issue.    Now if you have only one play for each "package" or player grouping that's a problem . 

Most of those substitutions are receivers rotating in and out keeping them fresh.  All of the players can run all of the plays. You don't see personnel packages based on plays. That would be simplistic and ridiculous

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