Do we have a 5* Curse?

[McLoofus 35,182]

2 minutes ago, keesler said:

No one at Auburn has the desire in any way, shape or form to operate like Saban/uat.  Auburn prides itself on being a cut above in moral character, and as long as our HC continues to represent Auburn in an exemplary fashion and does things the right way, he will remain the coach of the future.  Saban has a win at all cost mentality, Malzhan does not.  

Now, I dare anyone to tell me I'm lying!

Love ya, Kees, but you're lying.

saban's mental acuity for managing and motivating his roster is what sets him apart even more than whatever assistance he receives from the REC, and it has nothing to do with moral shortcomings. Furthermore, saban is constantly evolving and looking for new ways of doing things. He seeks ideas from anywhere he can get them. He's curious. Again, this is not a moral failing. That quality is what makes him the best coach in the country- or maybe 2nd best after a 10+ year reign- and the lack of that quality is why Gus hasn't gotten any better at his job since the day he got here. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

Just now, tigerbrotha12 said:

Duke was pretty good while he was at Auburn. I don't know, yeah we have some issues but its not like every 5 star that comes here is destined for failure.

Nope, but the percentage of success stories needs to be higher. 

I mentioned before, but 58% of all 5* recruits get drafted. Since that is an average, that means that there are teams for whom over 58% of their 5* recruits get drafted. Fewer than 50% of all of Auburn's 5* recruits even finish their careers at Auburn.  We need to do better. 

[tigerbrotha12 2,362]

2 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Nope, but the percentage of success stories needs to be higher. 

I mentioned before, but 58% of all 5* recruits get drafted. Since that is an average, that means that there are teams for whom over 58% of their 5* recruits get drafted. Fewer than 50% of all of Auburn's 5* recruits even finish their careers at Auburn.  We need to do better. 

I guess but look at what we've produced from the guys who were not 4 or 5 stars. 

 

Dee Ford was a 3 star and just made a pro bowl.

Nick Marshall was a 3 star and did nothing but win an SEC Championship and take us to a natty, then play in the NFL.

Sammie Coates was a 3 star and has played a number of years in the NFL. 

Deshaun Davis was another 3 star that just played in a senior bowl and probably will make an NFL Roster.

Kamryn Pettway - 3 star that led the SEC in rushing one season. 

 

Maybe we're not cranking out these 5 stars but we're turning some of these lower ranked guys into stars. 

In regards to solely the 5 stars though, you do have a point.

 

[McLoofus 35,182]

4 minutes ago, tigerbrotha12 said:

Maybe we're not cranking out these 5 stars but we're turning some of these lower ranked guys into stars. 

Absolutely! And I give our staff tons of credit every recruiting cycle for getting on the Jauntavious (sp?) Johnsons early. Deshaun Davis was a man crush of mine from before he actually sent in his fax. But we're not turning many of either into first or second round draft picks, and we're not turning any of it into truly successful seasons the last 5 years. 

We need elite players to perform at an elite level if we're going to win championships. 

[Tiger Refuge 6,660]

Just a quick count on 247 shows our main, cross state rival signed 52 composite 5 star recruits in that same time frame....so, yeah.

[GwillMac6 20,607]

When Bowl Cut and WEE man are bringing in former great NFL and college head coaches to these coaching clinics every year this is who gus brings to his coaching clinics. THE MAN has no great mentors who he learned under. He made his bones under Houston Nutt, Todd Graham and Gene Chizik in the college game. LOL. No wonder we are in this mess now. 

 

[McLoofus 35,182]

9 minutes ago, GwillMac6 said:

When Bowl Cut and WEE men are bringing in former great NFL and college head coaches to these coaching clinics every year this is who gus brings to his coaching clinics. THE MAN has no great mentors who he learned under. He made his bones under Houston Nutt, Todd Graham and Gene Chizik in the college game. LOL. No wonder we are in this mess now. 

This is exactly what I thought about when you showed the quote from Bill B. regarding bowl cut. That dude is bringing in the greatest NFL coach in history. And if he was already retired, he'd be bringing in the greatest CFB coach in history, because he worked for him.

William and Mary??? FFS!!!!

 

[GwillMac6 20,607]

9 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

This is exactly what I thought about when you showed the quote from Bill B. regarding bowl cut. That dude is bringing in the greatest NFL coach in history. And if he was already retired, he'd be bringing in the greatest CFB coach in history, because he worked for him.

William and Mary??? FFS!!!!

 

YAH William and Mary BABY!!!! That will get these up and coming coaches fired up and want to come to these things!!! lol

[McLoofus 35,182]

7 minutes ago, GwillMac6 said:

YAH William and Mary BABY!!!! That will get these up and coming coaches fired up and want to come to these things!!! lol

Not to mention that drip the recruits will be feeling when they hear about it. 

[GwillMac6 20,607]

8 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Not to mention that drip the recruits will be feeling when they hear about it. 

 

[AUwent 3,747]

13 hours ago, GwillMac6 said:

Is Gus still the coach? Well there is your answer. I will go to my grave thinking Jimbo choked on purpose vs us in the 4th so Gus could keep his job. I know as ridiculous as that sounds I really do believe it. It seriously looked like he was trying to throw the game with his 4th quarter playcalling. The worst playcalling I have ever seen.

You think Kirby and Nick threw the 2017 DSOR and IB for the same reason?

[GwillMac6 20,607]

33 minutes ago, AUwent said:

You think Kirby and Nick threw the 2017 DSOR and IB for the same reason?

hahahah no. We just whooped their asses those games. 

[keesler 5,923]

2 hours ago, McLoofus said:

Love ya, Kees, but you're lying.

saban's mental acuity for managing and motivating his roster is what sets him apart even more than whatever assistance he receives from the REC, and it has nothing to do with moral shortcomings. Furthermore, saban is constantly evolving and looking for new ways of doing things. He seeks ideas from anywhere he can get them. He's curious. Again, this is not a moral failing. That quality is what makes him the best coach in the country- or maybe 2nd best after a 10+ year reign- and the lack of that quality is why Gus hasn't gotten any better at his job since the day he got here. 

I love you too 'Loof!

I meant for anyone to tell me I was lying about the mentality of the Auburn people relative to the comparison made btween CGM & CNS......We have a serious group of passionate fans/alum/supporters that place tremendous value behind a HC with high character and the exact same folks diminish anything and everything that NS does.  Yet comparison's are still made between the two relative to their coaching/recruiting/operations, etc.

I know full well NS's management and operation style as well as his ability to evaluate every aspect of this program, seek input from others, and his willingness to evolve an change if he feels it will benefit his program.

(I failed to insert the  in my post - My Bad!)

[keesler 5,923]

1 hour ago, GwillMac6 said:

When Bowl Cut and WEE man are bringing in former great NFL and college head coaches to these coaching clinics every year this is who gus brings to his coaching clinics. THE MAN has no great mentors who he learned under. He made his bones under Houston Nutt, Todd Graham and Gene Chizik in the college game. LOL. No wonder we are in this mess now. 

 

Hold up - Larry Kehres (?) has 11 Division 3 NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS!  While Kirb's/Nicky could only muster some old coach with 7 Super Bowl rings & 3 AFC Title rings.

Who's getting the upper hand now?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Tiger Refuge 6,660]

2 hours ago, GwillMac6 said:

When Bowl Cut and WEE man are bringing in former great NFL and college head coaches to these coaching clinics every year this is who gus brings to his coaching clinics. THE MAN has no great mentors who he learned under. He made his bones under Houston Nutt, Todd Graham and Gene Chizik in the college game. LOL. No wonder we are in this mess now. 

 

William and Mary OC!? Well, by all means...

[McLoofus 35,182]

1 hour ago, keesler said:

(I failed to insert the  in my post - My Bad!)

No way man, that's on me! I should have been able to tell. I was triggered by some silly posts from others and wasn't thinking clearly, lol. 

[AUght2win 6,816]

4 hours ago, tigerbrotha12 said:

I guess but look at what we've produced from the guys who were not 4 or 5 stars. 

 

Dee Ford was a 3 star and just made a pro bowl.

Nick Marshall was a 3 star and did nothing but win an SEC Championship and take us to a natty, then play in the NFL.

Sammie Coates was a 3 star and has played a number of years in the NFL. 

Deshaun Davis was another 3 star that just played in a senior bowl and probably will make an NFL Roster.

Kamryn Pettway - 3 star that led the SEC in rushing one season. 

 

Maybe we're not cranking out these 5 stars but we're turning some of these lower ranked guys into stars. 

In regards to solely the 5 stars though, you do have a point.

 

This thread is not about 3 stars or Auburn developing its players. It's simply about how we have an inordinate amount of 5 star busts. Stay on target.

[keesler 5,923]

1 hour ago, Tiger Refuge said:

William and Mary OC!? 

I'll give you something to tame down that raucous dancin.

In 2017 uat brought in the following coaches to their Clinic.....  Falcon's HC (Dan Quinn), Texan's HC (Bill O'Brian), Duke HC (David Cutcliffe), Navy HC (Ken Niumatalolo), Vikings OC & former Miami HC (Tony Sparano)

In 2018 uat brought in ..... 2 SuperBowl winning HC's Eagle's HC (Doug Pederson), Packers HC (Mike McCarthy), WV HC (Dana Holgersen), Temple HC (Geoff Collins), Troy HC (Neal Brown)

In 2018 uga brought in .....  Patriots HC (Bill Belichik), Falcon's HC (Dan Quinn), LA Rams HC (Sean McVay) 

This is just for the "Coaching Clinics", it in no way includes NFL Coaches that "drop by" during Pro Day, or some random ass piddly little "Camp" those guys hold all the time.  

 

[AUght2win 6,816]

4 hours ago, McLoofus said:

Love ya, Kees, but you're lying.

saban's mental acuity for managing and motivating his roster is what sets him apart even more than whatever assistance he receives from the REC, and it has nothing to do with moral shortcomings. Furthermore, saban is constantly evolving and looking for new ways of doing things. He seeks ideas from anywhere he can get them. He's curious. Again, this is not a moral failing. That quality is what makes him the best coach in the country- or maybe 2nd best after a 10+ year reign- and the lack of that quality is why Gus hasn't gotten any better at his job since the day he got here. 

You need to check out Saban's history man. This nonsense about how he vets players and won't let his assistants watch film until they know their character is pure BS.

Look at Jon Taylor, a serial woman beater that Saban brought on campus from UGA. He was cut shortly after arriving for, ya guessed it, assaulting a woman. In the aftermath Saban claimed he did due diligence on Taylor's background and thought he deserved a second chance. Yet Mark Richt said Saban never even called him. Saban has also overseen a lot of guys who had major run ins with the law, like Reuben Foster, Rolando McClain, Hootie Jones, and Cam Robinson. Saban usually does nothing for punishment, citing that he "won't punish the team" for the players' mistakes. Hell, Courtney Upshaw was arrested for knocking his girlfriend around and never missed a day of PRACTICE. 

Don't cite Saban as a source of psychological prowess and discipline. He is just a guy who sweeps everything under the rug and will do anything to win. If Jovon Robinson, Duke Williams, Michael Dyer, or Sean White were at Alabama, they would never have missed a down. And their issues likely would have never even been made public.

[Tiger Refuge 6,660]

11 minutes ago, keesler said:

I'll give you something to tame down that raucous dancin.

In 2017 uat brought in the following coaches to their Clinic.....  Falcon's HC (Dan Quinn), Texan's HC (Bill O'Brian), Duke HC (David Cutcliffe), Navy HC (Ken Niumatalolo), Vikings OC & former Miami HC (Tony Sparano)

In 2018 uat brought in ..... 2 SuperBowl winning HC's Eagle's HC (Doug Pederson), Packers HC (Mike McCarthy), WV HC (Dana Holgersen), Temple HC (Geoff Collins), Troy HC (Neal Brown)

In 2018 uga brought in .....  Patriots HC (Bill Belichik), Falcon's HC (Dan Quinn), LA Rams HC (Sean McVay) 

This is just for the "Coaching Clinics", it in no way includes NFL Coaches that "drop by" during Pro Day, or some random ass piddly little "Camp" those guys hold all the time.  

 

I got a D 3 though...so you can’t stop me

from turning up the dance heat.

[McLoofus 35,182]

48 minutes ago, AUght2win said:

You need to check out Saban's history man. This nonsense about how he vets players and won't let his assistants watch film until they know their character is pure BS.

Look at Jon Taylor, a serial woman beater that Saban brought on campus from UGA. He was cut shortly after arriving for, ya guessed it, assaulting a woman. In the aftermath Saban claimed he did due diligence on Taylor's background and thought he deserved a second chance. Yet Mark Richt said Saban never even called him. Saban has also overseen a lot of guys who had major run ins with the law, like Reuben Foster, Rolando McClain, Hootie Jones, and Cam Robinson. Saban usually does nothing for punishment, citing that he "won't punish the team" for the players' mistakes. Hell, Courtney Upshaw was arrested for knocking his girlfriend around and never missed a day of PRACTICE. 

Don't cite Saban as a source of psychological prowess and discipline. He is just a guy who sweeps everything under the rug and will do anything to win. If Jovon Robinson, Duke Williams, Michael Dyer, or Sean White were at Alabama, they would never have missed a down. And their issues likely would have never even been made public.

I didn't say discipline.

However, there are different types of discipline and it is foolish to try to explain his success at bama without including the insane amount of discipline required to have all those players bought in, focused and prepared every single week. 

Oh, and I'm not sure anyone said he does character evals. They said he does personality evals. Hard to argue that he doesn't fill his locker room with guys who have the mental makeup to get on board with his system and win football games.

[AUght2win 6,816]

44 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I didn't say discipline.

However, there are different types of discipline and it is foolish to try to explain his success at bama without including the insane amount of discipline required to have all those players bought in, focused and prepared every single week. 

Oh, and I'm not sure anyone said he does character evals. They said he does personality evals. Hard to argue that he doesn't fill his locker room with guys who have the mental makeup to get on board with his system and win football games.

It's a minor league NFL team. The only thing the guys in that locker room care about is the next level. Saban does a good job of keeping them laser focused. But most of those kids go there self-motivated and hanging on Nick's every word because they know he can get them to the league. I bet our recruits aren't so sure about this staff's ability to get them to the NFL.

[AUwent 3,747]

3 hours ago, AUght2win said:

It's a minor league NFL team. The only thing the guys in that locker room care about is the next level. Saban does a good job of keeping them laser focused. But most of those kids go there self-motivated and hanging on Nick's every word because they know he can get them to the league. I bet our recruits aren't so sure about this staff's ability to get them to the NFL.

“He was always going to be a project!”—said about some highly touted recruit who disappoints. Buck stops with headman, and I’m just ready to see him gone.

[keesler 5,923]

3 hours ago, AUght2win said:

It's a minor league NFL team. The only thing the guys in that locker room care about is the next level. Saban does a good job of keeping them laser focused. But most of those kids go there self-motivated and hanging on Nick's every word because they know he can get them to the league. I bet our recruits aren't so sure about this staff's ability to get them to the NFL.

It can’t hurt to have seasoned, professional NFL Head Coaches and the likes of Kobe Bryant providing words of wisdom to the young guys.  

[cole256 17,039]

Don't know about that but I do know as a fan base we don't reallylike 5 stars, but we have so much pride on under dogs. They are the favorites and can play mediocre but we build them up to be top dogs. 5 star guy don't become an all time great but could still play decent......we are all over him.  That's who we pull for, then complain that we are average in the sport. 

I know it's not everybody, there are few things in the world that's absolute but that's what I notice, especially on the internet