More playmakers than 2010?

[AUFriction 1,179]

43 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Was it a "good" day for the defense? No, and I don't think anybody has said that. But that's a long way from pinning the loss on them.

3 plays, 6 yards, 1:07

3 plays, -3 yards, 0:57

4 plays, 9 yards, 1:13

Those were our first 3 offensive possessions. You can't do that to your defense. And then your best WR can't muff a punt right after a 3-and-out when your offense can't do anything. 

We only surrendered 6 points in the first half other than the touchdown after the muffed punt on which the guy didn't actually cross the goal line. 

Feel free to say that Steele and his group didn't have their best day but they would have won that game if the offense had bothered to participate. 

To add to your point, MSU only had 69 yards passing. We held their passing attack almost completely in check. It was by no means a stellar day for the defense, but keeping an opponent under 25 points and under 100 yards passing is hardly bad defense. That game was lost because we didn’t put the ball in the end zone once.

[WFE12 9,191]

We've seen it time and time again. Can't be like 2014 all over again...Here I go showing hope for the season...Oh boy. Better take advantage of the returning o-line and all this talent. Gonna be a completely different story next year.

[AU64 10,122]

1 hour ago, aujeff11 said:

Mississippi State had the top ranked scoring defense didn’t they? Turning the ball over and not being able to make stops in the second half ultimately gave us a loss. 

Your inclination to separate Kevin Steele’s guys and Malzahn’s guys shows how ate up you are. Just throwing out the obvious: Steele is Malzahn’s “guy” too. Despite your intentions you invite more scrutiny upon the defense when you pick sides and actively blame one side and deflect the blame from the other. 

thanks...guess some folks did not notice that MSU rushed for 350 yards had the ball 42 minutes of the game.....and UT game was almost the opposite...unable to stop the pass.   Just thinking that some things on the D side were hard to understand last year.  

[McLoofus 35,182]

10 minutes ago, AU64 said:

thanks...guess some folks did not notice that MSU rushed for 350 yards had the ball 42 minutes of the game.....and UT game was almost the opposite...unable to stop the pass.   Just thinking that some things on the D side were hard to understand last year.  

It's a shame that you still find these things hard to understand when they've been explained to you repeatedly. 

You and some you agree with are the ones who fail to notice the numbers that have been presented to you every time this game comes up. 

MSU held the ball for 42 minutes because we insisted on giving it to them immediately and repeatedly the entire first half of that game, save one drive. When holding onto the ball for ~1:00 before giving it back to them each time wasn't enough to gift them a touchdown, we finally opted not to possess the ball at all and just muffed the punt. This has been explained to you over and over again. You choose to ignore data because it doesn't confirm your opinion. 

Now, data doesn't explain everything about the MSU and UT games, but common sense does. Before those games, we had one of the top defenses and one of the worst offenses in the league and beyond. The first half of the MSU game offered the most extreme examples of both and the defense got sick of it. Nothing could be plainer to anybody not predisposed to displace blame and shift the negative spotlight away from our underperforming head coach. 

Unfortunately, your comments have once again had the opposite effect and shone the spotlight right back on our putrid offense last year and the man responsible for it. 

Edited April 15, 2019 by McLoofus

[McLoofus 35,182]

Again, the drive chart from that game. Any objective interpretation reveals one unit that came ready to play and another unit that didn't. Eventually, the latter unit gave in. 

http://www.espn.com/college-football/playbyplay?gameId=401012304

Also, regarding all those rushing yards. This is where a modicum of analytical thought comes in handy. If you're Kevin Steele and you're painfully aware that your offense is not going to score points that day, how aggressive are you going to be with your scheme? Are you maybe going to be conservative and keep everything in front of you and not give up the big play? And keep the other team out of the end zone? Because that's exactly what happened until 2 minutes left in the 4th quarter. (Of the 2 touchdowns awarded, only 1 was scored, and the other came on a goal line stand immediately after the muffed punt.)

I might bookmark this one for the next time you complain about every thread turning into "Gus bashing". It was you who wanted to discuss Gus's merits as an offensive coach. 

[aujeff11 6,243]

 

29 minutes ago, AU64 said:

thanks...guess some folks did not notice that MSU rushed for 350 yards had the ball 42 minutes of the game.....and UT game was almost the opposite...unable to stop the pass.   Just thinking that some things on the D side were hard to understand last year.  

It’s amazing that to call the loss a team loss is still hotly contested. 

Defense gives up 350 rushing yards 

Offense couldn’t score TDs

ST muffed a punt

 

But don’t dare call it a team loss.

Edited April 15, 2019 by aujeff11

[aujeff11 6,243]

21 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Also, regarding all those rushing yards. This is where a modicum of analytical thought comes in handy. If you're Kevin Steele and you're painfully aware that your offense is not going to score points that day, how aggressive are you going to be with your scheme? Are you maybe going to be conservative and keep everything in front of you and not give up the big play? 

Mississippi State had probably one of the worst vertical offenses in the conference, if not the nation. We weren’t worried about the pass at all. We simply couldn’t get off the field against a one dimensional offense.

 

And no offense, it makes no sense for our defense to give up as you’re implying over the offense’s inability to score. It was still a ballgame at halftime. It was still a ball game after the third quarter. The team still has to fight. Mississippi State’s offense wasn’t doing that well in the first half but their defense didn’t quit. Mississippi State’s offense scored one total TD between LSU, Bama,  Florida, and Kentucky, and the defense didn’t  call it quits for the season. 

Iowa beat Mississippi State with less than 200 yards of total offense. Their defense didn’t quit over the offense. It’s a team sport. Why are you not getting that simple concept?

 

Edited April 15, 2019 by aujeff11

[Win4AU 4,052]

MSU ran the same play over and over.  Auburn choose to defend against the RB keep instead of Fitz keep and he ate Auburn alive.  Deshaun got hurt in the first half and I think that further hurt the defense.  Offense a Td taken away and MSU has that bs TD right before half.  That game is when I knew Gus wasn’t “running” the offense because the running game was actually having some success but Auburn kept choosing to throw screens that were getting destroyed.  UT game was your typical 11am game.  All that’s rear view now though.

[StatTiger 3,188]

1 hour ago, AUFriction said:

To add to your point, MSU only had 69 yards passing. We held their passing attack almost completely in check. It was by no means a stellar day for the defense, but keeping an opponent under 25 points and under 100 yards passing is hardly bad defense. That game was lost because we didn’t put the ball in the end zone once.

It was Auburn's worst performance on run-defense under Kevin Steele and the sixth worst performance against the run by an Auburn defense from 1990-2018. Even Kevin Steele stated it was an unacceptable performance.

I stated earlier, the loss was a "team loss". The offense failed and so did the defense. If it makes someone feel better, I agree the offense played worse than the defense but it doesn't give the defense a pass for allowing 349 yards rushing to a team that could not throw the football.

Looking around the Southeastern Conference during the past three seasons, Auburn is No. 4 in holding conference opponents under 125-yards rushing. The Tigers have reached this goal 44.0 percent of the time, behind Alabama, Georgia and Mississippi State. Under Kevin Steele, the Auburn defense has made a significant improvement, compared to the 16.0 percent from 2013-2015 in conference play. It was a much-needed improvement, but his defense has yet to reach a preeminent level. Throughout the past three seasons, Auburn ranks No. 10 in the conference (16.0 percent), in the percentage of games they hold conference opponents under 300-yards in total offense. The Southeastern Conference average the past three seasons is 24 percent, with Alabama, Georgia, Mississippi State, and LSU coming in above 37 percent. For Auburn to reach a championship level on defense, the Tigers must reach at least 33 percent.

During the past 15 seasons, Auburn has fielded a top-25 run defense only three times, combining for a 36-3 record during those three seasons. During the past 15 seasons, Auburn has won only 36 percent of their games when allowing at least 170-yards rushing.

 

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,652]

3 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

Mississippi State had the top ranked scoring defense didn’t they? Turning the ball over and not being able to make stops in the second half ultimately gave us a loss. 

Your inclination to separate Kevin Steele’s guys and Malzahn’s guys shows how ate up you are. Just throwing out the obvious: Steele is Malzahn’s “guy” too. Despite your intentions you invite more scrutiny upon the defense when you pick sides and actively blame one side and deflect the blame from the other. 

they gave up 28 to Bama with Tua being on a bum ankle...we score 28 and we win without the 4th quarter theatrics

[aujeff11 6,243]

16 minutes ago, Dual-Threat Rigby said:

they gave up 28 to Bama with Tua being on a bum ankle...we score 28 and we win without the 4th quarter theatrics

You mean 24?

[McLoofus 35,182]

1 hour ago, StatTiger said:

I stated earlier, the loss was a "team loss". The offense failed and so did the defense. If it makes someone feel better, I agree the offense played worse than the defense but it doesn't give the defense a pass for allowing 349 yards rushing to a team that could not throw the football.

That's fine. What is ridiculous is going out of one's way to blame that loss primarily on the defense, as many continue to do. 

The defense didn't play their best but they played well enough to win and almost certainly could have kept the MSU offense to much less painful numbers had the offense even made an attempt to stay on the field. Even most of our "long" drives in terms of yardage barely used up any clock. 

 

[aujeff11 6,243]

1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

That's fine. What is ridiculous is going out of one's way to blame that loss primarily on the defense, as many continue to do. 

This post is rich given you literally called a punt returner that muffed the punt a “Gus guy” while objecting to the suggestion that the loss was a collective team loss. I’ve yet to see one poster put the loss primarily on the defense. We know which ax you’re grinding. 

[AUpreacherman22 3,884]

5 hours ago, StatTiger said:

Anytime a defense allows over 300 yards rushing, it should never be considered a good day on that side of the football. The MSU was no doubt, a team loss.

#truth

The entire team stunk on those two days and the entire team deserves their fair share of the blame.  The game plan on both sides of the ball was lacking, as well as the execution.  Coaches, O, D, and ST all missed the mark in those 2 games.  

[bigbird 60,460]

1 hour ago, AUpreacherman22 said:

#truth

The entire team stunk on those two days and the entire team deserves their fair share of the blame.  The game plan on both sides of the ball was lacking, as well as the execution.  Coaches, O, D, and ST all missed the mark in those 2 games.  

For two of the three that game was an outlier.

[McLoofus 35,182]

23 minutes ago, bigbird said:

For two of the three that game was an outlier.

Not to mention the only major mistake on special teams I can remember went right through the hands of our best wide receiver.

[BigWhiskey91 632]

5 hours ago, McLoofus said:

Not to mention the only major mistake on special teams I can remember went right through the hands of our best wide receiver.

Not that it was a major mistake, but the missed 50yd fg didn’t do anyone any favors. 

[BigWhiskey91 632]

8 hours ago, McLoofus said:

The defense didn't play their best but they played well enough to win and almost certainly could have kept the MSU offense to much less painful numbers had the offense even made an attempt to stay on the field. Even most of our "long" drives in terms of yardage barely used up any clock. 

 

It’s all about timing. The fumble before the end of the first half was crucial. Gave State a short field and they were able to max out and score a TD before half. Then the come out in the second half with a long drive and a FG. Auburn’s first 3 possessions in the second half totaled 177yds and should’ve been 13pts. The Whitlow fumble was crushing. Game would’ve been tied at that point.

State responded by putting together two drives totaling 131yds, one ending in a missed fg and the last ending with a TD and 7 min off the clock. 

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,652]

11 hours ago, aujeff11 said:

You mean 24?

Thought it was 28, but yeah. The fact that a hurt Tua could put up 24 but we couldn’t put up 10 is

[McLoofus 35,182]

6 hours ago, BigWhiskey91 said:

Not that it was a major mistake, but the missed 50yd fg didn’t do anyone any favors. 

No, it wasn't a major mistake, and it was Gus's decision to keep trotting our rookie kicker out for 50+ yd attempts the first half of the season because his offense couldn't move the ball.

[McLoofus 35,182]

6 hours ago, BigWhiskey91 said:

It’s all about timing. The fumble before the end of the first half was crucial. Gave State a short field and they were able to max out and score a TD before half. Then the come out in the second half with a long drive and a FG. Auburn’s first 3 possessions in the second half totaled 177yds and should’ve been 13pts. The Whitlow fumble was crushing. Game would’ve been tied at that point.

State responded by putting together two drives totaling 131yds, one ending in a missed fg and the last ending with a TD and 7 min off the clock. 

Timing, exactly. Auburn's first 3 drives of the 2nd half also averaged less than 2 minutes each. Even when the offense participated they didn't give the defense much of a break. Contrast that against Tuberville not letting Steve Spurrier have the ball for an entire 3rd quarter one time. 

Yeah, MSU had a good drive out of the half. We still kept them out of the end zone. By the time they iced the game our guys had been on the field way too long. 

If the offense had gotten off the bus our defense would had a good outing minus an unusual number of rushing yards.

One thing that's funny is that Ellis Johnson's defense is universally blamed for the losses in 2014, except for the DSOR. Nobody ever says that offense should have just scored even more every week.

[BigWhiskey91 632]

20 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

No, it wasn't a major mistake, and it was Gus's decision to keep trotting our rookie kicker out for 50+ yd attempts the first half of the season because his offense couldn't move the ball.

It was a 50yd fg, and prior he had just made a 47yd fg. He was a redshirt freshman and had hit from further away. Yes, field goals are attempted when the offense runs out of downs to move the ball. Be careful, if you keep grinding your axe, eventually you’ll run out of material.

[aujeff11 6,243]

21 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

No, it wasn't a major mistake, and it was Gus's decision to keep trotting our rookie kicker out for 50+ yd attempts the first half of the season because his offense couldn't move the ball.

He was a redshirt freshman last year that played as good as we could hope for.

 

Admit it. It made you mad when Anders hit that 53 yard FG against Liberty.. You had it up to here with Gus that day didn’t you? 

[BigWhiskey91 632]

11 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Timing, exactly. Auburn's first 3 drives of the 2nd half also averaged less than 2 minutes each. Even when the offense participated they didn't give the defense much of a break. Contrast that against Tuberville not letting Steve Spurrier have the ball for an entire 3rd quarter one time. 

Yeah, MSU had a good drive out of the half. We still kept them out of the end zone. By the time they iced the game our guys had been on the field way too long. 

If the offense had gotten off the bus our defense would had a good outing minus an unusual number of rushing yards.

One thing that's funny is that Ellis Johnson's defense is universally blamed for the losses in 2014, except for the DSOR. Nobody ever says that offense should have just scored even more every week.

If you’re advocating that Malzahn should slow his offense down to protect his defense or change the way the offense is designed to attack, I don’t know what to tell you. The offense is design around generating impact/explosive plays. There are several things that go into facilitating the explosive play generation as well. Pace, repitition and execution. Slowing down the pace exposes some of the designed simplicity which makes the offense easier to defend. The only time you’re going to see a Malzahn offense chewing up clock, is when we are trying to get out of a game by running the ball to death. 

The DSOR did get flack on the O side of the ball. If you go back and look at the game thread for the iron bowl that year, several clowns were complaining about the red zone offense in that game too.

[bigbird 60,460]

3 minutes ago, BigWhiskey91 said:

 The offense is design around generating impact/explosive plays...Slowing down the pace exposes some of the designed simplicity which makes the offense easier to defend.

Which is what we've seen the last 4 years. The O never adjusted after the new substitution rules.