2021 5* QB Brock Vandagriff (UGA)

[Mikey 16,545]

13 hours ago, Tiger said:

I read it as "I love Auburn and have been a die hard fan so I know all too well how QB coaching there seems to be poor, so I want to see if Gus can actually coach a QB because I want to be developed for the next level."

Because Cam Newton and Nick Marshall were such QB failures, right?

[bigbird 60,368]

50 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Because Cam Newton and Nick Marshall were such QB failures, right?

NM, JJ, SW, TQ, WB, JF3, JS, JG, BN

Of the 9 QBs that Gus has signed as HC, NM has been the only one that progressed in their development as a QB. JJ never developed or was never coached back from the brink. WB and JF3 were never developed. SW never progressed from year 1 to year 2 and JS actually took a step backwards from '17 to '18, albeit mainly due to the OL. JG and BN are, as of now, unknowns.

So, 1 out of 9 progressed, 2 are yet to be determined, 1 remained steady but misused, 3 never developed, 1 took a step back, and 1 was constantly in a cast.

To me, at best that could be described as .388 (NM,JG,BN,SW) and at worst .111(NM). That's not a track record to be proud of and it certainly is one to be weary of if your a top QB prospect.

[Beaker 2,457]

1 hour ago, bigbird said:

NM, JJ, SW, TQ, WB, JF3, JS, JG, BN

Of the 9 QBs that Gus has signed as HC, NM has been the only one that progressed in their development as a QB. JJ never developed or was never coached back from the brink. WB and JF3 were never developed. SW never progressed from year 1 to year 2 and JS actually took a step backwards from '17 to '18, albeit mainly due to the OL. JG and BN are, as of now, unknowns.

So, 1 out of 9 progressed, 2 are yet to be determined, 1 remained steady but misused, 3 never developed, 1 took a step back, and 1 was constantly in a cast.

To me, at best that could be described as .388 (NM,JG,BN,SW) and at worst .111(NM). That's not a track record to be proud of and it certainly is one to be weary of if your a top QB prospect.

And all this is about to change with 2019!   In 2020, we will be turning away 4 and 5* QBs unless they have a 32 ACT score.    

 

Pass that pitcher, my cup is running low.

 

Seriously, Birdman nailed this.   And I sincerely hope Dillingham needs a place to hunker down for 3-5 yrs, while having tremendous success here.  If so, the obvious trend will be reversed and Gus' demons exercised.  

[Beaker 2,457]

Follow up:  I just reread the entire thread and wondering how the hat figures into his skills.  Go back to page 1 and look at the pic.   Didn't Favre play spring ball in a hat?   I think Romo did also.  Does this mean this cat will morph into a Favre-Romo kinda talent?   I am thinking we need this guy the more I study the 'little things'.

 

Thank me later....remember:  details matter.

 

 

[McLoofus 35,182]

-5* recruit, #2 DT QB in the nation coming out of high school
-Spent almost 2 full seasons learning from Urban Meyer, Dan Mullen and Tim Tebow
-Led his juco team to a national championship
-The entire country believes that we paid two hundred thousand dollars for him ($180k was the number for the Newton family because 10% was supposed to go to Kenny Rogers IMO)
-NFL MVP in his 5th season with the Panthers

Man, where would a bum like that have landed if not for that one critical season under Gus Malzahn's tutelage? Pretty much cements Gus's legacy as a QB guru. Even taught Cam how to do this:

[ellitor 33,062]

15 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

-5* recruit, #2 DT QB in the nation coming out of high school
-Spent almost 2 full seasons learning from Urban Meyer, Dan Mullen and Tim Tebow
-Led his juco team to a national championship
-The entire country believes that we paid two hundred thousand dollars for him ($180k was the number for the Newton family because 10% was supposed to go to Kenny Rogers IMO)
-NFL MVP in his 5th season with the Panthers

Man, where would a bum like that have landed if not for that one critical season under Gus Malzahn's tutelage? Pretty much cements Gus's legacy as a QB guru. Even taught Cam how to do this:

I take it pretty much the entirety of the post is sarcasm?

[McLoofus 35,182]

5 minutes ago, ellitor said:

I take it pretty much the entirety of the post is sarcasm?

[abw0004 10,104]

26 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

-5* recruit, #2 DT QB in the nation coming out of high school
-Spent almost 2 full seasons learning from Urban Meyer, Dan Mullen and Tim Tebow
-Led his juco team to a national championship
-The entire country believes that we paid two hundred thousand dollars for him ($180k was the number for the Newton family because 10% was supposed to go to Kenny Rogers IMO)
-NFL MVP in his 5th season with the Panthers

Man, where would a bum like that have landed if not for that one critical season under Gus Malzahn's tutelage? Pretty much cements Gus's legacy as a QB guru. Even taught Cam how to do this:

In fairness, if you watch his earlier games in that season he was not near what he was towards the end.  This actually surprised me, because I did not remember it being like that in real time.  So Cam did progress under Malzahn.  If you ever have time, watch some of the full games from that season.  I do this when I get bored during the summer and am craving some Auburn football.  It is kind of fun knowing the outcome of each game.  I watch other seasons as well, like the 2017 UGA and Bama games.

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

8 hours ago, Mikey said:

Do you want a list of UAT legacy guys that came to AU, or AU legacy guys that went to UAT and elsewhere? UGA legacies at AU and vice-versa?  It would be a long, long list.

How many of these were players like this one? This isn't going to be a down in the mud recruitment. This one is going to be done the right way. No hands out. Can't name many that were lost that were done this way. With a player that is tops on the board for AU. One that has been coming to games since he was little. You can throw out the past all you want but it's not the case here. This kid would be committed to AU before the summer was over if Gus hadn't crapped in his pants last year.

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

8 hours ago, Mikey said:

Because Cam Newton and Nick Marshall were such QB failures, right?

. Wow.

[cole256 17,039]

4 minutes ago, abw0004 said:

In fairness, if you watch his earlier games in that season he was not near what he was towards the end.  This actually surprised me, because I did not remember it being like that in real time.  So Cam did progress under Malzahn.  If you ever have time, watch some of the full games from that season.  I do this when I get bored during the summer and am craving some Auburn football.  It is kind of fun knowing the outcome of each game.  I watch other seasons as well, like the 2017 UGA and Bama games.

That could simply be getting used to starting. Most players get better after their first couple

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

7 hours ago, bigbird said:

NM, JJ, SW, TQ, WB, JF3, JS, JG, BN

Of the 9 QBs that Gus has signed as HC, NM has been the only one that progressed in their development as a QB. JJ never developed or was never coached back from the brink. WB and JF3 were never developed. SW never progressed from year 1 to year 2 and JS actually took a step backwards from '17 to '18, albeit mainly due to the OL. JG and BN are, as of now, unknowns.

So, 1 out of 9 progressed, 2 are yet to be determined, 1 remained steady but misused, 3 never developed, 1 took a step back, and 1 was constantly in a cast.

To me, at best that could be described as .388 (NM,JG,BN,SW) and at worst .111(NM). That's not a track record to be proud of and it certainly is one to be weary of if your a top QB prospect.

No way is Brock comparing himself to Cam or even looking at Cam's development. He is no where near a QB like Cam or have Cam's talent. There may be 1 or 2 that come along ever so many years that do have Cam's talent. But Brock is a totally different QB. AU used, Derp is, Stidham as the model for Brock in his recruitment. Well, you can see how that is going.

Marshall? Lord have mercy. Marshall would come in play with the kid we have committed now. Not Brock. I can assure you that AU isn't using Cam or Nick as far as recruiting Brock. CVan see it now, Brock comes into AU and Gus puts videos of Cam and Nick on the screen. Brock is like "cool". Dabo puts videos of his current QB on and says, this could be how we use you. Brock is listening.

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

6 minutes ago, cole256 said:

That could simply be getting used to starting. Most players get better after their first couple

Cam did get better as the year went on. But a one year sample size on a generation QB isn't going to hold much water in the now. Cam was in 2010. That was 9 years ago. Gus show videos of Cam. Kirby shows videos of JJ, White, Willis and Stidham last year. Come on people.

[McLoofus 35,182]

13 minutes ago, abw0004 said:

In fairness, if you watch his earlier games in that season he was not near what he was towards the end.  This actually surprised me, because I did not remember it being like that in real time.  So Cam did progress under Malzahn.  If you ever have time, watch some of the full games from that season.  I do this when I get bored during the summer and am craving some Auburn football.  It is kind of fun knowing the outcome of each game.  I watch other seasons as well, like the 2017 UGA and Bama games.

Of course he progressed some- can't agree with "not near what he was towards the end"- as the season went on. So did the players around him and so did the play calling. Just like Nick Marshall was a little bit better in 2014 than he was in 2013. These are things that should be assumed would happen with any player at any position on any team. As you get more reps, you get better. That doesn't require a particularly good coach. 

Gus gets credit for using a generational talent at QB, a 5* freshman RB, an OL with four 4th-year starters and two All-Americans at the two most important positions on the OL, an elite speedster running sweeps, an NFL HBback and an NFL-caliber TE. TZach and DA weren't NFL WRs but they were very serviceable college receivers. Gus had a lot to work with and he did well with it. 

Gus did not turn Cam into something he wasn't already. 

 

[DAG 33,955]

8 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Of course he progressed some- can't agree with "not near what he was towards the end"- as the season went on. So did the players around him and so did the play calling. Just like Nick Marshall was a little bit better in 2014 than he was in 2013. These are things that should be assumed would happen with any player at any position on any team. As you get more reps, you get better. That doesn't require a particularly good coach. 

Gus gets credit for using a generational talent at QB, a 5* freshman RB, an OL with four 4th-year starters and two All-Americans at the two most important positions on the OL, an elite speedster running sweeps, an NFL HBback and an NFL-caliber TE. TZach and DA weren't NFL WRs but they were very serviceable college receivers. Gus had a lot to work with and he did well with it. 

Gus did not turn Cam into something he wasn't already. 

 

This man Cam Newton made mike Shula look like Bill Walsh. He has unbeliever innate talent. I give Gus credit for going out of his way to recruit him for sure. But a lot of Cam was just Cam making magic happen.

[WarDamnEagleWDE 12,737]

29 minutes ago, DAG said:

This man Cam Newton made mike Shula look like Bill Walsh. He has unbeliever innate talent. I give Gus credit for going out of his way to recruit him for sure. But a lot of Cam was just Cam making magic happen.

Gus did call and come up with that offense. He should get credit for that. Gus is a great OC. If all Gus has to do if run the offense, sign him up. Being a HC? Meh. Very MEH.

[Tiger 8,817]

9 hours ago, Mikey said:

Because Cam Newton and Nick Marshall were such QB failures, right?

You realize the prospect basically said what "the pack" has been saying about Gus for years, right?

This is a player. Weighing his college options. Who is a fan of AU meaning he has likely had dreams of being an AU QB since he was a child. And he's saying he needs to see if our coach can actually coach a QB.

Recruiting a top rated QB who is a lifelong AU fan with Gus at the helm is actually a deterrent to this prospect. Think about that.

[DAG 33,955]

7 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

Gus did call and come up with that offense. He should get credit for that. Gus is a great OC. If all Gus has to do if run the offense, sign him up. Being a HC? Meh. Very MEH.

Yes he did come up with the offense but Cam was a big reason the offense did what it did in 2010. Without him that is another 8-5 squad. 

[ellitor 33,062]

1 hour ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

No way is Brock comparing himself to Cam or even looking at Cam's development. He is no where near a QB like Cam or have Cam's talent. There may be 1 or 2 that come along ever so many years that do have Cam's talent. But Brock is a totally different QB. AU used, Derp is, Stidham as the model for Brock in his recruitment. Well, you can see how that is going.

Marshall? Lord have mercy. Marshall would come in play with the kid we have committed now. Not Brock. I can assure you that AU isn't using Cam or Nick as far as recruiting Brock. CVan see it now, Brock comes into AU and Gus puts videos of Cam and Nick on the screen. Brock is like "cool". Dabo puts videos of his current QB on and says, this could be how we use you. Brock is listening.

Not to mention the other two teams heavily involved, Oklahoma and Florida, have actual QB gurus as head coaches.

[AUintheATL 1]

47 minutes ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

Gus did call and come up with that offense. He should get credit for that. Gus is a great OC. If all Gus has to do if run the offense, sign him up. Being a HC? Meh. Very MEH.

WDE.... at the end of the day, do you think we get Brock or does he end up at Oklahoma?

[ellitor 33,062]

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

Gus did not turn Cam into something he wasn't already. 

Almost a lock we should be thanking Mullen  for the development Cam got the two years he was at Florida before we got him.

[mcgufcm 4,096]

C'mon now. That's just silly. Dan Mullen is very good QB coach, but he didn't make Cam any more than the HC at Blinn CC or any more than Gus. As a singular football talent, Cam was and is and will be.

I maintain, all we have to do is roll out a good offense with Gatewood/Nix under center and continue to recruit the OL well in 2020. It would help a good deal if we land Zierer because adding him and Buskey would give us more options at OT without having to rely on a true freshman. If we do those things, I expect to be in the lead pretty soon thereafter. If we don't, we're not going to sign him. It seems that simple.

[McLoofus 35,182]

6 minutes ago, mcgufcm said:

C'mon now. That's just silly. Dan Mullen is very good QB coach, but he didn't make Cam any more than the HC at Blinn CC or any more than Gus.

No, it's not silly. Mullen got him right out of high school. Mullen had more time with him than the other guys. Mullen has a much better track record with QBs than the other guys. Cam spent a season+ with Mullen and Tebow. Cam was an instant success at Blinn. Cam was going to commit to Mullen a 2nd time until Kenny Rogers screwed it up. 

Believe what you want but it's pretty unintelligent to call the other view silly. 

[ellitor 33,062]

1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

No, it's not silly. Mullen got him right out of high school. Mullen had more time with him than the other guys. Mullen has a much better track record with QBs than the other guys. Cam spent a season+ with Mullen and Tebow. Cam was an instant success at Blinn. Cam was going to commit to Mullen a 2nd time until Kenny Rogers screwed it up. 

Believe what you want but it's pretty unintelligent to call the other view silly. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

Quote

"Next year, we'll play two quarterbacks for sure," he said Friday. "We'll have to."

The main reason is to protect the Gators' most valuable asset. Tebow avoided major catastrophe this season but broke his right hand against FSU and played against Georgia with an injured right shoulder.

There appear to be three options for who could play in tandem with Tebow. Run-threat Cam Newton will be a sophomore next year, and John Brantley will be a redshirt freshman. Florida might sign a quarterback in February who could challenge as well.

Newton needs work, as Meyer said he has improved but likely will not play against Michigan in Tuesday's Capital One Bowl. But he might be needed next fall to give Tebow an occasional breather.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/schools/florida/2008.html

So Cam progressed enough in 2007 that Meyer was going to let him split reps as a sophomore the following season with perhaps the most accomplished and decorated college QB ever. Nah, he didn't learn much hanging around with that bunch.