Would you feel different if we had beaten FSU in 2013?

[ChltteTiger 649]

17 hours ago, gr82b4au said:

Not sure, but how many current head coaches have won a national title? I just think winning 2 national titles in the span of 3 years would have changed the way we look a things. If dabo goes 7-5 the next 3 years and then 10-2 (but no championship), do you thing they fire him at Clemson? I think he is set for life. 

Are you seriously suggesting Gus should be set at AU for life if we had just managed to keep FSU out of the endzone in those final seconds in Pasadena? Please just stop.

[Tiger 8,818]

1 hour ago, ChltteTiger said:

Are you seriously suggesting Gus should be set at AU for life if we had just managed to keep FSU out of the endzone in those final seconds in Pasadena? Please just stop.

Maybe not for life but his leash with these 8 win seasons would be a lot longer IMO. It took Chiz the bottom falling out to fire him and I think, to an extent, it would take something like that for Gus to get canned if he was on the short list of active coaches with a championship. 

But that just means we would eat more 8 win seasons before eventually firing him. Like if he wins 8 this year he's probably gone, but if he had that title to his name we probably would end up giving him 2-3 more years to turn it around.

[mustache eagle 2,389]

I would be more grateful for Gus getting us a natty in 2013.  We never had any business being successful that season and I believe he made that happen.  winning the second half of that game would have made me think better of him.  But not to the point of overlooking the last few years.  His atrocious coaching decisions in the couple of Clemson games, plus the coaching decisions that led up to having relying on a hobbled KJ to be our end of season savior ... that repeated bad coaching decisions can only go so far.

Leath having no testicles, which led to the idiotic long term contract extension at the SEC title game, is another story.  Leath shares some blame.  Gus might not be here this year without that stupid administrative decision.

[Barnacle 9,064]

17 hours ago, WarDamnEagleWDE said:

Yes. Gus has not been the same since. 

To me, this is a much more interesting conversation. How would a win in that game have changed things for Gus, for the program, etc.? 

[kevon67 2,368]

20 minutes ago, Barnacle said:

To me, this is a much more interesting conversation. How would a win in that game have changed things for Gus, for the program, etc.? 

Thank you and well put........While FSU loss was heartbreaking I did feel like the team give 100 percent in falling short so I wasn't bitter.

[Carnell 592]

21 hours ago, gr82b4au said:

There are sooo many posts on every Auburn board just bashing our head coach, especially now that the baseball and basketball team are enjoying so much success. Even though he engineered the most remarkable comeback season in NCAA history and coached us to the title game in 2013, I feel like that one game changed everything for Gus. If he wins that one game (where we were ahead by 2tds+), I feel like nobody is giving him the amount of grief that he gets these days. He would be recognized as a national championship head coach. 

** Granted, we fired Chiz in 2012 for utter misery 2 years after a national title, but our program was in the gutter at that point. We did not win an SEC game and were beaten by 45 points in just about every game. **

I would still feel the same about gus even if Auburn had beaten FSU because we were in the championship game due mostly to luck not gus's innovative playcalling.  Furthermore,  DCs became innovative in devising schemes to stop the zone read.  And 3.  After that clemson fiasco in 2016, playing 6 quarterbacks is so a asinine that he should have been fired after that game.

4.  You people say he needs a DT quarterback to make his system work.  This proves gus is not a good coach as a good coach will implement a scheme to fit his talent not try to fit his talent to his scheme.

 

[atl-tiger 655]

No, that season was lucky as hell.  We owe 2013 to Nick Marshall. 

 

[AU64 10,122]

7 minutes ago, atl-tiger said:

No, that season was lucky as hell.  We owe 2013 to Nick Marshall. 

 

Yep...nobody ever got to a championship game based on some lucky plays or fortunate officiating decisions before AU did.....and of course FSU was not lucky to win that game ….just because two experienced DBs for AU busted a routine defensive play on a short pass that would pretty much have ended the game.....and thus allowed the 'noles to go the length of the field in half a minute. 

[AuburnEagle79 2,163]

I'd probably be more frustrated with what is happening had we won it all. I get that we have a tough schedule year in and year out, but we should never win less than 9 games in a season. Never to the Mississippi schools, never to anyone not named LSU, Alabama, or Georgia. We should win at least 1 of those 3 every year. 

 

If we are halfway competent on offense, we beat Clemson twice. Those games frustrate me to no end. 

[Rednilla 5,383]

To answer the question in the OP, yes, everybody here would feel differently about Malzahn had he won it all in 2013. I would contend that had he done so, we would not have had as many mediocre seasons under Gus and probably an even more talented team this season, but Loof has a point that your OP left that open to interpretation. 

However, even if he beats FSU in 2013 and then goes on to the exact same results as he has since then, I feel pretty confident everyone would feel differently about him, even if they're saying now that they wouldn't because of X reason(s). As a matter of fact, there would probably be a much brighter outlook on 2019, as it seems that for the first time since Nick Marshall we have a QB capable of changing the game with his legs as well as being able to throw (not to say Gatewood is a given at QB, just that his presence in the starting QB mix would garner more optimism). Without the horrid memory of our second half against the Noles, Gus would still have a growing choir of dissent rising against him due to the mediocrity every season except 13 and 17, but it would not be nearly as loud, and there wouldn't be so much despair in the minds of the Tiger faithful.

And speaking of 2017, I am sick and tired of hearing about how we still lost 4 games. Losing in the SEC Championship shouldn't count against Malzahn the way so many do. They miss the forest because all they see is trees. He was 10-2 in the regular season with wins over our two biggest rivals, both of which were ranked #1 in the country when we played them. Winning 10 games in the SEC West is quite an accomplishment, and if we had that resume without going to the SECCG, I don't think we lose to ANYONE in the bowl game because the players would have been much more fired up rather than the let down of not making the playoffs.

[DAG 33,955]

8 minutes ago, Rednilla said:

To answer the question in the OP, yes, everybody here would feel differently about Malzahn had he won it all in 2013. I would contend that had he done so, we would not have had as many mediocre seasons under Gus and probably an even more talented team this season, but Loof has a point that your OP left that open to interpretation. 

However, even if he beats FSU in 2013 and then goes on to the exact same results as he has since then, I feel pretty confident everyone would feel differently about him, even if they're saying now that they wouldn't because of X reason(s). As a matter of fact, there would probably be a much brighter outlook on 2019, as it seems that for the first time since Nick Marshall we have a QB capable of changing the game with his legs as well as being able to throw (not to say Gatewood is a given at QB, just that his presence in the starting QB mix would garner more optimism). Without the horrid memory of our second half against the Noles, Gus would still have a growing choir of dissent rising against him due to the mediocrity every season except 13 and 17, but it would not be nearly as loud, and there wouldn't be so much despair in the minds of the Tiger faithful.

And speaking of 2017, I am sick and tired of hearing about how we still lost 4 games. Losing in the SEC Championship shouldn't count against Malzahn the way so many do. They miss the forest because all they see is trees. He was 10-2 in the regular season with wins over our two biggest rivals, both of which were ranked #1 in the country when we played them. Winning 10 games in the SEC West is quite an accomplishment, and if we had that resume without going to the SECCG, I don't think we lose to ANYONE in the bowl game because the players would have been much more fired up rather than the let down of not making the playoffs.

Why shouldn’t losing in the SEC championship game count ? Lol . It’s his job to get the players up for the bowl game as well. You lost me with some of that. Also , if we wouldn’t have loss in ridiculous fashion to LSU, I still think we go to the playoffs ( my opinion of course). 

[aujeff11 6,243]

6 minutes ago, Rednilla said:

And speaking of 2017, I am sick and tired of hearing about how we still lost 4 games. Losing in the SEC Championship shouldn't count against Malzahn the way so many do. They miss the forest because all they see is trees. He was 10-2 in the regular season with wins over our two biggest rivals, both of which were ranked #1 in the country when we played them. Winning 10 games in the SEC West is quite an accomplishment, and if we had that resume without going to the SECCG, I don't think we lose to ANYONE in the bowl game because the players would have been much more fired up rather than the let down of not making the playoffs

Cards were certainly stacked against us. Not many teams can say they beat two teams ranked number one in a season. Very, very few of them can say they then had to play one of the said formerly top ranked teams again as the reward. 

[Rednilla 5,383]

8 minutes ago, DAG said:

Why shouldn’t losing in the SEC championship game count ? Lol . It’s his job to get the players up for the bowl game as well. You lost me with some of that. Also , if we wouldn’t have loss in ridiculous fashion to LSU, I still think we go to the playoffs ( my opinion of course). 

I didn't say it shouldn't count, I said it shouldn't count in the way that you and so many others do. Yes, it's Gus's job to have the team ready to win every game, but he had the team ready enough to make the Championship Game in the first place. Using that loss as a reason to trump up how much he's lost at least 4 games every year since 2013 is disingenuous because we played an extra game compared to those seasons. Four losses is just different when half of them came in the postseason, no matter how bad a taste it left in your mouth that we lost the final two games that year.

[McLoofus 35,182]

19 minutes ago, Rednilla said:

I didn't say it shouldn't count, I said it shouldn't count in the way that you and so many others do. Yes, it's Gus's job to have the team ready to win every game, but he had the team ready enough to make the Championship Game in the first place. Using that loss as a reason to trump up how much he's lost at least 4 games every year since 2013 is disingenuous because we played an extra game compared to those seasons. Four losses is just different when half of them came in the postseason, no matter how bad a taste it left in your mouth that we lost the final two games that year.

So postseason wins don't count either, right? 

[DAG 33,955]

9 minutes ago, Rednilla said:

I didn't say it shouldn't count, I said it shouldn't count in the way that you and so many others do. Yes, it's Gus's job to have the team ready to win every game, but he had the team ready enough to make the Championship Game in the first place. Using that loss as a reason to trump up how much he's lost at least 4 games every year since 2013 is disingenuous because we played an extra game compared to those seasons. Four losses is just different when half of them came in the postseason, no matter how bad a taste it left in your mouth that we lost the final two games that year.

A loss is a loss is a loss. You are doing a lot of word gymnastics to try to diminish this fact. Now, I am not speaking about his others years right now, so don’t lump me with a bunch of other people unless you have quotes to do so. I am solely speaking on 2017. Yes he beat two #1 teams and he has gotten credit for that, at the very least by the program by getting a hefty raise. With that being said, he absolutely deserves criticism for losing to LSU in the manner he did and losing the UCF bowl game. I don’t particularly like that he loss to UGA in the SEC championship game , but I am not harping so much on that, as it is extremely hard to beat a great team twice in one season. My issue in your post is you seem to take issue with how people are reacting to the total number of losses in the season, but choose to overlook the path we got there .

We loss to an above average LSU team which made it virtually impossible to get into the playoffs without going perfect at the end of the season. The committee has already shown that they give credit to the SEC and willing to give Auburn the benefit of a doubt for that loss to LSU, but no way they would let a 3 loss team in the playoffs. But heck even if we would’ve won the SEC Championship game , we would’ve had to play an extra game period. And if he loss in the playoffs, it would still count as a loss. It doesn’t matter one iota to me whether he loss 3, 4 or 5 games. When you step foot on the field , the expectation for me is a victory, if you lose, it goes down as a loss. If you win it , it goes down in the win column. If you feel like that is disingenuous than we shouldn’t count the Vandy win or Memphis win then since those came in the post season. So you are being just as disingenuous in your assessment as well.   

[DAG 33,955]

1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

So postseason wins don't count either, right? 

Ahh why do you always beat me to it lol

[McLoofus 35,182]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

Ahh why do you always beat me to it lol

I withdraw! I withdraw! Hahaha

[McLoofus 35,182]

3 minutes ago, DAG said:

A loss is a loss is a loss. You are doing a lot of word gymnastics to try to diminish this fact. Now, I am not speaking about his others years right now, so don’t lump me with a bunch of other people unless you have quotes to do so. I am solely speaking on 2017. Yes he beat two #1 teams and he has gotten credit for that, at the very least by the program by getting a hefty raise. With that being said, he absolutely deserves criticism for losing to LSU in the manner he did and losing the UCF bowl game. I don’t particularly like that he loss to UGA in the SEC championship game , but I am not harping so much on that, as it is extremely hard to beat a great team twice in one season. My issue in your post is you seem to take issue with how people are reacting to the total number of losses in the season, but choose to overlook the path we got there .

We loss to an above average LSU team which made it virtually impossible to get into the playoffs without going perfect at the end of the season. The committee has already shown that they give credit to the SEC and willing to give Auburn the benefit of a doubt for that loss to LSU, but no way they would let a 3 loss team in the playoffs. But heck even if we would’ve won the SEC Championship game , we would’ve had to play an extra game period. And if he loss in the playoffs, it would still count as a loss. It doesn’t matter one iota to me whether he loss 3, 4 or 5 games. When you step foot on the field , the expectation for me is a victory, if you lose, it goes down as a loss. If you win it , it goes down in the win column. If you feel like that is disingenuous than we shouldn’t count the Vandy win or Memphis win then since those came in the post season. So you are being just as disingenuous in your assessment as well.   

Hear, hear.

May I add that had we lost to Clemson in a respectable manner, maybe even then it's looked at differently. But we had announcers openly question what Gus was thinking during that game with the plays he was running. 117 total yards. 

That fun November doesn't make that go away, and watching bama and uga play for a title proves it. 

[DAG 33,955]

1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

Hear, hear.

May I add that had we lost to Clemson in a respectable manner, maybe even then it's looked at differently. But we had announcers openly question what Gus was thinking during that game with the plays he was running. 117 total yards. 

That fun November doesn't make that go away, and watching bama and uga play for a title proves it. 

Yep! But I absolutely believe based on where we were pre the SEC championship game, a 2 loss Auburn team gets in, if their only 2 losses are on the road to ACC champion Clemson and the SEC championship to UGA. In fact I am insanely confident we get in. I don’t like how beating two #1 teams is propped but ignored is the other huge losses. I feel the same way when people talk about those losses but don’t consider the two #1 teams we beat. 

[Rednilla 5,383]

15 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

So postseason wins don't count either, right? 

Not in the same way regular season wins do, not when one of them came in the conference championship. Would you rather have been 9-4 with a loss to either UGA or Bama and a bowl loss, or 10-4 with a loss in the Championship Game and the bowl game? Would it make you feel better if we just didn't go to the SECCG?

[McLoofus 35,182]

7 minutes ago, DAG said:

Yep! But I absolutely believe based on where we were pre the SEC championship game, a 2 loss Auburn team gets in, if their only 2 losses are on the road to ACC champion Clemson and the SEC championship to UGA. In fact I am insanely confident we get in. I don’t like how beating two #1 teams is propped but ignored is the other huge losses. I feel the same way when people talk about those losses but don’t consider the two #1 teams we beat. 

Dude, we are having a serious agreement fest here. 

(I'm out of reactions)

[McLoofus 35,182]

8 minutes ago, Rednilla said:

Not in the same way regular season wins do, not when one of them came in the conference championship.

Ok. So we were actually 11 1/2-1 1/2 in 2013? And the BCSCG loss didn't count as much as the LSU loss? And SECCG win didn't count as much as, say, the Arkansas win? I can respect your position if it's consistent. I don't agree with it, but I respect it.

Quote

Would you rather have been 9-4 with a loss to either UGA or Bama and a bowl loss, or 10-4 with a loss in the Championship Game and the bowl game? Would it make you feel better if we just didn't go to the SECCG?

Um, I'd rather not lose 4 games.

You're asking me to choose between equally crappy scenarios. It's your assertion that one scenario is better than the other. That's the point. Every game counts. 

[Rednilla 5,383]

21 minutes ago, DAG said:

A loss is a loss is a loss. You are doing a lot of word gymnastics to try to diminish this fact. Now, I am not speaking about his others years right now, so don’t lump me with a bunch of other people unless you have quotes to do so. I am solely speaking on 2017. Yes he beat two #1 teams and he has gotten credit for that, at the very least by the program by getting a hefty raise. With that being said, he absolutely deserves criticism for losing to LSU in the manner he did and losing the UCF bowl game. I don’t particularly like that he loss to UGA in the SEC championship game , but I am not harping so much on that, as it is extremely hard to beat a great team twice in one season. My issue in your post is you seem to take issue with how people are reacting to the total number of losses in the season, but choose to overlook the path we got there .

We loss to an above average LSU team which made it virtually impossible to get into the playoffs without going perfect at the end of the season. The committee has already shown that they give credit to the SEC and willing to give Auburn the benefit of a doubt for that loss to LSU, but no way they would let a 3 loss team in the playoffs. But heck even if we would’ve won the SEC Championship game , we would’ve had to play an extra game period. And if he loss in the playoffs, it would still count as a loss. It doesn’t matter one iota to me whether he loss 3, 4 or 5 games. When you step foot on the field , the expectation for me is a victory, if you lose, it goes down as a loss. If you win it , it goes down in the win column. If you feel like that is disingenuous than we shouldn’t count the Vandy win or Memphis win then since those came in the post season. So you are being just as disingenuous in your assessment as well.   

First off, as I've said on here countless times, I'm a writer. Word gymnastics are in my blood.

Second, you may not have personally said it, I don't know and I don't care enough to go back and look, but I'd be shocked if Loof hasn't made the argument, and the two of you have been carrying on a pretty serious bromance on this site (and this thread), so I don't feel it's unfair to lump you in with him.

Third, I strongly disagree that the selection committee puts a two loss team that lost its conference championship game. It was a stretch for them to put in one loss Bama who didn't play in the CG, and if it were the other way around and two loss Bama beat undefeated Auburn to clinch the West, I don't think Auburn makes it in even with just that one loss.

Finally, again, I NEVER said the loss didn't count. If I did, please show me the quote, since you seem so hung up on that. I said the loss shouldn't count against the coach the same way a regular season or bowl loss does. I said nothing of the bad loss to LSU (and it was indeed a bad loss), nor did I say anything about it being different counting the bowl loss against him, because simply going .500 gets you into a bowl game these days.

[McLoofus 35,182]

2 minutes ago, Rednilla said:

Second, you may not have personally said it, I don't know and I don't care enough to go back and look, but I'd be shocked if Loof hasn't made the argument, and the two of you have been carrying on a pretty serious bromance on this site (and this thread), so I don't feel it's unfair to lump you in with him.

Really, dude? Nevermind what a weak ass attempt at insulting two people for no reason that is. It's stupid and illogical. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

3 minutes ago, Rednilla said:

First off, as I've said on here countless times, I'm a writer. Word gymnastics are in my blood.

You realize that word gymnastics aren't something to brag about, right? That just means you're using more words to be wrong.