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so the camps are like country clubs huh?


aubiefifty

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40 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

no you guys do. too many people think the dishonesty on your side is cute and i am tired of it. i am nothing more than blunt. discussions are made to see each others point of view and to see who is right and who is wrong. but here is the thing you do not get........if you are a liar then you waste peoples time and nothing educational comes out of the discussion.and you hate me for calling folks a liar. so why have you not said anything to your friends calling homie a liar? why is that? this is twice i have asked this. why is it wrong to point out a bald faced lie but ok to call homie a liar? now you will probably deflect or uses some cute smiley face to show your support. gosh i called you out one night when you were drunk and you admitted it.remember? i even told you i would be nice until the next day. now i got cats calling me a drunk. lol that is so rich. but it takes much more than that to upset me which all some of your and your sides posters try to do.

Huh...........?

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Just now, SaltyTiger said:

Huh...........?

 

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2 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

It amazes me that people on here calling others liars and claiming they alway admit when they are wrong.  Wasn’t it in January that the President said we had a humanitarian crisis at the border and the narrative on this board and in the media that it was a “manufactured” crises?

I surely don’t see many here admitting that their opinion back then was wrong.  Reminds me of the Doc Holiday quote in “Tombstone”;  “My hypocrisy only goes so far”.

Oh FFS. Not you, too. I've seen this stupid line several times today and I was wondering who was going to try to parrot it in here.

There *wasn't* a crisis in January. Trump lied and said there was. Now there *is* a crisis because he created it by incarcerating a bunch of people for whom he refuses to allocate the resources to provide care. Of course, he knew this ahead of time and it has been a tactic all along to blackmail Dems into giving him the legislation he wants along with $4.5 billion that isn't even specifically earmarked to give these poor kids their damned blankets. 

Jesus Christ. Use your head.

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one white child kidnapped is an amber alert. 2000 kidnapped is a trump agenda.

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shame.jpg

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37 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

Oh FFS. Not you, too. I've seen this stupid line several times today and I was wondering who was going to try to parrot it in here.

There *wasn't* a crisis in January. Trump lied and said there was. Now there *is* a crisis because he created it by incarcerating a bunch of people for whom he refuses to allocate the resources to provide care. Of course, he knew this ahead of time and it has been a tactic all along to blackmail Dems into giving him the legislation he wants along with $4.5 billion that isn't even specifically earmarked to give these poor kids their damned blankets. 

Jesus Christ. Use your head.

Our opinion as to when this became a crisis will never agree.  Having said that, There has to be a solution and I believe both the House and Senate are working on separate bills.  The Senate bill passed by 84-8 which seems promising and it includes faster processing, the House bill leaves the processing procedure as is.  To alleviate the log jam it would seem the processing would have to speed up.  I hope the Senate and House can get together and come up with a solution that works for every American.

 

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24 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Our opinion as to when this became a crisis will never agree.  Having said that, There has to be a solution and I believe both the House and Senate are working on separate bills.  The Senate bill passed by 84-8 which seems promising and it includes faster processing, the House bill leaves the processing procedure as is.  To alleviate the log jam it would seem the processing would have to speed up.  I hope the Senate and House can get together and come up with a solution that works for every American.

Yep. King Dipshit created a crisis and now it's up to Congress to fix it. Nobody's buying the BS GOP messaging but it doesn't matter. He's probably going to successfully play the Democrats' basic sense of decency and empathy against them and force a compromise. By putting children in cages. Art of the deal, huh? Dark, dark times. And some of y'all are okay with it.

This isn't the country I grew up in. The country I grew up in actually was great.

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politifact.com

No, Obama did not have family separation policy

5-6 minutes

President Donald Trump, in an interview with the Spanish-language TV network Telemundo, adamantly claimed that the separation of immigrant families at the border during his presidency happened because of an Obama policy. That’s not true.

José Díaz-Balart, anchor of "Noticias Telemundo," asked Trump if his "zero-tolerance" immigration policy was a mistake. The Trump policy called for the prosecution of all adults who crossed the border illegally; when parents came in with children, the families were separated.

In the interview that aired June 20, Trump said it was not a mistake. He argued that separations were due to an Obama policy and that Trump himself wanted families together.

"We had separations," Trump said. "When I became president, President Obama had a separation policy. I didn’t have it. He had it. I brought the families together. I’m the one that put them together."

Díaz-Balart said that despite 2,800 recent reunifications, the government still doesn’t know how many children are still separated from their parents.

"Are you ready? Under the Obama plan," Trump started saying, before Díaz-Balart pushed back saying that what they were talking about was Trump’s plan.

"No, we are not, because I’m the one that put people together. They separated. I put them together," Trump repeated. Reunifications happened, Díaz-Balart said, because a court ordered it.

"I inherited separation, and I changed the plan and I brought people together," Trump said. Trump repeated this claim later in the interview.

Trump’s persistent claims don’t align with the facts.

Separations under past administrations rare, systematic under Trump

Generally, a child and an adult who arrive together at the border can be separated when border officials cannot establish the custodial relationship; when they believe the custodian may be a threat to the child; or when the custodian is being detained for prosecution.

Immigration experts have told us that family separations were relatively rare under Obama and other past administrations. They did not happen at nearly the scale that they did under the Trump administration.

George W. Bush’s Operation Streamline referred for prosecution immigrants who crossed into the country illegally, but made exceptions for adults traveling with children. The Obama administration initially kept families together in detention, but after losing a legal challenge, released families out of detention after holding them for a limited time.

The Department of Homeland Security, which oversees border enforcement, previously told PolitiFact that Obama’s administration did not count the number of separated families.

It’s unclear exactly how many children were separated from their parents during Trump’s administration, which has acknowledged problems in its logistics and record-keeping. Under a court order, around 2,800 children have been reunited with their parents or otherwise discharged from federal custody.

The controversial family separations under Trump’s watch happened as a result of a new policy introduced in April 2018 by Trump’s then-Attorney General Jeff Sessions.

Sessions said an "escalated effort" was needed to address a crisis at the southwest border and directed the implementation of the "zero-tolerance" policy, to prosecute all adults illegally entering the United States.

In March 2017, then-DHS Secretary John Kelly told CNN he was considering separating children from parents to deter illegal immigration. In the Telemundo interview, Trump also said that "when you put the parents together with the children, when you don’t separate," more people arrive at the border.

Amid growing backlash and criticism of family separations, Trump issued an executive order to keep families together, even if a parent faced prosecution. Families will be detained together "where appropriate and consistent with law" and based on available resources, said his June 2018 order.

Before issuing the order, Trump had claimed that family separations could not be stopped through an executive order. That wasn’t true, either.

Our ruling

Trump said, "When I became president, President Obama had a separation policy. I didn’t have it. He had it."

The Obama administration did not have a policy to separate families arriving illegally at the border. Family separations rarely happened under the Obama administration, which sought to keep families together in detention. Then, based on a court decision, it released families together out of detention.

Separations under Trump happened systematically as a result of his administration’s policy to prosecute all adults crossing the border illegally. After mounting public pressure and criticism, Trump signed an executive order to stop separating families. Around 2,800 children have been reunited with their families because a court ordered the Trump administration to do so.

Trump repeatedly attempts to change the narrative about family separations, but the facts remain the same. Obama did not pass down to Trump a policy to separate families.

Trump’s claim is inaccurate. We rate it False.

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This isn't a Trump problem. As VP Pence eludes it is a problem with our Dems in Congress that can be easily remedied. But when you live in an echo chamber common sense is out the window. Wake up, pull your head out of your a$$ and seek some damn truth. It will serve you well.

See, when you rely on one side for information, you wind up doing amazingly stupid, dishonest things…

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7 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

This isn't a Trump problem. As VP Pence eludes it is a problem with our Dems in Congress that can be easily remedied. But when you live in an echo chamber common sense is out the window. Wake up, pull your head out of your a$$ and seek some damn truth. It will serve you well.

See, when you rely on one side for information, you wind up doing amazingly stupid, dishonest things…

did or did trump not close the border causing the crisis we have now? i am sure you will correct me if i am wrong. and if he did is it stil closed? if it is open again how long has it been open. people want to better their lives and are dying or being treated like criminals. it breaks my heart abd is against every christian value i was ever taught. so explain it to me when you get time. i doubt i will agree but i will listen to what you have to say. that is fair i think.

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Look, I'm not hear to argue. You can get your info from partisan hacks or our border patrol agents. I choose the later. You do you. It is not nearly as complicated as some try to make it. This can be solved easily just as it is in any other country. There are legal ways to enter a country and illegal ways. You seem to advocate an illegal path. Shame on you. BTW, the Mexican cartel thanks you. 

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22 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

Look, I'm not hear to argue. You can get your info from partisan hacks or our border patrol agents. I choose the later. You do you. It is not nearly as complicated as some try to make it. This can be solved easily just as it is in any other country. There are legal ways to enter a country and illegal ways. You seem to advocate an illegal path. Shame on you. BTW, the Mexican cartel thanks you. 

ok first off you have no ideas on my stance on immigration. all you really know is kids should not be put in cages and i feel sorry for those wanting to better their life. so you go ahead and do my thinking for me some more. to me this is dishonest on your part but it is true. show m where i shared my feelings on immigration.

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2 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

ok first off you have no ideas on my stance on immigration. all you really know is kids should not be put in cages and i feel sorry for those wanting to better their life. so you go ahead and do my thinking for me some more. to me this is dishonest on your part but it is true. show m where i shared my feelings on immigration.

Again listen to experts not partisan hacks that simply think orange man bad. 

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9 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

Again listen to experts not partisan hacks that simply think orange man bad. 

sorry orange man is bad. he is a disgrace and not fit to be president. he is as complete embarrassment. the really sad thing is he is not a good person period. but you folks could care less.

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2 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

sorry orange man is bad. he is a disgrace and not fit to be president. he is as complete embarrassment. the really sad thing is he is not a good person period. but you folks could care less.

Sorry, this isn't about the orange man. This is about right and wrong. Illegal immigration is wrong. The echo chamber you reside in will not allow you to see the simplicity of the real issue.

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5 minutes ago, AUFAN78 said:

Sorry, this isn't about the orange man. This is about right and wrong. Illegal immigration is wrong. The echo chamber you reside in will not allow you to see the simplicity of the real issue.

believe what you want. i agree the laws are flawed and need changing. trump screwed it all up. obama had the lowest numbers of immigrants in three decades or more. he just made it worse. period. the facts are out there if you really care about the truth....serious. i have already done it. so if you care about the truth show it and quit giving trump a pass. i am out until way later or tomorrow.

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Just now, aubiefifty said:

believe what you want. i agree the laws are flawed and need changing. trump screwed it all up. obama had the lowest numbers of immigrants in three decades or more. he just made it worse. period. the facts are out there if you really care about the truth....serious. i have already done it. so if you care about the truth show it and quit giving trump a pass. i am out until way later or tomorrow.

I believe the truth, not some partisan nonsense.

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20 hours ago, McLoofus said:

I'm very pessimistic about the election. And I'm growing moreso about the ability of our institutions to survive it. When basic dignity and decency are no longer valued... when "winning" is more important than thriving... what's left? 

Authoritarianism. 

Considering their tradition of beating on the socialist/communist model of tyranny, it's ironic that it's coming from the Republican party.

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10 hours ago, AUFAN78 said:

I believe the truth, not some partisan nonsense.

The numbers don't lie.

Trump didn't create the current crisis, he's just made it worse instead of addressing it effectively. 

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11 hours ago, AUFAN78 said:

This isn't a Trump problem. As VP Pence eludes it is a problem with our Dems in Congress that can be easily remedied. But when you live in an echo chamber common sense is out the window. Wake up, pull your head out of your a$$ and seek some damn truth. It will serve you well.

See, when you rely on one side for information, you wind up doing amazingly stupid, dishonest things…

There's some great irony.

Pence said blame the Democrats!  :roflol:

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An opposing view:

Former President Barack Obama’s top immigration chief in charge of removing illegal immigrants said that the “cages” Democrats have accused President Trump of housing children in were the brainchild of the Obama administration.

 

“I’ve been to that facility, where they talk about cages. That facility was built under President Obama under (Homeland Security) Secretary Jeh Johnson. I was there because I was there when it was built,” said Thomas Homan, who was Obama’s executive associate director of Immigration and Customs Enforcement for nearly four years.

At an immigration conference today, Homan, under consideration for a new position of “border czar” in the Trump administration, grew visibly angry answering a question about “cages” often cited by Democratic critics of the president.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/washington-secrets/baracks-ice-chief-cages-were-obamas-idea

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19 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

An opposing view:

Former President Barack Obama’s top immigration chief in charge of removing illegal immigrants said that the “cages” Democrats have accused President Trump of housing children in were the brainchild of the Obama administration.

“I’ve been to that facility, where they talk about cages. That facility was built under President Obama under (Homeland Security) Secretary Jeh Johnson. I was there because I was there when it was built,” said Thomas Homan, who was Obama’s executive associate director of Immigration and Customs Enforcement for nearly four years.

At an immigration conference today, Homan, under consideration for a new position of “border czar” in the Trump administration, grew visibly angry answering a question about “cages” often cited by Democratic critics of the president.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/washington-secrets/baracks-ice-chief-cages-were-obamas-idea

It should be pointed out that Homan is a Fox News contributor. Also, in that article it says that the facilities aren't meant to hold children. And he compares the House's approach to the legislative process to "extortion". Pretty politically opinionated guy. 

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53 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

It should be pointed out that Homan is a Fox News contributor. Also, in that article it says that the facilities aren't meant to hold children. And he compares the House's approach to the legislative process to "extortion". Pretty politically opinionated guy. 

Homan was Barack Obama’s immigration chief.  I don’t think he would change the facts just because he is a Fox News contributor.  There are a lot of politically opinionated people in the *news* industry, if you only hear one side of the story, you don’t get the whole story.  Echo chambers are not good for debate.

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3 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Homan was Barack Obama’s immigration chief.  I don’t think he would change the facts just because he is a Fox News contributor.  There are a lot of politically opinionated people in the *news* industry, if you only hear one side of the story, you don’t get the whole story.  Echo chambers are not good for debate.

And yet his disdain for Democrats is palpable. I don't think he's changing the facts, but saying that the House is committing "extortion" is not a fact. 

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