Play the season without fans at the stadium

[AUsince72 11,084]

4 hours ago, CleCoTiger said:

My advice is to listen to the health professionals on issues related to health. Listen to economists on issues related to the economy. Listen to politicians looking to get re-elected...almost not at all. And listen to conspiracy theorists...never.

I'm certainly not arguing anything with or against you here but just thought I'd take this pointed clip to relay an amusing anecdote (but a genuine situation I found myself in recently), that covers all 4 of your points in 1.  Hard as this may be to believe, I promise it's a true story....

In my situation, one of the many health organizations I see is for pain management.  I was there a month or so ago, simply for the visit required to update a pain script.  That's all.  "Same pain? Yes.  New script? Done".  That should (and normally would be) it.

However, the Dr (who I'd actually never met before as I'd been seeing a PA previously instead) comes in and before even one mention of me or my situation (barely even saying hello....literally), went into a 20 minute diatribe that covered everything from his disdain for the current WH administration, his worshipping of Dr. Fauci (who there's now disagreements as to his worth in this), and spewed some fairly wild conspiracy theories about why certain things are going on to manipulate policy & the economy.  (He covered all 4 of your points, LOL)....I kid you not.  Again, this is a true story.  ....thankfully he DID finally approve my script refill after I sat in stunned silence with my jaw dropped open (though he couldn't tell due to my mask) the whole time.

Oh, he DID do one cute thing, showing me how to make a homemade mask using a pleated paper towel, rubber bands & staples.  So, I did get SOMETHING useful from his ..... whatever you call it.  Not sure if he samples his own product or what but..... anyway.

Moral of the story, if y'all haven't noticed, those in leadership, the multitude of varying sources of statistics & models & everyone on these forums (like AUFamily, facebook, social media, etc.) are constantly contradicting each other.  This situation is unprecedented in modern history.  There ARE no experts (on this particular situation).  But plenty who THINK they are.

Just think for yourself, research as best you can & make your own informed decisions from there.  Chances are a bunch of people will agree with you....a bunch of people will disagree with you......and the rest will just insult you.

Be safe out there & may God bless!

[ToraGirl 5,498]

1 hour ago, AUsince72 said:

I'm certainly not arguing anything with or against you here but just thought I'd take this pointed clip to relay an amusing anecdote (but a genuine situation I found myself in recently), that covers all 4 of your points in 1.  Hard as this may be to believe, I promise it's a true story....

In my situation, one of the many health organizations I see is for pain management.  I was there a month or so ago, simply for the visit required to update a pain script.  That's all.  "Same pain? Yes.  New script? Done".  That should (and normally would be) it.

However, the Dr (who I'd actually never met before as I'd been seeing a PA previously instead) comes in and before even one mention of me or my situation (barely even saying hello....literally), went into a 20 minute diatribe that covered everything from his disdain for the current WH administration, his worshipping of Dr. Fauci (who there's now disagreements as to his worth in this), and spewed some fairly wild conspiracy theories about why certain things are going on to manipulate policy & the economy.  (He covered all 4 of your points, LOL)....I kid you not.  Again, this is a true story.  ....thankfully he DID finally approve my script refill after I sat in stunned silence with my jaw dropped open (though he couldn't tell due to my mask) the whole time.

Oh, he DID do one cute thing, showing me how to make a homemade mask using a pleated paper towel, rubber bands & staples.  So, I did get SOMETHING useful from his ..... whatever you call it.  Not sure if he samples his own product or what but..... anyway.

Moral of the story, if y'all haven't noticed, those in leadership, the multitude of varying sources of statistics & models & everyone on these forums (like AUFamily, facebook, social media, etc.) are constantly contradicting each other.  This situation is unprecedented in modern history.  There ARE no experts (on this particular situation).  But plenty who THINK they are.

Just think for yourself, research as best you can & make your own informed decisions from there.  Chances are a bunch of people will agree with you....a bunch of people will disagree with you......and the rest will just insult you.

Be safe out there & may God bless!

Waiting for the NAILED icon, and the EYE ROLL icon, too...for totally different occasions, of course!  (HA!)  Very well said.  It's all of the contradiction that has us in whiplash coupled with "having to be right."  As if anyone can claim that title right now.  Let's just be learners.  We can all agree that each of us has learned a HEAP during this time...and for sure, we have much, much more to learn.

I ordered some facemasks yesterday.  Unfortunately the world flag ones are backordered until July...so it's cherries for me.  I found my stash of bandanas last night, so life is exceedingly good.  #SMALL things.

Oh, and for interest's sake, I went to a SMALL high school graduation last night...18 in entire class.  Very limited guests.  FAIRLY widely spaced, but "you know."  Outdoors venue backing up to a horse pasture.  Just gorgeous.  Saw a wide range of different responses...so again...????  We just do the best that we can.

[oracle79 3,569]

5 hours ago, AuburnArch13 said:

Feel free to post whatever chart you found, but this is pretty obviously not true. There are ~328,000,000 in the United States. If the mortality rate was .002% (or lower) as you suggest, then even if everyone in America caught it, we’d only be look at 6,560 deaths (328,000,000 x .00002). Considering we’ve already eclipsed 80,000 deaths in the US with a only a fraction of the population having been infected, that number is clearly nonsense.

Depends mainly on the age group you're examining. Article link if interested (it's a conservative publication so you've been warned). The charts are from Netherlands because according to the article, the CDC hasn't published anything like it for the U.S.

https://www.conservativereview.com/news/horowitz-one-chart-exposes-lie-behind-universal-lockdowns/

 

[I_M4_AU 7,762]

3 minutes ago, oracle79 said:

Depends mainly on the age group you're examining. Article link if interested (it's a conservative publication so you've been warned). The charts are from Netherlands because according to the article, the CDC hasn't published anything like it for the U.S.

https://www.conservativereview.com/news/horowitz-one-chart-exposes-lie-behind-universal-lockdowns/

 

I’m sure the CDC has these statistics, but for some reason it isn’t published in our media.  Florida seems to be doing the right thing with regard to the most vulnerable in our country (or any other country).  Each individual is responsible for his own health and well-being.

[japantiger 4,051]

I think it's clear, if we have any 75+ year old players and coaches, they should sit out this season.  Otherwise, anything other than filling  every SEC stadium to the brim is BS.

[AuburnArch13 185]

3 hours ago, Mikey said:

I don't know that I can find that chart again, I'll look later. Your numbers look solid, particularly for before my 2nd cup of coffee. Given that there is no win-win with this virus, I think the damage done by 36,000,000 people losing their jobs is much worse than 80,000 deaths, many of those being already sick people in nursing homes.

You’re right that there isn’t a win-win here. With any solution there will be trade offs between lives lost and economic loss. But the trade off isn’t 36,000,000 people losing their jobs vs 80,000 deaths. Those are both part of the same side of a trade off . The restrictions that have been put in place has kept the mortality total at 80,000 so far. Without them the total would be much higher, likely many multiples higher. It’s also not safe to assume that there would be no economic damage without the restrictions. If there were no restrictions and the death total spiked there would be economic fall out. Businesses would likely still fail, and jobs would still be lost. The trade off we  are looking at is 80,000+ deaths plus 36,000,000 currently lost jobs vs a counterfactual with many more deaths and (possibly) some deal smaller job loss. It’s hard to put numbers to the counterfactual without some sophisticated modeling, which is why personally I tend to differ to the consensus of epidemiologists and economists whenever possible.

[AuburnArch13 185]

2 hours ago, oracle79 said:

Depends mainly on the age group you're examining. Article link if interested (it's a conservative publication so you've been warned). The charts are from Netherlands because according to the article, the CDC hasn't published anything like it for the U.S.

https://www.conservativereview.com/news/horowitz-one-chart-exposes-lie-behind-universal-lockdowns/

 

Those numbers at first glance don’t look too unreasonable to me at first glance, understanding that they are likely making some assumptions. We’ve known for a while that the risk levels skew heavily with age and this tends to reflect that. You mentioned in another post an aggregate mortality rate of around .2% (or .002). That actually reflects what I’ve seen from folks in the epidemiological community. If you assume that we have that rate in the US currently, then the 80,000 deaths that we’ve had translates to around 40,000,000 total cases or about ~12.5% of the US population so far that has contracted the virus. I’m not an epidemiologist but none of those numbers jump out as being impossible so far.

Looking specifically at the numbers that you posted, a few things that might look encouraging at first, but scarier upon further inspection are the rates for  folks in the 50-69 ranges. While the death rates themselves don’t look nearly as scary as their older cohorts, the hospitalization rates are actually pretty high. This seems to indicate that the survival rates of people in this age group is highly dependent on them getting good treatment. What we’ve seen in some of the most hard hit places like Italy is that many people who might have survived given could treatment were lost when the hospitals were overwhelmed with patients and patients had to be triaged. That’s why the whole “flatten the curve” mantra started. It’s easy to imagine the mortality rate for certain groups going up substantially if they aren’t getting prompt and adequate treatment. 
 

With all that said, there are still a lot of unknowns such as how virus react in the warmer months and such. But even with the rough numbers and rates we’ve discussed it’s not hard to imagine the total US deaths jumping into the hundreds of thousands of this thing goes unchecked. Heck, we’re almost a 100,000 now, and that’s a lot of Americans... 

 

[Quietmaninthecorner 1,945]

 

8:06 PM 5-16-20

USA           confirmed cases 1,507,925  deaths  89,599    = 5.9%

New York      confirmed   358,187      deaths   27,878     =  7.8%

Alabama   confirmed   11,674        deaths  485       = 4.2%   

Lee County      Confirmed 448   Deaths  31    =  6.9%

* deaths lag behind the "cases confirmed." 

Even if we had 2 times more cases in Alabama than have been confirmed so far we are still  above 2%   

 

 

 

 

[ertrader 197]

I'm guessing actual infections way more than 2 times confirmed cases. Here in New York it's at minimum 5x and perhaps even 10x or more. And New York is testing at a far higher rate than Alabama (avg 144 vs 76 tests per 100000 per day are the numbers I saw). I'm not sure exactly what the testing protocols are in Alabama, but would not be shocking if the multiplier was 10X to 15X for Alabama.

[aubiefifty 16,695]

On 5/14/2020 at 9:02 AM, Mikey said:

I saw a chart yesterday showing that there is a 99.998% recovery rate from this virus. That, of course, only counts people known to have had the virus because they sought medical care or got tested. The actual recovery rate is probably ten times or more greater due to so many having only minor symptoms or having no symptoms at all.

Meantime, over 30 million Americans are out of work and are in a family financial crisis not knowing how they will pay the rent and light bill. It's way past time to end the madness. The questionable "cure" is far more damaging than the virus itself.

are you willing to be the first person to donate your life like you would let those in nursing homes do? whats next, the handicapped? you are not god and pardon me but you do not get to act like god. that is one of the coldest things i have ever heard anyone say. now you can post some long diatribe denying it but your words are there for all to see. so before you throw anyone under the bus because they are old or sick how about putting your own life and others first. i mean good grief you want 72 to go ahead and kick because he is very sick? you want to take him away from his kids? your remarks concerning this are some of the stupidest i have ever heard. you know the nazi's did that with the sick and handicapped right? life is precious and only the good lord should be able to make those decisions. by the way this should be in the political section...........but i refuse to let it slide.

[japantiger 4,051]

18 hours ago, AuburnArch13 said:

You’re right that there isn’t a win-win here. With any solution there will be trade offs between lives lost and economic loss. But the trade off isn’t 36,000,000 people losing their jobs vs 80,000 deaths. Those are both part of the same side of a trade off . The restrictions that have been put in place has kept the mortality total at 80,000 so far. Without them the total would be much higher, likely many multiples higher. It’s also not safe to assume that there would be no economic damage without the restrictions. If there were no restrictions and the death total spiked there would be economic fall out. Businesses would likely still fail, and jobs would still be lost. The trade off we  are looking at is 80,000+ deaths plus 36,000,000 currently lost jobs vs a counterfactual with many more deaths and (possibly) some deal smaller job loss. It’s hard to put numbers to the counterfactual without some sophisticated modeling, which is why personally I tend to differ to the consensus of epidemiologists and economists whenever possible.

Which restrictions have resulted in lowering the mortality rate?  According to Gov Cuomo of NY, the restriction policies account for the majority of deaths/cases.

“If you notice, 18% of the people came from nursing homes, less than 1% came from jail or prison, 2% came from the homeless population, 2% from other congregate facilities, but 66% of the people were at home, which is shocking to us,”

 

[Mikey 16,545]

42 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

are you willing to be the first person to donate your life like you would let those in nursing homes do? whats next, the handicapped? you are not god and pardon me but you do not get to act like god. that is one of the coldest things i have ever heard anyone say. now you can post some long diatribe denying it but your words are there for all to see. so before you throw anyone under the bus because they are old or sick how about putting your own life and others first. i mean good grief you want 72 to go ahead and kick because he is very sick? you want to take him away from his kids? your remarks concerning this are some of the stupidest i have ever heard. you know the nazi's did that with the sick and handicapped right? life is precious and only the good lord should be able to make those decisions. by the way this should be in the political section...........but i refuse to let it slide.

Man, did you ever jump to a bunch of unwarranted conclusions! The wild assumptions are things I won't address. As to the highlighted part, yes I am willing to take some risks in order to enjoy the freedom I should be able to enjoy as an American citizen. For the rest, see the excellent response by @japantiger , just above.

[Mikey 16,545]

21 hours ago, oracle79 said:

Depends mainly on the age group you're examining. Article link if interested (it's a conservative publication so you've been warned). The charts are from Netherlands because according to the article, the CDC hasn't published anything like it for the U.S.

https://www.conservativereview.com/news/horowitz-one-chart-exposes-lie-behind-universal-lockdowns/

 

That's a much better and more complete chart than the one I saw. That other one has apparently been taken down now.

[japantiger 4,051]

1 hour ago, Mikey said:

Man, did you ever jump to a bunch of unwarranted conclusions! The wild assumptions are things I won't address. As to the highlighted part, yes I am willing to take some risks in order to enjoy the freedom I should be able to enjoy as an American citizen. For the rest, see the excellent response by @japantiger , just above.

This headline perfectly sums up the current irrational; and blatantly, unconstitutional behaviors of our "betters" in government and Karen's the nation over.  Cases are slowing; so it has to be bad news...  

 

[AUsince72 11,084]

8 minutes ago, japantiger said:

This headline perfectly sums up the current irrational; and blatantly, unconstitutional behaviors of our "betters" in government and Karen's the nation over.  Cases are slowing; so it has to be bad news...  

 

Good info JapanTiger.

However, something else really jumped out at me too....

SIX BUCKS FOR A NEWSPAPER?!?!?!?!

[AuburnArch13 185]

2 hours ago, japantiger said:

Which restrictions have resulted in lowering the mortality rate?  According to Gov Cuomo of NY, the restriction policies account for the majority of deaths/cases.

“If you notice, 18% of the people came from nursing homes, less than 1% came from jail or prison, 2% came from the homeless population, 2% from other congregate facilities, but 66% of the people were at home, which is shocking to us,”

 

I’m not sure this means what you think it does... There were certainly hopes that social distancing would have proven more effective here than it has. But, regrettably there are large contingencies of people not taking it as seriously as they should, and we have also done a pretty poor job as a county moving quickly on things like testing and contact tracing. But there are plenty of examples of these measures being used across the globe with different intensities and different levels of success (though nearly always more successful than ours). If you truly believe that slowing the spread of a contagious disease is unaffected by minimizing the types of interactions whereby that disease is spread, then maybe you’re throwing the word “irrational” around a little too cavalierly. 

[aubiefifty 16,695]

2 hours ago, Mikey said:

Man, did you ever jump to a bunch of unwarranted conclusions! The wild assumptions are things I won't address. As to the highlighted part, yes I am willing to take some risks in order to enjoy the freedom I should be able to enjoy as an American citizen. For the rest, see the excellent response by @japantiger , just above.

you have every right to enjoy freedom as long as that freedom does not put anyone else in harms way. and we have been going over this....you and me..........before. you are just parenting trump. if he comes out and says he screwed up i bet you stay home. and i still believe in my heart from this post and another you were willing to let the chips fall where they may to open the economy. and i have not seen you say before i addressed you that vulnerable deserve protection. there a lot of folks jump you about one thing or another on this forum. enough with what you have written to make me suspect what we say. so pardon me if i do not feel bad. also i have seen you proven wrong on a number of occasions and still not admit you are wrong. i know in my heart you are willing to sacrifice others for your freedom but that is neither your call nor your right. trump and the right are playing fast and loose with people lives because he is afraid he will lose the reelection if the economy does not get started up again.

[japantiger 4,051]

33 minutes ago, AuburnArch13 said:

I’m not sure this means what you think it does... There were certainly hopes that social distancing would have proven more effective here than it has. But, regrettably there are large contingencies of people not taking it as seriously as they should, and we have also done a pretty poor job as a county moving quickly on things like testing and contact tracing. But there are plenty of examples of these measures being used across the globe with different intensities and different levels of success (though nearly always more successful than ours). If you truly believe that slowing the spread of a contagious disease is unaffected by minimizing the types of interactions whereby that disease is spread, then maybe you’re throwing the word “irrational” around a little too cavalierly. 

If it is this simple, show me the correlation...I look forward to seeing it.  I'm a pretty decent modeler; so if you can explain how you think it works; I'll help you track down the data and run some analysis.  I am sure finding a correlation between policies and death rates per 100k by state or similar view will just jump off the page.   You know, like comparing NY to say, GA or TX.  

Here's what does correlate to death.  Being over 65, locked up in a nursing home, locked up anywhere, obese, diabetic, heart disease, lung disease, cancer, etc..  Any of these individually puts you at risk; the combination of any drives the risk up by minimally 10x.  98% of deaths are from the old and sick.

Here's what doesn't correlate to death; eating out with friends and family, going to the beach, going to the park, surfing, hunting, fishing, having a beer, getting a hair cut, though I'm pretty sure if you get a Karen "bob" cut this puts you in the at-risk group.  In general, anything in the great outdoors doesn't put you at risk.  There is zero documentary evidence of being outside engaging in activities poses any risk.  

Play the damn ball games.  My God, I can't believe how we've become a nation of chicken sh**s.  If your old, sick, otherwise at risk; or just scared, stay home.  I don't care how you want to conduct your life.  The rest of us will do things that do matter; like washing our hands, keeping our hands off random things and out of our mouths (you know, stuff we learned in kindergarten); take our temps, etc.  But I'm done with the reason du'jour  (flatten the curve, no, we have to test more; no we have to hide under the bed until our all-wise overlords run out of reasons to violate our rights) for shutting down the nation.  It is un-American and immoral for an at risk or afraid-few to tell everyone else they can't make a living and support themselves and their families and fundamentally wreck the solvency of the nation.

War Eagle...Here's to hoping Gus makes a liar out of me this year....but this is likely Bama, A&M's or someone else's year given the returning starter/production info I've seen.  

 

 

[japantiger 4,051]

26 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

you have every right to enjoy freedom as long as that freedom does not put anyone else in harms way. and we have been going over this....you and me..........before. you are just parenting trump. if he comes out and says he screwed up i bet you stay home. and i still believe in my heart from this post and another you were willing to let the chips fall where they may to open the economy. and i have not seen you say before i addressed you that vulnerable deserve protection. there a lot of folks jump you about one thing or another on this forum. enough with what you have written to make me suspect what we say. so pardon me if i do not feel bad. also i have seen you proven wrong on a number of occasions and still not admit you are wrong. i know in my heart you are willing to sacrifice others for your freedom but that is neither your call nor your right. trump and the right are playing fast and loose with people lives because he is afraid he will lose the reelection if the economy does not get started up again.

If you are afraid or vulnerable, don't go out.  Problem solved.  My actions will have no impact on you. 

Also, every time any of us gets in a car, our freedoms put's the other one in harms way.  Life is a high risk endeavor.  

I don't get why we've suddenly forgotten everything we've learned from the prior 10,000 years of human civilization; you don't quarantine the healthy.  

[Quietmaninthecorner 1,945]

 

43 minutes ago, japantiger said:

  

Also, every time any of us gets in a car, our freedoms put's the other one in harms way.  Life is a high risk endeavor.  

I don't get why we've suddenly forgotten everything we've learned from the prior 10,000 years of human civilization; you don't quarantine the healthy.  

That is why there are rules and laws governing how fast you drive, who can drive, often when and where you can drive. and punishment for those putting the safety of the public at risk.   And car crashes are still not contagious. 

At this point in the pandemic those wondering around public willy-nilly are putting others at risk.  Not just those out in public with them,  but those people carrying it home or to others that are isolating for need.  they are a danger to the public. 

 

What we have learned in the last 10,000 years is:   before we knew to isolate we had 1918 flu type numbers.   don't forget. 

 

 

 

 

[japantiger 4,051]

On 5/17/2020 at 2:51 PM, Quietmaninthecorner said:

 

That is why there are rules and laws governing how fast you drive, who can drive, often when and where you can drive. and punishment for those putting the safety of the public at risk.   And car crashes are still not contagious. 

At this point in the pandemic those wondering around public willy-nilly are putting others at risk.  Not just those out in public with them,  but those people carrying it home or to others that are isolating for need.  they are a danger to the public. 

 

What we have learned in the last 10,000 years is:   before we knew to isolate we had 1918 flu type numbers.   don't forget. 

But we don't stop driving; do we?  40k die per year on the road.  That is 11 death per 100k; to put that into perspective; that is more deaths per 100k each and every year thanthe current Covid death rate in 32 of the 50 states.  But we still drive; we even let young folks drive; knowing that they are the most lethal behind the wheel...but we can't let them go to school even though there is no correlation between coronavirus and school kid deaths.  The TX auto death rate (13/100k) is 3x what the coronavirus death rate is (4/100k).  

You have no info to support your assertion on putting others at risk.  Just how would that happen?  Please explain...if you are hiding under your bed; how does me going "willy nilly" out to eat, to the mall, hunting, fishing, working, etc., pose any threat to you?   or to Memaw?  Somehow  you and Memaw were going to WalMarts, grocery stores and liquor stores just fine; and neither you nor those workers, Willy-nilly, everyday for the last 3 months experienced  mass casualties...

 

 

[Quietmaninthecorner 1,945]

1 hour ago, japantiger said:

   

You have no info to support your assertion on putting others at risk.    Just how would that happen?  Please explain...if you are hiding under your bed; how does me going "willy nilly" out to eat, to the mall, hunting, fishing, working, etc., pose any threat to you?   or to Memaw?  Somehow  you and Memaw were going to WalMarts, grocery stores and liquor stores just fine; and neither you nor those workers, Willy-nilly, everyday for the last 3 months experienced  mass casualties...

 

 That is 11 death per 100k; to put that into perspective; that is more deaths per 100k each and every year thanthe current Covid death rate in 32 of the 50 states

 

take oot the driving death numbers for the top 18 states if you are gong to compare it to the Covid states without the top 18 states.  Covid deaths are still growing.   and yet death is not the only issue.   Large  percentages of hospitalized covid survivors  are finding further serious issues. 

I have zero issues with hunting, fishing, camping, hiking etc.   The mall, Walmart and grocery stores are different.   ONE sick person can infect a cashier who may not realize it until after infecting lots of customers.   Some of those customers may bring it home to Meemaw,  or to a friend with an imunocompromised  child.  This is how diseases are spread.    They can open,  but people need to take precautions seriously  until we actually flatten the curve or get a vaccine. 

We still drive,  but again THERE ARE RULES AND LAWS " to obey.    Look up how many car deaths there were per driver back before  speed rules, drunk driving laws,  seat belts,  stop lights,  turn signals etc.     all cause by people driving around willy-nilly.   millions of lives have been saved by restriction on driving.  If people would have used common sense ,  most of these laws wouldn't be needed.  But there are always the few that would continue to drive drunk or ridiculously fast or not look at a crossroad,  so we had to make laws and rules.  Same with the virus  while cases are growing.

 During some emergencies and disasters  we are made to stop driving in the area completely.       in pandemic terms.  you may have to curb your lifestyle.   

 

 If you can not see how it puts others at risk,  you need to look up how  viruses spread.    How do you think you catch any cold, flu, bug or virus.  It doesn't just magically appear.  It comes from someone with the disease.    The more contact ,  the more likely for transfer.    

No one  is hiding under the bed.  It is called being a mature responsible adult.   

91,000 extra deaths IS  mass casualties. 

 

[japantiger 4,051]

2 hours ago, Quietmaninthecorner said:

 

take oot the driving death numbers for the top 18 states if you are gong to compare it to the Covid states without the top 18 states.  Covid deaths are still growing.   and yet death is not the only issue.   Large  percentages of hospitalized covid survivors  are finding further serious issues. 

I have zero issues with hunting, fishing, camping, hiking etc.   The mall, Walmart and grocery stores are different.   ONE sick person can infect a cashier who may not realize it until after infecting lots of customers.   Some of those customers may bring it home to Meemaw,  or to a friend with an imunocompromised  child.  This is how diseases are spread.    They can open,  but people need to take precautions seriously  until we actually flatten the curve or get a vaccine. 

We still drive,  but again THERE ARE RULES AND LAWS " to obey.    Look up how many car deaths there were per driver back before  speed rules, drunk driving laws,  seat belts,  stop lights,  turn signals etc.     all cause by people driving around willy-nilly.   millions of lives have been saved by restriction on driving.  If people would have used common sense ,  most of these laws wouldn't be needed.  But there are always the few that would continue to drive drunk or ridiculously fast or not look at a crossroad,  so we had to make laws and rules.  Same with the virus  while cases are growing.

 During some emergencies and disasters  we are made to stop driving in the area completely.       in pandemic terms.  you may have to curb your lifestyle.   

 

 If you can not see how it puts others at risk,  you need to look up how  viruses spread.    How do you think you catch any cold, flu, bug or virus.  It doesn't just magically appear.  It comes from someone with the disease.    The more contact ,  the more likely for transfer.    

No one  is hiding under the bed.  It is called being a mature responsible adult.   

91,000 extra deaths IS  mass casualties. 

 

So you have no data....just more hysteria.   Please point out to me all the deaths in Walmart and grocery store populations.  I'll save you some time...there aren't any.  If there were any, every reporter in America would have reported it and it would be the lead on every CNN show that no one watches.  Show me...post data.    

Come to think of it, since this is a thread about Auburn playing football this fall; Auburn and the SEC should just play inside WalMart super centers since they seem to be the safest place in America...and they are big enough.  Top it off with selling lots of booze; and you get 2x the protection and everyone is happy to boot....

And back to good old Gov Nipple-rings Cuomo; who tried to deflect from his incompetence at forcing sick people back into nursing homes; had another moment of candor today.  On top of his prior admission and "shock" that 84% of the deaths came from people that were illegally confined; today we got  “Older people, vulnerable people are going to die from this virus, despite whatever you do,”  

This just won't do...we can't have a politician telling the truth.

[Mikey 16,545]

8 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

you have every right to enjoy freedom as long as that freedom does not put anyone else in harms way. and we have been going over this....you and me..........before. you are just parenting trump. if he comes out and says he screwed up i bet you stay home. and i still believe in my heart from this post and another you were willing to let the chips fall where they may to open the economy. and i have not seen you say before i addressed you that vulnerable deserve protection. there a lot of folks jump you about one thing or another on this forum. enough with what you have written to make me suspect what we say. so pardon me if i do not feel bad. also i have seen you proven wrong on a number of occasions and still not admit you are wrong. i know in my heart you are willing to sacrifice others for your freedom but that is neither your call nor your right. trump and the right are playing fast and loose with people lives because he is afraid he will lose the reelection if the economy does not get started up again.

There is no explanation for this post except that you had been drinking for some extended time when you wrote it. I hope you drink quality stuff that won't cause a bad hangover.

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,641]

On 5/16/2020 at 1:57 PM, japantiger said:

Otherwise, anything other than filling  every SEC stadium to the brim is BS.

Based on what