ga lied....what do you expect from Kemp?

[SaltyTiger 7,790]

10 hours ago, SocialCircle said:

If a definitive diagnosis cannot be made, but it is suspected or likely, it (Covid-19) can be reported as possible or presumed. 

Sounds like a reasonable and useful assumption. My guess is that testing is possible in most cases.

"However, please note that testing for COVID–19 should be conducted whenever possible."

[SocialCircle 570]

9 hours ago, TexasTiger said:

Just how many patients with Covid do you think are dying in hospitals of something else?

I don’t have a clue. However, all evidence I see indicates if anything the number of deaths caused by Covid-19 is over reported in the US and under reported in many other countries. 

[SocialCircle 570]

44 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

Sounds like a reasonable and useful assumption. My guess is that testing is possible in most cases.

"However, please note that testing for COVID–19 should be conducted whenever possible."

I think it is today but wasn’t earlier. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

Just got another $25 back from USAA. I keep waiting for our bill to land but they just keep giving me money. Not a meaningful amount, but still a lot nicer than seeing another installment due. 

[TexasTiger 12,831]

1 hour ago, SocialCircle said:

I don’t have a clue. However, all evidence I see indicates if anything the number of deaths caused by Covid-19 is over reported in the US and under reported in many other countries. 

In other words, the evidence didn’t alter your prior belief reached without looking at evidence.

[SaltyTiger 7,790]

1 hour ago, SocialCircle said:

I think it is today but wasn’t earlier. 

Would feel confident that testing  is available today. The numbers may be a little skewed based on best assumptions early on. Have serious doubts that they are off enough to warrant heartburn. 

[SocialCircle 570]

1 hour ago, TexasTiger said:

In other words, the evidence didn’t alter your prior belief reached without looking at evidence.

Your statement is illogical. Of course, I had looked at the evidence I posted prior to coming to the opinion Covid-19 deaths are over reported.  All evidence I have seen posted here only adds more evidence that Covid-19 deaths have been over reported in the US. I've already explained why. If you disagree with my reasoning as to why, then explain and I'm happy to discuss. 

[SocialCircle 570]

28 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

Would feel confident that testing  is available today. The numbers may be a little skewed based on best assumptions early on. Have serious doubts that they are off enough to warrant heartburn. 

The evidence suggests they have been over reported in the US and likely under reported in some other countries.  It is very hard for anyone to determine by how much based on the evidence.  I don't think we will ever know.  

[TexasTiger 12,831]

1 hour ago, SocialCircle said:

Your statement is illogical. Of course, I had looked at the evidence I posted prior to coming to the opinion Covid-19 deaths are over reported.  All evidence I have seen posted here only adds more evidence that Covid-19 deaths have been over reported in the US. I've already explained why. If you disagree with my reasoning as to why, then explain and I'm happy to discuss. 

You haven’t provided any evidence of your conclusion. Your assertion is that there are people with Covid-19 in hospitals, but dying from unrelated issues. Logic dictates any such cases would be very small. How many folks are dying from heart attacks and other Covid related issues who are not in hospitals at the time?

[McLoofus 35,182]

6 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

Logic dictates any such cases would be very small.

That's what I keep going back to. Sure, it's probably happening. But until numbers are produced- not that numbers can be trusted, especially in Georgia- then, like the "more suicides" thing, it's just a straw being grasped at in service of an established viewpoint. 

[I_M4_AU 7,801]

From CNN:

The group is sounding the alarm that the growing unemployment crisis, economic downturns and stress caused by isolation and lack of a definitive end date for the pandemic could significantly increase so-called "deaths of despair" unless local, state and federal authorities take action.

"Unless we get comprehensive federal, state, and local resources behind improving access to high quality mental health treatments and community supports, I worry we're likely to see things get far worse when it comes to substance misuse and suicide," Well Being Trust's chief strategy officer Dr. Benjamin F. Miller told CNN.

Experts warn of urgent need for Covid-19 mental health research

Miller emphasized the data is just a projection, and that actions taken could change the number of deaths.  "We can change the numbers -- the deaths have not happened yet. However, it is on us to take action now," Miller says.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/08/health/coronavirus-deaths-of-despair/index.html

If you believed the modeling of deaths by scientists for the Coronavirus, but deny the possibility of increased deaths because of despair, you might be politicizing this thing.

[SocialCircle 570]

1 hour ago, TexasTiger said:

You haven’t provided any evidence of your conclusion. Your assertion is that there are people with Covid-19 in hospitals, but dying from unrelated issues. Logic dictates any such cases would be very small. How many folks are dying from heart attacks and other Covid related issues who are not in hospitals at the time?

I have provided evidence including but not limited to guidance from the CDC and an official telling you the US is reporting Covid-19 deaths liberally and telling you someone who dies and has Covid-19 at the time of death is reported as a Covid-19 death. I can't help that you are ignoring or discounting it, but that is your right.  Someone doesn't have to die in a hospital to be counted as a Covid-19 death or to be listed with any other cause as death. 

[SocialCircle 570]

Meanwhile........more data supporting Kemp's decision to reopen: 

[TexasTiger 12,831]

13 minutes ago, SocialCircle said:

I have provided evidence including but not limited to guidance from the CDC and an official telling you the US is reporting Covid-19 deaths liberally and telling you someone who dies and has Covid-19 at the time of death is reported as a Covid-19 death. I can't help that you are ignoring or discounting it, but that is your right.  Someone doesn't have to die in a hospital to be counted as a Covid-19 death or to be listed with any other cause as death. 

You have zero evidence that people dying of something other than Covid are being labeled as Covid deaths. You have speculation that meets your political narrative.

[SocialCircle 570]

11 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

You have zero evidence that people dying of something other than Covid are being labeled as Covid deaths. You have speculation that meets your political narrative.

There is direct evidence for everyone to see. Haven’t you seen the reports of where this has been documented as having happened already? The other direct evidence I have is from doctors I personally know and who are friends of mine. Add this to the CDC guidance and the statement from the official telling you someone who dies with Covid-19 is reported as a Covid-19 death, etc....

The evidence is clear. The degree it has happened is unclear. 
 

Also, I am not interested in speculation or politic narratives, but I am interested in the truth. 

[SocialCircle 570]

2 hours ago, TexasTiger said:

You haven’t provided any evidence of your conclusion. Your assertion is that there are people with Covid-19 in hospitals, but dying from unrelated issues. Logic dictates any such cases would be very small. How many folks are dying from heart attacks and other Covid related issues who are not in hospitals at the time?

I am simply saying the evidence suggests Covid-19 deaths are being over reported in the US.  

[TexasTiger 12,831]

23 minutes ago, SocialCircle said:

There is direct evidence for everyone to see. Haven’t you seen the reports of where this has been documented as having happened already? The other direct evidence I have is from doctors I personally know and who are friends of mine. Add this to the CDC guidance and the statement from the official telling you someone who dies with Covid-19 is reported as a Covid-19 death, etc....

The evidence is clear. The degree it has happened is unclear. 
 

Also, I am not interested in speculation or politic narratives, but I am interested in the truth. 

You know doctors committing fraud? If not, what are actual causes of death they are attributing to Covid?

[SocialCircle 570]

1 minute ago, TexasTiger said:

You know doctors committing fraud? If not, what are actual causes of death they are attributing to Covid?

There have already been folks caught over reporting Covid-19 deaths in the US.  It is already out there for everyone to see. 

We are going around in circles now.  It isn't necessarily fraud when the CDC says you can assume the cause of death and when the official tells you someone who has Covid-19 at the time of death is reported as a Covid-19 death.  

[NolaAuTiger 3,295]

8 minutes ago, SocialCircle said:

I am simply saying the evidence suggests Covid-19 deaths are being over reported in the US.  

You are correct.

[TexasTiger 12,831]

21 minutes ago, SocialCircle said:

There have already been folks caught over reporting Covid-19 deaths in the US.  It is already out there for everyone to see. 

We are going around in circles now.  It isn't necessarily fraud when the CDC says you can assume the cause of death and when the official tells you someone who has Covid-19 at the time of death is reported as a Covid-19 death.  

But what are they actually dying of? I haven’t seen you provide any evidence that a person is actually dying of something totally unrelated to Covid, but being reported as Covid.

[SocialCircle 570]

1 hour ago, TexasTiger said:

But what are they actually dying of? I haven’t seen you provide any evidence that a person is actually dying of something totally unrelated to Covid, but being reported as Covid.

In April the Virginia Dept. of Health said they are including "probable" deaths from Covid-19 as Covid- 19 deaths without testing. This isn't "fraud" because of the guidelines from the CDC. Anyone who dies of anything and happens to have Covid-19 at the time of death can be counted as a Covid-19 death per those guidelines.   One example is a man in Colorado who died of alcohol poisoning and happened to test positive for Covid-19 at the time of his death, but was asymptomatic. At the time he was counted as a Covid-19 death.  

[TexasTiger 12,831]

53 minutes ago, SocialCircle said:

In April the Virginia Dept. of Health said they are including "probable" deaths from Covid-19 as Covid- 19 deaths without testing. This isn't "fraud" because of the guidelines from the CDC. Anyone who dies of anything and happens to have Covid-19 at the time of death can be counted as a Covid-19 death per those guidelines.   One example is a man in Colorado who died of alcohol poisoning and happened to test positive for Covid-19 at the time of his death, but was asymptomatic. At the time he was counted as a Covid-19 death.  

And I’d say the number of those anecdotal cases is likely pretty small. I’ve seen no evidence to indicate otherwise. And “probable” cause of death? That means there’s evidence indicating it’s likely.

[SocialCircle 570]

52 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

And I’d say the number of those anecdotal cases is likely pretty small. I’ve seen no evidence to indicate otherwise. And “probable” cause of death? That means there’s evidence indicating it’s likely.

Let’s ignore the fact the guidance from the CDC says anybody who has Covid-19 at the time of their death is counted as a Covid -19 death. Probable without testing per my doctor friends is indeed allowing deaths to be counted as Covid-19 that aren’t caused by Covid-19. This is likely because most Covid-19 reported deaths pay more at a time when hospitals are bleeding cash and laying people off. 

[TexasTiger 12,831]

1 hour ago, SocialCircle said:

Let’s ignore the fact the guidance from the CDC says anybody who has Covid-19 at the time of their death is counted as a Covid -19 death. Probable without testing per my doctor friends is indeed allowing deaths to be counted as Covid-19 that aren’t caused by Covid-19. This is likely because most Covid-19 reported deaths pay more at a time when hospitals are bleeding cash and laying people off. 

Got a legit official link to that supposed “fact?”

https://emergency.cdc.gov/coca/ppt/2020/Final_COCA_Call_Slides_04_16_2020.pdf

All deaths of those with Covid are “reported” to the CDC, but not attributed to Covid as the cause of death unless that’s the medical judgment of the doctor/medical examiner/coroner.

[SocialCircle 570]

1 hour ago, TexasTiger said:

Got a legit official link to that supposed “fact?”

https://emergency.cdc.gov/coca/ppt/2020/Final_COCA_Call_Slides_04_16_2020.pdf

All deaths of those with Covid are “reported” to the CDC, but not attributed to Covid as the cause of death unless that’s the medical judgment of the doctor/medical examiner/coroner.

That is one of my points. It can be reported as Covid-19 based on judgement. Do think money can cloud judgement? The video I posted by the official(Brix- I think her name is) said someone who dies with Covid-19 is counted as a Covid-19 death. Colorado did report someone as a Covid-19 death because they died of alcohol poisoning.