Minneapolis police kill unresisting black man

[aubiefifty 16,718]

1 minute ago, Gowebb11 said:

Amen. 

the sad shame of all this is if you speak out against this kind of injustice you are a cop hater. i admire the cops that do it right. they put their lives on the line every single day. now some want to put others lives on the line and mostly get away with it.

[DKW 86 7,411]

[Gowebb11 9,309]

7 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

the sad shame of all this is if you speak out against this kind of injustice you are a cop hater. i admire the cops that do it right. they put their lives on the line every single day. now some want to put others lives on the line and mostly get away with it.

Agreed. I’ve been on the other side of this argument until the past few years. There are certainly good cops, but there are a lot more bad seeds than we like to believe. A few days ago in our local Kroger, a small woman was being arrested for apparently shoplifting. She was no threat to anyone and not resisting in any way. There were 4 deputies present and three cars all with sirens flashing. They they could have walked her to a patrol car in 30 seconds but kept her handcuffed inside the store for about 20 minutes. Overkill at its finest. 

[I_M4_AU 7,773]

3 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

anyone else notice how few of the regulars on these boards have not said a word about any of this? not sure about the rest of you but it makes me wonder.

I haven’t said anything on this or the Arbery thread as all the facts have not been presented.  Most of the posters are running on emotion right now and I prefer to see how things turn out before engaging. JMO.

[AUDub 11,131]

4 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

not arguing but to me to me the charges made it worse. that cop killed that man because he did not care. to me that is the bottom line.

There's a diffence between "I'm going to kill him (2nd degree murder)" and "He can die, for all I care (depraved heart murder)."

A 2nd degree charge would require proof that the officer wanted to kill him by doing what he did. That will be very difficult to prove.

The 3rd degree charge is well established from the video alone, and is probably appropriate.

Quote

i also have another theory but folks will laugh but years ago i read the white hate groups were infiltrating the police force and even the military to learn military tactics. same with gang members.

Militia groups and the like love to recruit from the military and law enforcement. 

[aubiefifty 16,718]

16 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

I haven’t said anything on this or the Arbery thread as all the facts have not been presented.  Most of the posters are running on emotion right now and I prefer to see how things turn out before engaging. JMO.

i smell something and it is not teen spirit............it was all videoed. the man died and it finally arrested for murder AND he 18 complaints against him. how much you need. you agree with ol trmpies statement i bet.

[AUDub 11,131]

20 hours ago, NolaAuTiger said:

3rd-degree murder as the highest charge? Interesting. The same categorical charge one would receive in Minnesota for selling "bad" drugs to another, after said drugs result in death. 

Correct me if my cursory reading of their criminal statutes is wrong. 

 

18 hours ago, AUDub said:

Basically manslaughter. 

Further on this, Nola.

From reading the statutes, it looks like what differentiates the murder from the manslaughter charge is gross negligence vs. negligence.

Manslaughter - blow a red light and hit a pedestrian at a busy intersection while driving because you were posting on AUFamily on your phone.

Murder - blow a red light and hit a pedestrian at a busy intersection while tearing down the road at 100 mph in a 30 mph zone while posting on AUFamily and taking an absolute ripper from a bong.

[I_M4_AU 7,773]

3 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

i smell something and it is not teen spirit............it was all videoed. the man died and it finally arrested for murder AND he 18 complaints against him. how much you need. you agree with ol trmpies statement i bet.

I would like to see the results of an autopsy for starters.  Videos just show the actions and you seem to have already determined his intent.  He is allowed a defense.  Don’t try to lump me in with any other group, I can think for myself.

Your response is why a lot of us do not reply to situations like this, you give an honest answer that shouldn’t offend anybody and all you get is virtue signaling.

[Mims44 1,864]

2 hours ago, cole256 said:

Well I'm not going to argue, I can just tell you what I've experienced and I can tell you the overall tone. Now it's up to you to believe it or not or you can trick yourself to think it's different. I would bet all the money that I have though the same people that said the things that they said in every other case now either just want to talk about a riot or there's a huge but somewhere in the sentence he shouldn't have been killed....BUT.....

 

And lastly the silence, people that you know that have an opinion on the smallest of issues now are absent. Those patriots that just want justice and they don't care about color that will rip your head off if you even suggest that it a situation could have been handled better....nothing

 

But what do I know I bring up examples and show differences and I'm told this doesn't even exist...I'm just living it I guess you all can think I'm still lying about it or some of you know better of what you see....my question was always why would you think you would see it if you're not a minority? Why do you think millions of people are lying to you? But that's just me.

Oh, and I didn't mean to sound like I was wanting to argue. 

And I didn't mean that I believed the problem was fixed, or gone away. I was just noting that public opinion was not as varied this time around. You know me from about a decade of posting on different forums now, I'm almost always tryna be cheerful and look for some type of positive... and it hurts to say I don't believe this man will get the justice he deserves, and the American people, while overall angry, still aren't ready to force the issues needed to change.

 

1 hour ago, DKW 86 said:

He will be out before the warranty runs out on his car.

I hate that you're right.

[Mims44 1,864]

57 minutes ago, AUDub said:

There's a diffence between "I'm going to kill him (2nd degree murder)" and "He can die, for all I care (depraved heart murder)."

A 2nd degree charge would require proof that the officer wanted to kill him by doing what he did. That will be very difficult to prove.

The 3rd degree charge is well established from the video alone, and is probably appropriate.

Militia groups and the like love to recruit from the military and law enforcement. 

Is that because he used a knee? If so that seems weak.

If I use my hands around a mans neck and continue squeezing as he begs for his life, and I continue to squeeze until he is dead. I imagine people would would say I wanted to kill him.

[Gowebb11 9,309]

1 hour ago, AUDub said:

There's a diffence between "I'm going to kill him (2nd degree murder)" and "He can die, for all I care (depraved heart murder)."

Absolutely in a court of law. Unfortunately, there’s no difference to the guy murdered.  I wish our courts saw it a little more clearly. 

[AUDub 11,131]

41 minutes ago, Mims44 said:

Is that because he used a knee? If so that seems weak.

If I use my hands around a mans neck and continue squeezing as he begs for his life, and I continue to squeeze until he is dead. I imagine people would would say I wanted to kill him.

Chauvin has probably used the same irresponsible method of restraining people in the past and gotten away with it.

 

Intent is going to be very hard to establish to the jury, and an acquittal would not be a good thing. Freeman is probably charging him with the slam dunk.

[cole256 17,039]

I'm running off emotion right now because I'm the hunted. When it's not you it's easy to sit back and chill. You can see plain as day what happened but they want blood work and his background because they want to assassinate his character. When terriost stuff got big you best believe some new laws were created, other laws updated because look at who is the threat. You could actually kill a terrorist and it wouldn't be a big deal. Wouldn't have people saying wait for due process and all of that. Wouldn't be worried about well have to charge him low to make sure he gets something....

But we all know these laws weren't created with us in mind. 

[cole256 17,039]

2 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

I would like to see the results of an autopsy for starters.  Videos just show the actions and you seem to have already determined his intent.  He is allowed a defense.  Don’t try to lump me in with any other group, I can think for myself.

Your response is why a lot of us do not reply to situations like this, you give an honest answer that shouldn’t offend anybody and all you get is virtue signaling.

But other responses doesn't cause alot of you to not reply on other topics? On other topics on here many take offending people as a badge of honor on here and love to show it off. 

[AUDub 11,131]

39 minutes ago, Gowebb11 said:

Absolutely in a court of law. Unfortunately, there’s no difference to the guy murdered.  I wish our courts saw it a little more clearly. 

What would you like them to see more clearly? 

[I_M4_AU 7,773]

15 minutes ago, cole256 said:

But other responses doesn't cause alot of you to not reply on other topics? On other topics on here many take offending people as a badge of honor on here and love to show it off. 

You’re correct, and it is unfortunate this happens.  It drives people away and prevents others from entering and giving their opinions.  This subject is very *supercharged* and any statement that is perceived to be not the proper response will be jumped on as my OP suggests.

I will say IMO, at the very least, the cop is guilty of abuse of power.  The rest will have to wait on the facts.

[alexava 6,973]

I guess now we have to wait on the second autopsy. 

[Gowebb11 9,309]

1 hour ago, AUDub said:

What would you like them to see more clearly? 

Poorly worded on my part.  I  just don't believe we need as many degrees and caveats for murder. I would prefer a smaller menu for the purposes of charges. 

[AUDub 11,131]

20 minutes ago, Gowebb11 said:

Poorly worded on my part.  I  just don't believe we need as many degrees and caveats for murder. I would prefer a smaller menu for the purposes of charges. 

We have to differentiate because you can't punish every homicide the same way.

[wdefromtx 3,159]

2 hours ago, cole256 said:

I'm running off emotion right now because I'm the hunted. When it's not you it's easy to sit back and chill. You can see plain as day what happened but they want blood work and his background because they want to assassinate his character. When terriost stuff got big you best believe some new laws were created, other laws updated because look at who is the threat. You could actually kill a terrorist and it wouldn't be a big deal. Wouldn't have people saying wait for due process and all of that. Wouldn't be worried about well have to charge him low to make sure he gets something....

But we all know these laws weren't created with us in mind. 

Character assasinatiom is always going to be part of the defense. Look at rape cases and they almost always try to frame them in a bad light and say they were “asking for it.”  It doesn’t matter to me his bloodwork or background because it’s irrelevant to what happened to him. Hell we all have done stuff that we aren’t proud of in the past, but it doesn’t mean we are still the same person. In Houston everyone that knew him (he was from Houston) all said he was a likeable standup guy. 

Hopefully most people have the sense to realize the defense tactics. If they want to assasinate someone’s character, it needs to be the officer’s. 

 

[creed 1,629]

If I'm the lawyer for Mr. Floyd I'm going to use the MPD's policeing manuals against the cop and the department. I seriously doubt there isn't a section on how to subdue, secure and isolate a person that treats individuals as people and protects both the defendant and cop making the arrest. The cop followed his own agenda in this case and should get the maximum. 

[cole256 17,039]

4 hours ago, Mims44 said:

Oh, and I didn't mean to sound like I was wanting to argue. 

And I didn't mean that I believed the problem was fixed, or gone away. I was just noting that public opinion was not as varied this time around. You know me from about a decade of posting on different forums now, I'm almost always tryna be cheerful and look for some type of positive... and it hurts to say I don't believe this man will get the justice he deserves, and the American people, while overall angry, still aren't ready to force the issues needed to change.

 

I hate that you're right.

Hey man, I just wanted to say we have been laughing at each other since I was pretty much a kid so I don't want to come across or I don't want you to take me the wrong way. I hope many on here knows my heart and know I don't mean any ill will to any of you. I'm just so frustrated and to be honest somewhat scared and I know many of you know especially as men we don't like to feel like that, for ourselves or for our loved ones.....I've spent most of my life being the only black person at schools, all the way up to the industry I work in now....And I know the only way this stops is if people stand with me. So it hurts when you see guys you thought were your friends just stand pat and zip up at times like this. 

 

Like I said the silence has been the most frustrating and hurtful part.

[cole256 17,039]

48 minutes ago, wdefromtx said:

Character assasinatiom is always going to be part of the defense. Look at rape cases and they almost always try to frame them in a bad light and say they were “asking for it.”  It doesn’t matter to me his bloodwork or background because it’s irrelevant to what happened to him. Hell we all have done stuff that we aren’t proud of in the past, but it doesn’t mean we are still the same person. In Houston everyone that knew him (he was from Houston) all said he was a likeable standup guy. 

Hopefully most people have the sense to realize the defense tactics. If they want to assasinate someone’s character, it needs to be the officer’s. 

 

I agree for the most part but I feel the Trayvon Martin case set a horrible precedent with digging up anything to make it ok to kill (especially a black male) and people have run with it. Zimmerman got endorsements and became a mini celebrity, other men were killed by policemen and absolutely NOTHING was done but time off with pay, so there's no repercussions. You literally were given vacations and made a victim for pulling the trigger.....literally some defenses was ooops and let's move on. 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

2 hours ago, cole256 said:

I agree for the most part but I feel the Trayvon Martin case set a horrible precedent with digging up anything to make it ok to kill (especially a black male) and people have run with it. Zimmerman got endorsements and became a mini celebrity, other men were killed by policemen and absolutely NOTHING was done but time off with pay, so there's no repercussions. You literally were given vacations and made a victim for pulling the trigger.....literally some defenses was ooops and let's move on. 

I think one of the main differences is that this time it was at front and center on camera. In some of the previous cases there was some margin available to create reasonable doubt (which in most cases I attribute it to how defense attorneys cast the doubt.) My wife has been on some juries for violent crimes and said she lost a lot of faith in our justice system in how the attorneys play with the jurors minds. For the rest of us watching the cases I honestly think when they have this area of doubt it allows people to ignore the ugly truth and stick their head in the sand.  I may not be explaining it good, but it goes inline with the fact that we don’t have to deal with it on a daily basis and some punk out and choose to ignore it. When in reality they are perpetuating this by allowing others to do it. 

[ShocksMyBrain 9,362]

Killer Mike(ATL) had a great speech on what’s happening. 

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/killer-mike-speech-atlanta-protestors-press-conference-1007816/