SEC targets late July for COVID-19 decision-making

[AU_Tiger_88 417]

6 hours ago, McLoofus said:

It's not nearly that simple for a lot of people and a lot of the types of business they need to do.

There is no valid argument against wearing a mask. 

There is a valid argument for not wearing a mask.  If you have severe asthma it can trigger an attack.  Also, if you have already had COVID they have yet to prove that you can re-acquire the virus.  So if you have already had it what is the point to wearing a mask?  Just to make others feel better?  Also, most of these so called masks that people are wearing mainly just a piece of cloth over their face, doesn't stop the virus from going through it.   For example:  In one study, a mask that used 16 layers of handkerchief fabric was able to filter out 63 percent of 300-nanometer-sized particles. (The coronavirus is between 50 to 200 nanometers in diameter.) Most people are only using one layer...so it is more to protect people from coughing/sneezing on others.  That is if they wear it on their nose which I see a ton of people who don't.

[DAG 33,977]

17 minutes ago, AU_Tiger_88 said:

No mandates where I live.  Also, it is a choice here. 

It’s a choice whether it is mandated or not. It’s up to you to face whatever comes your way by the decisions you make 

[AU_Tiger_88 417]

1 minute ago, DAG said:

It’s a choice whether it is mandated or not. It’s up to you to face whatever comes your way by the decisions you make 

I agree it is a choice and there are consequences with everything you choose to do whether they are good or bad consequences.  However, the panic that has been spread by the media and pundits should be addressed at some point.  I am all for taking precautions but it is up to individuals to also take precautions to protect themselves.

[ShocksMyBrain 9,362]

1 hour ago, DAG said:

It’s a choice whether it is mandated or not. It’s up to you to face whatever comes your way by the decisions you make 

And not bitch when a shop says you can’t come in because they require it. 

[passthebiscuits 6,844]

Talked to high-ranking official in medicine today. Common belief right now is that SEC will back up play to 2nd week of September with an SEC-only tilt and one...meaning leave it up to the school to decide which “and one” game to schedule. 
 

We are still tentatively tied to Tennessee, but UT wants the game there. 
UNC is also a high priority for the “and one.” 

[AUsince72 11,084]

12 hours ago, AU_Tiger_88 said:

12 hours ago, DAG said:

It’s a choice whether it is mandated or not. It’s up to you to face whatever comes your way by the decisions you make 

I agree it is a choice and there are consequences with everything you choose to do whether they are good or bad consequences.  However, the panic that has been spread by the media and pundits should be addressed at some point.  I am all for taking precautions but it is up to individuals to also take precautions to protect themselves.

And therein lies a good example of my point previously.

You're both right.  Yet you discussed as reasonable adults without resorting to name-calling, attacking, nor denying our country's freedoms.

You "A" (the American individual protected by our country's freedoms) shouldn't have to wear a mask if you don't want to, or can't (and yes, can't is a thing.  I barely can breathe in them down here, in SW Fla, in July, with 110 deg heat indexes & tropical humidity whether it's admitted here or not).

You "B" (the establishment owner also protected by our country's freedoms) should be able to mandate who can & cannot come into said establishment.  You should be able to say "NO SOUP FOR YOU!" as it is your private place of business (or club, or whatever). 

Then "A" has a choice to make and can decide to keep the OTHER establishment open with their money.  And likewise someone who WANTS a mask can wear it wherever they wish.  Even in your car....by yourself....with nobody within 50' of you.....if that's your jam.

There, 2 Auburn Men acting like Auburn Men should.  No "you're evil" or "you're stupid"!  Nice.

These are actually no different than the very same choices we Americans have made forever and many in this country, and this site even, are so blinded by fear they've completely lost sight of that.

Starbucks charges $10 for a small coffee?  Go to McDonald's instead.

McDonald's has a 72% health rating and you've seen the fry cook not wash his hands?  Go to Five Guys instead.

Although Five Guys may be a bad example as they're helping perpetuate the cashless society ridiculousness now....but I digress.

[DAG 33,977]

59 minutes ago, AUsince72 said:

And therein lies a good example of my point previously.

You're both right.  Yet you discussed as reasonable adults without resorting to name-calling, attacking, nor denying our country's freedoms.

You "A" (the American individual protected by our country's freedoms) shouldn't have to wear a mask if you don't want to, or can't (and yes, can't is a thing.  I barely can breathe in them down here, in SW Fla, in July, with 110 deg heat indexes & tropical humidity whether it's admitted here or not).

You "B" (the establishment owner also protected by our country's freedoms) should be able to mandate who can & cannot come into said establishment.  You should be able to say "NO SOUP FOR YOU!" as it is your private place of business (or club, or whatever). 

Then "A" has a choice to make and can decide to keep the OTHER establishment open with their money.  And likewise someone who WANTS a mask can wear it wherever they wish.  Even in your car....by yourself....with nobody within 50' of you.....if that's your jam.

There, 2 Auburn Men acting like Auburn Men should.  No "you're evil" or "you're stupid"!  Nice.

These are actually no different than the very same choices we Americans have made forever and many in this country, and this site even, are so blinded by fear they've completely lost sight of that.

Starbucks charges $10 for a small coffee?  Go to McDonald's instead.

McDonald's has a 72% health rating and you've seen the fry cook not wash his hands?  Go to Five Guys instead.

Although Give guys may be a bad example as they're helping perpetuate the cashless society ridiculousness now....but I digress.

I can understand your frustration about some of the fighting . However, as good as dialogue may be, I do empathize with the other side as well. IMO, wearing a mask is not a hard thing to ask. Again, it is of my opinion that most people who choose not to do it , do not give much validity to that choice other than it is my right and I am not going to let anyone control me. I can respect that , but I also wish they will respect healthcare workers wishes to sign away their ability to be admitted . It is super frustrating as a healthcare provider when primary prevention is asked and folks just choose not to do it,  but then when tertiary prevention is needed, the healthcare workers are the one in the brunt of it all. In the brunt of angered patients, family members, doctors , etc. Some will say, you signed up for this , but the reality is we signed up to be frontline staff and educators . When we do educate and it goes on to deaf ears, that is a problem in my eyes. 

[DAG 33,977]

Also, I want to say the NBA is doing a fantastic job. I think I read they tested well over a couple hundred athletes and all were negative. A big reason is how specific, detailed and thorough they have gone to keep everyone safe. Yes, it is annoying. Yes, they are playing in a bubble. Yes, they have rules that they have to abide by,  but it seems to be very effective. 

[gr82be 14,423]

1 hour ago, AUsince72 said:

Go to Five Guys instead.

Although Give guys may be a bad example as they're helping perpetuate the cashless society ridiculousness now....but I digress.

Wasn't aware of that being the case since I have to avoid certain types of foods but the ridiculousness is running rampant everywhere now. Sign of the times, current and end, but that's another subject. 

To your point about two people having a civil discussion with differing viewpoints, it's becoming a lost art.  The mask wearing has been discussed ad nauseum and yet it goes on because one person thinks they can get the proverbial light to come on in the other person's head to change there mind. The other one figures that he's doing alright with the light he has because he sees what he sees just fine. People don't change unless they want to and no argument can be made to alter that fact. People are funny creatures. They don't want someone telling them what they should do unless they wanted to do it in the first place. 

Nathan, like many we both know what is ahead for us so the alarm being sounded by the media and some others just doesn't get me all worked up. There are a lot of present day issues that would be better served if we addressed them by loving our neighbor as we do ourselves. That will fix a lot of things. I've read the story and it ends well for some but that last chapter is a doozy. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

8 hours ago, AU_Tiger_88 said:

There is a valid argument for not wearing a mask.  If you have severe asthma it can trigger an attack.  Also, if you have already had COVID they have yet to prove that you can re-acquire the virus.  So if you have already had it what is the point to wearing a mask?  Just to make others feel better?  Also, most of these so called masks that people are wearing mainly just a piece of cloth over their face, doesn't stop the virus from going through it.   For example:  In one study, a mask that used 16 layers of handkerchief fabric was able to filter out 63 percent of 300-nanometer-sized particles. (The coronavirus is between 50 to 200 nanometers in diameter.) Most people are only using one layer...so it is more to protect people from coughing/sneezing on others.  That is if they wear it on their nose which I see a ton of people who don't.

When somebody says that they are asthmatic and they have tried wearing a mask and it gave them problems, then I will not argue with them. That has not happened yet.

Yes, exactly. You wear the damn mask to protect others! It is so telling that this would be introduced almost as an argument against them. 

And yes, there are an alarming number of people who still can't even figure out that they need to cover both the holes in their face. That shows a need for education, not capitulation.

Why are you working so hard to argue against them? Just wear a damn mask.

Oh, as for people who have already tested positive, there is a lot of research showing that the antibodies don't stick around very long and people are getting multiple infections.

There is so little information that we need to keep up with and so little effort required of us at this point and yet we still can't get it right. Unbelievable. 

[AUsince72 11,084]

1 hour ago, DAG said:

I can understand your frustration about some of the fighting . However, as good as dialogue may be, I do empathize with the other side as well. IMO, wearing a mask is not a hard thing to ask. Again, it is of my opinion that most people who choose not to do it , do not give much validity to that choice other than it is my right and I am not going to let anyone control me. I can respect that , but I also wish they will respect healthcare workers wishes to sign away their ability to be admitted . It is super frustrating as a healthcare provider when primary prevention is asked and folks just choose not to do it,  but then when tertiary prevention is needed, the healthcare workers are the one in the brunt of it all. In the brunt of angered patients, family members, doctors , etc. Some will say, you signed up for this , but the reality is we signed up to be frontline staff and educators . When we do educate and it goes on to deaf ears, that is a problem in my eyes. 

No problem with your post at all.

Again, many have reasons for & against, and to each their own.

I am just tired of the attacks, name calling, passive-aggressive to downright direct assaults on people (and in the real world, not just AUF posters).

So, just venting my frustration in that regards.  You've actually contributed some of the most valuable (and knowledgeable) info out there unlike some of these other "AUF sheriffs" that keep making things personal.

Thank you sir.

[AUsince72 11,084]

54 minutes ago, gr82be said:

Wasn't aware of that being the case since I have to avoid certain types of foods but the ridiculousness is running rampant everywhere now. Sign of the times, current and end, but that's another subject. 

To your point about two people having a civil discussion with differing viewpoints, it's becoming a lost art.  The mask wearing has been discussed ad nauseum and yet it goes on because one person thinks they can get the proverbial light to come on in the other person's head to change there mind. The other one figures that he's doing alright with the light he has because he sees what he sees just fine. People don't change unless they want to and no argument can be made to alter that fact. People are funny creatures. They don't want someone telling them what they should do unless they wanted to do it in the first place. 

Nathan, like many we both know what is ahead for us so the alarm being sounded by the media and some others just doesn't get me all worked up. There are a lot of present day issues that would be better served if we addressed them by loving our neighbor as we do ourselves. That will fix a lot of things. I've read the story and it ends well for some but that last chapter is a doozy. 

Yeah, I'm not saying "all" Five Guys, but there's some pretty popular ones "no cash accepted" and now this artificial change shortage where many restaurants and businesses are "requiring" exact change, etc.  We who believe in the Bible know where this is leading but beyond that....my cash is legal tender.  It's beyond ridiculous to say "I won't take your cash".  That's not fear....that's something else.  Anyway, I'm way off topic now.  Anyone with any Google skills can find this info if they so choose.

And yes, I know that nobody's minds are going to be changed at this point.  I think there's just a lot of satisfaction in "being right" going on now.  It's frustrating and making conversation pointless.  But I will endeavor as it ain't just "politics" to me.  It's the souls of people I love at stake....yes, I'm talking about AUF people I love like brothers & sisters.  They may not think the same about me, or even themselves, but I hope they do one day....and not when it's too late.

[AU_Tiger_88 417]

1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

When somebody says that they are asthmatic and they have tried wearing a mask and it gave them problems, then I will not argue with them. That has not happened yet.

Yes, exactly. You wear the damn mask to protect others! It is so telling that this would be introduced almost as an argument against them. 

And yes, there are an alarming number of people who still can't even figure out that they need to cover both the holes in their face. That shows a need for education, not capitulation.

Why are you working so hard to argue against them? Just wear a damn mask.

Oh, as for people who have already tested positive, there is a lot of research showing that the antibodies don't stick around very long and people are getting multiple infections.

There is so little information that we need to keep up with and so little effort required of us at this point and yet we still can't get it right. Unbelievable. 

Let's just face it you sir are a Mask shamer...Also People don't have to tell you their medical conditions but it still seems you think that they should wear a mask.  There are many people with breathing problems that the mask makes their breathing harder.  I see a lot of it here in SW Florida.  Many elderly who have tanks have a hard time breathing with their face covered but it seems that a person has to explain their medical condition to you so you will stop arguing with them...who made you the mask police?  We have freedoms in this country and if people don't want to wear a mask don't shame them as you don't know why they aren't doing it and it really isn't any of your business either.  If you are afraid to be around them don't be there but leave them alone.  To me it is a personal choice to wear or not to wear. 

You assume that people need education on how to wear a mask.  Most people don't but may wear it that way just to appease the mask police who judge them or comply because they need to run into a store that requires a mask.  There are too many "Karen's & Chad's" in our society now and no need for more mask police. 

Research also shows the antibodie test is really unreliable it can mean that you did have it or another COVID related like the common cold...so until something comes out that is peer reviewed and not pushed by the media (like earlier ones) and then I can read it...I won't hold my breath...

Also, you have probably assumed that I am an anti-masker but I am not.  I just believe in freedom of choice. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

8 minutes ago, AU_Tiger_88 said:

who made you the mask police?

It's wild to think that there would even be a need for such. You'd think that Americans would actually love thy neighbor and we wouldn't have to have this insane conversation.

Also, all of this "it's my right, freedumb USA USA" crap is exactly what I'm talking about. But hey, if that's the route we're going, then I am also well within my rights to call people who choose not to wear a mask without any legitimate reason not to selfish, lazy, flaming a**holes. I trust you'll respect my rights and keep on moving right along. Because that's your choice. To protect your feelings. 

Oh, as for the efficacy of various fabrics, again, it's insane that it still isn't sinking in with anyone at this point, but this should be very easy to understand. It was just circulated among all the nurses I support. This is further to a study published last week in JAMA that showed universal masking is associated with a significantly lower rate of SARS-CoV-2 positivity among healthcare workers. Which is further to common sense that has been consistently reinforced almost universally by medical experts/epidemiologists for quite some time now. 

[oracle79 3,569]

How far does the respiratory jet travel when one sneezes or coughs into the crooked elbow? Also weird that the 55 thread count measured less distance than the thicker 85 thread count, no? So much unknown.

[Gowebb11 9,314]

3 hours ago, McLoofus said:

And yes, there are an alarming number of people who still can't even figure out that they need to cover both the holes in their face. That shows a need for education, not capitulation

Amen. We still have a lot of people who don’t bother to cover their mouth when they cough or sneeze. Or wash their hands when they use the restroom. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

10 minutes ago, oracle79 said:

How far does the respiratory jet travel when one sneezes or coughs into the crooked elbow? Also weird that the 55 thread count measured less distance than the thicker 85 thread count, no? So much unknown.

The different thread counts are also for different materials. Cotton might be thicker than "elastic t-shirt material". 

Not sure about sneezes and coughs into the elbow, but that option doesn't really come into play if somebody doesn't react fast enough, doesn't also direct their face away from all other people, is carrying something that would prevent them from being able to, or- as is likely most common- just forgets to. 

[steeleagle 2,945]

58 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

The different thread counts are also for different materials. Cotton might be thicker than "elastic t-shirt material". 

Not sure about sneezes and coughs into the elbow, but that option doesn't really come into play if somebody doesn't react fast enough, doesn't also direct their face away from all other people, is carrying something that would prevent them from being able to, or- as is likely most common- just forgets to. 

lol. I have a hard enough time trying to GET my elbow up to my nose, at my age....so a mask is my better option.

 

[AU_Tiger_88 417]

7 hours ago, McLoofus said:

It's wild to think that there would even be a need for such. You'd think that Americans would actually love thy neighbor and we wouldn't have to have this insane conversation.

Also, all of this "it's my right, freedumb USA USA" crap is exactly what I'm talking about. But hey, if that's the route we're going, then I am also well within my rights to call people who choose not to wear a mask without any legitimate reason not to selfish, lazy, flaming a**holes. I trust you'll respect my rights and keep on moving right along. Because that's your choice. To protect your feelings. 

Oh, as for the efficacy of various fabrics, again, it's insane that it still isn't sinking in with anyone at this point, but this should be very easy to understand. It was just circulated among all the nurses I support. This is further to a study published last week in JAMA that showed universal masking is associated with a significantly lower rate of SARS-CoV-2 positivity among healthcare workers. Which is further to common sense that has been consistently reinforced almost universally by medical experts/epidemiologists for quite some time now. 

That is where you are incorrect.  You don't have to know the reason they aren't wearing a mask.  You are not entitled to that knowledge.  If you confronted someone on the street doing the mask shaming and you don't know if they have a condition, it isn't any of your business to know their medical condition.  Sorry but it isn't within your rights.

You do have a choice not to associate with them but you don't have to know why they aren't wearing it.  Do you also demand people wear a mask properly?  If not why not?  Dude you have made many assumptions about people that you have no clue of what they do or don't do.  I imagine that you assume that I don't wear a mask.  You just miss my point but that is ok.  It is a free country.

[McLoofus 35,182]

14 minutes ago, AU_Tiger_88 said:

That is where you are incorrect.  You don't have to know the reason they aren't wearing a mask.  You are not entitled to that knowledge.  If you confronted someone on the street doing the mask shaming and you don't know if they have a condition, it isn't any of your business to know their medical condition.  Sorry but it isn't within your rights.

You do have a choice not to associate with them but you don't have to know why they aren't wearing it.  Do you also demand people wear a mask properly?  If not why not?  Dude you have made many assumptions about people that you have no clue of what they do or don't do.  I imagine that you assume that I don't wear a mask.  You just miss my point but that is ok.  It is a free country.

Yeah, you're kind of off track here. I don't demand that I know anyone's medical condition. What is evident is that there are a lot of people arguing against mask wearing- or who are arguing "freedom" over "common sense and decency"- who have no such medical condition. What should be obvious is that, percentage-wise, people who have a legitimate medical reason not to wear a mask represent a very small fraction of the overall population, and are an exception to the rule rather than a driving force in the broader conversation. I've made no suggestion that it's within my rights to know a person's medical condition. 

As for choosing not to associate with somebody not wearing a mask, no, it is not always a reasonable option for someone to avoid physical proximity to other people who may not be wearing masks. 

Do I "demand" that people wear a mask properly? Depends on how much of a threat they pose to me or my family. Do I think it's fair to expect any American capable of browsing the internet to fully understand and embrace the handful of extremely basic and elementary measures put forth that would significantly curb the spread of this virus? Absolutely. 

I don't assume anything about your personal choices, nor do I miss your point. I'm just saying your point is indicative of the general selfishness in this country that has made the virus much deadlier and costlier than it had to be. Furthermore, the inability to distinguish between "illegal" and "wrong" belies a deep lack of both empathy and intelligence which is sadly also endemic to this country. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

Put another way, it is a fundamentally flawed stance to suggest that the onus should be upon Person B to avoid Person A doing the wrong thing, rather than upon Person A to do the right thing. If you fancy yourself more civilized than, say, a dog or a baboon, that is. 

[DAG 33,977]

52 minutes ago, AU_Tiger_88 said:

That is where you are incorrect.  You don't have to know the reason they aren't wearing a mask.  You are not entitled to that knowledge.  If you confronted someone on the street doing the mask shaming and you don't know if they have a condition, it isn't any of your business to know their medical condition.  Sorry but it isn't within your rights.

You do have a choice not to associate with them but you don't have to know why they aren't wearing it.  Do you also demand people wear a mask properly?  If not why not?  Dude you have made many assumptions about people that you have no clue of what they do or don't do.  I imagine that you assume that I don't wear a mask.  You just miss my point but that is ok.  It is a free country.

It is absolutely a free country. I know for a fact most people won’t do something unless they are either faced with impending doom or forced to do it. This is pretty much the population that makes up the healthcare admission rates when you take a look at people health issue. I can probably count on my hands the number of people who I have seen in my 10 years of healthcare who have had an issue that was not preventable. Again, this is their choices. I don't judge and I don't force a single thing on my patients. I give you all the data I have at my disposal and it’s up to you to take your health in your hands, IF, you don't have any barriers However, I got to ask, do you wear a mask? And if you choose to not wear a mask, why not? This discussion has gone on for far too long and I still don't know the answer to it.  

[Gowebb11 9,314]

1 hour ago, DAG said:

I still don't know the answer to it.  

None of us really do. But my perspective is that somewhere between freedoms/rights and mandates is civility. Just doing something because it’s good for the common community. And I really appreciate your medical perspective @DAG I represent a different side of health care and share the frustration of people creating horrible health situations for themselves with bad choices.  It illuminates a lot about personal responsibility. 

[AU_Tiger_88 417]

2 hours ago, McLoofus said:

As for choosing not to associate with somebody not wearing a mask, no, it is not always a reasonable option for someone to avoid physical proximity to other people who may not be wearing masks. 

Do I "demand" that people wear a mask properly? Depends on how much of a threat they pose to me or my family. Do I think it's fair to expect any American capable of browsing the internet to fully understand and embrace the handful of extremely basic and elementary measures put forth that would significantly curb the spread of this virus? Absolutely.

You still miss my point but that is ok.  I get it you are a do as I say person and nothing wrong with that but if you really think about it people are not really posing a threat to you as you have options and choices to seclude yourself and your family until this is over.  You may not like them but there are options, you may not like the consequences of those choices you make but that is why we have free will.  You just admitted as much in these posts about demanding people should wear masks, etc. 

So you seem to keep up with things.  Let see if we can have a little dialogue on this.  Do you know what the % of Death rate for this and the yearly flu?  Do you know what the % of deaths were here in the US that were Nursing home related?  Also do you know what the average monthly deaths that nursing homes account for?  If you don't want to converse fine.  Where I am leading to is this has been trumped up so much by the media etc that there has been fear and panic put out to the general population.  We have had over reporting and cases where COVID were not the cause of death but it was listed as the cause. 

We have seen officials decry not wearing masks but then wear masks (although I understand why they did it but it is off putting to try and treat the populace as little children).  Also we have seen governments decry some protests but hail others...over COVID and cases. 

There are many like me who are over it out here in the mainland and we do the things we need to do to keep safe but I don't buy into fear mongering or mask police or distance police.  There are a ton of Americans who have underlying conditions because of their choices that they have made in life and and some by just bad genetics. 

All I am saying is live and let live and let's be civil to each other but remember we are a free country.

[McLoofus 35,182]

24 minutes ago, AU_Tiger_88 said:

You still miss my point but that is ok.  I get it you are a do as I say person and nothing wrong with that but if you really think about it people are not really posing a threat to you as you have options and choices to seclude yourself and your family until this is over.  You may not like them but there are options, you may not like the consequences of those choices you make but that is why we have free will.  You just admitted as much in these posts about demanding people should wear masks, etc. 

So you seem to keep up with things.  Let see if we can have a little dialogue on this.  Do you know what the % of Death rate for this and the yearly flu?  Do you know what the % of deaths were here in the US that were Nursing home related?  Also do you know what the average monthly deaths that nursing homes account for?  If you don't want to converse fine.  Where I am leading to is this has been trumped up so much by the media etc that there has been fear and panic put out to the general population.  We have had over reporting and cases where COVID were not the cause of death but it was listed as the cause. 

We have seen officials decry not wearing masks but then wear masks (although I understand why they did it but it is off putting to try and treat the populace as little children).  Also we have seen governments decry some protests but hail others...over COVID and cases. 

There are many like me who are over it out here in the mainland and we do the things we need to do to keep safe but I don't buy into fear mongering or mask police or distance police.  There are a ton of Americans who have underlying conditions because of their choices that they have made in life and and some by just bad genetics. 

All I am saying is live and let live and let's be civil to each other but remember we are a free country.

Literally everything you just said, minus the personal observations, was shot down months ago and has been repeatedly since. Yes, I keep up with things. There's not much at all to keep up with strictly with regards to appropriate behavior. It's scary and truly disheartening that so many fail to, or that so many would rather ignore it out of spite and pettiness.