Coordinators (Merged)

[japantiger 4,051]

What has Mason done in the last 8 years to indicate he is still an elite defensive mind?

[BigBlueWDE 1,136]

2 minutes ago, japantiger said:

What has Mason done in the last 8 years to indicate he is still an elite defensive mind?

Regularly held the Vandy offense scoreless?

[ChrisH 135]

18 hours ago, metafour said:

Ryan Pugh just got hired as the OL coach at Baylor under Jeff Grimes. Pretty cool.

Talked to his dad on Monday and he said that some big news was coming soon. 

[DAG 33,955]

What did Derek Mason do in the last 8 years at Vandy? Only coaches up Vandy first consensus all American at the linebacker position who was a finalist for the Butkus award. Don’t worry, we will be seeing him once LSU hires him

[GwillMac6 20,607]

1 minute ago, DAG said:

What did Derek Mason do in the last 8 years at Vandy? Only coaches up Vandy first consensus all American at the linebacker position who was a finalist for the Butkus award. Don’t worry, we will be seeing him once LSU hires him

Sounds good to me! I will gladly take Marcus Freeman and that trade off. Woooo!!!! LFG bay bay!!!! I like how you think.

[Zeek 16,615]

8 minutes ago, GwillMac6 said:

Sounds good to me! I will gladly take Marcus Freeman and that trade off. Woooo!!!! LFG bay bay!!!! I like how you think.

If we don't get Mason I hope he goes to SC and not LSU

We don't want to recruit against him and coach against him if possible 

[DAG 33,955]

1 hour ago, GwillMac6 said:

Sounds good to me! I will gladly take Marcus Freeman and that trade off. Woooo!!!! LFG bay bay!!!! I like how you think.

I would love either or 

[Zeek 16,615]

12 minutes ago, DAG said:

I would love either or 

As long as the other isn't in the SEC West lol.

[DAG 33,955]

9 minutes ago, Zeek said:

As long as the other isn't in the SEC West lol.

Would not surprise me if both are in the west 

[W.E.D 11,070]

When do we start panicking? 

[sevenlee36 1,654]

3 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

When do we start panicking? 

The earlier the better I say

[japantiger 4,051]

5 hours ago, DAG said:

What did Derek Mason do in the last 8 years at Vandy? Only coaches up Vandy first consensus all American at the linebacker position who was a finalist for the Butkus award. Don’t worry, we will be seeing him once LSU hires him

That's not a body of work.  Dismukes won the Remington under Malzahn...so what.  Would you hire Malzahn as your OC? 

What is it he has done in his 7 years at Vandy that leads anyone to think he is still an elite D coordinator talent.  Just a simple question.  His last relevant D coordinator experience is pretty dated; just like our last coaches O coordinator experience was dated.  Just looking for something that says Vandy's D's did XXXX under him that would lead a reasonable person to think he still has his Stanford D mojo.  College football offenses changed massively after 2013.  Did he adapt in a way that would indicate he's not the Defensive version of Malzahn?

[W.E.D 11,070]

8 minutes ago, japantiger said:

That's not a body of work.  Dismukes won the Remington under Malzahn...so what.  Would you hire Malzahn as your OC? 

What is it he has done in his 7 years at Vandy that leads anyone to think he is still an elite D coordinator talent.  Just a simple question.  His last relevant D coordinator experience is pretty dated; just like our last coaches O coordinator experience was dated.  Just looking for something that says Vandy's D's did XXXX under him that would lead a reasonable person to think he still has his Stanford D mojo.  College football offenses changed massively after 2013.  Did he adapt in a way that would indicate he's not the Defensive version of Malzahn?

I agree. Mason doesn't move the needle and IDK why anyone thinks a failed HC is going to be some beast recruiting. It's not like he did anything at Vandy. Franklin at least showed his ability to get guys Vandy shouldnt 

[lca408 366]

7 minutes ago, japantiger said:

That's not a body of work.  Dismukes won the Remington under Malzahn...so what.  Would you hire Malzahn as your OC? 

What is it he has done in his 7 years at Vandy that leads anyone to think he is still an elite D coordinator talent.  Just a simple question.  His last relevant D coordinator experience is pretty dated; just like our last coaches O coordinator experience was dated.  Just looking for something that says Vandy's D's did XXXX under him that would lead a reasonable person to think he still has his Stanford D mojo.  College football offenses changed massively after 2013.  Did he adapt in a way that would indicate he's not the Defensive version of Malzahn?

If Malzahn had an OL like he did from 2013-2014, yes I still would. Dismukes was a Chizik recruit and already a good OL by the time Malzahn came back in 2013. He was showcased in that offense that was (no surprise) fantastic with an elite OL. 

Mason had Cunningham from 2014 to 2016 and is responsible for the lion’s share of his development into the star player he became even though he didn’t originally recruit him to Vandy. Just for clarification. 

[DAG 33,955]

13 minutes ago, japantiger said:

That's not a body of work.  Dismukes won the Remington under Malzahn...so what.  Would you hire Malzahn as your OC? 

What is it he has done in his 7 years at Vandy that leads anyone to think he is still an elite D coordinator talent.  Just a simple question.  His last relevant D coordinator experience is pretty dated; just like our last coaches O coordinator experience was dated.  Just looking for something that says Vandy's D's did XXXX under him that would lead a reasonable person to think he still has his Stanford D mojo.  College football offenses changed massively after 2013.  Did he adapt in a way that would indicate he's not the Defensive version of Malzahn?

Umm yes. I would absolutely hire Malzhan to solely be an OC. I would not hire him to be a HC. I absolutely believe If Gus can solely deal with being a coordinator he would do just fine . No different then when Gene chizik left Auburn and then all of a sudden he turned UNC to a quality defense. And No his defenses at Auburn were not elite. I am basing that on Gus’s body of work as a coordinator. His whole Resume. 

I did answer your simple ORIGINAL question. What has he did in the last 8 years? Since it didn’t satisfy you now you want to push the goal post. As a head coach he was horrible. I’m not going to convince you, Derek Mason, the head coach, should be here, especially since you already have a negative view of him. It would be a gigantic waste of time.  You already don’t like the guy. 
 

*posters in the political thread, take note.*
 

 

[Tiger1992 999]

5 minutes ago, achamb7 said:

To quote our coach, do you want it right, or do you want it right now? 

Both, obviously 

[aucanucktiger 1,789]

Chan Gailey has had an odd week. BSPNs professionals incorrectly reported he was fired so they then had to retract their rumor. Fins HC then said he expects entire staff back for 2021. Well, Gailey just resigned as fins OC so...there's that OC on the mkt tidbit.

 

[japantiger 4,051]

42 minutes ago, DAG said:

Umm yes. I would absolutely hire Malzhan to solely be an OC. I would not hire him to be a HC. I absolutely believe If Gus can solely deal with being a coordinator he would do just fine . No different then when Gene chizik left Auburn and then all of a sudden he turned UNC to a quality defense. And No his defenses at Auburn were not elite. I am basing that on Gus’s body of work as a coordinator. His whole Resume. 

I did answer your simple ORIGINAL question. What has he did in the last 8 years? Since it didn’t satisfy you now you want to push the goal post. As a head coach he was horrible. I’m not going to convince you, Derek Mason, the head coach, should be here, especially since you already have a negative view of him. It would be a gigantic waste of time.  You already don’t like the guy. 
 

*posters in the political thread, take note.*
 

 

Probably not going to find common ground if you'd actually hire Gus as OC.  Hell, he even fired himself, twice, as OC.

I didn't move the goal posts.  I requested thoughtful justification for why anyone would still think Mason elite D coordinator talent.  If it's all on the basis of one player getting an award; then so be it.  Not how I would make that decision; I'd want to know that what he did at Vandy was on the cutting edge of defending the current wide open elite offenses which are mostly a product of 2013 and later...post his time at Stanford.  If folks base this solely on his Sanford time; it's about as relevant as Malzahn's OC time pre HC job at Auburn.

[DAG 33,955]

5 minutes ago, japantiger said:

Probably not going to find common ground if you'd actually hire Gus as OC.  Hell, he even fired himself, twice, as OC.

I didn't move the goal posts.  I requested thoughtful justification for why anyone would still think Mason elite D coordinator talent.  If it's all on the basis of one player getting an award; then so be it.  Not how I would make that decision; I'd want to know that what he did at Vandy was on the cutting edge of defending the current wide open elite offenses which are mostly a product of 2013 and later...post his time at Stanford.  If folks base this solely on his Sanford time; it's about as relevant as Malzahn's OC time pre HC job at Auburn.

Faulty  logic. Would you not hire someone as a physician because they weren’t a good medical director. Two totally different avenues and priorities.

and you are right we aren’t going to find common ground. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

53 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

IDK why anyone thinks a failed HC is going to be some beast recruiting

IDK why you think he wouldn't be.

 

[W.E.D 11,070]

1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

IDK why you think he wouldn't be.

 

it was in the post you quoted

  

1 hour ago, W.E.D said:

. It's not like he did anything at Vandy. Franklin at least showed his ability to get guys Vandy shouldnt 

 

[McLoofus 35,182]

8 minutes ago, DAG said:

Faulty  logic. Would you not hire someone as a physician because they weren’t a good medical director. Two totally different avenues and priorities.

and you are right we aren’t going to find common ground. 

I'm surprised the "bad head coach = bad coordinator" logical fallacy is still being perpetrated 24 pages deep into this thread. If somebody knows enough about football to know that Derek Mason has been unsuccessful as a head coach, then they should also know some of the names of the *many* successful coordinators who previously failed as head coaches. 

[japantiger 4,051]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

Faulty  logic. Would you not hire someone as a physician because they weren’t a good medical director. Two totally different avenues and priorities.

and you are right we aren’t going to find common ground. 

No, and I didn't say that.  As a HC, you are responsible for the Defense and the DC hire.  Did Mason's DC hires, schemes or defensive performance indicate that he was a cut above at defeating post 2013 high powered offenses?   Remember, Mason fired his 1st DC hire after the 2014 season and acted as both HC and DC after the 2014 season at Vandy...sound familiar?  So to recap; Mason failed, by his own standards, to hire an effective DC.  He then assumed both physician and hospital administrator duties (your analogy).  Was there anything about his tenure as DC at Vandy that leads a reasonable person to think he possesses elite D coordinator skills in a post 2013 world.  

[japantiger 4,051]

2 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I'm surprised the "bad head coach = bad coordinator" logical fallacy is still being perpetrated 24 pages deep into this thread. If somebody knows enough about football to know that Derek Mason has been unsuccessful as a head coach, then they should also know some of the names of the *many* successful coordinators who previously failed as head coaches. 

Mason acted as his own DC after he fired his 1st DC hire after his 1st season at Vandy.  How do you rate his tenure as Vandy DC?  You should read what I ask, not what DAG says to get out of addressing what I ask..  

[McLoofus 35,182]

Just now, W.E.D said:

it was in the post you quoted

That was as a head coach at Vandy. That's in no way apples to apples with he would be capable of as a defensive coordinator at Auburn.

Interesting note: If you take the top 5-7 recruits from every class of his at Vandy, the overwhelming majority of them are on defense. Makes sense that a DC-turned-head coach just wasn't good at recruiting guys on offense. Maybe he didn't have a great staff because every great DC isn't equipped to run a program and hire an ace staff at Vanderbilt...

Do you think Muschamp is also no longer a viable DC?

Btw, James Franklin only had 1 class that was ranked better than Mason's better classes. Who knows how those kids actually panned out besides Zach Cunningham and Ralph Webb... who were exclusively developed by Derek Mason.