Coordinators (Merged)

[DAG 33,955]

23 minutes ago, japantiger said:

No, and I didn't say that.  As a HC, you are responsible for the Defense and the DC hire.  Did Mason's DC hires, schemes or defensive performance indicate that he was a cut above at defeating post 2013 high powered offenses?   Remember, Mason fired his 1st DC hire after the 2014 season and acted as both HC and DC after the 2014 season at Vandy...sound familiar?  So to recap; Mason failed, by his own standards, to hire an effective DC.  He then assumed both physician and hospital administrator duties (your analogy).  Was there anything about his tenure as DC at Vandy that leads a reasonable person to think he possesses elite D coordinator skills in a post 2013 world.  

So during this time did he still have responsibilities as the head coach? Simple question 

because a medical director who still chooses to do surgeries and a surgeon, who is solely responsible for his/her surgical cases are two different types of priorities, expectations, responsibilities.  One can concentrate on surgeries. The other position simply cannot just concentrate on doing surgeries. It is impossible. 
 

I am not asking him to be the head AND defensive coordinator . I want him to be strictly a defensive coordinator. That is a huge ass difference.

[japantiger 4,051]

3 minutes ago, DAG said:

So during this time did he still have responsibilities as the head coach? Simple question 

because a medical director who still chooses to do surgeries and a surgeon are two different types of priorities, expectations, responsibilities.  One can concentrate on surgeries. The other position simply cannot just concentrate on doing surgeries. It is impossible. 
 

I am not asking him to be the head AND defensive coordinator . I want him to be strictly a defensive coordinator. That is a huge ass difference.

Well,  if you're the patient, your expectation of the medical director/surgeon is 100% the same as the expectations for the surgeon/surgeon.  If you're only defense of his resume is saying  he created a no win situation for himself, well then, just another reason his judgement is suspect for a big role at Auburn.  I get it, you've got a thing for Mason.  You can't name a thing in his Vandy resume that would indicate his elite D coordinator chops are still relevant, even though he chose to assume that role. 

I believe there are many folks out there that have more impressive, current, relevant experience.  

My understanding (from a conversation with my brother) on the delay in assistant hiring has to do with current assistants contract buyouts and needing to get past the 3rd week of Jan to minimize $$ impact.  Anyone with any knowledge on this topic? True? As false as most rumors out there?

[japantiger 4,051]

26 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

That was as a head coach at Vandy. That's in no way apples to apples with he would be capable of as a defensive coordinator at Auburn.

Interesting note: If you take the top 5-7 recruits from every class of his at Vandy, the overwhelming majority of them are on defense. Makes sense that a DC-turned-head coach just wasn't good at recruiting guys on offense. Maybe he didn't have a great staff because every great DC isn't equipped to run a program and hire an ace staff at Vanderbilt...

Do you think Muschamp is also no longer a viable DC?

Btw, James Franklin only had 1 class that was ranked better than Mason's better classes. Who knows how those kids actually panned out besides Zach Cunningham and Ralph Webb... who were exclusively developed by Derek Mason. 

I think Muschamp would be poison to building a cohesive staff that wants to be at Auburn to help Harsin build a program.  His best skills seem to be looking for other jobs and working with agents to maximize Will Muschamp's income.  

[DAG 33,955]

Just now, japantiger said:

Well,  if you're the patient, your expectation of the medical director/surgeon is 100% the same as the expectations for the surgeon/surgeon.  If you're only defense of his resume is saying  he created a no win situation for himself, well then, just another reason his judgement is suspect for a big role at Auburn.  I get it, you've got a thing for Mason.  You can't name a thing in his Vandy resume that would indicate his elite D coordinator chops are still relevant, even though he chose to assume that role. 

I believe there are many folks out there that have more impressive, current, relevant experience.  

My understanding (from a conversation with my brother) on the delay in assistant hiring has to do with current assistants contract buyouts and needing to get past the 3rd week of Jan to minimize $$ impact.  Anyone with any knowledge on this topic? True? As false as most rumors out there?

  That might be true but it is not based on reality because although the medical director might be a very good surgeon, he could easily screw other things up because being the medical director also means making sure staffing is good, making sure policy is adequate , making sure your budget is align. So the expectations is a lot more than just making it out alive! What if you get an infection because there wasn’t the necessary equipment needed for a sterile process? Or the surgery took much longer and LOS delayed because you didn’t have a CRNA available or post surgical staff necessary to stabilize and transfer the patient. Yes, you got the surgery done but you are also failing at much other responsibilities. A surgeon just comes in, preps himself and the team and gets the surgery done . PERIOD.

Maybe the Defense wasn’t to his standards because he has a lot more other stuff to worry about rather than just the defense!

So my question would be what do you think what make you much more successful as a DC here versus when you were a HC. I would think he would say “well my responsibilities would strictly be on the defensive end and this is my vision.” 

[bigbird 60,368]

2 hours ago, W.E.D said:

When do we start panicking? 

You started 2 weeks ago

[japantiger 4,051]

3 minutes ago, DAG said:

  That might be true but it is not based on reality because although the medical director might be a very good surgeon, he could easily screw other things up because being the medical director also means making sure staffing is good, making sure policy is adequate , making sure your budget is align. So the expectations is a lot more than just making it out alive! What if you get an infection because there wasn’t the necessary equipment needed for a sterile process? Or the surgery took much longer and LOS delayed because you didn’t have a CRNA available or post surgical staff necessary to stabilize and transfer the patient. Yes, you got the surgery done but you are also failing at much other responsibilities. A surgeon just comes in, preps himself and the team and gets the surgery done . PERIOD.

Maybe the Defense wasn’t to his standards because he has a lot more other stuff to worry about rather than just the defense!

So my question would be what do you think what make you much more successful as a DC here versus when you were a HC. I would think he would say “well my responsibilities would strictly be on the defensive end and this is my vision.” 

I imagine he would say that.  The questions I would have for him in an interview would be:

• Name the 3 successful moves you made as Vandy DC to keep up with the fast pace of change in offenses in the SEC...how did you measure that success?
• Name your 3 most successful hires as either HC or DC and what made those hires successful
• Do you hire for expertise or attitude?
• why do you think you failed so badly at hiring other folks to implement your Defensive vision at Vandy (you fired your 1st coordinator after only one year and assumed that responsibility)
• How will that be different hiring assistants at Auburn to fullfill our vision for an elite Defense?
• What were your 3 biggest failures in your tenure at Vandy and what did you learn from them?
• Give me your evaluation of the returning Auburn talent in each position group and where we need to act quickly in the transfer portal or with JUCO to shore up? 
• What would be the 1st 3 changes you would to Auburns defense upon arrival and why?

And keep going on this vein....

[W.E.D 11,070]

46 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

That was as a head coach at Vandy. That's in no way apples to apples with he would be capable of as a defensive coordinator at Auburn.

Interesting note: If you take the top 5-7 recruits from every class of his at Vandy, the overwhelming majority of them are on defense. Makes sense that a DC-turned-head coach just wasn't good at recruiting guys on offense. Maybe he didn't have a great staff because every great DC isn't equipped to run a program and hire an ace staff at Vanderbilt...

Do you think Muschamp is also no longer a viable DC?

Btw, James Franklin only had 1 class that was ranked better than Mason's better classes. Who knows how those kids actually panned out besides Zach Cunningham and Ralph Webb... who were exclusively developed by Derek Mason. 

 

50 minutes ago, japantiger said:

Mason acted as his own DC after he fired his 1st DC hire after his 1st season at Vandy.  How do you rate his tenure as Vandy DC?

Pretty much this. Vandy wanted to emulate Stanford, so they hired Derek.  He could stop Chip's offense, but everyone has moved on from that.

I'd question Will Muschamp too.  Seems everything has passed him.

[W.E.D 11,070]

10 minutes ago, bigbird said:

You started 2 weeks ago

I at least waited until the new year before I started

[chizhead 618]

Mason as DC?....No thanks

[AlaskanFAN 1,665]

Daaang, how about we give the guy a chance to build his staff. Go through spring training, take his lumps the first year, make his adjustments for year two and then we can start railing on him if things are not going the way we want. Like it or not he is gonna get at least 3 years. Let’s just sit back for now and see what happens. After the past few years I am to tired to start bitching again, I am gonna take a year off. 

[DAG 33,955]

26 minutes ago, japantiger said:

I imagine he would say that.  The questions I would have for him in an interview would be:

• Name the 3 successful moves you made as Vandy DC to keep up with the fast pace of change in offenses in the SEC...how did you measure that success?
• Name your 3 most successful hires as either HC or DC and what made those hires successful
• Do you hire for expertise or attitude?
• why do you think you failed so badly at hiring other folks to implement your Defensive vision at Vandy (you fired your 1st coordinator after only one year and assumed that responsibility)
• How will that be different hiring assistants at Auburn to fullfill our vision for an elite Defense?
• What were your 3 biggest failures in your tenure at Vandy and what did you learn from them?
• Give me your evaluation of the returning Auburn talent in each position group and where we need to act quickly in the transfer portal or with JUCO to shore up? 
• What would be the 1st 3 changes you would to Auburns defense upon arrival and why?

And keep going on this vein....

Those are all good questions 

[steeleagle 2,945]

3 minutes ago, DAG said:

Those are all good questions 

As we can see in this day and age, stopping high powered offenses is near impossible w any defense or a DC's plan.

But the key is to look at being a solid D over the course of the year, and also, as stated above, does the DC have an idea of how to slow down the offenses of today. 

I am sure Harsin, and most HCs know who are the better DCs out there or who are the ones behind the DCs that could be hired as a DC.

I really don't wat Muschamp or any of the ex HCs/DCs, like Mason. 

[Tiger 8,818]

You gotta judge a DC on his DC tenure only. Auburn fans should know that by now with the Gus/OC/HC experiment

[McLoofus 35,182]

3 minutes ago, Tiger said:

You gotta judge a DC on his DC tenure only. Auburn fans should know that by now with the Gus/OC/HC experiment

Mushamp at Florida as HC: Loser

Muschamp back at Auburn as DC for one year: Immediately turned around one of the worst defenses in the conference, changed the culture in the locker room and behind the scenes, left a dream job waiting for Kevin Steele.

It's not rocket surgery, folks.

[Zeek 16,617]

Derek Mason and Marcus Freeman are big wins

Andy Avalos is an okay pickup

Haven't heard any other names 

[W.E.D 11,070]

19 minutes ago, Zeek said:

Derek Mason and Marcus Freeman are big wins

Andy Avalos is an okay pickup

Haven't heard any other names 

Pretty sure Freeman is going to Notre Dame.  Mason/Avalose are "names", but I'll take a wait and see approach.  Could be good.  throw Muschamp into that group too.  I'd probably rank em Avalos/Muschamp/Mason

[toddc 13,194]

Sounds like a name from Missouri is being reported for defensive line . Brick Haley! Has the name for a defensive coach for sure.

Previously, Haley was the defensive coordinator and linebackers coach at Baylor (1999–2001) after coaching outside linebackers for one season each at Clemson University (1998), and at Houston (1997). The defensive line coach at Troy State from 1994–96, he was promoted to defensive coordinator following the 1996 campaign before leaving for Houston. Haley coached the defensive line at Austin Peay from 1991-93 after starting his college coaching career as a graduate assistant at Arkansas in 1990. His first coaching job was at Enterprise (Ala.) High School in 1989.

2018-19 Missouri – Senior Associate Head Coach/Defensive Line;  2017 Missouri – Defensive Line;  2015-16 Texas – Defensive Line;  2009-14 LSU – Defensive Line;  2007-08 Chicago Bears – Defensive Line;  

[bigbird 60,368]

7 minutes ago, toddc said:

Sounds like a name from Missouri is being reported for defensive coordinator. Brick Haley! Has the name for a defensive coach for sure.

Previously, Haley was the defensive coordinator and linebackers coach at Baylor (1999–2001) after coaching outside linebackers for one season each at Clemson University (1998), and at Houston (1997). The defensive line coach at Troy State from 1994–96, he was promoted to defensive coordinator following the 1996 campaign before leaving for Houston. Haley coached the defensive line at Austin Peay from 1991-93 after starting his college coaching career as a graduate assistant at Arkansas in 1990. His first coaching job was at Enterprise (Ala.) High School in 1989.

He'd be a great pick up.

[Browning4AU 405]

13 minutes ago, bigbird said:

He'd be a great pick up.

For DC?

[GwillMac6 20,607]

58 minutes ago, toddc said:

Sounds like a name from Missouri is being reported for defensive coordinator. Brick Haley! Has the name for a defensive coach for sure.

Previously, Haley was the defensive coordinator and linebackers coach at Baylor (1999–2001) after coaching outside linebackers for one season each at Clemson University (1998), and at Houston (1997). The defensive line coach at Troy State from 1994–96, he was promoted to defensive coordinator following the 1996 campaign before leaving for Houston. Haley coached the defensive line at Austin Peay from 1991-93 after starting his college coaching career as a graduate assistant at Arkansas in 1990. His first coaching job was at Enterprise (Ala.) High School in 1989.

2018-19 Missouri – Senior Associate Head Coach/Defensive Line;  2017 Missouri – Defensive Line;  2015-16 Texas – Defensive Line;  2009-14 LSU – Defensive Line;  2007-08 Chicago Bears – Defensive Line;  

In the running for DL coach not DC. He was Steele's dc at Baylor during the 9-36 fiasco. 🤣😂 Don't scare people with that Todd!!!! He hasn't been a DC in 20 years. 

[GwillMac6 20,607]

1 hour ago, Zeek said:

Derek Mason and Marcus Freeman are big wins

Andy Avalos is an okay pickup

Haven't heard any other names 

Gerald Alexander DB coach for the dolphin's who's unit led the NFL in Ints this season. Coached under harsin at boise then went to cal until he became the dolphins DB coach. He's another possible candidate.

[Win4AU 4,052]

I don’t care who the guy brings in as long as the team ultimately wins.  That being said if he keeps hiring Boise guys why is this dragging?

[GwillMac6 20,607]

2 minutes ago, Win4AU said:

I don’t care who the guy brings in as long as the team ultimately wins.  That being said if he keeps hiring Boise guys why is this dragging?

Like coach said you want it done right or right now? He's bringing in the boise people he trusts the most and then will hire outsiders for the rest.

I think it's hilarious how people clamored for him to have full autonomy for his staff and then when he hires people he wants some are upset about it!!! Lol. Like what?!!

[steeleagle 2,945]

2 minutes ago, Win4AU said:

I don’t care who the guy brings in as long as the team ultimately wins.  That being said if he keeps hiring Boise guys why is this dragging?

Dragging? IF they are Boise guys, but they currently are scattered throughout other colleges and the NFL, then he is competing w/ their current employers. Sometimes it takes time....

I don't see the rush to hire reasoning...Whether it was this past Monday or it ends up being this weekend, it shouldn't matter, except for those who just want everything to just hurry up...

[toddc 13,194]

7 minutes ago, GwillMac6 said:

In the running for DL coach not DC. He was Steele's dc at Baylor during the 9-36 fiasco. 🤣😂

My bad! Fixed it