Ryan Pugh

[AubieinNC2009 79]

On 1/8/2021 at 1:23 PM, AUght2win said:

You do understand that Mikey and others are arguing there's nothing wrong with blackface, right? You do understand that's a totally different conversation than cancel culture, right?

I don't support cancel culture. But good GRIEF you guys are creeping me out going to bat on behalf of the practice of blackface. 

Im not saying that blackface is correct Im just tired of cancel culture

[GoAU 1,599]

48 minutes ago, homersapien said:

I am just curious to what sort of things might be offensive to a white man - on a daily basis - would be equivalent to the sort of things that might be offensive to a black man - on a daily basis.  

I am white man, and I can't imagine making that comparison.  Of course, beyond quantity, there's the quality of the offensive act.

Would you - for example - "let" an unwarranted traffic stop offend you?  How about several?

 

This isn’t making a lot of sense to me.  How are you possibly going to compare equivalence of something like being offended, which is completely subjective?  
 

Please explain how a double standard, based on race, will help solve racism?  
 

 

[cole256 17,042]

4 minutes ago, GoAU said:

All I’ve been saying the entire time is to treat everyone with equality and respect, and that double standards, based on race or anything else just perpetuate more racism.  

Right so instead of saying that's messed up or that's wrong you want to introduce the argument of reverse racism or whatnot.....there isn't any reverse racism of this guy deciding to do blackface. 

As a matter of fact it's really dumb to tell black people after everything is done and an entire society and infrastructure is built. The strongest country in the world......hey that's our bad but if you want things to be equal don't say anything about us.....But that's a different discussion. 

It's very frustrating when you try to talk about something like being mistreated and there is always a person that comes in with something like racism is talked about too much! Why can't we just get along. Or ofcourse the the word racist is used too much! 

[cole256 17,042]

2 minutes ago, AubieinNC2009 said:

Im not saying that blackface is correct Im just tired of cancel culture

Right and as he originally stated that's a totally different conversation......

[AubieinNC2009 79]

Just now, cole256 said:

Right and as he originally stated that's a totally different conversation......

yeah I must have misread the forum, I dont think blackface is right.  I hate that Pugh is being punished for it but that is the consequence of his choice.  Hopefully he can rebound and be a better person going forward.

[homersapien 11,357]

1 minute ago, GoAU said:

This isn’t making a lot of sense to me.  How are you possibly going to compare equivalence of something like being offended, which is completely subjective?  
 

Please explain how a double standard, based on race, will help solve racism?  
 

 

1) You are the one who made the comparison. I just asked for examples.

2) Because racism is not symmetrical in it's practice.

Can you please quote me and respond to my specific questions before we move on?

[GoAU 1,599]

2 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Right so instead of saying that's messed up or that's wrong you want to introduce the argument of reverse racism or whatnot.....there isn't any reverse racism of this guy deciding to do blackface. 

As a matter of fact it's really dumb to tell black people after everything is done and an entire society and infrastructure is built. The strongest country in the world......hey that's our bad but if you want things to be equal don't say anything about us.....But that's a different discussion. 

It's very frustrating when you try to talk about something like being mistreated and there is always a person that comes in with something like racism is talked about too much! Why can't we just get along. Or ofcourse the the word racist is used too much! 

First, I did say that was messed up.   I also said there are lots of things that could make some acts worse than others and I didn’t have the context in which he did it.  I am not saying it’s OK, but I am saying something done with the intent to offend is worse than an act of ignorance that may not have had malicious intent.  

Seconly, I didn’t tell “black people”,  I told people, as in ALL people.  

Ive stated what I thought the path forward should be, just curious as to what you think it would take to close the racist gap you perceive?   Not saying that to piss anyone off, just asking for some dialogue.  
 

 

[cole256 17,042]

14 minutes ago, GoAU said:

First, I did say that was messed up.   I also said there are lots of things that could make some acts worse than others and I didn’t have the context in which he did it.  I am not saying it’s OK, but I am saying something done with the intent to offend is worse than an act of ignorance that may not have had malicious intent.  

Seconly, I didn’t tell “black people”,  I told people, as in ALL people.  

Ive stated what I thought the path forward should be, just curious as to what you think it would take to close the racist gap you perceive?   Not saying that to piss anyone off, just asking for some dialogue.  
 

 

The only way, and I hope you don't take this personal, but the only way to rid it is of a middle of the road stance like this turns into a hard no this can't and won't be tolerated.

I know you didn't say it but there were a few that did say there's nothing wrong. Well that person should've had everybody at him as opposed to many that was at me. We had one guy on here immediately do everything in his power to deflect. Call him out on it! 

But take for instance when the kkk was at the political thing in South c but Trump wouldn't just come out and speak against them??? That's damn near as bad as the kkk people themselves. 

You see I'm on here and how many can't stand me, I'm not saying they are all bad people but some of them are......and it's much easier for them when instead of many being hell no this is wrong but it's well what about white face, and what about the church, what about reverse racism, you're reacting to something ten years ago, and you didn't say should in your sentence, and you said 80% of people I know for a fast it's 72.3% so you should reword that statement! Or it's what about that one guy that did it and people supported!

Meanwhile somebody that's racist is sitting back like 😜

Why would racism end if it's not uncomfortable to be a racist? But people have damn sure made it uncomfortable to talk about racism though! Imagine that🤔

[GoAU 1,599]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

I am just curious to what sort of things might be offensive to a white man - on a daily basis - would be equivalent to the sort of things that might be offensive to a black man - on a daily basis.  

I am white man, and I can't imagine making that comparison.  Of course, beyond quantity, there's the quality of the offensive act.

Would you - for example - "let" an unwarranted traffic stop offend you?  How about several?

 

Assume this is the post you wanted quoted?  
 

my comment was there are a lot of things that COULD offend me daily, should I chose to let them.  

You then replied if any of them were based on appearance and things being outside my control.  
 

My response was “yes”.  
 

You were the one to try and compare equivalence, not me.  All I said is there are things that could ( or do) offend me based on appearance or things outside my control.  
 

[GoAU 1,599]

6 minutes ago, cole256 said:

The only way, and I hope you don't take this personal, but the only way to rid it is of a middle of the road stance like this turns into a hard no this can't and won't be tolerated.

I know you didn't say it but there were a few that did say there's nothing wrong. Well that person should've had everybody at him as opposed to many that was at me. We had one guy on here immediately do everything in his power to deflect. Call him out on it! 

But take for instance when the kkk was at the political thing in South c but Trump wouldn't just come out and speak against them??? That's damn near as bad as the kkk people themselves. 

You see I'm on here and how many can't stand me, I'm not saying they are all bad people but some of them are......and it's much easier for them when instead of many being hell no this is wrong but it's well what about white face, and what about the church, what about reverse racism, you're reacting to something ten years ago, and you didn't say should in your sentence, and you said 80% of people I know for a fast it's 72.3% so you should reword that statement! Or it's what about that one guy that did it and people supported!

Meanwhile somebody that's racist is sitting back like 😜

Why would racism end if it's not uncomfortable to be a racist?

Appreciate the post, and your opinion, - thanks.  I guess I’ve always felt ignorance makes itself very clear, and if someone is dumb enough to be a racist, neither you, me or anyone else on the internet is going to succeed in educating them.  
 

 

[cole256 17,042]

10 minutes ago, GoAU said:

Appreciate the post, and your opinion, - thanks.  I guess I’ve always felt ignorance makes itself very clear, and if someone is dumb enough to be a racist, neither you, me or anyone else on the internet is going to succeed in educating them.  
 

 

That's fine some time, but what about that racist that's a teacher that has influence on kids? What about that racist that's a policeman? What about the racist that's in Senate? What about the racist doctor? What about the racist banker or loan officer? What about those racist laws? 

What you say may be true but you asked how to close the gap. How to get rid of it. And see I understand it's hard to be active or have passion for something that doesn't effect you or you don't have to worry about. And that's why it's still here because many many people aren't racist but they don't care. They're indifferent and unfortunately that helps people that are racist

[GoAU 1,599]

Fair enough.  But I will say racism affects all of us, not equally of course, but as a nation we are all worse off for it - in any / every form.   
 

You  also said something that really caught my attention when you said racist laws.   Am I correct in assuming that your referring to Jim Crow type laws, or are you referring to current laws?  
 

That being said, (not related to the blackface photo) we also need to be careful about slinging the label of racist around when it isn’t accurate or warranted.  I think it’s becoming a common political ploy and it dilutes those that truly earn the title.  
 

I still stand by that everyone treating each other equally is the best path forward, and will help racists take themselves out of the equation, but I do appreciate you explaining your opinions.  

[cole256 17,042]

16 minutes ago, GoAU said:

Fair enough.  But I will say racism affects all of us, not equally of course, but as a nation we are all worse off for it - in any / every form.   
 

You  also said something that really caught my attention when you said racist laws.   Am I correct in assuming that your referring to Jim Crow type laws, or are you referring to current laws?  
 

That being said, (not related to the blackface photo) we also need to be careful about slinging the label of racist around when it isn’t accurate or warranted.  I think it’s becoming a common political ploy and it dilutes those that truly earn the title.  
 

I still stand by that everyone treating each other equally is the best path forward, and will help racists take themselves out of the equation, but I do appreciate you explaining your opinions.  

In that same breath we should also watch insulting people saying they are victims and such. It just empowers the racists and shame actual victims. 

And no problem

[GoAU 1,599]

1 hour ago, cole256 said:

In that same breath we should also watch insulting people saying they are victims and such. It just empowers the racists and shame actual victims. 

And no problem

Appreciate the dialogue and discussion, have a good evening.  War Eagle!

[homersapien 11,357]

15 hours ago, GoAU said:

Assume this is the post you wanted quoted?  
Yes.  My point is that - as Cole put it - it's easy not to be passionate (blaise') about things that  don't affect you.  Your experiences with "being offended" in our society are not comparable to a black person's as the below example illustrates:

Would you - for example - "let" an unwarranted traffic stop not offend you?  How about several?

 

 

my comment was there are a lot of things that COULD offend me daily, should I chose to let them.  

And that implies an equivalence to what blacks might experience as well as implying that blacks shouldn't be so sensitive.

You then replied if any of them were based on appearance and things being outside my control.  
My response was “yes”.  

You were the one to try and compare equivalence, not me.  All I said is there are things that could ( or do) offend me based on appearance or things outside my control.  

No so.  Your statement clearly implies some sort of equivalence in life experience.  It implies that you (also) experience many things daily that offend you, if only you "let" them, implying that black people "allow" themselves to be offended when perhaps they shouldn't.

It clearly implies you and black people experience life on a more-or less-equivalent basis in our country as do white people, which is clearly false.  Even if you as a white person would like for that to be true - as I do - it's not.

 

Thanks for being civil.  Even if we don't agree, these are the kind of discussions we need to be having as a country.

[GoAU 1,599]

1 hour ago, homersapien said:

You were the one to try and compare equivalence, not me.  All I said is there are things that could ( or do) offend me based on appearance or things outside my control.  

No so.  Your statement clearly implies some sort of equivalence in life experience.  It implies that you (also) experience many things daily that offend you, if only you "let" them, implying that black people "allow" themselves to be offended when perhaps they shouldn't.

It clearly implies you and black people experience life on a more-or less-equivalent basis in our country as do white people, which is clearly false.  Even if you as a white person would like for that to be true - as I do - it's not.

 

Thanks for being civil.  Even if we don't agree, these are the kind of discussions we need to be having as a country.

No problem, I enjoy civil conversation and dialogue - more people should try it.  Kind of like mental exercise, and at times can be fun.  

Good point on the "let" comment - allow me to try and clarify / elaborate.  When I say "let", I am referring to how people allow someone else's actions to get into their head / psyche.  Since we're on the topic of racism, I will use race in my points below, but we need to be clear that similar stereotypes can happen based on socioeconomic status, gender, religion, political ideology, appearance, etc. and not just race.  All sorts of people get lumped into groups that are not accurate depictions of the individuals. 

I am also not trying to say "black" people "let" things bother them - I would never imply an entire race of people experiences or feels the same about anything.  All I can do is treat every person I come across with respect and dignity, and know that I did my part.  I raise my kids the same way, racists  just profess their own ignorance.  There are certainly people that experience similar events differently - and if you allow someone else to get in your head like that, you're letting them win.  This is why I am such a big proponent of treating everyone equally, and avoiding double standards.  If you think tying to apply double standards and assigning labels to people that may (or may not) meet your definition of a racist, conservative, liberal, LGBTQ, etc , I would urge you to reconsider.  This will lead to further division - you can't bring people together by separating them into different groups.

In your traffic stop example, I have absolutely been stopped several times for either minor issues, or just to "check things out".  All I try and do is remember that I don't know what the officer is looking for, whether someone with a similar car or appearance committed a crime, etc.  Me assuming, it is only done based on racial stereotyping is a choice.  And even in the remote chance that it is, there is nothing I can do to affect that other than to be courteous and respectful and put that guy in my rear view mirror.  I am fairly confident 99+% of police officers do their jobs to protect others, and in many cases put their lives on the line to protect people (of every race) that they don't even know.  Except for one specific MP on Ft Benning, that guy was spawned directly from the pits of Hades, but that's a different story for a different time 😉

Unfortunately, when it comes to these subjects, you cannot force or legislate the way someone thinks or feels.  Taking the high road, trying to change people experiences through positive interaction and dialogue, and raising our kids right is the best we can do.  As much opportunity as we still have, we have come a LONG way as a nation, and based in my travels have more success at diversity than any other nation I've experienced.

[AUDub 11,141]

18 hours ago, AubieinNC2009 said:

Im not saying that blackface is correct Im just tired of cancel culture

Cancel culture has always been a thing. Only difference is who's threated these days. 

[savorytiger 182]

2 minutes ago, AUDub said:

Cancel culture has always been a thing. Only difference is who's threated these days. 

I think social media amplifies the negative effects of cancel culture. People might shrug off some sort of drama in the past, but it's much less likely to happen when their entire circle is talking about it.

Personally, though, it's really hard to take it seriously when I only hear people complain about it when someone does something bad. Say awful things in speeches, get removed from future bookings. Masturbate in front of women when there's a clear power dynamic issue, lose your shows. Wear black face 10 years ago, lose a job opportunity today. Actions have consequences, and the people who own up to their past are able to bounce back.

[AUDub 11,141]

On 1/9/2021 at 7:33 PM, cole256 said:

Believe it or not he has stated up again on me lately and he's told some pretty pointless lies and have been calling for mods.....the lie he told would be pretty easy for a mod to see, I don't know what his plan is yet unless he's just very stupid and don't think a mod will be able to figure his stuff out

He's a vindictive old coot.

Don't worry about him. Everyone here knows what time of day it is when it comes to him. 

[McLoofus 35,182]

16 hours ago, AUDub said:

Cancel culture has always been a thing. Only difference is who's threated these days. 

Venn diagram of people who whine about cancel culture and people who boycotted Nike over Colin Kaepernick.

[AuCivilEng1 10,995]

He ****ed up in college. You don’t paint your face black by mistake. It was a poor choice. Now it has come back to haunt him. It happens to a lot of people in one way or another. Some people don’t study, or slack off on the practice field, or drink  and eat too much. The difference with Ryan is his actions for his **** up hasn’t had consequences until now. He doesn’t “deserve” anything. He will pay for his stupidity with a missed opportunity at a job and move on with his life, because he’s a grown man. 
 

The people defending his actions as not racist or “he doesn’t deserve this” are ridiculous. Of course black face is racist! Not because of the color he painted his face, but because of the history behind black face. And Ryan is a product of my generation so I know for a fact he knew it was stupid and risky when he made the choice to do it. 
 

The personal accountability people sure seem to not like personal accountability when it comes to young white kids. Because they “deserve”a good life and job and second chances. 
 

Let coach Boone tell you how it is!