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Harsin vs Gus from a former player


ValleyTiger

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2 hours ago, cole256 said:

Nobody is a strong word I guess you're correcting me on me saying everybody and I'll listen because your sort of show me the flaw just like you said everybody. But there were absolutely people who said this. I have this pattern that when I talk about things I talk about my personal experiences. I don't just pull stuff out of the air. 

They were saying he got lazy or complacent somewhat the same picture they painted of rocker

If people said this about Jeff Grimes then I don’t remember it. And y’all know I follow Auburn recruiting closer than anyone on this board.

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9 hours ago, Barnacle said:

Thinks Russell is one of the best strength coaches in the country. Dismukes echoed that point. He doesn't think Pittman is in touch with modern strength and conditioning. On the other hand, thinks Pittman will be excellent in developing mental toughness. Overall wished we kept Russell as S&C, but brought Pittman in some capacity for the mental aspect.

One of the many areas we need to steal from Bama, and now UGA is doing it too.  They have a Strength Coach and a Conditioning coach.

Haven't heard much about Harsin's off the field plans outside of recruiting, but hopefully we do more player development/psychology along with dozens of analysts. 

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9 hours ago, Barnacle said:

Said there were obviously competitive guys who hated losing, especially those actually on the field

I don't think we'll ever fully appreciate what Derrick Brown and Marlon Davidson meant to this program or, perhaps more accurately, Gus's career. 

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At the same time, Harsin kept a balance that made being a part of the team enjoyable

This is really exciting to hear. I've been concerned about it. Until we prove that we can turn recruits into NFL prospects, I think we'll need to maintain some of that personal appeal. 

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Said he thought Gus had a better approach to strength and conditioning than Harsin. Thinks Russell is one of the best strength coaches in the country. Dismukes echoed that point. He doesn't think Pittman is in touch with modern strength and conditioning.

Shout to whichever poster said exactly this about Pittman. This is my heartfelt invitation to you to drop an ITYS.

It's a big concern given the grizzly bears with 4.3 speed being cranked out around the league.

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Talked about the need for Auburn to catch up in the football facilities race. Thought Boise's facilities were actually nicer than Auburn's.

Oof. Let that sink in.

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Apparently Malzahn did not let a lot of former players come back and spend time around the program.

"Family".

 

Thanks much for summarizing. I still plan to listen when I can so thank you also @ValleyTiger very much for sharing. Dismukes is one of my favorite players of the last 10 years and how priceless are Kozan's thoughts? 

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Listening to this podcast made me both angry at Gus and hopeful about Harsin.

I can't believe that he didn't care enough about the players to teach them what they needed to know about football. It's shocking and disheartening.

It's also bodes well for the future that the program is in for a culture change. Hearing those linemen talk about position players not working out hard is horrifying. The only thing that was a slight letdown about the future was what they had to say about losing Russel as S&C coach. Every other change sounds positive.

Thanks for posting it, @ValleyTiger

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Lots of great points!   My hope is that with more resources, Pitman will hire assistants and utilize technology and resources to develop a state of the art S&C program while still teaching an old school mentality and work ethic.  
Overall, I have gotten the sense that CBH ain’t playing games.  He’s here to be successful, and I believe he knows how to do it.   He’s a winner that also embraces the values that make the AU family special.   I like the staff he has assembled.  The ones I don’t know have gotten glowing reviews from those around them about their work ethic, drive, and ability to recruit and develop players.  3 former DCs and a former HC on the defensive side!   In the very short time he’s been here, it’s looks like we actually have a chance to turn this 2021 recruiting class into a decent one (I didn’t think that was possible).   My thoughts were we could start to have a consistently successful program by the 2023 season.   He might even surprise us there and have success sooner.  Props to AD Greene!  You hired the right man for the job!!!

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1 minute ago, AUbritt said:

I can't believe that he didn't care enough about the players to teach them what they needed to know about football. It's shocking and disheartening.

I hate to say it, but it's been a common criticism of Gus for years. 

I believe that he did have a genuine desire to do right by his players on a personal level, but he loved nothing nearly so much as himself when it came to football. 

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6 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I hate to say it, but it's been a common criticism of Gus for years. 

I believe that he did have a genuine desire to do right by his players on a personal level, but he loved nothing nearly so much as himself when it came to football. 

I guess I heard it differently this time because it came directly from the mouths of players and from their perspective. It's one thing to read posters talking about Gus's passing routes lacking sophistication, hearing that Gus was paranoid and narcissistic, and so on. For me, anyway, it was shocking to hear from players how all that played out and had such a negative impact on them in terms of both their performance at Auburn and their preparation for the pros. It's kind of surprising we won as much as we did under Gus.

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14 minutes ago, AUpreacherman22 said:

Lots of great points!   My hope is that with more resources, Pitman will hire assistants and utilize technology and resources to develop a state of the art S&C program while still teaching an old school mentality and work ethic.  
Overall, I have gotten the sense that CBH ain’t playing games.  He’s here to be successful, and I believe he knows how to do it.   He’s a winner that also embraces the values that make the AU family special.   I like the staff he has assembled.  The ones I don’t know have gotten glowing reviews from those around them about their work ethic, drive, and ability to recruit and develop players.  3 former DCs and a former HC on the defensive side!   In the very short time he’s been here, it’s looks like we actually have a chance to turn this 2021 recruiting class into a decent one (I didn’t think that was possible).   My thoughts were we could start to have a consistently successful program by the 2023 season.   He might even surprise us there and have success sooner.  Props to AD Greene!  You hired the right man for the job!!!

The work ethic comments stood out to me, too. I suspect that's why Caddy was retained.

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I can vouch for the locker room before it was updated being embarrassing.  I had the chance in back to back years to tour Auburn and Alabama’s locker rooms.  Nothing about Auburn’s recruit area or locker rooms would impress a 2* let alone the big recruits.  We had about 20 people in the Auburn locker room and it felt full.  I can’t imagine have 50-75 dudes being cramped in there trying to dress out.  Bama’s wasn’t as extravagant as I was expecting but at least had room to turn around.  Hopefully that has all changed since the renovation.

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29 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

I don't think we'll ever fully appreciate what Derrick Brown and Marlon Davidson meant to this program or, perhaps more accurately, Gus's career. 

This is really exciting to hear. I've been concerned about it. Until we prove that we can turn recruits into NFL prospects, I think we'll need to maintain some of that personal appeal. 

Shout to whichever poster said exactly this about Pittman. This is my heartfelt invitation to you to drop an ITYS.

It's a big concern given the grizzly bears with 4.3 speed being cranked out around the league.

Oof. Let that sink in.

"Family".

 

Thanks much for summarizing. I still plan to listen when I can so thank you also @ValleyTiger very much for sharing. Dismukes is one of my favorite players of the last 10 years and how priceless are Kozan's thoughts? 

I'm not hating but just saying the facilities was bad is sort of under selling it. They said the facilities are back dated like 10 years.....they had to beg for things like cleats.....can you imagine being a big time player here and literally your rival has the best of the best??? To me it's not about recruiting anymore, we literally weren't trying

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10 hours ago, cole256 said:

Everybody should listen to this and you'd understand some of our struggles recently. It's not rocket science.

Also LMAO at when grimes was here how everybody was saying he couldn't recruit. It shows how much people really know about stuff

I recall that Grimes could recruit well, but kinda like Rocker he didn't want to be on the road all the time.  I think he had some young kids when he was here.

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Just now, AUbritt said:

I guess I heard it differently this time because it came directly from the mouths of players and from their perspective. It's one thing to read posters talking about Gus's passing routes lacking sophistication, hearing that Gus was paranoid and narcissistic, and so on. For me, anyway, it was shocking to hear from players how all that played out and had such a negative impact on them in terms of both their performance at Auburn and their preparation for the pros. It's kind of surprising we won as much as we did under Gus.

As one of the posters who has said these things, it's an uncomfortable validation for sure.

As for us winning as much as we have, it's truly a function of just being Auburn. On auto-pilot, we're an 8-5 program. Just by being who and where we are, we're naturally better than an Ole Miss or Arkansas most years. They have to do something extraordinary to be better than us in any given year. And then you throw in a couple noncons and a couple patty-cakes from the East and, boom, 8 wins. That's  what Gus gave us. He gave us a special season early because he just happened to have the perfect assemblage of talent for the only thing he could do well, and that was heavily predicated upon the very good and experienced offensive line that his predecessor left him on a silver platter. Any surprising successes after that- and there were, what, 3? Two Iron Bowls and a uga game?- were primarily gifted him by his defense. And that's an important distinction. Our defenses have been fine to much better than fine since mid-2015. 

Honestly, those Clemson games were the everything we needed to know about Gus. 

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Good to listen to former players perspective. Good gracious, it was discouraging to listen to though. Confirmed to me that we kept Gus about 8 years longer than we should have.

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1 minute ago, fredst said:

Good to listen to former players perspective. Good gracious, it was discouraging to listen to though. Confirmed to me that we kept Gus about 8 years longer than we should have.

Agreed, but that's also what has me encouraged about Harsin.

Sounds like he could be the right coach at the right time (or maybe late, but better late than never).

 

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2 minutes ago, AUbritt said:

Agreed, but that's also what has me encouraged about Harsin.

Sounds like he could be the right coach at the right time (or maybe late, but better late than never).

I think it's fair to say right time. I think Gus still had a lot of support going into 2020. I don't think there was much resistance to change remaining by December. Hopefully that increases CBH"s chances of early success. 

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12 minutes ago, McLoofus said:

As one of the posters who has said these things, it's an uncomfortable validation for sure.

As for us winning as much as we have, it's truly a function of just being Auburn. On auto-pilot, we're an 8-5 program. Just by being who and where we are, we're naturally better than an Ole Miss or Arkansas most years. They have to do something extraordinary to be better than us in any given year. And then you throw in a couple noncons and a couple patty-cakes from the East and, boom, 8 wins. That's  what Gus gave us. He gave us a special season early because he just happened to have the perfect assemblage of talent for the only thing he could do well, and that was heavily predicated upon the very good and experienced offensive line that his predecessor left him on a silver platter. Any surprising successes after that- and there were, what, 3? Two Iron Bowls and a uga game?- were primarily gifted him by his defense. And that's an important distinction. Our defenses have been fine to much better than fine since mid-2015. 

Honestly, those Clemson games were the everything we needed to know about Gus. 

Imagine what some elbow grease and lunch pail mentality will do for us. Sleeping giant, perhaps, waking up.

It's also incredible that players kept coming with this information out there. Blessing we haven't tanked like we did in 2008, 2012. 

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14 minutes ago, fredst said:

Good to listen to former players perspective. Good gracious, it was discouraging to listen to though. Confirmed to me that we kept Gus about 8 years longer than we should have.

Gus, his inability to develop OL combined with his scheme is the sole reason we haven't been able to recruit many players worth a damn.  Hopefully with Friend and a more advanced scheme we'll be able to have a good OL again for the first time in a while

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Kind of down about the comments on Pitman but at the same time he said Pitman would restore Mental toughness which was encouraging. He said he wished Pitman would however take notes from Russell on the things he did which helped with preventing injuries. Not sure exactly what that is and someone here can probably give some insight on what Russell did differently. 

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Just now, AUnCullman said:

Kind of down about the comments on Pitman but at the same time he said Pitman would restore Mental toughness which was encouraging. He said he wished Pitman would however take notes from Russell on the things he did which helped with preventing injuries. Not sure exactly what that is and someone here can probably give some insight on what Russell did differently. 

Yeah, there is so much more to S&C than just lifting weights, which seems like that's his focus.  A balanced body, mobility, stretching, etc doesn't seem like it's something he's really in line with.  Maybe he's learned a thing or two since Adams was at BSU

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2 minutes ago, AUnCullman said:

Kind of down about the comments on Pitman but at the same time he said Pitman would restore Mental toughness which was encouraging. He said he wished Pitman would however take notes from Russell on the things he did which helped with preventing injuries. Not sure exactly what that is and someone here can probably give some insight on what Russell did differently. 

Sounded to me like Pitman was focusing on basic lifts like deadlift and squat, which is fine if you want to focus mainly on strength; but that Russell had many more innovative approaches to strength AND conditioning AND overall health.

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1 hour ago, McLoofus said:

 

Shout to whichever poster said exactly this about Pittman. This is my heartfelt invitation to you to drop an ITYS.

 

What is missing from this comment is pittman brings a mental toughness.   So its a tradeoff.   (thats how i understood wills comment) 

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7 hours ago, ellitor said:

If people said this about Jeff Grimes then I don’t remember it. And y’all know I follow Auburn recruiting closer than anyone on this board.

same.  probably was our most active recruiter, definitely put on the most miles to find the best, right guys for Auburn.

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I appreciate the personal experience of a player that played at BSU under CBH. Great information to potential recruits that helps build on his reputation that they might not know due proximity to the program he came from.  Some of this information/opinions don’t make sense to me and just feels like unnecessary “piling on” on a coach in our past ( so just move on rather than defame). I am very grateful Gus left only because of 2nd tier success in the West (compare his record for the total time he was here) rather than a forced resignation due to obvious “improper benefits “ to players (Dye). One example of inconsistencies would be that Gus’s S&C coach was “better” than Pitman will be, when one of the consistent observations by many posters is that our lines (both sides) were weak and needed to be stronger.

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This may sound odd but Pittman is the right hire, but maybe not the best hire.  CBH needs to get his program off and running how he wants with who wants to be here.  Pittman's job is going to be to instill this between now and Spring ball and there after.  It is so very critical to have someone who knows what you want and how you want this done in year one.   Hopefully he will be afforded a larger S&C staff that focuses on new age S&C, especially body care and maintenance.  

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