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Vaccine passport on the way?


SLAG-91

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5 hours ago, Auburnfan91 said:

Employers mandating employees be vaccinated in order to remain employed is a step too far.  They've never mandated regular flu shots in order to be employed. COVID isn't going to be similar to smallpox where the vaccine is going to eradicate it if we just get people vaccinated. We haven't eradicated influenza despite flu shots being widely available since the 1940's. Yet now in 2021 with COVID some are arguing in support of coercing everyone to get the COVID vaccine in order to be employed, being able to travel, or basically return to pre-COVID way of life even though the vaccine won't eradicate it.

Why aren't we treating the vaccine like a regular flu shot? Those most at risk should get the vaccine. Healthy people that don't have COVID and have tested negative for COVID shouldn't be required to get the vaccine. Yet we're not hearing that argument be made.

Schools have mandatory vaccinations. Certain employers already require some vaccinations. 

And for the umpteenth time, this is not the flu. 

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14 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

Newsflash:  The CDC doesn’t have insider info at Pfizer nor does the company feed them early info. They don’t coordinate their press releases. 

And the worry about the surge still stands. The vaccine news is great but we need a whole lot mote people to get it before we can relax. And if dimwits start acting like this is over too soon, people are doing to get sick and die unnecessarily. 

The timing was excellent. She didn’t have inside info, but it still goes against the Biden narrative.   The Biden Administration (and the *science*) have been sending mixed messages for some time now.  What people see and what has been told by *the science* do not match (Fl vs NY as an example).

People have lived under this cloud of fear for a year now and most people know how to handle their own life’s.  Constantly telling people the world is going to end will only be ignored after a while.  As Rand Paul said the data is not there to support wearing a mask if you are vaccinated.  The data states that even if you do contract COVID after being vaccinated you will not require hospitalization and the symptoms will be diminished.

I’m living my life and if a COVID surge comes I feel a lot more comfortable than I have been if I contract the virus.  After all the CDC Director just told me a vaccinated person does not carry the disease, so why should I live in fear?  And why should anybody else?  Why is our leader wearing a mask when he is vaccinated?

ANS: because he is no leader, he is a politician.

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13 hours ago, Auburnfan91 said:

Out of the 1.2 million people who are fully vaccinated against COVID-19 in Washington, epidemiologists have reported evidence of 102 breakthrough cases in 18 counties since Feb. 1, representing less than 0.01% of all fully vaccinated individuals in the northwestern U.S. state. Most cases were patients who experienced only mild symptoms, if any, according to a press release from the Washington State Department of Health.

This is the pertinent information; the rest is fear mongering.  That is all.  Get vaccinated and live your life.

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On 3/30/2021 at 1:29 PM, metafour said:

Once you give these people power, you think they're going to freely hand it back? It goes against human nature. You have CDC and WHO directors who no one knew the names of a year ago who are now global "health celebrities". You think they want to go back to studying malaria or ebola in Africa lmao? 

:rolleyes:  Yeah there's sooooo much "power" in providing epidemiological advice when you are a trained epidemiologist!  :lmao: 

They are all just a part of the evil "elite" that are trying to keep their feet on the neck of the common good ole boys!

Damn, but this country has gotten stupid. :no:

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Damn, but this country has gotten stupid. :no:

I love how people show their monkey shines in situations like this. The Libertarians are being especially silly. 

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On 3/31/2021 at 7:57 AM, homersapien said:

your defense is clearly an argument suitable only for a Trump cultist.   Just admit it. 

I will admit it.....but he never actually said the virus itself was a hoax.

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From NBC News:

Their reaction comes after hearing this statement from CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky.

“Our data from the CDC today suggests that vaccinated people don’t carry the virus, don’t get sick and that it’s not just in clinical trials, but it’s also in real world data,” said Walensky.

The director is referring to a new study of nearly 4,000 frontline workers, some vaccinated and some not. They tested themselves weekly for COVID-19 infections between December and March.

Among fully vaccinated people in the study, there were only three COVID-19 infections detected.

Unvaccinated participants logged 161 covid cases, scientific evidence experts say proves fully-vaccinated people are protected in two ways.

“Essentially vaccines block you from getting and giving the virus,” said UCSF Infectious Disease Specialist Dr. Monica Gandhi, adding this new information is significant.

“You can feel safe as a vaccinated person going indoor dining, going to a gym, going to the movies, going to places you did not feel safe before,” said Ghandi.

You can feel safe, she said, without being reckless.

“Now they can rewrite guidelines and say vaccinated people can be around unvaccinated people even without masks and distancing,” said Ghandi. “Not out in public because we don’t know who is vaccinated and who is not,  still going to maintain masks and distancing until everyone who wants to get a vaccine can get it.”

https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/coronavirus/vaccinated-individuals-dont-carry-virus-or-get-sick-cdc/2506677/

The last paragraph is contradictory in that this Infectious Disease Specialist just can’t give up the power of telling people they don’t have to wear a mask in public.  They just have to keep the Biden authoritarian mandates even though the science says otherwise.  

It seems the CDC has not changed its guidelines yet either.

It’s funny how people that *follow the science* can’t adapt when the science tells them something they don’t want to believe.

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6 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

From NBC News:

Their reaction comes after hearing this statement from CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky.

“Our data from the CDC today suggests that vaccinated people don’t carry the virus, don’t get sick and that it’s not just in clinical trials, but it’s also in real world data,” said Walensky.

The director is referring to a new study of nearly 4,000 frontline workers, some vaccinated and some not. They tested themselves weekly for COVID-19 infections between December and March.

Among fully vaccinated people in the study, there were only three COVID-19 infections detected.

Unvaccinated participants logged 161 covid cases, scientific evidence experts say proves fully-vaccinated people are protected in two ways.

“Essentially vaccines block you from getting and giving the virus,” said UCSF Infectious Disease Specialist Dr. Monica Gandhi, adding this new information is significant.

“You can feel safe as a vaccinated person going indoor dining, going to a gym, going to the movies, going to places you did not feel safe before,” said Ghandi.

You can feel safe, she said, without being reckless.

“Now they can rewrite guidelines and say vaccinated people can be around unvaccinated people even without masks and distancing,” said Ghandi. “Not out in public because we don’t know who is vaccinated and who is not,  still going to maintain masks and distancing until everyone who wants to get a vaccine can get it.”

https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/coronavirus/vaccinated-individuals-dont-carry-virus-or-get-sick-cdc/2506677/

The last paragraph is contradictory in that this Infectious Disease Specialist just can’t give up the power of telling people they don’t have to wear a mask in public.  They just have to keep the Biden authoritarian mandates even though the science says otherwise.  

It seems the CDC has not changed its guidelines yet either.

It’s funny how people that *follow the science* can’t adapt when the science tells them something they don’t want to believe.

I think what he's saying is, until we know most people have gotten the vaccine, throwing open the doors to no masks in public in general doesn't make sense.  There's no way to tell who is vaccinated and who isn't (and evidently a significant amount of people want to fight any system that would do that).  So you don't want businesses and venues starting to cram people into tight spaces again as before COVID because you could cause cases to surge again.  But for those who are vaccinated, they can feel safe being around unvaccinated people.

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2 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

I think what he's saying is, until we know most people have gotten the vaccine, throwing open the doors to no masks in public in general doesn't make sense.  There's no way to tell who is vaccinated and who isn't (and evidently a significant amount of people want to fight any system that would do that).  So you don't want businesses and venues starting to cram people into tight spaces again as before COVID because you could cause cases to surge again.  But for those who are vaccinated, they can feel safe being around unvaccinated people.

I can see this.  If there is vaccination hesitation it would be advantageous for Biden to take the mask off and show America the incentive to get vaccinated.

I’m not sure the public will accept another Spring/Summer with the mask.  Hopefully we have herd immunity by then.

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2 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

I’m not sure the public will accept another Spring/Summer with the mask.  Hopefully we have herd immunity by then.

Or another school year. This one has sucked enough ditchwater for a generation..."dystopian" would be mild.

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3 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

I can see this.  If there is vaccination hesitation it would be advantageous for Biden to take the mask off and show America the incentive to get vaccinated.

I’m not sure the public will accept another Spring/Summer with the mask.  Hopefully we have herd immunity by then.

I agree with the messaging on this.  With this new data, I think it would be good for Biden and others in the administration who are fully vaccinated to start going maskless more (unless for instance they're visiting sick people or something where a high concentration of COVID is likely to be).  And also, hammer home this simple message:  "Get the vaccine, get back to normal."  They've been cautious while waiting for the data on infection prevention and transmission came in.  It's in.  Throw it in overdrive and get people on board.

Here's another thing I think would be smart and kind of magnanimous.  Some folks might not like it, but Biden should reach out to Trump, offer praise for the good effect Operation Warp Speed had on vaccine development, tout that both he and Trump and their respective families are fully vaccinated, and do a PSA urging everyone to get it.  I know there are pitfalls to giving Trump any press, but it's a thought.

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7 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Here's another thing I think would be smart and kind of magnanimous.  Some folks might not like it, but Biden should reach out to Trump, offer praise for the good effect Operation Warp Speed had on vaccine development, tout that both he and Trump and their respective families are fully vaccinated, and do a PSA urging everyone to get it.  I know there are pitfalls to giving Trump any press, but it's a thought.

It would show a little unity, but the blowback would be unbearable for Biden.

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Just now, I_M4_AU said:

It would show a little unity, but the blowback would be unbearable for Biden.

Probably.

And this is where Trump's behavior really hurts us.  If Biden were following any other GOP President in office, a PSA like this would likely be a no brainer.  If this had happened during Obama's presidency, I have zero doubt we'd see Bush doing this with him.  And if it'd been Bush, there'd be something like this with him and Bill Clinton.  Trump has made himself so uniquely repellant though, all the risk (which is not insignificant) for such a move is on Biden.

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17 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

I agree with the messaging on this.  With this new data, I think it would be good for Biden and others in the administration who are fully vaccinated to start going maskless more (unless for instance they're visiting sick people or something where a high concentration of COVID is likely to be).  And also, hammer home this simple message:  "Get the vaccine, get back to normal."  They've been cautious while waiting for the data on infection prevention and transmission came in.  It's in.  Throw it in overdrive and get people on board.

Here's another thing I think would be smart and kind of magnanimous.  Some folks might not like it, but Biden should reach out to Trump, offer praise for the good effect Operation Warp Speed had on vaccine development, tout that both he and Trump and their respective families are fully vaccinated, and do a PSA urging everyone to get it.  I know there are pitfalls to giving Trump any press, but it's a thought.

Pretty sure he commended the previous administration on OWS and probably should leave it there regarding Trump. Biden going maskless would have Trumpbots wearing three mask.

After having COVID I appreciate and understand the side of caution. Had the vaccine but plan on proceeding as though still vulnerable until the test of time proves otherwise. If anything good comes from this hope it is that everyone is somewhat “ virus educated”. Hopefully some of what individuals learned will carry over into flu spread, etc....

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I knew she would walk her statement back:

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has walked back the claim made by its director that vaccinated people don’t carry the coronavirus.

CDC chief Rochelle Walensky said earlier this week that “vaccinated people do not carry the virus, don’t get sick.”

But the health agency clarified the statement Thursday,  saying “the evidence isn’t clear” and that Walensky was “speaking broadly.”

“It’s possible that some people who are fully vaccinated could get COVID-19,” a CDC spokesperson told the New York Times. “The evidence isn’t clear whether they can spread the virus to others. We are continuing to evaluate the evidence.”

Dr. Peter Bach, director of the Center for Health Policy and Outcomes at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center in New York, said confusion about bulletproof immunity could lead to Americans refusing to wear a mask after getting the jabs.

“This opens the door to the skeptics who think the government is sugarcoating the science,” Bach told the paper.

On Monday, Walensky told MSNBC’s Rachel Maddow: “Our data from the CDC today suggests that vaccinated people do not carry the virus, don’t get sick.”

“And that it’s not just in the clinical trials, it’s also in real-world data,” she added.

https://nypost.com/2021/04/02/cdc-walks-back-claim-that-vaccinated-people-cant-carry-covid/

ETA:  This is the 2nd time she has had to walk one of her statements back, the other being about vaccinated teachers not needing the vaccine to teach school.

Is the CDC following the science or being political?  Is the CDC promoting another *noble lie* to *save* the nation.  Does Walensky have permission to speak her mind or is she being undercut by her colleagues?  I don’t think she can keep this up and still be the director for very long.

Confusing times in the US right now.  Stay safe.

Edited by I_M4_AU
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The messaging from the CDC has been "malleable" for quite a while now...beginning to think they need a new Magic 8-ball to consult.

I mean, who can argue with these two statements made within the last WEEK..."we say it's safe to travel...but don't travel."

Right.

Ex-6LUFXEAAl-UQ.jpeg

 

 

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37 minutes ago, SLAG-91 said:

The messaging from the CDC has been "malleable" for quite a while now...beginning to think they need a new Magic 8-ball to consult.

I mean, who can argue with these two statements made within the last WEEK..."we say it's safe to travel...but don't travel."

Right.

Ex-6LUFXEAAl-UQ.jpeg

 

 

At least we are getting clear and unambiguous direction.  :drippingsarcasm7pa:

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On 4/1/2021 at 3:43 PM, SaltyTiger said:

I will admit it.....but he never actually said the virus itself was a hoax.

Oh I think at some level, he knew it was real. 

But then, what exactly was he calling a "hoax" - Democrats warning about the danger? 

What message does that send to MAGAs other than the pandemic is a hoax?

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15 hours ago, homersapien said:

Oh I think at some level, he knew it was real. 

But then, what exactly was he calling a "hoax" - Democrats warning about the danger? 

What message does that send to MAGAs other than the pandemic is a hoax?

Exactly! What he said doesn't matter. How it made you feel is what is important!

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15 hours ago, homersapien said:

Oh I think at some level, he knew it was real. 

Glad to be of some help to you Brother Homer. He certainly conveyed the danger of the virus to me and MAGAs in my circles. We wore mask, avoided crowds, washed our hands often, understood that gargling bleach was harmful.......many of us had the virus anyway.

15 hours ago, homersapien said:

But then, what exactly was he calling a "hoax"

I have explained this to you. Once again, he used the term pursuant to the Russia hoax and impeachment hoax 

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2 hours ago, Grumps said:

Exactly! What he said doesn't matter. How it made you feel is what is important!

No, it's exactly about what he said.  It's called communication. 

Trump's words, taken in context, communicated the message the virus was a Democratic hoax.  A responsible, reasonable politician would never have uttered the word "hoax" in the context of criticizing the oppositions position on a real pandemic as being excessive.

Trump:

"Thirty five thousand. That's a lot of people. And so far, we have lost nobody to coronavirus in the United States."

"Now, the Democrats are politicising the coronavirusthis is their new hoax."

 

"This" obviously refers to the coronavirus. This is clear by the context  "Democrats politicizing the coronavirus"...   "their" obviously refers to Democrats.

So he is calling the coronavirus a Democratic hoax.

This has nothing to do with feelings.  It's literal interpretation.  If you want to argue that's not what he meant - which may be true, since Trump spewed out the "hoax" word all too frequently - then go ahead.  But that falls into the category of "what he said doesn't matter".

 

 

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1 hour ago, SaltyTiger said:

Glad to be of some help to you Brother Homer. He certainly conveyed the danger of the virus to me and MAGAs in my circles. We wore mask, avoided crowds, washed our hands often, understood that gargling bleach was harmful.......many of us had the virus anyway.

I have explained this to you. Once again, he used the term pursuant to the Russia hoax and impeachment hoax 

But he was talking about coronavirus.  :dunno:

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10 minutes ago, homersapien said:

But he was talking about coronavirus.  :dunno:

https://www.politifact.com/article/2020/oct/08/ask-politifact-are-you-sure-donald-trump-didnt-cal/

Factcheck.org: "Trump did use the word ‘hoax’ but his full comments, and subsequent explanation, make clear he was talking about Democratic attacks on his administration’s handling of the outbreak, not the virus itself."

The Washington Post Fact Checker: "The context of the full quote shows Trump criticized Democratic talking points and media’s coverage of his response to the coronavirus, but does not call the virus itself a hoax."

Snopes: "Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus a hoax."

AP Fact Check: "The accusation is misleading. So is the selective video editing that made it appear Trump was calling the coronavirus a ‘new hoax.’"

 

 
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"Now, the Democrats are politicising the coronavirus this is their new hoax."

Applying the rules of the English language that I was taught to the sentence you shared, this is clearly referring to the politicization of the coronavirus by the democrats as being the hoax. We obviously learned the rules of written English differently.

It's okay for you to feel that he meant something different. It's just not how some of us interpret things.

Edited by Grumps
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