United will train 50% women and minority pilots

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

 

United Airlines is the only major US airline to own a flight school, and the airline is beginning to accept new applications as of today as it embarks on a plan to train 5,000 new pilots by 2030 (upon completion of the program, pilots are guaranteed a job with United).

That’s cool in and of itself, as we see how the industry expects there to be so much demand for pilots in the coming years. What’s even cooler is that United is setting a goal of having at least half of those pilots be women and people of color.

Backed by scholarship commitments from United Airlines and JP Morgan Chase, United Aviate Academy will create opportunities for thousands of students to pursue a career in commercial aviation. United has initially committed to providing $1.2 million in scholarships, while JP Morgan Chase has also committed to providing $1.2 million in scholarships. While that’s great, that ultimately won’t go that far, given how expensive flight training is.

On top of that, United is partnering with Sallie Mae to offer private student loans, ensuring that no highly-qualified and highly-motivated candidate will be turned away because they can’t afford to enroll.

United Aviate Academy expects to enroll 100 students in 2021.

 

 

This is a fantastic initiative

Just to show why this is needed, a mere 5% of airline pilots in the US are women. Even more jarring is that just over 1% of airline captains are female, meaning a vast majority of female pilots are first officers.

So it shows you that progress is being made (in the sense that there are more entry level pilots than senior pilots who are female), but it also shows you how much more work there is to be done.

The percentage of US airline pilots who are people of color is even smaller. And perhaps the most shocking statistic of all is that there are fewer than 150 Black female pilots at US airlines.

Bottom line

Huge respect to United Airlines for setting a goal of training 5,000 pilots by 2030 through its flight academy, and making half of those pilots either women or people of color.

While diversity is improving in many areas, airline flight decks are definitely lagging. This largely comes down to how expensive it is to train to become a pilot, putting many people at a disadvantage. At least on a surface level United’s newest initiative intends to address that.

I look forward to the day where there’s no longer novelty to having a pilot who is female or a person of color.

https://onemileatatime.com/united-airlines-diversity-goal-pilots/

WTH? Being a professional pilot is not like other jobs that you drive to the office, work for 8 hours and drive home.  It is a lifestyle that doesn’t fit everybody.  The requirements are both mental and physical in that you can be disqualified just by being diabetic, have heart issues, have ever contemplated suicide and on and on.

The airlines have been hiring women and POC since the 60’s, one has to ask themselves; why haven’t more women and POC stepped up to be airline pilots?  Even the last 2 decades has seen more and more women (along with POC) in aviation, but the percentage has stayed relatively the same.  The demand for airline pilots are now driven by retirements and now would be the time to break into the industry.  The question becomes; why would a female and POC suddenly be interested in the job, if they weren’t before?

The cost of flight training is steep, to say the least, and this program helps in that, but you still have to take out a loan to see yourself through and that right there is a gut check if you aren’t totally committed.

The other issue might be; if United is committed to training 2500 pilots that are women and POCs and only 5% of that group have been highly qualified and highly motivated to this point, will they have to lower their standards to get the other 45% of applicants to the detriment of other qualified applicants?

The bottom line is; if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.  This corporate virtue signaling isn’t good for the country.

[CoffeeTiger 5,089]

I thought the first few paragraphs were stuff YOU were writing @I_M4_AU and i thought "Wow, I'm very surprised to see him having such a differing, diverse view like that" 

Then i got to the bottom  and was like 

"oh...right, Nevermind”

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

@CoffeeTiger, at least you thought I was redeemable for a few minutes.  😂 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

Yeah a pilot is someone I don't want companies passing up on more qualified candidates just to meet some quota they established. It is one thing to go out a promote and try to get more females or POC by making them aware of the opportunities that exist in aviation and United, but this isn't the profession to be setting a quota and potentially passing up more qualified candidates. Personally I don't care if the pilot is a purple transgender person....as long as they are 100% qualified, capable and fit for duty for whatever flight I am on. 

 

Up and coming pilots have to be committed for sure, I bet some second guess their career choice when they are at the bottom of the ladder flying RJ's for practically peanuts.

[SLAG-91 1,483]

Barry Goldwater, who some here would pillory mercilessly as a heartless conservative (he was anything but), said in his later years re: homosexuals in the military...

"You don't need to be 'straight' to fight and die for your country. You just need to shoot straight."

Essentially, "if you can do the job, welcome aboard."

Expanding your recruiting pool makes perfect sense...folks of any color, background, etc. are perfectly capable of being good pilots, soldiers, etc. 

Competence cannot be compromised in meantime, and should still be priority #1, especially with jobs where not being able to do it properly can directly lead to people being killed. If there is a standard to be met, everyone has to meet that standard.

[AUDub 11,141]

5 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

@CoffeeTiger, at least you thought I was redeemable for a few minutes.  😂 

Damn dude we're talking about access to training.

Just go ahead and say you don't think black people and/or women are as capable of being airline pilots and have done with it. 

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

13 hours ago, AUDub said:

Damn dude we're talking about access to training.

Just go ahead and say you don't think black people and/or women are as capable of being airline pilots and have done with it. 

Where did I say that?  There are professional women and black people that are professional pilots as we speak.  They have met the standards and continue to meet the standards.  For decades only 5% or so of professional pilots have been women and POC while airlines and private training facilities have been catering to women especially.  Yet, United thinks, because they are giving partial scholarships to women and POC, they will entice more people to the profession.  I doubt this will happen.

In my best Robert Duvall voice; “so you just want to up and fly airplanes”?  Here is what American Airlines require of their new hires:

Excellent communication skills and quick and accurate decision-making skills

Close attention to detail

Minimum age of 23

Ability to work varying hours of the day or night, on weekends and holidays

Must be able to secure appropriate airport authority and/or Customs security badges

Completed FAA criminal background checks

Ability to learn and work with PEDs

Distance vision corrected to 20/20 and near vision corrected to 20/40 or better in each eye

Current Unrestricted Airline Transport Pilot (ATP) rating (multi-engine)

Valid FCC Restricted Radio Telephone Operator permit

Valid First Class Medical Certificate

Flight time in accordance with all FAA requirements

Must be able to fluently speak and understand English

Must have the right to work in the United States

Must have a valid passport and documentation allowing for entry into the United States after an international flight

Most applicants have around 5000 hrs or so at a minimum.  If you are just starting out, which the United add implies, it can take years to be qualified.  It is a long and difficult road that requires a deep seated love to fly.  Once you finish your basic pilot training (private pilot) you progress to Instrument and commercial ratings and end up with about 250 to 300 hours.  Now comes the time when most well intentioned individuals need to get from 250 hours to 5000 by either flight instruction, flying banners, flying tours (like the Grand Canyon), flying some sort of charters, etc.  It can take years and years to get the experience and many times you will scare yourself to death once or twice and get to learn from these type of things.

Now, what United Airlines is attempting to do is cut this process down to the bare minimum.  After the initial flight training (250 hrs), somehow they are going to get their pilots enough hours to be hired by their airline.  The minimum hours is around 1200 hours to achieve an Airline Transport Pilot (ATP) rating, but you have little or no useful experience.  Even at this low time it will take at least a year to achieve this mark.  Then they will be *fully qualified* to fly as first officer on your next flight.  I would think any captain that will have a person (no matter who they are) that has only 1200 hrs of flight time will be very suspect of allowing that person to do anything except throw a couple of switches.  At this point the 1200 hr pilot will get hours, but not much else.

There are a lot of women and POC in the pipeline (pilots that are at regionals, flying charter, etc.) right now, and United could draw from that pool of pilots and that will open up those positions for other pilots, but, historically, only 5% or so will be women or POC.  Once that pool of women and POC pilots is used up, then United either will give up on their virtual signaling or lower the standards to meet their goal.

I have personally flown with and trained professional women and POC pilots for a major airline and they have met or exceed the standards in most cases (nobody is perfect).  I have no doubt women and POC can be professional pilots, but the opportunity is already there, why haven’t these people stepped up in the past?  It’s not all about the partial  scholarship.  There will be a lot of busts if they hold the standard and that is my fear is they will not hold the standard.

 

[TexasTiger 12,828]

Hire the most qualified. Train a broader pool to choose from. Think this got misrepresented in most stories I’ve heard.

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

2 hours ago, TexasTiger said:

Hire the most qualified. Train a broader pool to choose from. Think this got misrepresented in most stories I’ve heard.

How does training/hiring 50% POC and women the most qualified?  It’s a lot like picking the most qualified VP, but only choosing from a pool of women of color. 

[TexasTiger 12,828]

3 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

How does training/hiring 50% POC and women the most qualified?  It’s a lot like picking the most qualified VP, but only choosing from a pool of women of color. 

They are opening a school to train 5,000 pilots. They hardly need 5,000 pilots, but they’ll have a large pool to choose from. They’ve only committed to 50% women/minority students, not hires.

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

44 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

They are opening a school to train 5,000 pilots. They hardly need 5,000 pilots, but they’ll have a large pool to choose from. They’ve only committed to 50% women/minority students, not hires.

From their website:  United Airlines is the only major US airline to own a flight school, and the airline is beginning to accept new applications as of today as it embarks on a plan to train 5,000 new pilots by 2030 (upon completion of the program, pilots are guaranteed a job with United).  What’s even cooler is that United is setting a goal of having at least half of those pilots be women and people of color.

They said they would hire 5000 new pilots in 10 years, I am not sure of the retirements, but that sound about right.  If you are selected to be trained and complete the training you are guaranteed a job.  This is corporate virtue signaling at its best.

[TexasTiger 12,828]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

From their website:  United Airlines is the only major US airline to own a flight school, and the airline is beginning to accept new applications as of today as it embarks on a plan to train 5,000 new pilots by 2030 (upon completion of the program, pilots are guaranteed a job with United).  What’s even cooler is that United is setting a goal of having at least half of those pilots be women and people of color.

They said they would hire 5000 new pilots in 10 years, I am not sure of the retirements, but that sound about right.  If you are selected to be trained and complete the training you are guaranteed a job.  This is corporate virtue signaling at its best.

Link to this on their actual website? You’re not citing their actual website. Being a student just starts you on a multi step path toward United pilot and you have to succeed at each stage:

https://unitedaviate.com/aviate-program-career-paths/united-aviate-academy/

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

10 hours ago, TexasTiger said:

Link to this on their actual website? You’re not citing their actual website. Being a student just starts you on a multi step path toward United pilot and you have to succeed at each stage:

https://unitedaviate.com/aviate-program-career-paths/united-aviate-academy/

I know this, the point being they said they will hire 50% women and/or POC which would indicate they will finish training and hire those numbers.  To get to this number they will have to train a lot as some will not make it through training.  Even with the partial financial aid, I find it will be difficult to attract enough applicants that will make it through training to reach their goal.  Hence, the virtue signaling.

There are plenty of qualified pilots in the pipeline that would not have to go through their academy to get hired.  I am beginning to wonder if they are just trying to promote their academy with this stunt.

[TexasTiger 12,828]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

I know this, the point being they said they will hire 50% women and/or POC which would indicate they will finish training and hire those numbers.  To get to this number they will have to train a lot as some will not make it through training.  Even with the partial financial aid, I find it will be difficult to attract enough applicants that will make it through training to reach their goal.  Hence, the virtue signaling.

There are plenty of qualified pilots in the pipeline that would not have to go through their academy to get hired.  I am beginning to wonder if they are just trying to promote their academy with this stunt.

Maybe they are. But when I first saw it (not here) I had to read twice to see they weren’t indicating they would hire 50% women and POC. They have partnerships to help provide financial aid. But I suspect they genuinely want to have a more diverse pilot group and this is not a bad way to make that more likely. Pilots have to succeed at each level to advance to finally flying for United, but it gives many folks opportunities to get their foot in the door that may not be getting those opportunities now. Like everyone else, I want the person flying my plane to be there on merit. As I read the details, this plan doesn’t conflict with that.

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

16 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

As I read the details, this plan doesn’t conflict with that.

As long as the standards are the same and they are met.  If the goal of diversity out weighs the standards, something will change and I hope it isn’t the standard.

[TexasTiger 12,828]

52 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

As long as the standards are the same and they are met.  If the goal of diversity out weighs the standards, something will change and I hope it isn’t the standard.

With the liability and reputational risk at stake due to underprepared pilots, I’ll be surprised if any legitimate standards change.

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

2 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

I’ll be surprised if any legitimate standards change.

Bingo, please tell me how a standard becomes illegitimate.  If a standard is deemed not legitimate because the majority can’t meet them, you are lowering your standards and those standards do not have anything to who the student might be.

There are changes in how you teach because of a difference in technology, but the standard remains the same as it is laid out by regulations.  How each airline accomplishes those standards are up to them.

[TexasTiger 12,828]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

Bingo, please tell me how a standard becomes illegitimate.  If a standard is deemed not legitimate because the majority can’t meet them, you are lowering your standards and those standards do not have anything to who the student might be.

There are changes in how you teach because of a difference in technology, but the standard remains the same as it is laid out by regulations.  How each airline accomplishes those standards are up to them.

You’re bending over backwards to fit a narrative. Standards are continually reassessed in any industry that continues to thrive. Do you think standards are identical to the 1950s in the airline industry? I’m not predicting what changes in standards occur over the next 10 years— not my area of expertise— but I would expect some whether this initiative were taken or not. I don’t expect them to be lowered.

[I_M4_AU 7,788]

58 minutes ago, TexasTiger said:

You’re bending over backwards to fit a narrative. Standards are continually reassessed in any industry that continues to thrive. Do you think standards are identical to the 1950s in the airline industry? I’m not predicting what changes in standards occur over the next 10 years— not my area of expertise— but I would expect some whether this initiative were taken or not. I don’t expect them to be lowered.

This happens to be my area of expertise as I was in the airline industry for 34 years and 20 of those years I was in the training department as a trainer and evaluator.  I was an APD (Aircrew Program Designee) which is a pilot that has been designated by the FAA to issue type ratings, so I am very familiar what the standards are and literally they have not changed since the 50’s.  Here is a typical type rating scenario:

There is a briefing that lays down the standards;

Heading within +/- 5 degrees,
Airspeed within +/- 10 kts
Altitude within +/- 100 feet.
The applicant will have to perform a low visibility takeoff requiring a takeoff alternate,
A V₁  cut (engine failure on takeoff at liftoff)
A single engine approach hand flown to a landing
A CATIII approach to a missed approach 
A CATIII approach to a landing
A non precision approach to a rejected landing
An approach involving a Non Normal (usually a no flap approach) with out the use of a glide slop reference either electronic or visual
A rejected takeoff with Max takeoff weight (and if the applicant is a captain and evacuation).

If the applicant exceeds the standards in one maneuver he/she has to repeat the ride.  The applicant only has to repeat those maneuvers that were not done correctly unless in the opinion of the examiner the whole ride should be repeated.  Additional training (a minimum of 5 hours of simulator time) is given the applicant before retesting.  The applicant gets 3 attempts.

These are FAA driven and have not changed.  What has changed is the technology and that has caused problems with some older pilots transitioning to the new generation aircraft and that will continue as new technology is made available.

The lowering of the standards can creep in if the examiner does not hold to these strict guidelines.  I’m hopeful that the professionals at United will continue to hold the standard.

[TexasTiger 12,828]

Just now, TexasTiger said:

If those are FAA regs, United won’t change them.