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5 hours ago, auburnphan said:

My player comps for Bo and TJ

Bo a less accurate Sean White

TJ a bigger version of Jeff George

 

Help me out with your assertion that Bo Nix and Sean White are similar QBs. I'm not seeing it...

Type of QB:
- Sean White: Pro-Style
- Bo Nix: Dual-Threat

Stature/Size:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Prototypical

Athleticism:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Very Good

Arm Strength:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Very Good

Key On-Field Attributes:
- Sean White: Anticipation, Accuracy
- Bo Nix: Athleticism, Arm Talent

Off the Field:
- Sean White: Lost job due to problems here, very sad
- Bo Nix: No known issues

 

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It’s hard for AU fans to adjust to the fact that QBs who play for Harsin and Bobo almost always improve and develop. Throw in better O line coaches and an actual big boy offensive scheme and all of ou

Not looking for a savior. Looking for competent QB play.

There is a huge discussion about this in the recruiting thread, but why would this be the best case? Wouldn't the best case be to have the best player here to play the QB position ?

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35 minutes ago, tsande07 said:

Help me out with your assertion that Bo Nix and Sean White are similar QBs. I'm not seeing it...

Type of QB:
- Sean White: Pro-Style
- Bo Nix: Dual-Threat

Stature/Size:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Prototypical

Athleticism:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Very Good

Arm Strength:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Very Good

Key On-Field Attributes:
- Sean White: Anticipation, Accuracy
- Bo Nix: Athleticism, Arm Talent

Off the Field:
- Sean White: Lost job due to problems here, very sad
- Bo Nix: No known issues

 

I think in this case, they're referring more to their impact on the game and team. 

Sean White and Bo both share the tendency of not being gamebreaking, but if the game plan and the talent are superior, they'll be able to help you move to a win. They'll never take over a game though on their own merits. Bo tended to be bailed out by Seth William's 50/50 ability (because he couldn't separate), the run by tank, and Schwartz's ridiculous speed to take screens far further than they should have went.

Sean White had a similar path with Louis, Duke, etc. 

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18 minutes ago, Malcolm_FleX48 said:

I think in this case, they're referring more to their impact on the game and team. 

Sean White and Bo both share the tendency of not being gamebreaking, but if the game plan and the talent are superior, they'll be able to help you move to a win. They'll never take over a game though on their own merits. Bo tended to be bailed out by Seth William's 50/50 ability (because he couldn't separate), the run by tank, and Schwartz's ridiculous speed to take screens far further than they should have went.

Sean White had a similar path with Louis, Duke, etc. 

An interesting take. If you were able to successfully read that from the initial comment, I can only salute you.

Continuing with your line of thinking, what about Stidham? Or Nick Marshall, ignoring any moments you might argue he was game-breaking? In other words, are the quarterbacks themselves similar, or are some of these features of an offensive system built around the running game and long, low-percentage throws down the field?

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How can TJ make Bo better and Vice versa? That’s a good question to ask that’s probably been answered ITT. 
 

As noted before it’s hard to gauge Bo because he’s been in a HS offense his entire career. Can he develop the discipline to stay in the pocket and not throw off his back foot over the summer? I can’t wait to see what Bobo does with these guys. I hope they are pushed the absolute brink. The Auburn Tigers need an all conference QB. They need a QB who can will them to victory. 
 

Bo and TJ have a helluva opportunity in front of them. Any true competitor would kill for this. 

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On 5/24/2021 at 4:33 AM, WarTim said:

Cole, how’s the recovery going?

I'm ok. One day at a time. Thanks for asking!

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12 hours ago, tsande07 said:

Help me out with your assertion that Bo Nix and Sean White are similar QBs. I'm not seeing it...

Type of QB:
- Sean White: Pro-Style
- Bo Nix: Dual-Threat

Stature/Size:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Prototypical

Athleticism:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Very Good

Arm Strength:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Very Good

Key On-Field Attributes:
- Sean White: Anticipation, Accuracy
- Bo Nix: Athleticism, Arm Talent

Off the Field:
- Sean White: Lost job due to problems here, very sad
- Bo Nix: No known issues

 

Sean was equally athletic, and played with a similar style.  Sean 6 foot, Bo 6’1” nice try.  They both have the same will to win and compete, which compensates for their main weaknesses.  Sean’s was arm strength and Bo has average arm strength as he floats almost all of his deep balls.  Bo has several from inaccuracy, forgets his fundamentals when he plays live football and has legit fear in the pocket and no poise.  Seems to be afraid to take a hit in the pocket but will lower his shoulder running the ball, just weird.  Sean would take or give a hit, no hesitation.   I hope Bo could be Sean on the field this year, we would be a much better team for it.

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13 hours ago, tsande07 said:

Key On-Field Attributes:
- Sean White: Anticipation, Accuracy
- Bo Nix: Athleticism, Arm Talent

Not exactly sure what you see in 'arm talent' with Nix. He's wildly inaccurate at times. Also, Sean White was much better at pocket presence than Nix IMO. 

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26 minutes ago, auburnphan said:

Sean was equally athletic, and played with a similar style.  Sean 6 foot, Bo 6’1” nice try.  They both have the same will to win and compete, which compensates for their main weaknesses.  Sean’s was arm strength and Bo has average arm strength as he floats almost all of his deep balls.  Bo has several from inaccuracy, forgets his fundamentals when he plays live football and has legit fear in the pocket and no poise.  Seems to be afraid to take a hit in the pocket but will lower his shoulder running the ball, just weird.  Sean would take or give a hit, no hesitation.   I hope Bo could be Sean on the field this year, we would be a much better team for it.

You don't understand. Sean was selfish and stupid to take hits, but Bo is a competitor and just cares more. 

 

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18 hours ago, ScotsAU said:

Bo is like Sean White on steroids though. He’s faster, more elusive, and has a bigger arm.

Sean wasn't the athlete Bo was but he did not have happy feet. He stayed in the pocket until the end to make an accurate throw. Arm strength alone does not make a great QB. There have been some great QB's that just had average arms. A great QB has to see the field, analyze the coverage, make correct quick decisions and then he has to get the ball to his receiver. Some use their legs to gain yardage or buy time in the pocket, some stand in and take a hit to make a play, some have great arms and some don't. There no single ideal QB just like there is no single ideal Offense.  A great QB in wrong type of offense may not look so great.

We have a new Offense three different types of QB's in Bo, Finley, Davis and I think we have coaches that would make adjustments depending on which QB wins the job.  The biggest problem I had with Gus was not making adjustments based on the players he had. Last year he has some solid WR's some solid TE's and some RB's who could catch out of the backfield and an O-line that was sub par and he didn't adjust his O to fit his players, Quick slants, TE's release, Passes to RB's when they had already turned up field instead of when they were running East West, Fake screen then go when DB's were coming up hard.   

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Also Bo nix is not a great athlete . Adequate at best. See this is why I hate this stuff because it looks like I am hating but when conversations aren’t integrated in reality , it can seem that way. Stop overrating both of these candidate . The hard truth is T.J. Finley has a lot of potential , which ultimately means “he hasn’t done anything super meaningful.” On the flip side Bo Nix hasn’t done anything earth shaking at his position either . The upside to Bo is experience and he has been here a little bit longer. That is pretty much it.
 

The hope is this competition will be so fierce that it would force both of these QBs to be student of the game. That is why places like Bama and tOSU always have to quality QBs. The competition is so fierce that even if players don’t win the starting position , they are capable starters regardless. Also why players don’t run from competition there and also why there isn’t a huge fear from the fanbase that a player will transfer due to competition. It is bred in the culture . 

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13 hours ago, tsande07 said:

Help me out with your assertion that Bo Nix and Sean White are similar QBs. I'm not seeing it...

Type of QB:
- Sean White: Pro-Style
- Bo Nix: Dual-Threat

Stature/Size:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Prototypical

Athleticism:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Very Good

Arm Strength:
- Sean White: Adequate
- Bo Nix: Very Good

Key On-Field Attributes:
- Sean White: Anticipation, Accuracy
- Bo Nix: Athleticism, Arm Talent

Off the Field:
- Sean White: Lost job due to problems here, very sad
- Bo Nix: No known issues

 

This is why you disliked every time I gave an accurate analysis of Bo post....you literally don't see Bo. You see a different person in your head that doesn't exist

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4 minutes ago, cole256 said:

This is why you disliked every time I gave an accurate analysis of Bo post....you literally don't see Bo. You see a different person in your head that doesn't exist

Bo is the new Gus. 

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1 minute ago, McLoofus said:

Bo is the new Gus. 

My man said Bo is the prototype as far as size and very good arm talent.....pretty wild.

 

You are exactly right. I can see the posts now they both love Auburn!  

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24 minutes ago, DAG said:

Also Bo nix is not a great athlete . Adequate at best.

That's a bit dramatic.  He's a really good athlete.  His wild escape ability proves that.  Manzel is an extremely good athlete and similar.  His HS combine shuttle times was 4.37s.  That's the same as NFL running backs at the combine.

One can be a very good athlete, but be a poor QB.

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8 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

One can be a very good athlete, but be a poor QB

This is true and IMO that is NOT Bo Nix. No idea why you referenced manziel. Bo is not in the stratosphere of Johnny football. 

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Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, DAG said:

This is true and IMO that is NOT Bo Nix. No idea why you referenced manziel. Bo is not in the stratosphere of Johnny football. 

QB wise, sure.  But athletic ability, quickness, and change of direction he is.  Also, his shuttle proves that.  You can't be that quick & change direction and be a bad athlete/unathletic.

He's easily and above average athlete for a CFB QB, not elite.  Basically everything outside throwing the ball consistently well (that we've seen so far)

Edited by W.E.D
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19 hours ago, ScotsAU said:

Bo is like Sean White on steroids though. He’s faster, more elusive, and has a bigger arm.

To be honest I don't think Bo is anything like Sean White.

Bo is a gunslinger, pretty inaccurate, very athletic, strong, and doesn't manage a pocket very well. He's a reactive QB.

Sean was a thrower, very accurate under 25 yards, stood in the pocket, and had hte presence to know how to manage a pocket. He had quickness but nothing like Bo's athleticism. He was fragile, and couldn't throw it very far after 25 yards. He's a thinking QB.

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5 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

QB wise, sure.  But athletic ability, quickness, and change of direction he is.  Also, his shuttle proves that.  You can't be that quick & change direction and be a bad athlete/unathletic.

He's easily and above average athlete for a CFB QB, not elite.  Basically everything outside throwing the ball consistently well (that we've seen so far)

A shuttle means very little in the scheme of football playing . Just like the forty . Johnny manziel , who made world class athletes , look foolish and an okay 40 time. I don’t go off that stuff. I go off what you can do on the field. It’s like when NFL scouts was questioning the honey badger strength because he sucked at bench press at the combine, yet this dude is a bonafide player on the field and always in the mix. This is where we again are going to disagree. I am not going off what you do with no pads on and underarmour wind resistant gear around cones . I am basing what I see on how you perform against world class athletes on the field and there is no comparison with those two when you turn on the film. 

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, DAG said:

A shuttle means very little in the scheme of football playing . Just like the forty . Johnny manziel , who made world class athletes , look foolish and an okay 40 time. I don’t go off that stuff. I go off what you can do on the field. It’s like when NFL scouts was questioning the honey badger strength because he sucked at bench press at the combine, yet this dude is a bonafide player on the field and always in the mix. This is where we again are going to disagree. I am not going off what you do with no pads on and underarmour wind resistant gear around cones . I am basing what I see on how you perform against world class athletes on the field and there is no comparison with those two when you turn on the film. 

Definitely agree with you on people being too critical of poor testing when they perform well on the field.

I think you can be an extremely great athlete, test well, and be a bad football player.  If you can't read defenses, see what is happening and be able to react, you're going to look worse than someone who can do that, but might have a little less pure athleticism.  We see that a lot in the NFL.  Kids test off the charts in things that measure pure ability, but are busts b/c they aren't good football players.

I'm talking pure athleticism vs being a good complete football player.  But has some of the first, but not much of the second, at the moment.

I don't think how you perform on the field defines your athleticism.  Great athletes can be bad football players.  I believe that is where we disagree.

Edited by W.E.D
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2 minutes ago, W.E.D said:

Definitely agree with you on people being too critical of poor testing when they perform well on the field.

I think you can be an extremely great athlete, test well, and be a bad football player.  If you can't read defenses, see what is happening and be able to react, you're going to look worse than someone who can do that, but might have a little less pure athleticism.

I'm talking pure athleticism vs being a good complete football player.  But has some of the first, but not much of the second, at the moment.

I don't think how you perform on the field defines your athleticism.  Great athletes can be bad football players.  I believe that is where we disagree.

That’s fair but you said Bo Nix has wild escapability and referenced his shuttle, while talking about manziel. I am not saying Bo Nix is not athletic . I am saying he is not on manziel athleticism, at least on the football field. To me , Johnny football shows that on the field.
 

Also in terms of athletic ability , a really good athlete can be placed in many different scenarios. For example, JF3 was a three star football player. He didn’t have this star studded career at all in college. However , dude got a super bowl ring.  Let me tell you, if Bo don’t make at QB, his athleticism isn’t going to keep him in the NFL. With that being said, I do think Bo will make it. He is more Jeff Driskel to me however versus Johnny football. And that is not a diss. 

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28 minutes ago, DAG said:

 Let me tell you, if Bo don’t make at QB, his athleticism isn’t going to keep him in the NFL.

Right, I think that's where he is a very good athlete, not elite.  JF3 is an elite athlete, bad QB.  Bo is a very good athlete, but he's not going to play in the NFL unless he figure out how to throw consistently.

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1 hour ago, DAG said:

Also Bo nix is not a great athlete . Adequate at best.

This is going too far. Athleticism is actually his only standout tool at this point. He is an above-average athlete at the position.

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, metafour said:

This is going too far. Athleticism is actually his only standout tool at this point. He is an above-average athlete at the position.

Correct that is what I mean when I say adequate. He does just enough to keep defenses at bay. I honestly don’t know how else to say this lol. He is not at a point where defenses will go “yeah, we completely have to game plan around his athleticism.” I don’t consider him really good, I don’t consider him very good or great. If you want to call that above average cool, but that is not good nor great. 

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1 minute ago, DAG said:

Correct that is what I mean when I say adequate. He does just enough to keep defenses at bay. I honestly don’t know how else to say this lol. He is not at a point where defenses will go “yeah, we completely after to game plan around his athleticism.” I don’t consider him really good, I don’t consider him very good or great. If you want to call that above average cool, but that is not good nor great. 

Above average is by definition "good". I don't get what you're trying to prove or show here. Had they wanted to, they could have schemed up a decent run game involving him - but Malzah was obviously committed to showing off his "passing" offense. He can move and he can take hits. No, he's not Lamar Jackson, but your use of the term "adequate" is quite silly. He is more athletic than most QB's. Even the guys at PFF who rag on Bo Nix (justifiably) have no problem pointing out that he is in fact quite athletic.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, metafour said:

Above average is by definition "good". I don't get what you're trying to prove or show here. Had they wanted to, they could have schemed up a decent run game involving him - but Malzah was obviously committed to showing off his "passing" offense. He can move and he can take hits. No, he's not Lamar Jackson, but your use of the term "adequate" is quite silly. He is more athletic than most QB's. Even the guys at PFF who rag on Bo Nix (justifiably) have no problem pointing out that he is in fact quite athletic.

Do you know the definition of adequate? It is satisfactory.  He averaged about 3.4 yards per carry last year. If the lane is open he can get yards. If it breaks down he can leave the pocket and gain some yards. But he is not someone who at any moment is going to break multiple yards for TDs. A good athlete to me is someone like Malik Willis. Another reference is Dak Prescott.  A great Athlete is Lamar Jackson. I would love to see Bo Nix run against Bama or Georgia. Please show me that because supposedly he is a five star dual threat  QB.  I WOULD love for someone to scheme around his only tool as you put it politely. You mentioned he is more athletic than most QBs? In what context? Is he more athletic than pro style QB Matt Corral? 

You just said he is a good athlete because he can move and take hits. Is that the qualifier now? Do you consider Joe Burrow a good athlete?

 

You can show me all the PFF quotes. I can also show you the Kirk Herbstriet quotes too about how great of a dual threat he is, but I WANT TO SEE IT ON THE FIELD. This is exactly why he gets the hate he gets. People overhype the dude and then when he doesn't produce, people are like "Wait this is the next one?"

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