Critical Race Theory

[jj3jordan 2,050]

30 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

So I read it. 

Here's the thing. the article points out in total about 35 give or take school districts in the United State that it says are teaching CRT. (note that on the proof list for the book, most of the school districts had it on a 'recommended summer reading list', so while we could argue if that book is good for children or not, it seems to be just on a standard reading list and not actually being taught in the classrooms), so i'd argue most of those 30 school's it lists are not in fact teaching CRT even if their libraries do carry a book that has some ideas of CRT in it. 

But going back to my point...35 school districts are 'proof' that CRT is being taught all around America. Sounds horrifying, right? But wait, how many school districts are there in the United State? 

About 13,800   so we've got "confirmed" CRT in about 35/13,800 districts or 0.2% of US schools. This after almost half a year of obsessive media coverage and attempts to find and stamp out CRT by the Right.

I don't know....I'm still not seeing the 'all hands on deck' crisis that Republican news is wanting us to believe in. 

 

And A Meme 

.2% is several times higher than Covid death rate but we still take that very seriously.  I say we take this seriously also.  A much different threat but still very damaging to our country.

[CoffeeTiger 5,099]

21 minutes ago, jj3jordan said:

.2% is several times higher than Covid death rate but we still take that very seriously.  I say we take this seriously also.  A much different threat but still very damaging to our country.

covid death rate is closer to 1.8%  https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality . Far higher than 0.2%

600,000+ and counting deaths from a virus is almost as serious and important as a few schools in America recommending a book with CRT principles in it?

 

You guys are unbelievable.  

 

[AUFAN78 3,894]

1 hour ago, CoffeeTiger said:

So I read it. 

Here's the thing. the article points out in total about 35 give or take school districts in the United State that it says are teaching CRT. (note that on the proof list for the book, most of the school districts had it on a 'recommended summer reading list', so while we could argue if that book is good for children or not, it seems to be just on a standard reading list and not actually being taught in the classrooms), so i'd argue most of those 30 school's it lists are not in fact teaching CRT even if their libraries do carry a book that has some ideas of CRT in it. 

But going back to my point...35 school districts are 'proof' that CRT is being taught all around America. Sounds horrifying, right? But wait, how many school districts are there in the United State? 

About 13,800   so we've got "confirmed" CRT in about 35/13,800 districts or 0.2% of US schools. This after almost half a year of obsessive media coverage and attempts to find and stamp out CRT by the Right.

I don't know....I'm still not seeing the 'all hands on deck' crisis that Republican news is wanting us to believe in. 

 

 

Like most CRT proponents, you cannot argue in good faith. Dude, it is one article. There are many more articles reporting similar things in various parts of the country. Like homey, you've resorted to ridiculous posts full of straw men. 

There are plenty of other examples that prove racial essentialism and collective guilt are being taught to young students. In Cupertino, California, an elementary school required third graders to rank themselves according to the “power and privilege” associated with their ethnicities. Schools in Buffalo, New York, taught students that “all white people” perpetuate “systemic racism” and had kindergarteners watch a video of dead black children, warning them about “racist police and state-sanctioned violence.” And in Arizona, the state’s education department sent out an “equity toolkit” to schools that claimed infants as young as 3 months old can start to show signs of racism and “remain strongly biased in favor of whiteness” by age 5.

Why would you even attempt to defend this garbage?  

[AUFAN78 3,894]

I taught history in Poland soon after the collapse of the Soviet Union. My students were eager to learn objective truth--something which the Soviet regime abhorred. When I look at the fight over Critical Race Theory (CRT), it reminds me of the party-approved curricula that my students’ parents remembered from the days behind the Iron Curtain. Like the Soviet Ministry of Education’s dogma, CRT is blatantly ideological. It’s no wonder CRT’s proponents are intent on muddying the waters with bad faith arguments. 

https://www.realcleareducation.com/articles/2021/08/02/the_lefts_crt_straw_man_shows_they_dont_trust_parents_to_teach_morality_110617.html

[homersapien 11,362]

3 hours ago, AUFAN78 said:

https://www.realcleareducation.com/articles/2021/08/02/the_lefts_crt_straw_man_shows_they_dont_trust_parents_to_teach_morality_110617.html

 

A Popular Political Site Made a Sharp Right Turn. What Steered It?

Real Clear Politics has been catering to campaign obsessives since 2000. It pitches itself as a “trusted, go-to source” for unbiased polling. The Trump era changed its tone, and funding sources.

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=Freedom+Works

 

Also, Adam Brandon is the president of FreedomWorks.  (Another right wing site.)

 

Hardly a good source for an unbiased perspective on CRT.

[AUFAN78 3,894]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

 

A Popular Political Site Made a Sharp Right Turn. What Steered It?

Real Clear Politics has been catering to campaign obsessives since 2000. It pitches itself as a “trusted, go-to source” for unbiased polling. The Trump era changed its tone, and funding sources.

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=Freedom+Works

 

Also, Adam Brandon is the president of FreedomWorks.  (Another right wing site.)

 

Hardly a good source for an unbiased perspective on CRT.

What exactly did the RCP article get wrong?

[DKW 86 7,419]

1 hour ago, AUFAN78 said:

What exactly did the RCP article get wrong?

Shhhhh... He is dismissing the source. A few on here are allowed to dismiss any source at any time as a way to kinda win any argument without having to actually engage in the subject.

[homersapien 11,362]

5 hours ago, AUFAN78 said:

What exactly did the RCP article get wrong?

The Left’s CRT Straw Man Shows They Don’t Trust Parents to Teach Morality

Title begs the question.  (At least you know what's comming.)

 

 

By Adam Brandon
August 02, 2021

 

I taught history in Poland soon after the collapse of the Soviet Union. My students were eager to learn objective truth--something which the Soviet regime abhorred. When I look at the fight over Critical Race Theory (CRT), it reminds me of the party-approved curricula that my students’ parents remembered from the days behind the Iron Curtain. Like the Soviet Ministry of Education’s dogma, CRT is blatantly ideological. It’s no wonder CRT’s proponents are intent on muddying the waters with bad faith arguments. 

No substance, just opinion.

And that’s exactly what we saw from Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s interview with CNN’s Don Lemon last week. When asked about the pushback against critical race theory, the New York City Congresswoman replied: “Why don’t Republicans want kids to know how to not be racist?”

 

Parents like myself are stunned by Ocasio-Cortez’s ignorance. Aside from sounding like an activist college student who has yet to reconcile with reality, Ocasio-Cortez reverts to a common straw-man argument. She contends that parents and Republicans don’t want their kids to learn about racism or the history of it in this country. What she is responding to, however, is an argument entirely different from the one reverberating across the country.

AOC didn't say that.  Putting words in AOC's mouth. Total missrepresentation.  Typcal tactic of political hyperbole and propaganda.

No one is asking for schools to not teach about slavery and Jim Crow, or shy away from any other painful parts of our history.

Well they certainly didn't teach it when I went to school almost 60 years ago in Alabama.  I can only hope they teach it now.  (Of course the usual suspects will claim it's CRT.)

What parents are asking for is that critical race theory, a divisive sociological ideology that stands opposite of the West’s liberal tradition, does not become the lens through which all of history and social interaction is contextualized—especially when it comes to teaching kids in K-12.

More BS opinion /propaganda - a hopeless simplification of CRT, which is not being taught in K1-2 for that very reason, its too subtle and complicated for the 1-12 level.  

Teaching the painful parts of history shouldn’t be controversial, but it also falls on parents to raise their children to be good people who treat their fellow Americans with the dignity and respect they deserve. This is dangerous to the Left’s agenda. 

"Dangerous to the left's agenda"?   What is the left's agenda?  Is it like the Jew's agenda? 

Such a phrase is a clear marker of fascist propaganda.

Adherents to CRT must believe that white people will always be complicit in racism against non-white people regardless of good intent. In other words, Ocasio-Cortez wants children to be taught to judge each other by the color of their skin. 

Total BS.  AOC has never suggested as such and the idea this is being taught in K1-12 is laughable.  No one involved with K1-12 education would teach such a thing. It's a ridiculous charge.

We also have to remember that CRT is not truth—it’s theory. And when it comes to the humanities and soft sciences, it’s not standard to take theories as hard facts or build an entire curriculum based on them. There are plenty of academic theories that exist, but that doesn’t mean we start basing kids’ classes on them. Instead of asking why parents don’t want CRT in schools, we should be asking why leftists want it so badly.

Exactly.  That's why the idea it's being taught in K1-12 is absurd.  It's material more appropriate for college level courses and above. It's a different and interesting way of considering the nature of racism.  It's probably not appropriate for K1-12, which is why it's not being taught there. 

Anyone claiming otherwise, need to present evidence that it is.  I suspect that simply teaching the actual history is enough to rile the conservative crazies this piece is taylored for.

It’s no secret that one of the aims of Soviet education was to consolidate all learning in the hands of the state. CRT’s activist approach to teaching history aims to achieve a similar end. Ask parents if they think that morality should be left up to schools to teach, and you will gain all the clarity you need about why parents across the country are organizing to defeat CRT.

Considering the source, I figured there'd be a communism/socialist appeal in here somewhere.   Again this is totally off subject and is pure propaganda. 

Not only should parents be stunned by the congresswoman’s ignorance, but they should be insulted by what her remarks suggest. Implied in her is argument is that parents are incapable of teaching their own kids about racism. Apparently, the only way to get kids to understand the immorality of treating people differently based on skin color is to get the government and CRT-trained teachers involved. Ironically, though, CRT would teach students that skin color is suggestive of a perpetual societal power struggle rather than an accident of birth.

Children should be taught the true history of racial relations in this country.  That's not something any parents are liable to do any more than they are liable to teach sexual biology.  And like it or not,  it's part of our history.  A history which has shaped our present. Every person in this country need to be instructed into all parts of our history.

But even with the challenges mounting, there is enormous grassroots energy in opposition to CRT. Parents know that they don’t have to put up with CRT in schools and that they can be change-makers by showing up to local school board meetings, running for school board, or pulling their kids out of public schools. How the CRT battle fares on the local level will determine its course nationwide. Politicians like Ocasio-Cortez should know that there’s no better fighter for our nation’s children than a concerned parent. But that may be too much for a product of today’s higher education system to realize.

Yeah, there are an "enormous" amount of people who still think Trump won the last election. 

It doesn't take much to gin up outrage with a bunch of lies designed to install fear in folks who aren't particularly critical thinkers - those liberal communists are trying to brainwash your kids!

Typical far right radio BS.  Reminds me of Rush. Pure alarmist propaganda to rile up the right wing base.

 

 

 

Adam Brandon is the president of FreedomWorks.

Edited August 3, 2021 by homersapien

[AUFAN78 3,894]

17 hours ago, homersapien said:

The Left’s CRT Straw Man Shows They Don’t Trust Parents to Teach Morality

Title begs the question.  (At least you know what's comming.)

 

 

By Adam Brandon
August 02, 2021

 

I taught history in Poland soon after the collapse of the Soviet Union. My students were eager to learn objective truth--something which the Soviet regime abhorred. When I look at the fight over Critical Race Theory (CRT), it reminds me of the party-approved curricula that my students’ parents remembered from the days behind the Iron Curtain. Like the Soviet Ministry of Education’s dogma, CRT is blatantly ideological. It’s no wonder CRT’s proponents are intent on muddying the waters with bad faith arguments. 

No substance, just opinion.

And that’s exactly what we saw from Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s interview with CNN’s Don Lemon last week. When asked about the pushback against critical race theory, the New York City Congresswoman replied: “Why don’t Republicans want kids to know how to not be racist?”

 

Parents like myself are stunned by Ocasio-Cortez’s ignorance. Aside from sounding like an activist college student who has yet to reconcile with reality, Ocasio-Cortez reverts to a common straw-man argument. She contends that parents and Republicans don’t want their kids to learn about racism or the history of it in this country. What she is responding to, however, is an argument entirely different from the one reverberating across the country.

AOC didn't say that.  Putting words in AOC's mouth. Total missrepresentation.  Typcal tactic of political hyperbole and propaganda.

No one is asking for schools to not teach about slavery and Jim Crow, or shy away from any other painful parts of our history.

Well they certainly didn't teach it when I went to school almost 60 years ago in Alabama.  I can only hope they teach it now.  (Of course the usual suspects will claim it's CRT.)

What parents are asking for is that critical race theory, a divisive sociological ideology that stands opposite of the West’s liberal tradition, does not become the lens through which all of history and social interaction is contextualized—especially when it comes to teaching kids in K-12.

More BS opinion /propaganda - a hopeless simplification of CRT, which is not being taught in K1-2 for that very reason, its too subtle and complicated for the 1-12 level.  

Teaching the painful parts of history shouldn’t be controversial, but it also falls on parents to raise their children to be good people who treat their fellow Americans with the dignity and respect they deserve. This is dangerous to the Left’s agenda. 

"Dangerous to the left's agenda"?   What is the left's agenda?  Is it like the Jew's agenda? 

Such a phrase is a clear marker of fascist propaganda.

Adherents to CRT must believe that white people will always be complicit in racism against non-white people regardless of good intent. In other words, Ocasio-Cortez wants children to be taught to judge each other by the color of their skin. 

Total BS.  AOC has never suggested as such and the idea this is being taught in K1-12 is laughable.  No one involved with K1-12 education would teach such a thing. It's a ridiculous charge.

We also have to remember that CRT is not truth—it’s theory. And when it comes to the humanities and soft sciences, it’s not standard to take theories as hard facts or build an entire curriculum based on them. There are plenty of academic theories that exist, but that doesn’t mean we start basing kids’ classes on them. Instead of asking why parents don’t want CRT in schools, we should be asking why leftists want it so badly.

Exactly.  That's why the idea it's being taught in K1-12 is absurd.  It's material more appropriate for college level courses and above. It's a different and interesting way of considering the nature of racism.  It's probably not appropriate for K1-12, which is why it's not being taught there. 

Anyone claiming otherwise, need to present evidence that it is.  I suspect that simply teaching the actual history is enough to rile the conservative crazies this piece is taylored for.

It’s no secret that one of the aims of Soviet education was to consolidate all learning in the hands of the state. CRT’s activist approach to teaching history aims to achieve a similar end. Ask parents if they think that morality should be left up to schools to teach, and you will gain all the clarity you need about why parents across the country are organizing to defeat CRT.

Considering the source, I figured there'd be a communism/socialist appeal in here somewhere.   Again this is totally off subject and is pure propaganda. 

Not only should parents be stunned by the congresswoman’s ignorance, but they should be insulted by what her remarks suggest. Implied in her is argument is that parents are incapable of teaching their own kids about racism. Apparently, the only way to get kids to understand the immorality of treating people differently based on skin color is to get the government and CRT-trained teachers involved. Ironically, though, CRT would teach students that skin color is suggestive of a perpetual societal power struggle rather than an accident of birth.

Children should be taught the true history of racial relations in this country.  That's not something any parents are liable to do any more than they are liable to teach sexual biology.  And like it or not,  it's part of our history.  A history which has shaped our present. Every person in this country need to be instructed into all parts of our history.

But even with the challenges mounting, there is enormous grassroots energy in opposition to CRT. Parents know that they don’t have to put up with CRT in schools and that they can be change-makers by showing up to local school board meetings, running for school board, or pulling their kids out of public schools. How the CRT battle fares on the local level will determine its course nationwide. Politicians like Ocasio-Cortez should know that there’s no better fighter for our nation’s children than a concerned parent. But that may be too much for a product of today’s higher education system to realize.

Yeah, there are an "enormous" amount of people who still think Trump won the last election. 

It doesn't take much to gin up outrage with a bunch of lies designed to install fear in folks who aren't particularly critical thinkers - those liberal communists are trying to brainwash your kids!

Typical far right radio BS.  Reminds me of Rush. Pure alarmist propaganda to rile up the right wing base.

 

 

 

Adam Brandon is the president of FreedomWorks.

So all you have is your opinion? Nothing factual? No bombshell?

[SLAG-91 1,483]

5th Circuit Court of Appeals and CRT

"There's a big difference between prohibiting racial discrimination and endorsing disparate impact theory. ... It's the difference between securing equality of opportunity regardless of race and guaranteeing equality of outcome based on race. It’s the difference between color blindness and critical race theory."

On race-neutral policies, he (Justice James C. Ho) said, "Congress enacted Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 to prohibit intentional racial discrimination — not to restrict neutral policies untainted by racial intent that happen to lead to racially disproportionate outcomes."

Tangential to the "is it being taught in schools or not?" discussion, but thought it seemed germane to the overall thread.

[AuburnNTexas 7,140]

Like any theory there is some truth to Critical race theory. There is no doubt that Slavery helped this country to grow, there is no doubt that slavery is dehumanizing and an abhorrent way to treat people. There is no doubt that there we had Jim Crow type laws to keep Blacks down and in some case poor whites down is some states. There is no doubt that certain neighborhoods were redlined creating wealth inequity in this country.  

History is a panorama and you have to look at the whole picture to truly understand it. For thousand of years slavery was the norm in the world. There were slaves in Europe, Asia, Africa, the Middle East. Depending on what part of the world and what owner slaves went from brutally abused to used but not abused as badly. Slavery started dying out with the Industrial revolution either because it was cheaper to pay a very cheap wage to the working man then having to feed, clothe, and put a roof over the slaves head or we slowly became more altruistic. Probably a bit of both. Plantation type agriculture cotton, tobacco, etc. was late to the industrial age where people could be replaced by machines. We still have some forms of slavery in other countries. 

To judge our Founding Fathers by todays standards is not fair. These were great men of their times who did have slaves and some slept with them they were not perfect but some of their ideals when they produced documents like the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution is what they should be judged by. These documents set a standard we should all aspire to. These men were just that men so of course they were not perfect and didn't always live up to their own ideals. 

If we are going to Judge our founding Father's then we also have to judge all the people of the past. African's that captured and sold slaves from other tribes, Arabs that did the same, Asians, that did the same, Europeans that did the same. Europeans came to America's and conquered the inhabitants the people we refer to as Indians who are really different Asian Groups that had come into the new World in multiple waves often displacing and exterminating those who came before and were not strong enough. What about all the great conquering nations through out history.  The Romans, The Greeks, the Persians, the Huns, the Mongols, in Africa there were multiple empires that were founded by conquering of other people the Ashanti, the Zulu.   Sadly most empires or kingdoms came about because one people were more warlike and had better armies and conquered other areas. This has been the way of the world from beginning of time.  

So yes we should teach about Slavery, Jim Crow Laws, Red Lining neighborhoods I think we have to an extent but could probably do better but we should also teach about the greatness in things like the Declaration of Independence and the US Constitution, how this country developed a large middle class, pushed public Education for all, created Land Grant colleges, help rebuild both our enemies and our friends countries after World War II.  In the past after Wars the Victor's always punished the losers leading to the next war. We should put slavery into context with the times it wasn't just something happening in the US it was the way of the world at that time.

We need an honest history that shows our blemishes and our warts but also our greatness but most importantly in our schools we need to teach the things that will allow our children to flourish. We have fallen behind the world in teaching Math and Science we need to reemphasize that, we need to find a way to improve all of our schools but especially our inner city and rural schools, we have to find a way to break the cycle of poverty in the inner cities and some rural areas (education is the key).  Inner City school districts have a large number of high paying, non-teaching positions to move paperwork some do to meet government regulations some to just push paper. Inner city schools often pay more per student then other school systems and produce worse results as there are issues in inner cities that are not conducive to education (Crime, latch key kids, higher percentage of single moms, dad or mom in jail, no computers for study at home, hunger or non nutritious meals). 

We need to think outside of the box. I have read enough about CRT to think it may be a problem but I am smart enough to know the problem is much bigger that that. The issue where I have seen Teacher Unions doing everything they can to prevent class room teaching, the amount of money teachers Unions put into politics instead of into education that money could pay for tuition subsidies for undergraduate students who will become teachers, graduate schools for teachers.  

Social Justice won't happen without good paying jobs and people capable of doing those jobs. If our education system is spending to much time on Social Justice and not enough time on the basics that a person needs to get a job that plan for Social Justice will fail because there is no Social Justice where there is poverty. Our schools need to prepare students for todays jobs and the jobs of the future.  

[cole256 17,043]

On 8/2/2021 at 10:24 AM, AUFAN78 said:

Like most CRT proponents, you cannot argue in good faith. Dude, it is one article. There are many more articles reporting similar things in various parts of the country. Like homey, you've resorted to ridiculous posts full of straw men. 

There are plenty of other examples that prove racial essentialism and collective guilt are being taught to young students. In Cupertino, California, an elementary school required third graders to rank themselves according to the “power and privilege” associated with their ethnicities. Schools in Buffalo, New York, taught students that “all white people” perpetuate “systemic racism” and had kindergarteners watch a video of dead black children, warning them about “racist police and state-sanctioned violence.” And in Arizona, the state’s education department sent out an “equity toolkit” to schools that claimed infants as young as 3 months old can start to show signs of racism and “remain strongly biased in favor of whiteness” by age 5.

Why would you even attempt to defend this garbage?  

Arizona. Do they even celebrate Martin Luther King Jr birthday yet? Don't believe that

[SLAG-91 1,483]

27 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Arizona. Do they even celebrate Martin Luther King Jr birthday yet? Don't believe that

Can't tell if my sarcasm meter is busted or not, but the answer is yes.

MLK Jr. holiday in Arizona

Side note: I didn't know that New Hampshire used to call this observance Civil Rights Day until the late 90s.

Carry on, y'all.

[cole256 17,043]

10 minutes ago, SLAG-91 said:

Can't tell if my sarcasm meter is busted or not, but the answer is yes.

MLK Jr. holiday in Arizona

Side note: I didn't know that New Hampshire used to call this observance Civil Rights Day until the late 90s.

Carry on, y'all.

Yes sarcastic as Arizona is known for being on of the lesser friendly states towards black people.

[homersapien 11,362]

I don't believe those stories 78 posted for a second.

"CJ" is just another right wing propaganda rag.  That's why two of the references supposedly backing up those stories were back to CJ itself and the third was to "The Washington Examiner"  

(Oh, and the only Washington Examiner references were to tweets. )

It's all bogus.

Edited August 8, 2021 by homersapien

[cole256 17,043]

It's just hilarious the people so passionate and involved in this thread are the same that hates people to point out racism. I'm convinced the people that want to ignore and put silence on it have an agenda.