Pats cut Cam, name Mac Jones starter

[DAG 33,964]

Just now, TitanTiger said:

He was a lock to be the starter if he doesn't have to sit out.  He just was.  Any look at Belichick's history tells you that if Cam does what he needed to do, he was going to be the starter at least early in the season.  But Cam put himself in this situation by not being vaccinated.  Only players who are not vaccinated are forced to undergo daily Covid-19 tests and are subject to the five-day reentry process that Cam got snagged in.  Lamar has no one pushing him at all in Baltimore.  Cam did.  The job was his until this happened.

Bro Lamar could have freaking Justin Fields behind him right now. He is not getting cut due to covid. But whatever agree to disagree.

[steeleagle 2,945]

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

If he doesn't sit out 5 days and allow Jones to get all the first team reps and coaching, he's the week one starter.  

The coach approved his leaving the facility. That means that had nothing to do with him losing his job. 

Jones just showed in that last week, they could go with the rookie.

Cam played in that last preseason game. He didn't need much practice being a vet.

He simply lost the job...

[steeleagle 2,945]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

Bro Lamar could have freaking Justin Fields behind him right now. He is not getting cut due to covid. But whatever agree to disagree.

I agree. Cam didn't have that luxury. I think the coaches just felt Jones got better even up to the last preseason game...and that convinced them to bite the bullet.

Cam didn't fit Josh MCDaniel's offense that well anyway. He wants a guy that can be accurate(Brady like), make smart decisions(like Brady), and manage the game( Brady like)... The only thing Jones doesnt have is experience, but that is not enough to NOT be the starter when comparing his passing ability to Cams....

The 5 day Covid ban, hurt Cam staying on the roster...but I think Jones would have started 1st game.

[DAG 33,964]

4 minutes ago, steeleagle said:

I agree. Cam didn't have that luxury. I think the coaches just felt Jones got better even up to the last preseason game...and that convinced them to bite the bullet.

Cam didn't fit Josh MCDaniel's offense that well anyway. He wants a guy that can be accurate(Brady like), make smart decisions(like Brady), and manage the game( Brady like)... The only thing Jones doesnt have is experience, but that is not enough to NOT be the starter when comparing his passing ability to Cams....

The 5 day Covid ban, hurt Cam staying on the roster...but I think Jones would have started 1st game.

Right and I think it is more to the story. 

[DAG 33,964]

 

[TitanTiger 20,472]

16 minutes ago, steeleagle said:

The coach approved his leaving the facility. That means that had nothing to do with him losing his job. 

The only reason he had to sit out five days was that he was unvaccinated.  That's on Cam.

 

16 minutes ago, steeleagle said:

Jones just showed in that last week, they could go with the rookie.

Cam played in that last preseason game. He didn't need much practice being a vet.

He simply lost the job...

A job he'd still have had he not sat out.

[aubiefifty 16,753]

well now that is all over i hope he goes somewhere more friendly to cams talents. i would love to see him with the raiders just because i am a fan from back in their badboy days. and i was hoping he would win a superbowl for us as well.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

19 minutes ago, DAG said:

Bro Lamar could have freaking Justin Fields behind him right now. He is not getting cut due to covid. But whatever agree to disagree.

Lamar is has a hammer lock on the starting job AND has no one pushing him.  Cam was going to be the starter.  But the being unvaccinated, he put himself in a situation where he could have to sit out due to the NFL's COVID protocol, and then it actually happened.  The fact that there was a rookie pushing him made that doubly bad.  But Mac Jones wasn't going to be the Week One starter until the quarantine thing happened, bottom line.

[SRBautigerfan 1,040]

1 minute ago, aubiefifty said:

well now that is all over i hope he goes somewhere more friendly to cams talents. i would love to see him with the raiders just because i am a fan from back in their badboy days. and i was hoping he would win a superbowl for us as well.

As a long suffering Raiders fan I must say there's nothing bad boy about them anymore, only bad.  😩

[aubiefifty 16,753]

Just now, SRBautigerfan said:

As a long suffering Raiders fan I must say there's nothing bad boy about them anymore, only bad.  😩

i had high hopes when gruden took over but it has not worked out.

[steeleagle 2,945]

5 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

The only reason he had to sit out five days was that he was unvaccinated.  That's on Cam.

 

A job he'd still have had he not sat out.

Listen to the ADam Schefter piece above. Cam was not going to be the starter....

[e808 3,025]

43 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

 

I'm telling you, that's not how it was viewed in Patriot World.

Belichick is not a guy that likes starting rookies, especially at the QB spot.  Something drastic had to happen for Cam not to be the starter Week 1 and his preseason play - which was limited anyway due to the fact that they knew what they had with Cam and didn't need to risk him getting hurt with unnecessary snaps - was not that something.  He was not "awful."  He was 14 of 21 for 162 yds, 1 TD and 1 INT.  Pedestrian, but again, they weren't putting him out there to rack up numbers, simply to get him ready for the first game.  But this deal where he got himself sidelined and not even allowed on at the team facilities for 5 days was.

I agree Cam missed games last year due to Covid whether it was his fault or not. Now fast forward to this season u out again and leave the door open for the guy pushing for your spot. Then the questions become do u roll with him and chance a third time or take ur chances with the rookie. Cam to the Raiders please. I don’t believe in Carr.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

I'll also say this...and I cannot prove this so don't ask for evidence.  It's a hunch.

Belichick and Saban are cut from the same cloth.  Saban has made getting everyone vaccinated a point of emphasis - he does not want anyone putting the team's goals in jeopardy by having a key starter or group of starters have to miss a game due to COVID protocols.  As a result, Alabama is 100% vaccinated.  I don't think it's much of a leap to say Belichick likely has the same attitude about it.  He can't make anyone get the shot, but he's gonna be hella pissed if someone puts the team and their goals at risk by missing games from COVID and not being vaccinated.

Cam's decision not to vaccinate showed exactly what could happen during the season and despite it being partly a team misunderstanding, if Cam was vaccinated, even with the misunderstanding he wouldn't have had to sit out.  You can't tell me that whole thing sat well with the head coach.  To him that's not putting the team first.
 

[DAG 33,964]

2 minutes ago, steeleagle said:

Listen to the ADam Schefter piece above. Cam was not going to be the starter....

It doesn't matter what Adam's says because HE WAS ABSOLUTELY GOING TO START WEEK 1. I guess that ends that discussion. If he had been performing, he wouldn't have gotten cut. It is a risk versus reward scenario.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

Another take that has some merit - at least in terms of why the Pats cut Cam rather than just making him the backup:  Cam wants a chance here toward the tail end of his career to be a starter and the Pats wanted to give him a chance to do that.  Maybe I'm reading Belichick wrong and all is well in terms of how he feels about Cam and his health decisions.  It's a reasonable take.

I still believe that Belichick's history says Cam would have been the starter early in the season.  Maybe Jones takes over somewhere in the middle.  But I don't think their first choice was to name a rookie the starter.  I think this quarantine thing created that possibility.

[cole256 17,042]

Knew this was going to be a problem when drafted. Mac is no joke, it's crazy how people sleep on him. I remember people on here saying he just has a good o line and Bo was better..it's like wtf are you looking at? Are you serious?

[AuburnEagle79 2,165]

This was a perfect storm of bad things for Cam. His play has been average at best, Mac has looked to be just as good, then Cam missed time. I wouldn't blame it all on Covid, it's a piece of the puzzle.

He was never going to last the season as the starter, so he will have to decide if he wants a paycheck to be a backup or just call it quits. I figure Atlanta will make a run at him as a reserve if he wants it since McCarron is out. 

 

[TitanTiger 20,472]

2 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Knew this was going to be a problem when drafted. Mac is no joke, it's crazy how people sleep on him. I remember people on here saying he just has a good o line and Bo was better..it's like wtf are you looking at? Are you serious?

Let's not turn this thread into another Bo Nix debate.  I understand why people would have some doubts about Mac.  The QBs who've put up big numbers at Alabama under Saban for the most part haven't done a lot in the NFL.  Parker-Wilson, McElroy, McCarron, Coker, Hurts, Tua...mostly washouts or career backups aside from Hurts.  The jury is still out on Tua and he could possibly take off still.  So there's been a legitimate question as to how good QBs coming out of Tuscaloosa really are compared to how good their supporting cast are.

But I'd seen enough of Jones to believe he had a really good chance to be at least a solid NFL starter.  That was just my opinion.

 

[McLoofus 35,182]

5 minutes ago, AuburnEagle79 said:

I wouldn't blame it all on Covid, it's a piece of the puzzle.

This.

No matter how you cut it- no pun intended- these guys not getting vaccinated didn't do what they could to make sure they showed up to work every day at a critical time for their team and for themselves.

No way we're gonna pin down exactly how detrimental it is but it is 100% "a piece of the puzzle", as you said.

[cole256 17,042]

2 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Let's not turn this thread into another Bo Nix debate.  I understand why people would have some doubts about Mac.  The QBs who've put up big numbers at Alabama under Saban for the most part haven't done a lot in the NFL.  Parker-Wilson, McElroy, McCarron, Coker, Hurts, Tua...mostly washouts or career backups aside from Hurts.  The jury is still out on Tua and he could possibly take off still.  So there's been a legitimate question as to how good QBs coming out of Tuscaloosa really are compared to how good their supporting cast are.

But I'd seen enough of Jones to believe he had a really good chance to be at least a solid NFL starter.  That was just my opinion.

 

I used that as a reference to show how little some think of Mac. And if people make a case of how good a guy is based off of other people then that should end the debate right there. I don't care if he played for una you can look and see the way he goes through progressions and where he placed the ball how good he is. 

Some people will look and see two guys go 7-10 and think it's the same thing. It's not. Bammer has good wr's but they weren't just running streaks beating people all the time. He was hitting them perfectly allowing them to use their athleticism. It's the difference of a guy like waddle and a guy like Schwartz having a 20yard catch as opposed to a 63 yard td

[e808 3,025]

Unfortunately, for Cam he was used and abused for what he was at Carolina with not many weapons. Then he goes to a Patriots team with even worse offensive talent. Thus, Brady left. Hopefully, he gets another shot with a team with better talent on offense. 

Edited September 1, 2021 by e808

[cole256 17,042]

You can't ever give your back up a chance to shine without you being there. That's pretty much it. I've seen a guy become a starter because another guy went out of town.

I actually took a guy's spot on varsity when I was a freshman in basketball because he got in trouble and got detention at the absolute wrong time. Can't do it.

Edited August 31, 2021 by cole256

[Dual-Threat Rigby 8,656]

I don't see the value of arguing if Cam would've been the starter if he didn't mess up. Ignoring that he obviously did mess up, he wasn't ahead by a substantial gap. NE brass disgusts me with some of their undertones, but even the least atrocious of them has made it plain Cam was not much ahead of the kid before the incident.

Cam would've kept his job because he was the incumbent and the not rookie, not because he's still an elite beast.

[DAG 33,964]

8 minutes ago, Dual-Threat Rigby said:

Cam would've kept his job because he was the incumbent and the not rookie, not because he's still an elite beast.

He gets it!

[Cardin Drake 1,821]

Damn, i hope someone else picks Cam up.  And it's not like it was hard to root against the Pats before, but I'll be rooting for failure. It's not personal with Mac, I just can't root for graduates of Satan University.