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Giving Coach Harsin a pass this season


tbone4jc

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On 11/21/2021 at 7:54 PM, DAG said:

3 points to Ole miss, 3 points to USCe, 0 points to the Aggies, 6 against Mississippi State

Damn our defense!

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1 hour ago, AU-24 said:

Total O ranked 8th

Total D ranked 8th

Right but that is not a great stat to use.  Why? Because total offense takes into account way more than just scoring. For instance the bend don’t break , will potentially give up total yards so you can be in the second half of the conference. However , if you are limiting scoring , you can be in the top half. Specifically Auburn is in the top half of limiting opponents scoring , 4th in the sec. Alternatively, the offense is 8th in total offense but they are 11th in PPG. It does no good to rack up yardage and not convert in scoring. Mind you the offense does not have a single stat that is in the top half of the conference whereas the defense is in the top half for PPG and rush defense. The pass defense is terrible. This is not equal footing. 

Edited by DAG
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1 minute ago, DAG said:

Right but that is not a great star to use ? Why? Because total offense takes into account way more than just scoring. For instance the bend don’t break , will potentially give up total yards so you can be in the second half of the conference. However , if you are limiting scoring , you can be in the top half. Specifically Auburn is in the top half of limiting opponents scoring , 4th in the sec. Alternatively, the offense is 8th in total offense but they are 11th in PPG. It does no good to rack up yardage and not convert in scoring. Mind you the offense does not have a single stat that is in the top half of the conference whereas the defense is in the top half for PPG and rush defense. The pass defense is terrible. This is not equal footing. 

You can only say it so many ways, so many times. Some only see what they want to see.

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4 minutes ago, bigbird said:

You can only say it so many ways, so many times. Some only see what they want to see.

Right. I really don’t know how else to provide facts. The defense isn’t elite . I wouldn’t even be qualify them as good but they are adequate enough to win 8 games with. The problem is the offense was below average in every stat. If the offense was at least above average, we would be an 8 win team with a chance to be competing for the sec west title. I think the big issue is the allure of CDM and the hype most of us had for the defense especially the secondary which has almost shown to be the weakest group on our team. Now, there are other factors to that . One it can be coaching . Two, it can be attributed to talent . Three, the pash rush is poor. I don’t care if you are Jalen Freaking Ramsey, if you can’t trust your defensive line it will affect your ability to cover. There is a reason why guys like Richard Sherman , Josh Norman , etc are elite . It is not just their cover skills. They are usually paired with a good to great front seven also. 

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9 hours ago, shabby said:

Well that's pretty much the point isn't it. Why doesn't it match that and isn't the head coach largely responsible for that

Well each player has had multiple position coaches so maybe there are limitations in the raw material. Are you proposing to keep hiring and firing position coaches until one of them extracts the skills and talents that equals a recruiting site's star rating? 

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https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ncaa/fei/overalldef/2021
 

I’m on my phone and it’s hard to read but this website does a great job at explaining the analytics if anyone is interested. Another great resource below  

 

https://collegefootballdata.com/team/Auburn

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1 hour ago, DAG said:

Right. I really don’t know how else to provide facts. The defense isn’t elite . I wouldn’t even be qualify them as good but they are adequate enough to win 8 games with. The problem is the offense was below average in every stat. If the offense was at least above average, we would be an 8 win team with a chance to be competing for the sec west title. I think the big issue is the allure of CDM and the hype most of us had for the defense especially the secondary which has almost shown to be the weakest group on our team. Now, there are other factors to that . One it can be coaching . Two, it can be attributed to talent . Three, the pash rush is poor. I don’t care if you are Jalen Freaking Ramsey, if you can’t trust your defensive line it will affect your ability to cover. There is a reason why guys like Richard Sherman , Josh Norman , etc are elite . It is not just their cover skills. They are usually paired with a good to great front seven also. 

I'm telling you man, it's as if the people the most upset feel like mason could produce this pressure and sacks and such but he just chooses not to. As if he can push the button to lead to all of that but he refuses to.

Why on earth would he not produce pressure and sack the qb if he has that option? 

 

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7 hours ago, tbone4jc said:

How many players did we loose to the NFL, graduation and the transfer portal? How many defenders did we sign off of the transfer panel? Where on God's green Earth does our OLine stack up to anyone?  The lack of talent is real to say otherwise is asinine.

It's an excuse. The level of compiled talent of our team despite all the factors rates 14th overall. Sure there are position weaknesses.  But say we were an untalented team that you proclaim us to be. shouldn't we still see growth throughout the season and not regression? 

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1 hour ago, creed said:

Well each player has had multiple position coaches so maybe there are limitations in the raw material. Are you proposing to keep hiring and firing position coaches until one of them extracts the skills and talents that equals a recruiting site's star rating? 

If a coach can't develop talent absolutely. The only variable is the time it takes to evaluate the coach. Im my concerned with the fact that we have a staff that seems incapable of recruiting talent or developing them. If that combination manifests as I believe it will we bill a mediocre yeM for years to come. We could have had and continue to need a coach like Napier. He is someone that can recruit lights out and when with the talent level that he has. Instead I feel like our coach and do neither of those two things

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29 minutes ago, cole256 said:

I'm telling you man, it's as if the people the most upset feel like mason could produce this pressure and sacks and such but he just chooses not to. As if he can push the button to lead to all of that but he refuses to.

Why on earth would he not produce pressure and sack the qb if he has that option? 

 

Didn't he produce pressure the entire 1st half using multiple blitz packages against South carolina before switching to a consistent  3 man rush?

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18 minutes ago, shabby said:

Didn't he produce pressure the entire 1st half using multiple blitz packages against South carolina before switching to a consistent  3 man rush?

Yes and one of the times he did that, the RB got loose because one player didn't do his assignment then most of you on the game thread blamed him for that. Yeah, I guess he should've covered the guy from the booth. Mind you in the South Carolina game they had one TD in the second half. They scored less than their average PPG. So exactly what are we complaining about?

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4 minutes ago, DAG said:

So exactly what are we complaining about?

We lost?

seriously, went to A day for the first time in years. Easy to see in the spring that we have absolutely no depth defensively. Our defense has be gassed in the fourth quarter. 

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1 minute ago, SaltyTiger said:

We lost?

seriously, went to A day for the first time in years. Easy to see in the spring that we have absolutely no depth defensively. Our defense has be gassed in the fourth quarter. 

Some of you guys are unbearable. Why are you complaining about the defense? The defense did their job. 

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Just now, SaltyTiger said:

Not complaining sir. Just making a statement from my observation

But the guy I responded to is complaining about the defense. So if you want to complain, complain about the below average offense. Some of you guys want to throw everyone under the bus, except the sole reality of what is the downfall.

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15 minutes ago, DAG said:

Yes and one of the times he did that, the RB got loose because one player didn't do his assignment then most of you on the game thread blamed him for that. Yeah, I guess he should've covered the guy from the booth. Mind you in the South Carolina game they had one TD in the second half. They scored less than their average PPG. So exactly what are we complaining about?

I'm not complaining actually. I don't feel Mason is the problem. I'm just stating that our line can generate pressure. Most the pressure Georgia generates comes from disguised blitzs and formations.  3 man rush packages from them?  Never. Utilizes 3 man pressure packages.as the go to for a team that requires more to create  pressure seems a baffling approach. 

Edited by shabby
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7 minutes ago, DAG said:

But the guy I responded to is complaining about the defense. So if you want to complain, complain about the below average offense. Some of you guys want to throw everyone under the bus, except the sole reality of what is the downfall.

Understand….the observation was in agreement with your analysis. 

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12 minutes ago, shabby said:

I'm not complaining actually. I don't feel Mason is the problem. I'm just stating that our line can generate pressure. Most the pressure Georgia generates comes from disguised blitzs and formations.  3 man rush packages from them?  Never. Utilizes 3 man pressure packages.as the go to for a team that requires more to create  pressure seems a baffling approach. 

UGA defense is one of the most discipline defenses in the nation and I love to watch them play. I am not going to even get into the nuances of some of the other stuff you are describing because quite frankly I am just tired of the convo. I will say, even as talented as they are, all 11 of them for the most part do their job. Our defense has shown that they are incapable of doing the simple things, which can easily lead to big plays or mishaps. 

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1 hour ago, shabby said:

Didn't he produce pressure the entire 1st half using multiple blitz packages against South carolina before switching to a consistent  3 man rush?

I didn't watch the entire game yet but I can and come back and tell you what I see

But once again.....WE DON'T HAVE DEPTH.  We aren't going to be able to keep and maintain a super high level of play while these guys are getting banged and beat up on over and over and over. Especially when the offense doesn't sustain drives.

If anything you should see that and think this is where we are heading. This is what we will get to eventually

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29 minutes ago, shabby said:

I'm not complaining actually. I don't feel Mason is the problem. I'm just stating that our line can generate pressure. Most the pressure Georgia generates comes from disguised blitzs and formations.  3 man rush packages from them?  Never. Utilizes 3 man pressure packages.as the go to for a team that requires more to create  pressure seems a baffling approach. 

We aren't Georgia. They have different calibre of athlete than we do. But yes when you have a secondary that you feel can will all their match up AND most importantly the guys you send, you know they will not only get there but get there in a hurry, you may be more aggressive.

When you have film that 5 times you called a blitz and 3 went for td's......you don't keep trying to blitz.

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17 minutes ago, cole256 said:

We aren't Georgia. They have different calibre of athlete than we do. But yes when you have a secondary that you feel can will all their match up AND most importantly the guys you send, you know they will not only get there but get there in a hurry, you may be more aggressive.

When you have film that 5 times you called a blitz and 3 went for td's......you don't keep trying 

You don't rush 3 give the qb all day and watch the secondary get beat every single time. And yet that is the net effect of rushing 3.  You saw in real time the effect rushing 3 had in the Mississippi State game and the effect multiple blitz packages had in the South Carolina game. How you defend this approach is baffling. 

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2 minutes ago, shabby said:

You don't rush 3 give the qb all day and watch the secondary get beat every single time. And yet that is the net effect of rushing 3.  You saw in real time the effect rushing 3 had in the Mississippi State game and the effect multiple blitz packages had in the South Carolina game. How you defend this approach is baffling. 

Your reading comprehension is baffling. 

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7 minutes ago, shabby said:

You don't rush 3 give the qb all day and watch the secondary get beat every single time. And yet that is the net effect of rushing 3.  You saw in real time the effect rushing 3 had in the Mississippi State game and the effect multiple blitz packages had in the South Carolina game. How you defend this approach is baffling. 

Lol...what I'm saying is baffling, actual football strategy? Ok. 

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2 minutes ago, DAG said:

Your reading comprehension is baffling. 

That's hilarious, considering the source.

The 21 points to USCe isn't the problem. 40 unanswered to MSU now, that's a PROBLEM! I'll be interested in seeing how Harsin goes about fixing this problem. I like Mason as a coach. Maybe they can get some better players and not surrender 40 unanswered to a gimmick offense being run with inferior players. Time will tell.

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11 minutes ago, cole256 said:

Lol...what I'm saying is baffling, actual football strategy? 

It's baffling because you think rushing 3 allows the players to rest when all it does is extend drives and keeps the secondary running in coverage for 10 second routes.  And yes it is also strategy but when that strategy evidently doesn't work i.e. the Mississippi state game you change your strategy.  I would also love to know why we didn't have the personally to run pressure blitz and 4 man rushes during the Mississippi state game but suddenly had the personal one week later when that's exactly what we did... effectively

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