How did all this start?

[ToomersStreet 795]

11 minutes ago, Mikey said:

Maybe some remedial arithmetic is in order? 8-5 is better than 6-7.

We really need to work on your sarcasm for starters.  Gus had a 7-6 season that looked worse from start to finish than Harsin initial season.  Also that was year three for Gus.  They were his player because even under Chizik the offense was recruited for Malzahns system.  if Harsin turns out to be an 8-5 coach then I will change my tone.  Yet, under Gus, a high school QB was never once developed.  Receivers struggled once in the NFL, offensive line recruiting was neglected for four straight cycles, part of that was Malzahns very poor o-line development.  Harsin had to spend all of year one teaching the line how to be an actual line.  Un-teach Nix bad habits, teach the receivers how to be college receivers.  Our offense had to go from learning a high school system where you run a jet sweep on 3rd and 14 (because no one knows why) or throw it deep on 3rd and 1 to learning how to make reads.  Harsin may or may not be the guy but Gus proved in eight years he definitely was not.  He lost four games his initial season with a very weak non conference record.  This is his last year with Heupels players then he will start to regress.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

3 hours ago, ToomersStreet said:

You're right I dont know why said that.  Except for Shenkers quote:

 

Listen and Listen Carefully: @CoachHarsin is my football coach! He is the leader I want to have in my corner. If you have a problem with his Discipline, Toughness, and Conviction that he instills in his players than get your entitled, selfish, and soft tail out away this program.

.  Also, when Lee Hunter said  "The reason I chose to leave Auburn because we got treated like we wasn't good enough, and like dogs," Hunter wrote  

When a reporter did an Instagram interview with Hunter and asked for specific reasons, Harsin is unreasonable with players being late to practice, team meetings, or class.  Harsin would then take disciplinary action.  What kind of action?  Suspended from practice, facilities, weightroom, team meetings for one week.

 

 

SO YEAH.  A BUNCH OF UNDISCIPLINED CRYBABIES THAT GUS 8-5 MALZAHN CREATED

Lee Hunter is one kid. 

[oracle79 3,569]

41 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

Lee Hunter is one kid. 

True, but many others that left the program liked what he posted.

[EastAl_Tiger 225]

1 hour ago, TitanTiger said:

Lee Hunter is one kid. 

One bad apple......

[Mikey 16,576]

4 hours ago, ToomersStreet said:

if Harsin turns out to be an 8-5 coach then I will change my tone.

I'll be very surprised if Harsin ever wins eight games in one season at Auburn. Looking at 4-8, or at the very best 5-7 next year, primarily because he let the team be gutted through the transfer portal and has failed to bring in sufficient replacements.

On the bright side, he'll probably break his five game losing streak early on, because his first two opponents next year are Mercer and San Jose State. Surely there won't be a huge 2nd half collapse in at least one of those two games.

Quote: "Yet,under Gus, a high school QB was never once developed.."

Gee, Auburn's record books say that Bo Nix is Auburn's all-time career total offense leader. What planet do you live on?

 

Edited February 13, 2022 by Mikey

[TitanTiger 20,472]

1 hour ago, EastAl_Tiger said:

One bad apple......

 

1 hour ago, oracle79 said:

True, but many others that left the program liked what he posted.

Guys, let’s not swing wildly to the opposite extreme and start theorizing that Harsin was just doing things right and making the boys work and everyone who had a problem with how he treated some of them (and how he treated some coaches) as lazy, disloyal malcontents. When 20 guys leave, several of whom were either starters or in line to be playing a lot more this season, it’s not just all on them. That feels like a revisionist narrative to make you feel better about how things ended up and Harsin still being here. 

[AURealist 2,185]

28 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

 

Guys, let’s not swing wildly to the opposite extreme and start theorizing that Harsin was just doing things right and making the boys work and everyone who had a problem with how he treated some of them (and how he treated some coaches) as lazy, disloyal malcontents. When 20 guys leave, several of whom were either starters or in line to be playing a lot more this season, it’s not just all on them. That feels like a revisionist narrative to make you feel better about how things ended up and Harsin still being here. 

No, by all means let's keep the anti-Harsin drumbeat going.  

[TitanTiger 20,472]

37 minutes ago, AURealist said:

No, by all means let's keep the anti-Harsin drumbeat going.  

Because the only two options are anti-Harsin or How Saint Bryan Defeated Mordor.

[DAG 33,976]

2 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

 

Guys, let’s not swing wildly to the opposite extreme and start theorizing that Harsin was just doing things right and making the boys work and everyone who had a problem with how he treated some of them (and how he treated some coaches) as lazy, disloyal malcontents. When 20 guys leave, several of whom were either starters or in line to be playing a lot more this season, it’s not just all on them. That feels like a revisionist narrative to make you feel better about how things ended up and Harsin still being here. 

 call it from both sides . It is clear as day some of these rumors and allegations were extreme that was allowed to get ran with . I don’t think a single one of us that still support CBH would dare say CBH is perfect or he can’t get better. But it’s hilarious you are talking about extremes when that’s all we have heard the last week or so. There was no conclusive evidence that CBH was abusive , racist , had sexual misconduct or leads a toxic environment otherwise he would’ve been gone by now.

There was a whole thread started with that this young man said, with several likes from former players. You then had posters treating this like truth, even to the point of a racism discussion, which got abated by Bird (Thankfully). At that time there was no one saying, "let's not swing wildly." It was all fair game. Apparently the young man was asked specifics and nothing he said qualified being treated like a dog.

What we have is a type A coach, whom some responded to and others did not. Is that the appropriate way to go about fielding a successful team ? I don’t believe so, but we will see where he goes now. 

Edited February 13, 2022 by DAG

[TitanTiger 20,472]

22 minutes ago, DAG said:

 call it from both sides . It is clear as day some of these rumors and allegations were extreme that was allowed to get ran with . I don’t think a single one of us that still support CBH would dare say CBH is perfect or he can’t get better. But it’s hilarious you are talking about extremes when that’s all we have heard the last week or so. There was no conclusive evidence that CBH was abusive , racist , had sexual misconduct or leads a toxic environment otherwise he would’ve been gone by now. What we have is a type A coach, whom some responded to and others did not. Is that the appropriate way to go about fielding a successful team ? I don’t believe so, but we will see where he goes now. 

What part of what I said made you think I was advocating for the opposite extreme?  Like the entire point of what I said was that we don't swing from the first extreme (Harsin is an horrible human who sh**s on people) to the opposite extreme (what I said that you quoted).  The truth is somewhere between those poles and blames falls on Harsin and on some of the players/coaches.

[DAG 33,976]

10 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

What part of what I said made you think I was advocating for the opposite extreme?  Like the entire point of what I said was that we don't swing from the first extreme (Harsin is an horrible human who sh**s on people) to the opposite extreme (what I said that you quoted).

But you never ever make that point of people saying he is a crap human being. The post I am responding to specifically describes you saying that we shouldn't assume CBH was just doing right (I can assure you most of us aren't doing that). You then double down and accuse these posters of feeling better about how CBH situation concluded by making revisionary history? How so?

Seems like the ones trying to make themselves feel better are the ones who were wrong from the start and now cannot help it that they didn't get their way. Further, if you really felt like this, why weren't you making this case about a week ago when this extreme was occurring on threads? There was a specific thread for this topic and it was snowballing so out of control Big Bird had to moderate it.

 

Edited February 14, 2022 by DAG

[DAG 33,976]

13 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

The truth is somewhere between those poles and blames falls on Harsin and on some of the players/coaches.

Edited February 14, 2022 by DAG

[TitanTiger 20,472]

31 minutes ago, DAG said:

But you never ever make that point of people saying he is a crap human being. The post I am responding to specifically describes you saying that we shouldn't assume CBH was just doing right (I can assure you most of us aren't doing that). You then double down and accuse these posters of feeling better about how CBH situation concluded by making revisionary history? How so?

Seems like the ones trying to make themselves feel better are the ones who were wrong from the start and now cannot help it that they didn't get their way. Further, if you really felt like this, why weren't you making this case about a week ago when this extreme was occurring on threads? There was a specific thread for this topic and it was snowballing so out of control Big Bird had to moderate it.

 

When I say, "let's not swing to the opposite extreme," it logically implies that I think there are two extremes.  And being that they are "extremes," neither are desirable.  I don't know how that's not picked up on and that I need to explicitly spell that out for grown adults.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

29 minutes ago, DAG said:

[DAG 33,976]

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

When I say, "let's not swing to the opposite extreme," it logically implies that I think there are two extremes.  And being that they are "extremes," neither are desirable.  I don't know how that's not picked up on and that I need to explicitly spell that out for grown adults.

The same way grown adults should know baseless rumors shouldn't be allowed to run rampant. But I guess logic runs amiss among adults, am I right? 

Kind of like the other day when your little buddy said CBH doesn't like to recruit top guys? Extreme no? That is a little different than saying, CBH is not utilizing the NIL to it's best extent to get top guys, no? 

Edited February 14, 2022 by DAG

[oracle79 3,569]

2 hours ago, TitanTiger said:

 

Guys, let’s not swing wildly to the opposite extreme and start theorizing that Harsin was just doing things right and making the boys work and everyone who had a problem with how he treated some of them (and how he treated some coaches) as lazy, disloyal malcontents. When 20 guys leave, several of whom were either starters or in line to be playing a lot more this season, it’s not just all on them. That feels like a revisionist narrative to make you feel better about how things ended up and Harsin still being here. 

True or not, the sentiment was Gus was soft and not demanding of players. Then you get the polar opposite of him here and a bunch of guys opt out. I'm fine with that, that's what they should do if they can't get on board with the new culture and I wish them success wherever they go. Harsin needs to get his guys in here that fit his culture, and I am much more of a fan of his culture than Gus's. Of course well see how it turns out and I'm fine with that. But, don't base decisions or opinions on social media posts of teenagers please. The vast majority of players on the team support him and I'll guarantee all the future ones he recruits or pulls from the portal will do the same.

[DAG 33,976]

1 minute ago, oracle79 said:

True or not, the sentiment was Gus was soft and not demanding of players. Then you get the polar opposite of him here and a bunch of guys opt out. I'm fine with that, that's what they should do if they can't get on board with the new culture and I wish them success wherever they go. Harsin needs to get his guys in here that fit his culture, and I am much more of a fan of his culture than Gus's. Of course well see how it turns out and I'm fine with that. But, don't base decisions or opinions on social media posts of teenagers please. The vast majority of players on the team support him and I'll guarantee all the future ones he recruits or pulls from the portal will do the same.

BUT WHAT IF IT WAS 20 PLAYERS?! [ Yellow Font]

[TitanTiger 20,472]

1 minute ago, DAG said:

The same way grown adults should know baseless rumors shouldn't be allowed to run rampant. But I guess logic runs amiss among adults, am I right? 

A week ago we were trying to understand what was happening.  There were some pretty big accusations going on and not just rumors from anons on message boards.  We immediately squashed talk of the more salacious rumor regarding personal misconduct and I doled out more than one suspension to people who violated that.  But the rest of it was being talked about openly by players who'd left, players who stayed but graduated or will be moving on to the NFL, and some who spoke to reporters.  This wasn't all just a load of bull****.

Either we were going to allow it to be talked about here or we weren't.  When we decided to allow it, we tried to strike a balance between allowing people to discuss it and not letting it completely run buck wild.  I'm sure we didn't do a perfect job but overall I think we did a pretty good job threading that needle.

 

1 minute ago, DAG said:

Kind of like the other day when your little buddy said CBH doesn't like to recruit top guys? Extreme no? That is a little different than saying, CBH is not utilizing the NIL to it's best extent to get top guys, no? 

Who's my little buddy and why should I have known every blessed thing said on this forum?

[TitanTiger 20,472]

3 minutes ago, oracle79 said:

True or not, the sentiment was Gus was soft and not demanding of players. Then you get the polar opposite of him here and a bunch of guys opt out. I'm fine with that, that's what they should do if they can't get on board with the new culture and I wish them success wherever they go. Harsin needs to get his guys in here that fit his culture, and I am much more of a fan of his culture than Gus's. Of course well see how it turns out and I'm fine with that. But, don't base decisions or opinions on social media posts of teenagers please. The vast majority of players on the team support him and I'll guarantee all the future ones he recruits or pulls from the portal will do the same.

Some players left for that reason.  Others left because they felt like he didn't care about them as people, didn't care about their families and just wanted it to all be about football.  We've had 20 guys bolt.  I think it stands to reason it's all not because they were soft.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

2 minutes ago, DAG said:

BUT WHAT IF IT WAS 20 PLAYERS?! [ Yellow Font]

Twenty is a lot.  Even for a coach who is implementing "culture change."  Not everyone or even most of them were necessarily unable to handle being coached hard.

[DAG 33,976]

Just now, TitanTiger said:

A week ago we were trying to understand what was happening.  There were some pretty big accusations going on and not just rumors from anons on message boards.  We immediately squashed talk of the more salacious rumor regarding personal misconduct and I doled out more than one suspension to people who violated that.  But the rest of it was being talked about openly by players who'd left, players who stayed but graduated or will be moving on to the NFL, and some who spoke to reporters.  This wasn't all just a load of bull****.

Either we were going to allow it to be talked about here or we weren't.  When we decided to allow it, we tried to strike a balance between allowing people to discuss it and not letting it completely run buck wild.  I'm sure we didn't do a perfect job but overall I think we did a pretty good job threading that needle.

 

Who's my little buddy and why should I have known every blessed thing said on this forum?

So maybe you need to do a better job of vetting then? To allow some of this rumors to keep going on without an ounce of concrete evidence was shameful. The truth of the matter was a lot of you guys don't like him as a coach, still don't like him as a coach and couldn't find a personal hand to get him the off out of here. So which wasn't  a lot of bull s*** then?

[oracle79 3,569]

3 minutes ago, TitanTiger said:

I think it stands to reason it's all not because they were soft.

Didn't say they were soft. Just they couldn't get on board with the current culture. People aren't going to hold your hand throughout life and most bosses in the real world that I know aren't going to be calling your parents and updating them on your progress and well being. Some programs will I'm sure, so I'm again glad that they realized this and moved on. It helps them and it helps Auburn.

Edited February 14, 2022 by oracle79

[DAG 33,976]

1 minute ago, TitanTiger said:

Twenty is a lot.  Even for a coach who is implementing "culture change."  Not everyone or even most of them were necessarily unable to handle being coached hard.

I never once, nor made that assumption. My point is you have a handful of people who stick up for him. You have twenty people who leave for whatever reason. Why are we choosing one over the other. And then sit here and say, "Well that is not the case." That has been shown the dang case all week.

[TitanTiger 20,472]

1 minute ago, DAG said:

So maybe you need to do a better job of vetting then?

Maybe if you don't think we do a good enough job you should go somewhere else?  We do the best we can for volunteers who have jobs.

 

1 minute ago, DAG said:

To allow some of this rumors to keep going on without an ounce of concrete evidence was shameful. The truth of the matter was a lot of you guys don't like him as a coach, still don't like him as a coach and couldn't find a personal hand to get him the off out of here. So which wasn't  a lot of bull s*** then?

Your opinion is duly noted.  Like I say, our moderating staff does a damn good job.  We will never get it exactly right or do it to everyone's satisfaction.  It's up to you whether that's satisfactory to you or not but it's not changing just because it didn't suit you.

[DAG 33,976]

Just now, TitanTiger said:

Maybe if you don't think we do a good enough job you should go somewhere else?  We do the best we can for volunteers who have jobs.

 

Your opinion is duly noted.  Like I say, our moderating staff does a damn good job.  We will never get it exactly right or do it to everyone's satisfaction.  It's up to you whether that's satisfactory to you or not but it's not changing just because it didn't suit you.

Who is we? I love quite a bit of y'all. Some of you guys do a damn good job moderating and being balanced. But are you going to answer my question or not?