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Worried about Flanigan...


steeleagle
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2 hours ago, Rednilla said:

He's a junior this year. I'm unsure if basketball players get a Covid year or not, so if they do, he's got two years eligibility left. If not, then he's only got one more.

Far as I know they do, that’s why Zep has already announced he’s coming back. Think that’s right anyways. 

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I understand why everybody is worried about Flanigan. He has not played very well since returning from his injury whether he is still not 100% or if it is mental which can be one of the hardest parts of coming back from an injury or it is a combination of both he is not the old Flanigan. We don't need the old Flanigan on this team but what we do need is the shutdown defender Flanigan and the 3rd year player with a high basketball IQ. If we have a guard who can slow down or shutdown Appleby we win this game easy last year Flanigan could have done that for us. A contested three by a much bigger Flanigan versus a Green is a much more difficult shot.

As bad as he has played I have also noticed some positive things in the Vandy game where he made a bad play how fast he got back on defense and a couple of dunks looks like he is getting his hops back.  I might start Cambridge next game and bring Flan in with Green puts a little less pressure on him and might help him with the mental side. Flanigan is the key to how far we going in the big dance and I don't know why but I think he is getting close. 

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He shouldnt be on the court right now in my opinion.  He is a liability and until he proves otherwise he should have limited mins at best. Im pulling for him but I have been saying this for a few weeks, he is not helping the team with what he is doing out there on the floor.  Too many turnovers, sloppy passes, weak takes to the rim, not finishing with contact, just a laundry list of issues really.  Jaylin Williams should be getting his minutes.  

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2 hours ago, BHDAU1 said:

He shouldnt be on the court right now in my opinion.  He is a liability and until he proves otherwise he should have limited mins at best. Im pulling for him but I have been saying this for a few weeks, he is not helping the team with what he is doing out there on the floor.  Too many turnovers, sloppy passes, weak takes to the rim, not finishing with contact, just a laundry list of issues really.  Jaylin Williams should be getting his minutes.  

Not Jay-Cambridge. He can keep teams more honest with his ability to run.

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When coming back from an injury it's not just about the leg still hurting. It's just a shame he's going thru this with this team. 

I know he has to feel under appreciated

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Love his defensive intensity. I hope he’s not gun shy. Three shot attempts in two games. We need him to be a little more aggressive than that, but if he defends like he has and takes care of the ball, he fits with this team. Defense travels. And he’s an under appreciated part of our defense. 

Edited by mcgufcm
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On 2/20/2022 at 9:55 PM, mcgufcm said:

Love his defensive intensity. I hope he’s not gun shy. Three shot attempts in two games. We need him to be a little more aggressive than that, but if he defends like he has and takes care of the ball, he fits with this team. Defense travels. And he’s an under appreciated part of our defense. 

The thing is, he isn’t taking care of the ball. His turnover percentage is among the worst in the entire country, and he’s starting on a top 5 team. This board is full of comments about Wendell’s turnovers - Wendell is second-worst on the team in TO% at 15.9%, Allen is at a mind-blowing 24.9%. 
 

The advanced stats show clearly he hurts us by being on the floor. His improvement is also the biggest variable in our ceiling right now IMO, so I hope he works through whatever this is. (Not to mention that I just feel for the guy.) 

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4 hours ago, Dunndone414 said:

The thing is, he isn’t taking care of the ball. His turnover percentage is among the worst in the entire country, and he’s starting on a top 5 team. This board is full of comments about Wendell’s turnovers - Wendell is second-worst on the team in TO% at 15.9%, Allen is at a mind-blowing 24.9%. 
 

The advanced stats show clearly he hurts us by being on the floor. His improvement is also the biggest variable in our ceiling right now IMO, so I hope he works through whatever this is. (Not to mention that I just feel for the guy.) 

I 100% agree with this. THAT is why AF needs to be on the floor right now.

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5 hours ago, Dunndone414 said:

The thing is, he isn’t taking care of the ball. His turnover percentage is among the worst in the entire country, and he’s starting on a top 5 team. This board is full of comments about Wendell’s turnovers - Wendell is second-worst on the team in TO% at 15.9%, Allen is at a mind-blowing 24.9%. 
 

The advanced stats show clearly he hurts us by being on the floor. His improvement is also the biggest variable in our ceiling right now IMO, so I hope he works through whatever this is. (Not to mention that I just feel for the guy.) 

This. Williams, Moore, and Berman when healthy, give us a better chance of winning than Flanigan does. Give them his minutes, Bruce.

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Opposite. Flanigan is a necessary piece if the goal is a title. He needs time to work out the kinks. If the goal is to be good, give his minutes away. There is zero question he lifts the team’s ceiling though. 

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1 hour ago, mcgufcm said:

Opposite. Flanigan is a necessary piece if the goal is a title. He needs time to work out the kinks. If the goal is to be good, give his minutes away. There is zero question he lifts the team’s ceiling though. 

Just my opinion, but there’s no question in my mind that if Willams got Flans 24 minutes and Flan got Williams’ 15 minutes, Auburn would be a better team. Williams has better 2pt,3pt, and FT%’s along with comparable rebound #’s and HALF the turnovers per game 

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Very good points on both sides.  I've been on the fence, but...

I think it's too late this year for Flan to return to last year's form.  For whatever reason, he has not progressed much in the past month.  His injury was very significant.

It's time to move on, if there are other choices.

If somehow Jaylin could get more playing time...

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Jaylin can’t play the three. So either you’re asking Smith to move up or you’re asking Jaylin to do something he’s never done.

If anyone’s minutes change, it’s Cambridge. Or you see more three guard. 

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18 hours ago, jluvah said:

This. Williams, Moore, and Berman when healthy, give us a better chance of winning than Flanigan does. Give them his minutes, Bruce.

None of them have AF's skill set and Moore and Berman certainly would not help us more. On a single possession, maybe, but not over the course of a game, AF needs to play. 

14 hours ago, jluvah said:

Just my opinion, but there’s no question in my mind that if Williams got Flans 24 minutes and Flan got Williams’ 15 minutes, Auburn would be a better team. Williams has better 2pt,3pt, and FT%’s along with comparable rebound #’s and HALF the turnovers per game 

Now, how much he needs to play is a legit question to work through. Of all of our guys, the two that I wish could get more minutes are Cardwell and Williams. Unfortunately for them (from a playing time perspective) they are behind Kessler and Smith. At this point I would be interested to see Kessler at the 5, Williams at the 4, Smith at the 3, and 2 guards to see how that flows. Maybe give Williams 5-7 more minutes in that rotation. WIth the time left, I don't want CBP to give up on AF, but its time to look for immediate solutions as well. 

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21 hours ago, mcgufcm said:

Opposite. Flanigan is a necessary piece if the goal is a title. He needs time to work out the kinks. If the goal is to be good, give his minutes away. There is zero question he lifts the team’s ceiling though. 

And there’s also the issue of..you’re taking a creator off the floor when our other creator is struggling. Even if Allen isn’t doing that role particularly well, the threat of that guy setting up something does a lot more for you than DC

I wish there was a way to get Moore involved, who I felt showed some really good things on O when AF was out. I will say that was against the easier part of the schedule, and even if he played as well as he did then, it probably doesn’t make a huge difference for your tourney hopes. You probably (maybe) win the Ark or the Florida games, but you gotta try to figure out how to get at least a positive return out of AF 

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5 hours ago, JwgreDeux said:

None of them have AF's skill set and Moore and Berman certainly would not help us more. On a single possession, maybe, but not over the course of a game, AF needs to play. 

Now, how much he needs to play is a legit question to work through. Of all of our guys, the two that I wish could get more minutes are Cardwell and Williams. Unfortunately for them (from a playing time perspective) they are behind Kessler and Smith. At this point I would be interested to see Kessler at the 5, Williams at the 4, Smith at the 3, and 2 guards to see how that flows. Maybe give Williams 5-7 more minutes in that rotation. WIth the time left, I don't want CBP to give up on AF, but its time to look for immediate solutions as well. 

Smith at the 3 is a look that I think we definitely should’ve tried just from a spacing standpoint by now. I think Jaylin or Moore at the 4 can be more of a mismatch than our SFs have been currently, even if outside shots don’t fall 

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I might get flamed for this but I don't Flanigan is a vital piece to this team.  We have more than enough bench behind him.  And Im not talking about scrubs.  Williams in my opinion is one of the most improved players on this team this year.  Just rewatch some of the games and concentrate on him.  He is moving constantly to get open, diving for loose balls, hitting the boards, hitting pull up jumpers right outside the rim, taking care of the ball, and generally giving what appears to be MAXIMUM effort at all times on the court, right or wrong.  And he is right a lot more than he is wrong like in past years.  Williams is a starter on just about any SEC team and many others in the top 25.  Flanigan just came back too early.  He cleary IMO needs a full offseason of health and practice to hopefully get back to where he was.  I'm not forgetting he was getting 1st team preseason ALL SEC hype prior to the season, but anyone who thinks he resembles that guy from last year is pulling at straws.  I sincerely hope he comes back next year as a lottery pick, but right now he is undraftable in anywhere but the last rounds, if at all at his current level of play.  I don't think he is key to AU wining big things this year, its going to be Williams and to a lessor degree Cambridge.  Just my .02 Watch the film snd concentrate on Flanigan, he is not the same guy as last year.

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Did Jabari play any 3 when Flan was out early this season? I can't seem to remember if he did or not. If he did not then it may just be wishful thinking on fans part that he can play that position. I mean i don't see why he could not play it.....i think Jabari moves well enough on defense to stay with opposing 3s. It would take us from a very fast an athletic team to probably an average team in those regards. I dunno....i like the idea of Jabari and Williams taking the minutes but the more i look at rotations for the year the optinos are probably Berman and Moore if you want to take Flans minutes. I don't think Berman can play defense against the elite teams.....i don't know why Moore wouldn't get more of a shot. 

I know a healthy and dialed in Flan makes this the best AU team it can be.....but with 4 games left in the season when do you make the call that he isn't walking through that door this season?

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Cambridge started at the 3, and played more minutes. We were also giving Berman and Moore run. That’s how most of Flanigan’s minutes were divvied up. 

Things I liked last night: stayed locked in defensively; slipped into the post against smaller dudes which resulted in one bucket; limited the turnovers (2)… as I’ve said before, he can provide a lot more, but if he’s defending like that and taking care of the ball, Flanigan is hugely important to the team. Even that limited version is a major plus. If the offense bounces back even a little (and Bruce running the duck ins for him are signs that Bruce is actively thinking of how to get him going), look out.

Things I didn’t like: looked timid using his right on drives… he’s overwhelmingly a dominant hand driver right now in a way that is too predictable; and that three-point attempt. 😳

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15 minutes ago, mcgufcm said:

Cambridge started at the 3, and played more minutes. We were also giving Berman and Moore run. That’s how most of Flanigan’s minutes were divvied up. 

Things I liked last night: stayed locked in defensively; slipped into the post against smaller dudes which resulted in one bucket; limited the turnovers (2)… as I’ve said before, he can provide a lot more, but if he’s defending like that and taking care of the ball, Flanigan is hugely important to the team. Even that limited version is a major plus. If the offense bounces back even a little (and Bruce running the duck ins for him are signs that Bruce is actively thinking of how to get him going), look out.

Things I didn’t like: looked timid using his right on drives… he’s overwhelmingly a dominant hand driver right now in a way that is too predictable; and that three-point attempt. 😳

Yeah, if he could just find his stroke from beyond the arc, we'd be good, because that's all we need from him on offense, and he's already providing the defense. He has it within him, he's just got to find it in a hurry if he's going to be the player we need him to be.

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1 hour ago, mcgufcm said:

Cambridge started at the 3, and played more minutes. We were also giving Berman and Moore run. That’s how most of Flanigan’s minutes were divvied up. 

Things I liked last night: stayed locked in defensively; slipped into the post against smaller dudes which resulted in one bucket; limited the turnovers (2)… as I’ve said before, he can provide a lot more, but if he’s defending like that and taking care of the ball, Flanigan is hugely important to the team. Even that limited version is a major plus. If the offense bounces back even a little (and Bruce running the duck ins for him are signs that Bruce is actively thinking of how to get him going), look out.

Things I didn’t like: looked timid using his right on drives… he’s overwhelmingly a dominant hand driver right now in a way that is too predictable; and that three-point attempt. 😳

Yep. I think because the last he played was an entire different role and everybody is new to him he's just having to adjust on the fly. 

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Flan was improved last night. D was solid moved well took it inside a couple of times and was a little timid or would have scored and been basket plus 1.  The three was ugly and was shot to soon for no reason. I would like to see similar effort against Tenn. and get around 8 points with no stupid turnovers. I don't mind an effort turnover a game but the ones where he passes with somebody in passing lane he has been around to long to do that. 

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8 minutes ago, AuburnNTexas said:

Flan was improved last night. D was solid moved well took it inside a couple of times and was a little timid or would have scored and been basket plus 1.  The three was ugly and was shot to soon for no reason. I would like to see similar effort against Tenn. and get around 8 points with no stupid turnovers. I don't mind an effort turnover a game but the ones where he passes with somebody in passing lane he has been around to long to do that. 

I listened to PEarl specifically point out Flanigan's struggles and he wanted to give him praise for doing the other things in a game that help his team.

....But he still makes dumb mistakes, had 4 fouls in 22 mins of play, 3 pts, 1 reb and 2 TOs. Devan had 87 points, a block, 1  TO, and 3-4 shooting. His strength and help is on fast breaks, his O rebounding, and his blocks. 

Flanigan needs to find his confidence. Until he does, he will hurt us offensively.

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31 minutes ago, steeleagle said:

Devan had 87 points, a block, 1  TO, and 3-4 shooting. His strength and help is on fast breaks, his O rebounding, and his blocks. 

Damn! Dude had a great night scoring free throws. :P

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