Renaming Buildings

[Son of A Tiger 560]

There is another thread here about renaming army bases, particularly those currently named after officers in the Confederate Army. How would you feel about doing the same for buildings named after well known Confererate officers?

Edited January 15, 2023 by Son of A Tiger

[Son of A Tiger 560]

Interesting that there was a lot of discussion about renaming army bases but no comment about renaming well knows buildings. I know there is a big difference but the underlying logic is similar.

[AURex 1,994]

As for renaming Auburn buildings ......

Tiger Hall has been named in honor of Bessie Mae Holloway, and Eagle Hall has been named in honor of Josetta Brittain Matthews. Recent Board of Trustees decisions concerning the names of certain buildings on campus are part of an ongoing effort by Auburn to honor individuals whose contributions to the university have led to meaningful change and are deserving of such recognition. All of these changes have come amid the creation of two task force groups—the Presidential Task Force for Opportunity and Equity and the Auburn Board of Trustees Task Force.

This February [2021], Auburn’s Board of Trustees voted to rename two residence halls in recognition of two Auburn trailblazers, Bessie Mae Holloway and Josetta Brittain Matthews. Holloway was the first Black person to serve as a member of the Board of Trustees and only the second woman, serving from 1985-2000. Matthews was the first Black student to graduate from Auburn, earning a master’s degree in 1966 and a doctorate in 1975, both in education. She was also the first Black faculty member at the university, joining the College of Liberal Arts as a French and history instructor around 1972.

Most recently, Auburn’s student center was named in honor of Harold D. Melton, the chief justice of the Georgia Supreme Court and first Black president of the Auburn Student Government Association.

Additionally, in November 2020, the Board unanimously supported the removal of Gov. Bibb Graves’ name from the campus amphitheater and drive that bore his namesake. The resolution stated that keeping his name on campus would be “inconsistent with the university’s mission and the Auburn Creed and would chill, rather than encourage, broad use of facilities that are intended to be enjoyed as sites for engagement by the campus community.”

https://ocm.auburn.edu/newsroom/campus_notices/2021/04/091545-building-naming-qa.php

 

 

[AURex 1,994]

Auburn decided not to rename Wallace Hall, which was named after the fanatically racist George C Wallace.

https://www.theplainsman.com/article/2021/09/trustees-approve-plaque-to-contextualize-name-of-wallace-hall

 

[homersapien 11,362]

There is an ongoing controversy about renaming Tillman Hall at Clemson University. (Tillman Hall is literally the architectural equivalent of Sanford Hall in Auburn.)

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/02/13/clemson-debates-whether-rename-building

Racist Enshrined

Clemson students and professors explain why they are so upset that the university's board refuses to change the name of a prominent campus building. 

Kaitlin Mulhere

February 13, 2015

 

In 1876, a black state senator in South Carolina was hauled off by a train by a mob. Simon Coker was given the chance to pray before he was murdered. While kneeling, he was shot in the head.

The assassination was part of a systematic paramilitary campaign by white supremacists in the post-Civil War South to intimidate and suppress black voters. One of the leaders present at Coker’s murder became South Carolina’s governor and a longtime U.S. senator.

His name was Benjamin Tillman.

Today, 139 years later, at the center of the campus of Clemson University, stands an iconic brick building.

Its name is Tillman Hall.

A growing number of students and faculty members say that in 2015, at a public university trying to demonstrate its commitment to diversity and inclusion, that’s simply not O.K.

“If there was any example of a person whose name doesn’t deserve to be on a building, Ben Tillman is that person,” said Chenjerai Kumanyika, an assistant professor of communications studies at Clemson. “He was an egregious individual.”

The graduate student government has voted in favor of renaming the building. This week, the Faculty Senate did as well. They know that many of the university's early leaders held racist views, but note that Tillman, who boasted of murdering black people, should not be honored. 

But on Wednesday, the chairman of the Board of Trustees said the name won't change.

“Some of our historical stones are rough and even unpleasant to look at,” Chairman David Wilkins said in a statement. “But they are ours and denying them as part of our history does not make them any less so.  For that reason, we will not change the name of our historical buildings.”

A statute of Tillman stands outside the South Carolina State House in Columbia, and Tillman also has a building bearing his name at Winthrop University, where students tried to have that changed. Likewise, students at universities throughout the South have tried, with various levels of success, to remove odes to racist founders and supporters.

This push to come to terms with Clemson’s racism-linked history started last semester, as students organized events to align with wider national demonstrations about equality and racial discrimination.

Graduate student A. D. Carson was part of a student group that delivered a list of seven grievances to the administration in January, all aimed campus diversity. Grievance number five -- about buildings named for individuals known for their prejudice -- has snowballed into what is now the spotlight on Tillman Hall.

More than 6,100 people have signed an online petition opposing efforts to rename the building.

Those who are fighting to preserve the name are on the wrong side of history, though, said Ryan Gagnon, a Ph.D. student who submitted the resolution to the graduate student government to support changing the name.

“Tillman was an evil man even for a time when racism was accepted,” Gagnon said. “That says a lot.”

Gagnon is originally from Washington State. He wasn’t familiar with Tillman, and he started researching him after Carson came to speak at a graduate student meeting.

Clemson isn’t as inclusive as some at the university would like you to believe, Gagnon said. Of the 13 members of the Board of Trustees, all but 3 are white men. Six percent of the Clemson student population is black, lower than any of the other public colleges in the state. Almost 28 percent of the state's population is black. 

Gagnon and Carson know what people who support the name of the building will say. They’ve heard all the arguments before: that Tillman was a product of his times, or that Tillman Hall honors his commitment to Clemson, not racism.  

In response, they point out that Tillman Hall used to be named Main Building. It didn’t take on the name of the white supremacist until 1946, 17 years before the first black student enrolled at Clemson as a result of a lawsuit.

Gagnon compares the ties to history and legacy to Germany’s history, where Nazis aren’t honored with buildings. And when Carson hears justifications about the importance of Tillman, he questions the lack of recognition for others who helped build the university.

“When people say to me, ‘Without Tillman there would not be Clemson,’ I say, ‘Without slaves there would not be Clemson,'” he said, referring to research by Rhondda Thomas, an associate professor of African-American literature at Clemson, that found convicts, many of whom were former slaves or the sons of slaves, built much of the university. 

Carson thinks there are other ways to acknowledge Tillman’s role in the university’s birth without pasting his name on the campus’s most recognizable building.

Often during debates over renaming campus buildings, people worry it will have a domino effect, said Stephen Kantrowitz, a history professor at the University of Wisconsin-Madison. They ask, where does it stop?

“In this case, I’d ask, ‘Where should it start?’” said Kantrowitz, who wrote a biography about Tillman and his legacy on politics, Ben Tillman and the Reconstruction of White Supremacy (University of North Carolina Press). 

Tillman was the son of the wealthiest fraction of the slave-holding class, and he grew up just as slavery was ending. In a world where actual slavery wasn’t legal, he spent his adult life trying to maintain a system of white supremacy, Kantrowitz said.

At the time, South Carolina had a formally integrated institution at the University of South Carolina, and the state was on the path toward building an interracial democracy. Tillman helped destroy that, according to Kantrowitz. He was a prime architect in what became the Jim Crow system of laws.

“To say that he was a man of his time, well, he helped make his time,” Kantrowitz said.

In speeches on the Senate floor and all over the state, Tillman talked proudly about his participation in the violent attacks during the summer of 1876, when Coker was killed and the Hamburg Massacre took place.

But Tillman was a politician in a period when Southern politicians routinely bragged about such things to get elected, said Alan Grubb, a history professor at Clemson.

Grubb is opposed to renaming the building, saying that it was named after Tillman because of what he did for Clemson, not as a celebration of his actions as a white supremacist. He says he understands the controversy over Tillman, but is bothered by the idea of removing his name and eliminating a part of the university’s history. Clemson’s history has never been a secret, he said. Anyone can read about Tillman’s legacy.

“But once something disappears, it’s really hard to talk about it because it’s not there,” he said. “Tillman Hall just begs you to try to explain Ben Tillman.”

Mostly, Grubb thinks all the attention on Tillman Hall is a distraction from other social issues on campus. Clemson does need to become more diverse and inclusive, but there are better ways to do it, he said.

Yet Kumanyika, the communications professor who wants to see the name changed, said that having such a well-known building named for Tillman obscures his role in history. People start to see him as an icon that can’t be scrutinized.

During the Faculty Senate meeting, professors spoke of trying to recruit talented minority faculty members who were unwilling to work in a hall named for Tillman. The building houses the education school and honors college.

A lot of people who support Tillman Hall, including those who commented on the online petition, fall back on tradition. But tradition isn’t enough to outweigh the negatives of Tillman’s legacy, Kumanyika said.

Tillman was indeed an important booster and backer of Clemson. But his primary commitment was always the subordination of African-Americans, Kantrowitz said.

As governor in 1890, for example, Tillman had the chance to get federal money through the Morrill Land-Grant Acts, which were meant to build up agricultural education. But the law required integrated campuses, or otherwise stipulated that the money would be split up between colleges serving blacks and whites.

Based on population, two-thirds of the federal money would go to a historically black college in Orangeburg and the rest would go to Clemson. But Tillman wouldn’t take the money unless he could be guaranteed that Clemson would receive at least half of it, Kantrowitz said.  

“Like the rest of his legacies, Clemson always came second to white supremacy.”

 

https://www.wyff4.com/article/no-movement-on-renaming-tillman-hall-at-clemsons-campus/36354932

No movement on renaming Tillman Hall at Clemson’s campus

No action on legislation to make Heritage Act-related changes across the state

CLEMSON, S.C. —

On June 12, 2020, Clemson University’s Board of Trustees approved changing the name of the school’s honor’s college to remove John C. Calhoun’s name. It also requested the ability to remove Benjamin Tillman’s name from Tillman Hall – a move that would need approval from South Carolina’s legislature.

“We must recognize there are central figures in Clemson's history whose ideals, beliefs and actions do not represent the university's core values of respect and diversity,” said Chairman Smyth McKissick.

The next day, Clemson football players led a rally and march in the shadow of Tillman Hall.

In the wake of the deaths of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor, they asked for equality. They asked for solidarity. They asked for change.

In the year that followed, Floyd’s killer – former Minneapolis Police officer Derek Chauvin – was convicted of second- and third-degree murder and second-degree manslaughter.

But in the year that followed at Clemson, Tillman’s name – the name of a man who was one of the university’s founders and was “well known for his racist views,” according to the university’s profile of him on its website – is still on one of the most prominent buildings on campus.

No legislation was filed in South Carolina’s House or Senate to remove Tillman’s name from the building.

Rep. Jerry Carter, who represents the Clemson area, told WYFF News 4 Investigates he was not contacted by anyone at the school to write or support legislation that would make the name change legal and official.

“I have not been approached by the university,” he said. “I've been approached by some alumni, but not the university proper, no.”

Carter supported the name change while running for office.

“If they think changing this has a positive impact in terms of how students feel about Clemson University and who they promote, who they represent, then that's something that should happen,” he said. “I support the Board of Trustees. They're fighting history.”

For its part, Clemson University released the following statement on the building’s name:

“Clemson University’s position has not changed since the adoption of the Board resolution regarding Tillman Hall. There have been 14 bills introduced that would amend the Heritage Act and the University continues to monitor their progress. Should the General Assembly determine to move forward with one of these bills, the University will request consideration of our language.”

WYFF News 4 Investigates reviewed all legislation related to repealing or enhancing the Heritage Act – specifically Section 10-1-165 in the state’s code of laws that require a two-thirds vote from each branch of the General Assembly to remove, relocate or alter memorials and monuments on public property.

Each bill introduced has been referred to a committee. No bill has been returned to either the House or Senate for debate or a vote.

With less than two weeks left in the 2021 session, it is unlikely any of the legislation moves through either chamber this year.

One of the bills waiting for committee consideration would remove Tillman’s statue from the South Carolina State House grounds.

“I think if enough people in this state were to know the history behind Tillman, they would want the statue removed and put in the museum for, you know, ancient white racists or whatever,” said Tom O’Brien, founder of Take Tillman Down. “I think the Confederate flag was the start. Tillman seems like a slam dunk on something that's inappropriate.”

O’Brien’s group holds monthly rallies at the statue. He believes Clemson’s move to rename Tillman Hall would help the group’s cause.

“It certainly wouldn't hurt,” he said. “I think it would be a good move on their part. I don't know why you would want to have a building on your grounds named after the man.”

Carter believes change will likely come at Clemson, but could not say when or how easily that change would be.

“I know there is a strong feeling among legislators that we don't want to revise history, and some feel that pulling monuments, changing building names is doing that,” he said. “I think it's one of those that I would hope would come up next year and during off session it will give it a chance to mature in terms of conversations and let people know what their positions are.”

WYFF News 4 Investigates reviewed the names of dozens of buildings on the university’s campus. Nearly all of them bare the names of white men.

The newly named business school does include a woman. It is the Wilbur O. and Ann Powers College of Business

The Harvey and Lucinda Gantt Multicultural Center is not in its own building. The center – named to honor Clemson’s first Black student – is located in Brackett Hall, according to the school’s website.

Eight of the buildings on campus are named for Confederate soldiers, with the history of many of those buildings detailed in an online Clemson Libraries project.

For the 27 buildings where the year the name was established is published, 12 were named in 1966. That includes five of the buildings named for men who fought for the Confederacy.

There are now references to “Old Main” – the original name of Tillman Hall – on Clemson’s website. The building is also called Tillman Hall throughout the site.

-----------------------------

Personally, I would support changing it. 

While one could argue pretty much everyone in South Carolina - like much of the south - was racist at the time.  There is no value in honoring the most egregious examples promoting it.

We need to acknowledge the history of racism, but not continue to honor the leaders who produced and promote it. 

Just as naming southern military army bases after Confederate generals is an insult to the U.S. Military, naming campus buildings to honor prominent racists is an insult to black students.

We need to reject this past and put it behind us in order to advance the dream of a multicultural country in which all citizens are respected.

 

Edited January 16, 2023 by homersapien

[Son of A Tiger 560]

2 hours ago, homersapien said:

 

Personally, I would support changing it. 

While one could argue pretty much everyone in South Carolina - like much of the south - was racist at the time.  There is no value in honoring the most egregious examples promoting it.

We need to acknowledge the history of racism, but not continue to honor the leaders who produced and promote it. 

Just as naming southern military army bases after Confederate generals is an insult to the U.S. Military, naming campus buildings to honor prominent racists is an insult to black students.

We need to reject this past and put it behind us in order to advance the dream of a multicultural country in which all citizens are respected.

 

Funny you think this and talk about renaming Clemson's old building but don't mention Auburn's own Samford Hall which Clemson's was patterned after. Samford Hall was named after William J. Samford who was a Lt. in the Confederate Army. He was an ardent secessionist and a strong defender of states rights. Do you and others want to open that can of worms? That wouldn't sit well with a whole lot of Auburn people. So where do you draw the line?

William J. Samford (1900-01) | Encyclopedia of Alabama

William J. Samford Biography | HowOld.co

 

 

Edited January 16, 2023 by Son of A Tiger

[homersapien 11,362]

4 hours ago, Son of A Tiger said:

Funny you think this and talk about renaming Clemson's old building but don't mention Auburn's own Samford Hall which Clemson's was patterned after. Samford Hall was named after William J. Samford who was a Lt. in the Confederate Army. He was an ardent secessionist and a strong defender of states rights. Do you and others want to open that can of worms? That wouldn't sit well with a whole lot of Auburn people. So where do you draw the line?

William J. Samford (1900-01) | Encyclopedia of Alabama

William J. Samford Biography | HowOld.co

 

 

Strong defender of "states rights".  

States rights for what purpose pray tell?

I'm OK with renaming our version of that building as well.  But Tillman is far more egregious example of a person who does not need to be honored.

 

[Son of A Tiger 560]

16 minutes ago, homersapien said:

Strong defender of "states rights".  

States rights for what purpose pray tell?

I'm OK with renaming our version of that building as well.  But Tillman is far more egregious example of a person who does not need to be honored.

 

Let me as clear as I can. You would be in favor of renaming Auburn's Samford Hall?

[cole256 17,043]

I wonder where you stand 🤣

[autigeremt 6,598]

Naming buildings or erecting monuments after Confederate military personnel was ignorant and shouldn’t have happened in the first place. As for Tilman and Samford? I suspect at some point those buildings will lose the name given to them in the future. 

Edited January 17, 2023 by autigeremt

[DKW 86 7,419]

Google up Bibb Graves. JSU just renamed BGH. Unfortunately they picked another guy with just about as bad a historical context. I think UNA has a BGH still. 
 

Give this some time. Politicians will remember that they can generate some positive publicity renaming buildings and it will proceed. 

[cole256 17,043]

If I remember correctly at one time in Pulaski TN they had a school named after I guess somebody important to the kkk. I have a crazy story if anybody ever want to hear about what happened to me in Pulaski.

To be honest all the things that has happened I'm lucky to be alive

[I_M4_AU 7,793]

37 minutes ago, cole256 said:

If I remember correctly at one time in Pulaski TN they had a school named after I guess somebody important to the kkk. I have a crazy story if anybody ever want to hear about what happened to me in Pulaski.

To be honest all the things that has happened I'm lucky to be alive

Was it *Nathan Bedford Forrest*?  He is credited for founding the KKK.  Do tell your experience.

[homersapien 11,362]

15 hours ago, Son of A Tiger said:

Let me as clear as I can. You would be in favor of renaming Auburn's Samford Hall?

Yes.  To be specific, I said I was OK with it.

 

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by homersapien

[homersapien 11,362]

2 hours ago, DKW 86 said:

Google up Bibb Graves. JSU just renamed BGH. Unfortunately they picked another guy with just about as bad a historical context. I think UNA has a BGH still. 
 

Give this some time. Politicians will remember that they can generate some positive publicity renaming buildings and it will proceed. 

I suspect it's students and school administrators who are driving this more than politicians.

[CoffeeTiger 5,099]

15 hours ago, Son of A Tiger said:

Let me as clear as I can. You would be in favor of renaming Auburn's Samford Hall?

 

I'm not specifically advocating for it, but I wouldn't care either way.

It's just a name, and William Samford wasn't really even much of a notable figure or important to Auburn history aside from living in the area and being a sickly governor that died 6 months into office with no real accomplishments. If he didn't actually own slaves or specifically write some terrible racists screeds that survive today, I don't think many would care much about renaming our Samford Hall though.

 

 

 

 

 

[Son of A Tiger 560]

2 hours ago, CoffeeTiger said:

 

I'm not specifically advocating for it, but I wouldn't care either way.

It's just a name, and William Samford wasn't really even much of a notable figure or important to Auburn history aside from living in the area and being a sickly governor that died 6 months into office with no real accomplishments. If he didn't actually own slaves or specifically write some terrible racists screeds that survive today, I don't think many would care much about renaming our Samford Hall though.

 

 

 

 

 

I bet you're wrong. I think a lot of alumni, especially older ones who donate more money, would be POed. Maybe someone can put a poll and let's see.

 

 

[CoffeeTiger 5,099]

3 minutes ago, Son of A Tiger said:

I bet you're wrong. I think a lot of alumni, especially older ones who donate more money, would be POed. Maybe someone can put a poll and let's see.

 

 

I worded the end that kind of poorly. I meant to indicate that I don't think many people would demand/advocate for changing the name of Samford hall, because William Samford isn't a particularly controversial figure....and also because Auburn University...and of course the State of Alabama in general are pretty conservative places. 

 

 

[cole256 17,043]

10 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Was it *Nathan Bedford Forrest*?  He is credited for founding the KKK.  Do tell your experience.

I don't know I'll Google it. I won't tell the story here because I don't want to detail this guys thread. I don't know where to put it though. Maybe I'll start a thread

[CoffeeTiger 5,099]

23 hours ago, I_M4_AU said:

Was it *Nathan Bedford Forrest*?  He is credited for founding the KKK.  Do tell your experience.

I know about Bedford Forrest mainly from that crazy story about that one young Alabama State Representative a few years ago, Will Dismukes, who created controversy for being a keynote speaker at some weird Confederate/Bedford Forrest memorial celebration event on the same day as civil right leader John Lewis's celebration of life.

 

[SaltyTiger 7,789]

20 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

I know about Bedford Forrest mainly from that crazy story about that one young Alabama State Representative a few years ago, Will Dismukes, who created controversy for being a keynote speaker at some weird Confederate/Bedford Forrest memorial celebration event on the same day as civil right leader John Lewis's celebration of life.

 

Most people know from Forrest Gump being named after him.

[SaltyTiger 7,789]

19 hours ago, Son of A Tiger said:

I bet you're wrong. I think a lot of alumni, especially older ones who donate more money, would be POed. Maybe someone can put a poll and let's see.

 

 

There would be a lot of pushback. Of course a lot of older people like to call it Old Main.

Funny, can’t remember when a passenger elevator was installed in the place. Have a friend that retired military in the mid 90’s. He got a job with the University, “Assistant something  to President”. Office was on fourth floor of Samford and entailed making sure all i’s dotted and t’s crossed on University contracts. Part of job requirements included being able to walk four flights of stairs regularly.

[I_M4_AU 7,793]

51 minutes ago, CoffeeTiger said:

I know about Bedford Forrest mainly from that crazy story about that one young Alabama State Representative a few years ago, Will Dismukes, who created controversy for being a keynote speaker at some weird Confederate/Bedford Forrest memorial celebration event on the same day as civil right leader John Lewis's celebration of life.

 

He was one of the first guerrilla fighters in the Civil War.  He did have success in this endeavor, but never gave up the Confederacy.

Nathan Bedford Forrest (1821-1877) was a Confederate general during the Civil War (1861-65). Despite having no formal military training, Forrest rose from the rank of private to lieutenant general, serving as a cavalry officer at numerous engagements including the Battles of Shiloh, Chickamauga, Brice’s Crossroads and Second Franklin. Known for his maxim “get there first with the most men,” Forrest was relentless in harassing Union forces during the Vicksburg Campaign in 1862 and 1863, and conducted successful raiding operations on federal supplies and communication lines throughout the war. In addition to his ingenious cavalry tactics, Forrest is also remembered for his controversial involvement in the Battle of Fort Pillow in April 1864, when his troops massacred black soldiers following a Union surrender. After the Civil War Forrest worked as a planter and railroad president, and served as the first grand wizard of the Ku Klux Klan. He died in 1877 at the age of 56.

https://www.history.com/topics/american-civil-war/nathan-bedford-forrest

 The definition of an evil genius. 

[CoffeeTiger 5,099]

53 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

Most people know from Forrest Gump being named after him.

hmm. Didn't know that. 

[icanthearyou 4,462]

Racists have no right to have their names on public buildings.  They have no right to be in government, not our government.

Anything else is antithetical to our constitution.