Climate Activism Has a Cult Problem

[arein0 949]

5 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Not johnnyAU, but you can thank the present occupant of the White House for this one.  You didn’t say it, but it has been the underlying cause of *panic* that has gripped the leftist world.  It is a self fulfilling prophecy perpetuated by political actors.

Or is it a call for urgency to develop practical alternatives and the mentioning of change has the right in shambles?

[johnnyAU 3,630]

3 minutes ago, arein0 said:

Or is it a call for urgency to develop practical alternatives and the mentioning of change has the right in shambles?

False urgency under the guise of CAGW. The use of feaux fear to drive economic change for power and $$$. Works every time. 

[arein0 949]

2 minutes ago, johnnyAU said:

False urgency under the guise of CAGW. The use of feaux fear to drive economic change for power and $$$. Works every time. 

So was I wrong in my assumption that you dont think we should be investing in developing cleaner alternatives?

[johnnyAU 3,630]

Just now, arein0 said:

So was I wrong in my assumption that you dont think we should be investing in developing cleaner alternatives?

I said before nuclear is the clear choice as an alternative for fossil fuels, but there is no urgency to make the switch. There is no "climate crisis" or "climate emergency". However, energy independence and cleaner energy are worth investing, but not under a false fear campaign. The idea that wind, solar or biomass can ever be the primary sources is a fool's errand. The idea that wind, solar or battery storage are really "green" at all is also ludicrous. 

[wdefromtx 3,159]

Crazy how some on here act like we aren’t already trying and developing cleaner alternatives. Maybe they just aren’t the ones that help line the right peoples pockets. 
 

Also why would many take this seriously when they tell us to make sacrifices and then get into their nice private jet? 
 

We have had technology to reduce dependence on fossil fuels for decades and it’s called nuclear. Yet the same people crying about FF don’t want that. 
 

[arein0 949]

1 hour ago, johnnyAU said:

I said before nuclear is the clear choice as an alternative for fossil fuels, but there is no urgency to make the switch. There is no "climate crisis" or "climate emergency". However, energy independence and cleaner energy are worth investing, but not under a false fear campaign. The idea that wind, solar or biomass can ever be the primary sources is a fool's errand. The idea that wind, solar or battery storage are really "green" at all is also ludicrous. 

I'm fairly ignorant about nuclear energy so forgive me if I'm wrong on this, but from a quick search it seems like nuclear doesnt come without its own issues: time to build the site, uranium is also a nonrenewable resource, and what do we do with / how to store the nuclear waste.

I can see by this message that you are extremely close minded on the subject, so this will be my last message.

[johnnyAU 3,630]

2 hours ago, arein0 said:

I'm fairly ignorant about nuclear energy so forgive me if I'm wrong on this, but from a quick search it seems like nuclear doesnt come without its own issues: time to build the site, uranium is also a nonrenewable resource, and what do we do with / how to store the nuclear waste.

I can see by this message that you are extremely close minded on the subject, so this will be my last message.

There have been improvements in nuclear over the past several years, however nothing will ever be 100% perfect.  It does remain at this point the best solution. That doesn't mean better won't eventually come along. It just hasn't yet.

[autigeremt 6,588]

7 hours ago, arein0 said:

You dont think it would be worth it to reduce our greenhouse gas emissions? You do realize most of the world sees what we do and tries to copy us right? You dont think the rest of the world would immediately try to switch over to cleaner energy if we are successful in providing a more efficient alternative?

You didn’t read the full post did you? 

[arein0 949]

12 minutes ago, autigeremt said:

You didn’t read the full post did you? 

I missed the last sentence. My apologies. 

[SaltyTiger 7,773]

On 1/28/2023 at 10:50 AM, homersapien said:

Pretty impressive if they can do it by 2024.

(Oh and I suspect all of those lifestyle choices will reflect at least similar improvement in emissions footprints in the future.  We have - or are developing - the technologies.) 

Thanks for supporting my point.  Seriously.

But I'm not sure I understand your second sentence. Are you proposing we make instantaneous radical changes?  Do you think that's practical?

Or to put it another way, do you still own a shirt?  Matthew 5:40-44

 

The second sentence is pretty clear. What do you expect of skeptics? 
 

Do not get your “eye for eye” reference.

[jj3jordan 2,043]

5 hours ago, arein0 said:

I'm fairly ignorant about nuclear energy so forgive me if I'm wrong on this, but from a quick search it seems like nuclear doesnt come without its own issues: time to build the site, uranium is also a nonrenewable resource, and what do we do with / how to store the nuclear waste.

I can see by this message that you are extremely close minded on the subject, so this will be my last message.

Brand new reactor in Bellafonte AL completed but never fired up. Bargain.

 

[aubiefifty 16,733]

all this crap and you people still do not get it. did god or jesus not tell us to take care of our planet? i am pretty sure i read that somewhere. we have places here in alabama that on certain days they tell you NOT to go swimming in the water. this is fact. and the same folks tell you not to eat catfish are they contain poisons and are not healthy to eat. it has been on al.com several times. but at the end of the day we should search for the truth and no partison crap on either side.

   also let me point out i know christians that say no need to worry or do anything because the rapture is coming and there is no need. i have heard it a few times starting back in the eighties. now is this just a handful or a whole ton of people? and does it include christian pols as well?

[AUDub 11,136]

On 1/27/2023 at 12:33 PM, wdefromtx said:

Ummmm the climate would still be changing on it's own if humans were not here. How that change would look compared to current changes can't be determined exactly but that is beside the point. 

It is changing, but natural climate change occurs far more gradually. We're talking seriously deep time here. The current warming is occurring too rapidly for the environment's buffers to absorb.

CO²'s properties as a forcing agent are quite well understood, and have been since the Civil War, the oceans are undergoing acidification, etc. 

We may not know all of the finer points yet, but it's abundantly clear that it's going to suck unless we act to limit the potential change within an envelope. 

Evolution goes hand in hand with this, being a gradual process that responds to forcings, including environmental ones. 

The Earth's ecosystem exists in a tenuous balance with very tight tolerances. Organisms on earth today evolved in a relatively stable environment in the current epoch. We upsetting that balance and we're already seeing the effects. Coral is dying worldwide as the oceans warm and become more acidic, things that rely on calcified shells are having trouble adjusting, etc.

We see these kinds of rapid changes in the environment in the echoes of Earth's history, and they are associated with mass extinction events. 

On 1/27/2023 at 12:33 PM, wdefromtx said:

Natural climate changes due to naturally occurring events did not cease to exist once humans started to inhabit the planet. So should we label you a NGW denier?

BTW it is science and physics that have proven that the climate has changed over time...long before humans. 

Punching a strawman. 

[AUDub 11,136]

Two additional things regarding above:

1. Given what we know about the forcings at play, natural climate change would result in a slight cooling trend as opposed to the massive warming event we're currently observing. 

2. When I say extinction event, I'm not saying humanity is going extinct. We'll still be here in a century. But it will be a very different world. What will happen is a massive reduction in ecological diversity as species that are not suited for these rapid ecological changes die off. There will be winners and there will be losers, but there will be ecological chaos.

To some degree, we are insulated from this, but things will change for us. Sea levels will rise as the ice caps continue their downward spiral. Weather patterns will change. Areas that are deserts will green. Areas that are green will become deserts. Some areas will cool. Most will warm.

[homersapien 11,357]

5 hours ago, AUDub said:

It is changing, but natural climate change occurs far more gradually. We're talking seriously deep time here. The current warming is occurring too rapidly for the environment's buffers to absorb.

CO²'s properties as a forcing agent are quite well understood, and have been since the Civil War, the oceans are undergoing acidification, etc. 

We may not know all of the finer points yet, but it's abundantly clear that it's going to suck unless we act to limit the potential change within an envelope. 

Evolution goes hand in hand with this, being a gradual process that responds to forcings, including environmental ones. 

The Earth's ecosystem exists in a tenuous balance with very tight tolerances. Organisms on earth today evolved in a relatively stable environment in the current epoch. We upsetting that balance and we're already seeing the effects. Coral is dying worldwide as the oceans warm and become more acidic, things that rely on calcified shells are having trouble adjusting, etc.

We see these kinds of rapid changes in the environment in the echoes of Earth's history, and they are associated with mass extinction events. 

Punching a strawman. 

This "earth has changed before" along with the "earth is constantly changing" arguments are so tiresome! 

It's the perfect illustration of simply not understanding the problem.  Obviously, humans have a major issue comprehending geological timescales.

There's a great exhibit - an extended linear graph using the stairwells - at the Smithsonian Museum of Natural History History on this.  It shows the timeline of earth with relative accuracy.  Many of the geologic epochs extend for dozens of feet on this scale.  It extends upward for several floors until at the top, it shows the timeline for humans, which like an inch long. 

Most people have no idea of just how briefly modern homo sapiens have existed in the earth's history (as well as the impact we have had.)

It's very difficult to visualize 160,000K years (for man) compared to geologic epochs that lasted hundreds or thousands of millions of years.

And even one starts with the current epoch and plots temperature change, the increase starting soon after the industrial age - is a spike.  A spike that has yet to level off, and no guarantee it will.

So, in one sense, the earth's climate is changing, thanks to us. 

Edited January 30, 2023 by homersapien

[I_M4_AU 7,783]

FBI Director Christopher Wray admitted he left an August hearing in front of the Senate Judiciary Committee to jump on an FBI jet for a vacation in the Adirondacks, a move Republicans said cut the key oversight hearing short.

The flight in question occurred on Aug. 4, the day before FBI investigators sought and received approval for the unprecedented raid of former President Donald Trump’s resort home in Mar-a-Lago. The search happened after the weekend, on Aug. 8.

Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-IA), ranking member on the Senate Judiciary Committee, expressed frustration with Wray during the August hearing over him leaving before a second round of questions.

“You left an oversight hearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee required by statute so that you could vacation with your family. I find that absolutely unbelievable, and frankly indefensible,” Hawley said Thursday, also asking Wray to turn over all receipts and reimbursements for use of the plane to the committee.

Wray replied: “Senator, we will be happy to comply with oversight requests related to the use of the plane.

Flight Radar 24 records show a Gulfstream G550 belonging to the Justice Department flew from Manassas, Virginia, to Reagan National Airport the afternoon of Aug. 4, then left the nation’s capital for Saranac Lake, New York, at 4:44 p.m. The flight returned to Manassas that evening. Records show the jet took off again the afternoon of Aug. 8 for Saranac Lake, then returned that evening to Manassas.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/justice/wray-admits-jetting-off-adirondacks-august-senate-hearing

The story here is not that Wray left a Congressional meeting to go on vacation, the story is the *Green* Administration isn’t serious about *Green*.  Wray seemingly used the plane to get to the meeting, flew to Saranac Lake to vacation and flew back to Manassas after the vacation.  If Wray drove to the meeting he would have had to fly back to DC to pick up his car.

A whistleblower has stated he has flown the FBI jet to DC to avoid the traffic to DC, so not the first time.

Records obtained by The Daily Wire show the jet has made the roughly 15-minute flight between its base at Manassas Regional Airport in Virginia and Washington, D.C., area airports 140 times since 2020. The whistleblower and currently suspended FBI agent, who spoke to The Daily Wire, said the local trips are made to save Wray and possibly other bureau bigwigs from the 45-minute drive to and from Manassas on either end of their flights.

“The FBI jet is being used, I believe, in a grossly mismanaged way,” FBI agent Kyle Seraphin, who was suspended from the bureau last year, told The Daily Wire. “Chris Wray has a jet fly from Manassas, Virginia, to Reagan National Airport, because he doesn’t want to sit in traffic.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/fbi-director-christopher-wray-summons-bureaus-jet-to-d-c-area-airport-to-dodge-traffic-whistleblower

Speaking of Davos; this is from a year ago but we know it hasn’t changed much:

Researchers found that all private jet flights to and from airports serving Davos during the World Economic Forum 2022 caused a total of 9,700 tonnes of CO2, equivalent to the emissions of about 350,000 average cars in a week. Researchers attribute a majority of these to private flights undertaken by WEF participants. Climate-damaging emissions from private jet flights quadrupled during the one week of the meeting compared to the weeks before and after the event.

“Given that 80% of the world’s population has never even flown, but suffers from the consequences of climate-damaging aviation emissions, and that the WEF claims to be committed to the 1.5°C Paris Climate Target, this annual private jet bonanza is a distasteful masterclass in hypocrisy. Private jets must be consigned to history if we are to have a green, just and safe future for all. It’s about time our political leaders start to lead by example instead of producing hot air in secret meetings with big business,” added Schenk.

Private jets are not regulated in the EU, even though they are the most polluting mode of transportation on the planet per passenger kilometre.[2] For the first time, in 2022, several EU countries have started to push for an EU-wide regulation of private jet emissions. Greenpeace is calling for a ban on private jets and short-haul flights with train alternatives in the EU.

https://www.greenpeace.org/international/press-release/57867/hundreds-of-ultra-short-private-jet-flights-to-davos-world-economic-forum/

Leaders, lead and what we are seeing in not leadership.  These elitists are waiting for a grassroots effort to effect change while doing nothing themselves to alleviate the problem.  Taking Air Force One to Delaware every other weekend isn’t *doing your part* Mr. President.

If this is such a problem why is the current administration just throwing our tax dollars at it?  Start eating bugs 🐛 and driving your electric cars you want us to buy.

You Al Gore wannabes need to talk to your elected officials and demand accountability.  I will still wait until the elitist start to take it seriously.

[aubiefifty 16,733]

57 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

FBI Director Christopher Wray admitted he left an August hearing in front of the Senate Judiciary Committee to jump on an FBI jet for a vacation in the Adirondacks, a move Republicans said cut the key oversight hearing short.

The flight in question occurred on Aug. 4, the day before FBI investigators sought and received approval for the unprecedented raid of former President Donald Trump’s resort home in Mar-a-Lago. The search happened after the weekend, on Aug. 8.

Sen. Chuck Grassley (R-IA), ranking member on the Senate Judiciary Committee, expressed frustration with Wray during the August hearing over him leaving before a second round of questions.

“You left an oversight hearing before the Senate Judiciary Committee required by statute so that you could vacation with your family. I find that absolutely unbelievable, and frankly indefensible,” Hawley said Thursday, also asking Wray to turn over all receipts and reimbursements for use of the plane to the committee.

Wray replied: “Senator, we will be happy to comply with oversight requests related to the use of the plane.

Flight Radar 24 records show a Gulfstream G550 belonging to the Justice Department flew from Manassas, Virginia, to Reagan National Airport the afternoon of Aug. 4, then left the nation’s capital for Saranac Lake, New York, at 4:44 p.m. The flight returned to Manassas that evening. Records show the jet took off again the afternoon of Aug. 8 for Saranac Lake, then returned that evening to Manassas.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/justice/wray-admits-jetting-off-adirondacks-august-senate-hearing

The story here is not that Wray left a Congressional meeting to go on vacation, the story is the *Green* Administration isn’t serious about *Green*.  Wray seemingly used the plane to get to the meeting, flew to Saranac Lake to vacation and flew back to Manassas after the vacation.  If Wray drove to the meeting he would have had to fly back to DC to pick up his car.

A whistleblower has stated he has flown the FBI jet to DC to avoid the traffic to DC, so not the first time.

Records obtained by The Daily Wire show the jet has made the roughly 15-minute flight between its base at Manassas Regional Airport in Virginia and Washington, D.C., area airports 140 times since 2020. The whistleblower and currently suspended FBI agent, who spoke to The Daily Wire, said the local trips are made to save Wray and possibly other bureau bigwigs from the 45-minute drive to and from Manassas on either end of their flights.

“The FBI jet is being used, I believe, in a grossly mismanaged way,” FBI agent Kyle Seraphin, who was suspended from the bureau last year, told The Daily Wire. “Chris Wray has a jet fly from Manassas, Virginia, to Reagan National Airport, because he doesn’t want to sit in traffic.

https://www.dailywire.com/news/fbi-director-christopher-wray-summons-bureaus-jet-to-d-c-area-airport-to-dodge-traffic-whistleblower

Speaking of Davos; this is from a year ago but we know it hasn’t changed much:

Researchers found that all private jet flights to and from airports serving Davos during the World Economic Forum 2022 caused a total of 9,700 tonnes of CO2, equivalent to the emissions of about 350,000 average cars in a week. Researchers attribute a majority of these to private flights undertaken by WEF participants. Climate-damaging emissions from private jet flights quadrupled during the one week of the meeting compared to the weeks before and after the event.

“Given that 80% of the world’s population has never even flown, but suffers from the consequences of climate-damaging aviation emissions, and that the WEF claims to be committed to the 1.5°C Paris Climate Target, this annual private jet bonanza is a distasteful masterclass in hypocrisy. Private jets must be consigned to history if we are to have a green, just and safe future for all. It’s about time our political leaders start to lead by example instead of producing hot air in secret meetings with big business,” added Schenk.

Private jets are not regulated in the EU, even though they are the most polluting mode of transportation on the planet per passenger kilometre.[2] For the first time, in 2022, several EU countries have started to push for an EU-wide regulation of private jet emissions. Greenpeace is calling for a ban on private jets and short-haul flights with train alternatives in the EU.

https://www.greenpeace.org/international/press-release/57867/hundreds-of-ultra-short-private-jet-flights-to-davos-world-economic-forum/

Leaders, lead and what we are seeing in not leadership.  These elitists are waiting for a grassroots effort to effect change while doing nothing themselves to alleviate the problem.  Taking Air Force One to Delaware every other weekend isn’t *doing your part* Mr. President.

If this is such a problem why is the current administration just throwing our tax dollars at it?  Start eating bugs 🐛 and driving your electric cars you want us to buy.

You Al Gore wannabes need to talk to your elected officials and demand accountability.  I will still wait until the elitist start to take it seriously.

let us remember the thug known as trump take a private yet ALL THE TIME. see how that works? and i bet trump jets around more than biden by a huge margin.

[I_M4_AU 7,783]

2 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

let us remember the thug known as trump take a private yet ALL THE TIME. see how that works? and i bet trump jets around more than biden by a huge margin.

You are all about whataboutism. One difference, fifty, Trump didn’t advocate to kill the fossil fuel industry and, in fact, got us out of the Paris Climate Agreement.   His administration in not the one being hypocritical.

[aubiefifty 16,733]

10 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

You are all about whataboutism. One difference, fifty, Trump didn’t advocate to kill the fossil fuel industry and, in fact, got us out of the Paris Climate Agreement.   His administration in not the one being hypocritical.

pot meet kettle.anyway how have you been scooter? i say that with love by the way.

[I_M4_AU 7,783]

5 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

pot meet kettle.anyway how have you been scooter? i say that with love by the way.

Not bad.  You haven’t been around lately.  Were you taking a break?

[aubiefifty 16,733]

2 minutes ago, I_M4_AU said:

Not bad.  You haven’t been around lately.  Were you taking a break?

i had two people mouth off on me in the same day. one called me white trash and stupid so i took a break. i left the guilty party a very bad private message so i might or might not get in trouble for that and get a time out but at least i make it private. all because i posted a video bashing auburn to get folks to call them out as liars like i did. it caught me off guard and crushed my soul. so i took a break.

[arein0 949]

1 hour ago, I_M4_AU said:

Leaders, lead and what we are seeing in not leadership.  These elitists are waiting for a grassroots effort to effect change while doing nothing themselves to alleviate the problem.  Taking Air Force One to Delaware every other weekend isn’t *doing your part* Mr. President.

If this is such a problem why is the current administration just throwing our tax dollars at it?  Start eating bugs 🐛 and driving your electric cars you want us to buy.

You Al Gore wannabes need to talk to your elected officials and demand accountability.  I will still wait until the elitist start to take it seriously.

I can understand this point. Its very hard to get people on board for change when the person asking for change doesn't show they are changing.

[SaltyTiger 7,773]

5 hours ago, aubiefifty said:

all this crap and you people still do not get it. did god or jesus not tell us to take care of our planet? i am pretty sure i read that somewhere. we have places here in alabama that on certain days they tell you NOT to go swimming in the water. this is fact. and the same folks tell you not to eat catfish are they contain poisons and are not healthy to eat. it has been on al.com several times. but at the end of the day we should search for the truth and no partison crap on either side.

   also let me point out i know christians that say no need to worry or do anything because the rapture is coming and there is no need. i have heard it a few times starting back in the eighties. now is this just a handful or a whole ton of people? and does it include christian pols as well?

You are correct in that the Coosa and Mobile rivers are in bad shape. Mobile from APCO coal ash. The Coosa from poultry farm runoff. To my knowledge “you people” and their counter parts like yourself enjoy electricity an poultry products. 
 

Don’t forget that Atlanta Democratic mayors attempted to destroy the Chattahoochee in the 90’s by dumping raw sewage into tributaries. There was also the blatant bus dumping into the storm system by the DNC. You do understand that ultimately that crap ended up in the once beautiful river.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/democratic-campaign-bus-dumps-sewage-into-georgia-storm-drain-police-say

Many people refuse to eat catfish because they are bottom feeders. Of course other species are also affected by polluted waters. Below is a link for Alabama fish advisory.

https://www.alabamapublichealth.gov/tox/assets/al-fish-advisory-2022.pdf

 

[aubiefifty 16,733]

6 minutes ago, SaltyTiger said:

You are correct in that the Coosa and Mobile rivers are in bad shape. Mobile from APCO coal ash. The Coosa from poultry farm runoff. To my knowledge “you people” and their counter parts like yourself enjoy electricity an poultry products. 
 

Don’t forget that Atlanta Democratic mayors attempted to destroy the Chattahoochee in the 90’s by dumping raw sewage into tributaries. There was also the blatant bus dumping into the storm system by the DNC. You do understand that ultimately that crap ended up in the once beautiful river.

https://www.foxnews.com/us/democratic-campaign-bus-dumps-sewage-into-georgia-storm-drain-police-say

Many people refuse to eat catfish because they are bottom feeders. Of course other species are also affected by polluted waters. Below is a link for Alabama fish advisory.

https://www.alabamapublichealth.gov/tox/assets/al-fish-advisory-2022.pdf

 

i do not care who does it salty. to me it should not be a partison issue and i feel like some folks needed some prison time to go along with those fines. i remember back in the late nineties there was some kind of spill and there were dead fish everywhere. there were catfish the size of dee rfloating on top of the water and alive but dying. a coworker actually swam out and straddled one and paddled himself back to shore. he strapped the catfish on the front hood of his car and got a ticket for obstructing his view. but when they started putting out no swimming advisories it got my attention.

[SaltyTiger 7,773]

6 minutes ago, aubiefifty said:

i do not care who does it salty. to me it should not be a partison issue and i feel like some folks needed some prison time to go along with those fines. i remember back in the late nineties there was some kind of spill and there were dead fish everywhere. there were catfish the size of dee rfloating on top of the water and alive but dying. a coworker actually swam out and straddled one and paddled himself back to shore. he strapped the catfish on the front hood of his car and got a ticket for obstructing his view. but when they started putting out no swimming advisories it got my attention.

Runoff, etc…is a huge problem. Can remember our coastal bays being crystal clear on a consistent basis. See glimpses now after extended droughts. Really hard to see how anything survives some of the brown froth.