Defensive Coordinator Diiscussion

[Ed_ 3]

If Muschamp wants to hire Elmo, I'm fine with that. Let's just get Muschamp.

Elmo's fine, I guess. Grover would probably be a better fit IMO.

I've always prefered Oscar the Grouch's fire.

[aucanucktiger 1,789]

Wow, either Will Muschamp is Auburn-bound or about half the registered posters on this board will have egg on their faces.

I will say, as exciting as having CWM on Gus' staff is, with the discussions about who has what amount of control over hiring D staff, I'm reminded about the tension in the Chizik vs Malzahn dynamic of head coach vs wunderkind assistant. This is more genius HC hiring great DC though I guess.

[AEAugirl 9,623]

Phillip Marshall (free info BTW) is saying that barring anything crazy he expects Muschamp to be named DC but that could be a week away. I know they are "ironing out" details about staff.

I wonder if the delay in FL getting a deal with McElwain could be holding up finalizing a staff with Muschamp....seeing as how it was said that McElwain would be interested in retaining some of the staff (and I am assuming that would be mostly defensive).

PMarshall also said not to assume T Rob would follow Muschamp, that he loves Auburn but he has been very happy at Florida.

[douggwilliams 61]

If anyone knows how it feels to get your scheme messed with by a HC it is CGM. He will let CWM do his thing. Does anyone know if CWM coaches any positions?

[TitanTiger 20,471]

Wow, either Will Muschamp is Auburn-bound or about half the registered posters on this board will have egg on their faces.

People are just saying what virtually everyone out there who has contacts on the inside is saying, from Bruce Feldman to Jay Tate to Phillip Marshall.

I will say, as exciting as having CWM on Gus' staff is, with the discussions about who has what amount of control over hiring D staff, I'm reminded about the tension in the Chizik vs Malzahn dynamic of head coach vs wunderkind assistant. This is more genius HC hiring great DC though I guess.

There has been absolutely zero talk of Malzahn ever interfering with Ellis Johnson's defenses. I don't know why there would suddenly be a concern that Gus would meddle with CWM's.

[aucanucktiger 1,789]

Read my post again Titan. Where do I say anything about Gus interfering with Johnson?

[CJBas 4]

Bringing in a new DC like Muschamp you need to let him hire his own staff and let him do his job.

[Strychnine 1,802]

Wow, either Will Muschamp is Auburn-bound or about half the registered posters on this board will have egg on their faces.

I will say, as exciting as having CWM on Gus' staff is, with the discussions about who has what amount of control over hiring D staff, I'm reminded about the tension in the Chizik vs Malzahn dynamic of head coach vs wunderkind assistant. This is more genius HC hiring great DC though I guess.

I would suspect that Gus would defer to Muschamp's recommendations on defensive assistants. Gus knows the previous defensive staff was clearly not working, otherwise he would not have fired Johnson. All evidence points to Muschamp being able to oversee the crafting of an outstanding defense. If the incoming DC is indeed Muschamp, that is two logical reasons to conclude that Gus would take his recommendations.

[Browning4AU 405]

Wow, either Will Muschamp is Auburn-bound or about half the registered posters on this board will have egg on their faces.

I will say, as exciting as having CWM on Gus' staff is, with the discussions about who has what amount of control over hiring D staff, I'm reminded about the tension in the Chizik vs Malzahn dynamic of head coach vs wunderkind assistant. This is more genius HC hiring great DC though I guess.

I would suspect that Gus would defer to Muschamp's recommendations on defensive assistants. Gus knows the previous defensive staff was clearly not working, otherwise he would not have fired Johnson. All evidence points to Muschamp being able to oversee the crafting of an outstanding defense. If the incoming DC is indeed Muschamp, that is two logical reasons to conclude that Gus would take his recommendations.

I agree with that, but hopefully they can agree to keep RG there in some capacity if for nothing else but recruiting purposes.

[AuburnGrad97 37]

In my opinion, Ellis, Fountain and Harbison are the problems, and these are the coaches that need to be replaced. I'm sorry if I offend anyone, but our secondary hasn't been good in many years. I cannot understand why we can't grasp the concepts of jamming at the line, and looking for the freaking ball. Other than Jonathan Jones, the only int's we had all year were because the opposing QB threw a horrible pass right to our guys. Jones was the only DB that ever made a play on the ball.

Our special teams was just as bad, if not worse, than our secondary. We signed the #1 kicker and #1 punter a in Carlson and Hutchinson. Our kicking game should have been much better than it was. Losing Parkey and Clark was devastating, but the drop off shouldn't have been that extreme. Our kick and punt coverage was also awful. If Carlson didn't kick it out of the endzone, you could bet the returner was going to get to at least the 30-35 yard line, and usually by running straight up the field. And 30 yard punts consistently aren't going to flip the field. Can't have that.

I trust Gus to do what is right by our current coaches, and with his hires to correct the problem. War Damn Eagle!!!

BTW, I would love to see Rocker back, and also Spikes as our LB coach!!!!

[douggwilliams 61]

In my opinion, Ellis, Fountain and Harbison are the problems, and these are the coaches that need to be replaced. I'm sorry if I offend anyone, but our secondary hasn't been good in many years. I cannot understand why we can't grasp the concepts of jamming at the line, and looking for the freaking ball. Other than Jonathan Jones, the only int's we had all year were because the opposing QB threw a horrible pass right to our guys. Jones was the only DB that ever made a play on the ball.

Our special teams was just as bad, if not worse, than our secondary. We signed the #1 kicker and #1 punter a in Carlson and Hutchinson. Our kicking game should have been much better than it was. Losing Parkey and Clark was devastating, but the drop off shouldn't have been that extreme. Our kick and punt coverage was also awful. If Carlson didn't kick it out of the endzone, you could bet the returner was going to get to at least the 30-35 yard line, and usually by running straight up the field. And 30 yard punts consistently aren't going to flip the field. Can't have that.

I trust Gus to do what is right by our current coaches, and with his hires to correct the problem. War Damn Eagle!!!

BTW, I would love to see Rocker back, and also Spikes as our LB coach!!!!

I agree, but wouldnt Spikes need to be a GA first as it is his first coaching opportunity?

[meh130 1,043]

They had great penetration all year and our DB's couldn't cover a slant or a screen.

Yeah...no.

Um yea if you didn't see the Interior lines penetration in the run game and in the passing game then you need glasses

Dude, the pass rush was MIA on 90% of our snaps this year. I don't necessarily fault Garner for that, but it's true.

Notice I said interior line not the edge. One cannot not deny that the interior line got good penetration especially in the run game. Only problem I had from our line this season was the lack of an edge pass rusher.

I saw three of our DL put flat on their butts within 1/2 of a second of the snap against Ole Miss. The only reason the backside DE was not is it was a zone read and he was not blocked. I will say, Gabe Wright got up fast, and was close to making a play when Frost made the tackle.

You are right about our lack of an edge rusher, but our guys were getting beat one-on-one too many times. We may have played well at times but we're inconsistent.

We were 55th in yards per rush attempt, and 89th in yards per pass attempt. We were tied for 95th in sacks, and 94th in total tackles.

[younggun 14]

^{My 2 cents worth. All the speculation about CRG is from a personal opinion on page 1. It even states, "my guess is." So I guess my question is, why the crap has everyone jumped on that like it is the gospel truth and basically thrown CRG under the Gus Bus. CRG is a super coach and recruiter. It was a major coup when we got him to leave UGA and come home and now, in the name of Muschamp, he is now the holdup of the signed contract, moving to ST coach or being fired. Maybe its just me, but I just don't understand the 180 degree turn. When we got CRG 2 yrs ago, he was the greatest DL coach in the history of coaching(besides Rocker) and now, he's expendable. How did he get so bad so fast? Any answers?}

Wait...let me find my glasses

I swear when I typed this originally, I just thought I hadn't had enough coffee yet. I guess size really does matter.

[AuCivilEng1 10,995]

In my opinion, Ellis, Fountain and Harbison are the problems, and these are the coaches that need to be replaced. I'm sorry if I offend anyone, but our secondary hasn't been good in many years. I cannot understand why we can't grasp the concepts of jamming at the line, and looking for the freaking ball. Other than Jonathan Jones, the only int's we had all year were because the opposing QB threw a horrible pass right to our guys. Jones was the only DB that ever made a play on the ball.

Our special teams was just as bad, if not worse, than our secondary. We signed the #1 kicker and #1 punter a in Carlson and Hutchinson. Our kicking game should have been much better than it was. Losing Parkey and Clark was devastating, but the drop off shouldn't have been that extreme. Our kick and punt coverage was also awful. If Carlson didn't kick it out of the endzone, you could bet the returner was going to get to at least the 30-35 yard line, and usually by running straight up the field. And 30 yard punts consistently aren't going to flip the field. Can't have that.

I trust Gus to do what is right by our current coaches, and with his hires to correct the problem. War Damn Eagle!!!

BTW, I would love to see Rocker back, and also Spikes as our LB coach!!!!

You can't blaim the missed field goals and shanked punts on any coach. Kicker and Punters are expected to know how to kick and punt when they come in and work on it more while they are here. Fountain can't help these guys kick and punt better. The coverage and blocking did drop off though.

[AuCivilEng1 10,995]

In my opinion, Ellis, Fountain and Harbison are the problems, and these are the coaches that need to be replaced. I'm sorry if I offend anyone, but our secondary hasn't been good in many years. I cannot understand why we can't grasp the concepts of jamming at the line, and looking for the freaking ball. Other than Jonathan Jones, the only int's we had all year were because the opposing QB threw a horrible pass right to our guys. Jones was the only DB that ever made a play on the ball.

Our special teams was just as bad, if not worse, than our secondary. We signed the #1 kicker and #1 punter a in Carlson and Hutchinson. Our kicking game should have been much better than it was. Losing Parkey and Clark was devastating, but the drop off shouldn't have been that extreme. Our kick and punt coverage was also awful. If Carlson didn't kick it out of the endzone, you could bet the returner was going to get to at least the 30-35 yard line, and usually by running straight up the field. And 30 yard punts consistently aren't going to flip the field. Can't have that.

I trust Gus to do what is right by our current coaches, and with his hires to correct the problem. War Damn Eagle!!!

BTW, I would love to see Rocker back, and also Spikes as our LB coach!!!!

I agree, but wouldnt Spikes need to be a GA first as it is his first coaching opportunity?

I don't think so. I think that is something that guys do to get used to the grind of coaching. Takeo's years of experience in the Pro's has probably tought him more about that that a few years as a GA ever could. Hey if Takeo comes at least we will have a pep talk guy on staff! I can't really see and of the current staff being all that firey in the locker room.

[Strychnine 1,802]

I would suspect that Gus would defer to Muschamp's recommendations on defensive assistants. Gus knows the previous defensive staff was clearly not working, otherwise he would not have fired Johnson. All evidence points to Muschamp being able to oversee the crafting of an outstanding defense. If the incoming DC is indeed Muschamp, that is two logical reasons to conclude that Gus would take his recommendations.

I agree with that, but hopefully they can agree to keep RG there in some capacity if for nothing else but recruiting purposes.

I would agree that I would like to see RG retained. That said, I also know that if Muschamp were recommending replacing him, there would be a reason for it that Muschamp could clearly articulate to Gus. He certainly knows more about coaching defense and evaluating assistants than I do, so I'd defer to his judgment there. I think Gus is also smart enough to know that Muschamp knows more about coaching defense in college football in general (and the SEC specifically) than he does too.

[Micah511 0]

I would suspect that Gus would defer to Muschamp's recommendations on defensive assistants. Gus knows the previous defensive staff was clearly not working, otherwise he would not have fired Johnson. All evidence points to Muschamp being able to oversee the crafting of an outstanding defense. If the incoming DC is indeed Muschamp, that is two logical reasons to conclude that Gus would take his recommendations.

I agree with that, but hopefully they can agree to keep RG there in some capacity if for nothing else but recruiting purposes.

I would agree that I would like to see RG retained. That said, I also know that if Muschamp were recommending replacing him, there would be a reason for it that Muschamp could clearly articulate to Gus. He certainly knows more about coaching defense and evaluating assistants than I do, so I'd defer to his judgment there. I think Gus is also smart enough to know that Muschamp knows more about coaching defense in college football in general (and the SEC specifically) than he does too.

if you want Rodney Gardner to stay because he is a proven coach and auburn man that is warranted. But to say you want a coach to stay on staff for "recruiting purposes" sounds a lot like how a lot of people wanted to keep our towel waiving friend of the Chizik era here after Malzahn was hired.

[TheBlueVue 177]

They had great penetration all year and our DB's couldn't cover a slant or a screen.

Yeah...no.

Um yea if you didn't see the Interior lines penetration in the run game and in the passing game then you need glasses

Dude, the pass rush was MIA on 90% of our snaps this year. I don't necessarily fault Garner for that, but it's true.

Probably because there was no elite pass rusher.

Lots of teams don't have an elite pass rusher but can still get pressure. It certainly helps, but you shouldn't need a transcendent talent on the line to get some pressure fairly consistently.

So you think Dee Ford is a transcendent talent? He was very good over achiever who had a knack for making a big play at a critical moment. Auburn had neither this season on defense. Lawson may turn into that kind of player but that's a heavy mantle to put on a young player. Losing those 2 hurt Auburn a lot more than I thought it would but it was the only difference but I wouldn't classify either as transcendent talents.

[TitanTiger 20,471]

They had great penetration all year and our DB's couldn't cover a slant or a screen.

Yeah...no.

Um yea if you didn't see the Interior lines penetration in the run game and in the passing game then you need glasses

Dude, the pass rush was MIA on 90% of our snaps this year. I don't necessarily fault Garner for that, but it's true.

Probably because there was no elite pass rusher.

Lots of teams don't have an elite pass rusher but can still get pressure. It certainly helps, but you shouldn't need a transcendent talent on the line to get some pressure fairly consistently.

So you think Dee Ford is a transcendent talent? He was very good over achiever who had a knack for making a big play at a critical moment. Auburn had neither this season on defense. Lawson may turn into that kind of player but that's a heavy mantle to put on a young player. Losing those 2 hurt Auburn a lot more than I thought it would but it was the only difference but I wouldn't classify either as transcendent talents.

He was considered an elite pass rusher...hence being a first round draft pick. My point is simply that you do not need a Jadaveon Clowney to get a consistent pass rush if your tackles are performing.

[TheBlueVue 177]

They had great penetration all year and our DB's couldn't cover a slant or a screen.

Yeah...no.

Um yea if you didn't see the Interior lines penetration in the run game and in the passing game then you need glasses

Dude, the pass rush was MIA on 90% of our snaps this year. I don't necessarily fault Garner for that, but it's true.

Probably because there was no elite pass rusher.

Lots of teams don't have an elite pass rusher but can still get pressure. It certainly helps, but you shouldn't need a transcendent talent on the line to get some pressure fairly consistently.

So you think Dee Ford is a transcendent talent? He was very good over achiever who had a knack for making a big play at a critical moment. Auburn had neither this season on defense. Lawson may turn into that kind of player but that's a heavy mantle to put on a young player. Losing those 2 hurt Auburn a lot more than I thought it would but it was the only difference but I wouldn't classify either as transcendent talents.

He was considered an elite pass rusher...hence being a first round draft pick. My point is simply that you do not need a Jadaveon Clowney to get a consistent pass rush if your tackles are performing.

Gotcha. We certainly didn't have any pressure from the edge this year and when EJ was expressing concerns about it preseason I had no idea it would become such a glaring liability. Dee hasn't lived up to his elite status and neither has Lemonier but Corey wasn't a 1st round pick. My point is Dee was very good but not transcendent and the fact that he rarely if ever plays for KC seems to bear that out. Auburn simply lacked quickness and athleticism from the outside and they covered it up pretty well early but couldn't keep it covered.

[AUsince72 11,084]

Not knocking Garner at all. Big fan and I hope it works out that he's able to stay. But I've been reading in this thread, and others, about the lack of a pass rush this year being due to the lack of an "elite" pass rusher. I guess my question is.... Isn't it an elite D-1, SEC West D-Line & D-End Coach's job to help mold and create elite pass rushers? Should Auburn only be allowed to have 1 per year and if he's hurt, then....too bad?

As much as I love Garner, I wonder if he's more of a DT coach and AU SHOULD have a separate DE coach?

[TheBlueVue 177]

Not knocking Garner at all. Big fan and I hope it works out that he's able to stay. But I've been reading in this thread, and others, about the lack of a pass rush this year being due to the lack of an "elite" pass rusher. I guess my question is.... Isn't it an elite D-1, SEC West D-Line & D-End Coach's job to help mold and create elite pass rushers? Should Auburn only be allowed to have 1 per year and if he's hurt, then....too bad?

As much as I love Garner, I wonder if he's more of a DT coach and AU SHOULD have a separate DE coach?

In a word , Yes but, you cant make a silk purse from a sow's ear. He didn't have the kind of player he needed to make an elite pass rusher. Effort can only take a player so far if he lacks the basic talent and pass rushing ability is definitely requires a lot of God given talent like size and quickness. Some things cannot be taught.

[McLoofus 35,182]

Dee hasn't lived up to his elite status and neither has Lemonier but Corey wasn't a 1st round pick. My point is Dee was very good but not transcendent and the fact that he rarely if ever plays for KC seems to bear that out.

Pro football performance has nothing to do with college football performance.

Not knocking Garner at all. Big fan and I hope it works out that he's able to stay. But I've been reading in this thread, and others, about the lack of a pass rush this year being due to the lack of an "elite" pass rusher. I guess my question is.... Isn't it an elite D-1, SEC West D-Line & D-End Coach's job to help mold and create elite pass rushers? Should Auburn only be allowed to have 1 per year and if he's hurt, then....too bad?

As much as I love Garner, I wonder if he's more of a DT coach and AU SHOULD have a separate DE coach?

By definition, "elite" means that most programs don't even have 1, much less 2. What we failed to produce behind Lawson, though, was even "very good". But I'm willing to blame that on the roster. We didn't have much to begin with, and had a couple tough injuries on top of Lawson's. That's why some of us are very concerned about the current recruiting cycle, and hoping like heck that Muschamp inks a deal and brings a couple stud DEs with him.

[PowerOfDixieland 3,225]

You can't blaim the missed field goals and shanked punts on any coach. Kicker and Punters are expected to know how to kick and punt when they come in and work on it more while they are here. Fountain can't help these guys kick and punt better. The coverage and blocking did drop off though.

Nowhere in AUG97's post was "blaim" placed for missing field goals. In fact, Carlson should be the only name considered for special teams MVP.

Remove Carlson (which Fountain did for Hutchinson) and you've got a black hole of special teams. We were terrible in every area of that facet. Have you forgotten that we had a field goal blocked and returned for a touchdown against aTM? When I watched that play, my first thought was "Dear Lord, Gabe Wright!!??"

I'm curious to know why he hasn't been held accountable for the lack of development with guys like Fulse and Uzomah?

And why wasn't his name ever mentioned in the "Kick Six" discussion? There's a reason he was off the field for four of five years.

My mother could have done his job last year with Parkey, Clark and Prosch.

[TheBlueVue 177]

"Pro football performance has nothing to do with college football performance."

Oh, I agree but my response was to the use of "transcendent talent". If Dee Ford was a transcendent talent he'd be playing on Sundays...he's on a team and that says a lot but transcendent talents play. My point being Auburn didn't have a transcendent talent and got pretty consistent pass rush last year form a true freshman and an over-achiever who earned his elite status